DD called up wh and asked him why was i talking to lawyers and such. I dont know what he told her but he left me a message on my voicemail that said DD is crying and bawling, dont do this, please call me back. i ignored him and talked to DD. I said dont worry about anything, i havent made a decision yet about what i want to do, but you know we both love you. I asked her how did she know what i was doing. she said she was spying on me from her room. Not 15 minutes later WH walks thru the front door like he still lives here, falls to his knees and kisses me everywhere. I am not impressed.He says give me 4 days to get everything right. I guess were down from a week then <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> .I said you dont get it. I want to divorce you, i dont want to be a part of this triangle anymore. He says im getting everything ready for us, i've been looking at apartments, we can probably only take 1 of our dogs, yada yada. meanwhile im staring at him in disbelief. He totally acted as if i didnt say anything.he says give me a hug and a kiss. i said i told you what im gonna do if you dont want to accept it than i dont know what to tell you.Then he left saying he'll call me and we'll talk more later. what should i do?

So, your WH saw the light of day, and now wants you back after an affair he had? Is that right?

Sorry, just not sure about your situation.

-Caren

Shelly,

Are you in Plan B? If so...did you spell out specific conditions for him to return home?

If so...then I think the answer is that you continue to do what you are doing: take care of your own business and limit contact with him.

The ball is in his court. Is he ready to end the affair NOW and do the things he needs to do to begin the recovery process?

Andrew, I have heard this junk from him about 100 times. I was going to go to plan B today after posting it up here, but i think its a moot point. He will not honor it. Sometimes I think that man thinks he owns me. I have to go to work soon anyway, maybe figure out what to do then.

Shelly,

You have reached a turning point. He is probably aware you mean business. So that is what you need to continue to do. 1 week in A land equates to 4 months in real time. So four days = ?????

Let him know you don't know what 4 days mean. That will take you up to New Year's. That mean any type of an anniversary for WS/OP? Did he spend $$ on her already?

If he really means anything, he s/b willing to lose all $$ he spent on the A. That should be part of what he w/b willing to do in addition to what you already require.

Make sure you know your boundaries and requirements.

NO calls, no convo....until you are convinced. Right now that s/b convincing with long term actions....not a bunch of words or tears.

JMHO,
L.

You need to be very clear with your daughter now from this moment forward...EXACTLY what you are doing in regards to her father....

the second WH walked in your door and opened his mouth and YOU did not get up and leave...

YOU become responsible for each second of insanity you even listened to...

not him...

you...

I want to divorce you,

I didn't know YOU wanted a divorce..that's news to me...
if that's what you want then file tomorrow...the problem Shelly is that while you are attempting to get accountability and be married to someone who means what they say...then darnit you need to model that exact behavior...

if you tell your husband you want a divorce..and you really don't..
or don't follow immediately with action...

you become no more believable in his mind..than he is in your mind...

your words will come to have as much meaning as his....

you need a plan b letter

with specific issues of contact with daughter visitation etc...

clear narrowly defined elements of even begining to think of reconcilliation with him...

every thing else is you saying bring me more chaos...
I am waiting...

shell this post is tough on you..cause enough is enough...

ARK

Yes Ark, tough but absolutely true. I am not so foggy myself that I dont recognize it when truth is shoved in my face. I should have been clearer with my DD about what i was going to do with her dad. I intend to rectify that when i figure it out myself. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> Dont get me wrong, i have no intention at all of continuing to enable his adultery. I just dont think my H will really come to his senses unless he believes he is losing his wife. I feel so shellshocked right now.I feel disgust for WH and thats it. That man deserves to lose his family for all his deception and total lack of respect for his wife and DD.I dont believe anything he says, i've heard it all before. Now he's got my MIL involved and she called me today begging me to give him one more chance, I dont want to hurt this lady, she's been very kind and supportive towards me, its unfair of WH to drag this sick woman into all this because he doesnt want to do the right thing. I told her as nicely as i could all that had transpired and she said that no dirty ******* would ever be accepted into her family, that to give her ow's # and she'd tell her that personally,(i had to laugh at that one) and that she would not allow me to leave her son! (huh???) anyways she finished it up by telling me she ripped WH a new one and he says he doesnt want to lose his family to call me and tell me he loves me and to give him his 4 days. (dont know why its 4 days yet, am still working on it)I didnt promise her anything, I told her I loved her, thanks for her support and i'd talk to her tomorrow. any comments? Im kinda getting lost again.

shelly_3,

I know this feels REALLY confusing, but if you use the "thinking" part of your brain, it isn't that murky at all.

Your H had an A. You asked him to stop the A. He did not. You continued to ask and began Plan A to the best of your understanding and ability. He still did not end the A. He promised you a bunch of hot air, and you hoped, and you wanted to believe him, and he never once followed through. The A did not end.

Finally, you have reached a turning point where you have had enough of the A triangle -AND- the empty promises.

So being very detached and dispassionate, here's how it goes:

(Hubby),
I made a vow to love you until death parts us, and I do not intend to break my vow. I know that I did participate in making an environment in which an A blossomed. I have taken a realistic, hard look at myself and how I contributed, and I am working and have been working on becoming the woman I am intended to be.

I love you and intend to be your W, but I can no longer stand the pain of this A. I have asked you to stop, you have promised to stop, and it has not stopped. Therefore, I am stating that I want to separate from you completely, and have no contact OF ANY KIND until the following boundaries have been respected:

1) NO CONTACT with the OW for any reason! No excuses! You prove it to me, because I'm not going to be the cop and snoop--it's your responsibility to make the effort to prove it to me.

2) COMPLETE, TRANSPARENT HONESTY. Turn over all cell phones, passwords, email accounts, etc. and completely open up and be honest about every single thing. Not even one hidden little white lie! Reveal everything you did with OW, reveal your honest feelings and thoughts to me, and be entirely open.

3) ACCOUNTABILITY. Willingness to share where you are, who you are with, when you will be coming and going, etc. Be accountable for your time, your energy, your feelings--and freely and willingly account to me.

4) COUNSELING. Clearly there are personal issues for both of us, so I would demand individual couseling for you to address your temptation demons, and marriage coaching with the Harley's to address our relationship demons. This is non-negotiable.

*****

Now shelly_3, I'm sure you recognize this format is basically a Plan B letter, huh? Well, get a little detached here girl, and think about it. Has your hubby done ANY of the things on your list of requirements to come home? Shoot, he's still asking for 4 MORE DAYS to end the A!!!!!!! This is the same old dance as before (the dance of manipulation) only this time he has noticed that you have refused to dance the old dance and he is pulling out all his cards to get you to re-engage in the old dance.

DON'T DO IT!!

You can be completely honest with your DD and tell her that her dad has a girlfriend, and since he's married to you, that's not good. So, you told dad that he could not have both and now you are protecting yourself in case dad won't leave the girlfriend. And shelley_3, that is exactly what you ARE doing!!! You are not rushing into divorce. You are not "punishing" your WH. You are doing what is fiscally responsible for yourself and your DD given that your WH does not seem to be acting responsibly!! When he starts to ACT responsibly, you will stop consulting lawyers for info, huh??? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

So be brave, girl. Be strong and empowered for yourself, your DD, and your WH. Allow him to endure the consequences of his choices to not end the A...and yes, he is going to cry and hurt!! Well, DUH!! He chose it!!


CJ

4 days shelly? Well what about setting a specific date like 4 or 5 th Jan 2005 - because he may get the year wrong - for him to come with you with a decision.

You tell him now what YOU expect if he wants to work on the M the rest is up to him.

When the date is up you then decide how you will respond - still fogged and non commital may = Plan B change locks etc etc,

Maybe if he says he will start working you then say ok no contact first .. he writes and signs letter you are happy with YOU post it..gives you all cells, PC access codes etc etc, then you consider how he can come back into the home. Do MC and or IC etc etc.

Have you been seeing a MC at all? COuld you afford the Harleys here or someone like Cerri a marriage coach on Saveyourmarriage site - lot cheaper???
Might be a good move no matter what response you get.

Very good plan B letter FNC! I think i'm going to use it almost word for word. Just to clarify a little WH has always said that he knows he's coming home, he just needs to "get things together first." Im not sure what the heck he needs 4 days for i asked both him and MIL that and got no answer. When i played my wh's messages to me for ow's answering machine i realized i was ready to play hardball. I avoided doing that for months because i was so afraid that he would divorce me. When i did that it made me happy. Let HER cry herself to sleep everynight! She was so smug and condescending telling her relatives she wouldnt believe anything i said unless she seen it with her own eyes or heard it from my H's lips. I gave Wh enough rope to hang himself with his own words. Okay, enough about insignificant nuisances.
Counselling? I want to but I dont think WH will agree to it, I guess i could try huh?

Couselling should be non-negotiable, just like no contact..........whats the use of having him back if hes just going to fall right back into the old behaviour which led to the affair in the first place.
YOU are willing to change and so MUST he!!!

four days sounds like a man that has a newyears party planned with his ow..

probably plans on getting you mad enough in the next few days that you kick him out so he will be innocent in the fact he HAS to go to her....

give a day or two to plan..build up the excitement....
then the big night..
and a day to recover...
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

ark