The forecast in this area is for thick fog. Man, was our MC session hard today. WH is so out of it. He still hasn't ended it with OW. He says he thought it would be easier like he could do it in one visit or a phone call. NC, of course, is a big priority for me. DUH! I think he's probably running her around as much as me. He's still nattering on about his work. He's still mad at me for exposing him. Can't figure out what possible good that it did. Of course, it's all about him. He takes things in the worst way. He saw an email where I said his brother was angry and he took it to mean that his brother was going to kick his butt. Any vent from me is an expression of no love.

WH has a really big problem with qualifying statements: maybe, probably, sort of, kind of. Our therapist talked about how I could feel better if things were a little more absolute and he was less "slippery". That S-word punched a really big, red button on him. WH threatened to walk out of the session, to quit the marriage then and there. Intense anger. Can't figure why anybody would have the opinion that he's slippery. Later said that to him slippery=a$$h0le. Instead of that word, we started phrasing it as a lack of absoluteness. Funny, what set him off.

Talked about how he wonders what I've said to the kids, what spin I've put on things to make them think poorly of him. Our oldest and quite passionate, free thinking son sent WH an email at work that was apparently blocked by the IT people. WH said that IT said it contained profanity and a death threat and WH had them delete it without even reading it. Wonders what horrible things I could have possibly said to make our son so angry. Like the truth? I said. Unfortunately, many young men, including my son, use words that often aren't very nice. WH said an email like that could have made him lose his job! Of course, the reverse babble to that was that having an affair with a co-worker could also make him lose his job and that didn't seem to bother him.

Wh bristled when I said the kids were disappointed that he never offered to take them shopping or out for something before Christmas. He wondered why I didn't say anything LAST WEEK INSTEAD OF NOW!?! Clueless. Totally clueless. I don't think it even occurred to him that he should see his kids.

So, where do we stand on this? We're trying to work on him being more absolute in his comments and actions and me being less angry. It's a nasty circle. We're going to try the passed back and forth notebook to record our thoughts. Written things are concrete and not open to subjective memory.

We were mad but he asked me out for a beer at our favorite brewery afterwards. We talked some more and tried to setup some kid time for him. The kids aren't toO keen on it. My counselor asked me if I really wanted to work on this marriage or bail out now. I said I had to see it through to the bitter end. That the issues had to be resolved one way or another. It's hard. Whatever happens, I don't want to have any doubts.

Uh-huh . . . now that your WH has seen that he can have both his wife and his girlfriend and you will not stand up to him, he has started bullying you to make *sure* you don't start giving him any trouble and will stay in your place. Expect him to get worse, because you are now showing him that you will go along with this charade too and play the game exactly the way *he* wants to play it.

I used to get The Word Game played on me, too. I didn't DARE call what he was doing "dating". I didn't DARE refers to his co-workers as "girlfriends." If I didn't call it dating, then it wasn't dating. If I didn't call them girlfriends, then they weren't girlfriends. It was all something else, like "Teambuilding" and "co-workers," and using those terms made it all okay. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

After several months of walking on eggshells about the semantics of what he was doing, my head finally exploded. I told him I was sick of pretending and tap-dancing around reality. Where did he get the lying idea that if you don't call something what it is, then that's not what it is??? He was furious but I did not ever back down on this again.

Your WH is still playing you. I am afraid that like many BSs, you have the idea that if you can present yourself as "better" than the OP, your WS will somehow wake up and pick you. That is not how cheating works. It is not a choice between which woman he likes better. He has chosen to have both a wife *and* a girlfriend, and you and the OW are giving him what he wants.

Didn't you already do a good Plan A over Christmas and your anniversary? Given your WH's behavior, what is to be gained by continuing Plan A? I'm jes' askin' . . .
Mulan

Carol, I agree with Mulan that you need to plan B, but I am not sure what that means for MC. I loved the "slippery" comment, it has my WH's name written all over it. It is amazing how some men can take simple terms you say and misconstrue it into something totally different and at the same time be very evasive or "not absolute" with their own words. "I don't know" is my husbands favorite. I think one of the biggest struggles for men during times like these is the control issues. How dare their wife tell them what they can and can not do!!! Well Carol you and I both know that in order to survive we must put our foot down at some point.
I am sorry that your kids are seeing a side of their Dad that makes them dislike him. I have one who doesn't really care if she sees him or not. My other D is struggling with loyalty. Angry that her Dad had an EA but justifying it because he was so unhappy. I told him that he needed to tell her it is wrong to step out of the marriage for any reason. I don't want her thinking that marriage is disposable like so many people think it is. I understand your need to see this thing through. Just stay well and let us know when you need a shoulder.

I am in a Princess Bride mood today, HC - I've already quoted it once on the board.

Your husband's reaction to "slippery" reminds me of Miracle Max's wife dancing around her husband chanting "humperdink! humperdink!"

I don't know. probably not a good idea to pull. but I'm just in a weird mood.

Inconceivable! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Yeah..slippery hit a little too close to home..and it has a negative association.

Sort of like the difference between referring to what the affair partners do as *screwing* instead of *making love*. Same action..but one makes ya flinch if you'd rather paint it a different way.

Slipperyness..also known as evasion..is very common for a wayward who is trying to cake eat. They DO NOT want to get pinned down and make a commitment..to anything. You could ask his favorite color and you'd likely get a disclaimer <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> .

I think MULAN is spot on. Stop playing his game by his rules and start running YOUR plan.

Noodle

Have you considered a session with Steve Harley?

I can understand your not going to PLAN B yet given your H's continued involvement with you.

My concern has been your therapist not working immediately and directly on helping WH establish NC with the OW? There is no need for discussion about this. He needs to understand that this has to be done in order for you to have a marriage. Is your therapist an experienced MC? What are her credentials?

Do you buy at all the Harleys' notion about an A being like an addiction?

HC.....

Listen to these guys.....take the ball and move it to your own court!

Stop play "word games" with WH. He's keeping the "game" in his court, and HE'S his own referee!

I found this out the hard way, let things go on too long. When WH finally realized he no longer had control of the "game", he came on over to my court.....it's not a game if there is no one on the other side of the net to hit the ball back to you!

I hope you "see" what I'm saying! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Be strong!

K

I'm trying to get ball control but it's really hard. This is a hard time of year, too. We have more time on our hands, people are home for the holidays and our routine is different. I'm hoping I can do things differently come January.

I have considered a session with Steve H. I think our MC is doing well but perhaps WH would have more respect for a male counselor. I am getting nowhere on the NC thing. It isn't something our counselor focuses on although she's good at many other things. We have a lot of issues to talk about. I know that NC is a big part of MB. Believe me, I really want it to happen. I don't know how to get much but lies from WH.

Sometimes, a lot of the people on the forum seem really negative. At first reading, I feel a bit put upon. After the next reading, I put that aside. I know that everybody has been through this and you know the tricks of the cheaters. I've only been at this for 2 months. I'm willing to learn what I can. I'll make mistakes. I can't see dragging it all out for too long. WH says he needs time to figure it out. In January, I'm going to make sure he gets that opportunity. Once we get back into homework and sports practice and game and all the other events that happen, there's not going to be time for him to just pop by. (He is calling before he comes.)

I'm checking the SH counseling page now.

Carole:

At least think about scheduling a session with Steve Harley for yourself in order to get his perspective on your next step. He considers himself a MARRIAGE COACH. He is a pure genius regarding this stuff.