Hi,
I'll try and summarize this as quickly as I can.
I posted several weeks ago on Divorce/Divorcing..
I left my husband approx. 3 yrs. ago for another man, as practically none of my 'needs' were being met. That didn't last very long, but I still moved out with our children (5)...and have sinced learned alot about myself...and what went wrong with our marriage etc. I want desparatly to try again with my soon to be ex. He sends my mixed signals and is making it even harder. The past few weeks we have been getting along quite well...I even make up excuses to go talk to him. He jokes about things in our past...We have a 'big' court date this wednesday...and I DON'T want to go. This has been in the legal system for 3 yrs now (doesn't that tell you something?).
I tried explaining to him last week how I felt, and that I'd like to put off the date and take baby steps to see if we 'like each other'. He did not answer yes or no...but we continued with a great conversation. Well...last night I dropped the kids off by him, and we were getting along great again...and I asked him if he thought about what I said..he said 'a little'...then I asked about wednesday..and he said 'I'm pretty sure I'll be seeing you in court'....argh.....he's the most stubborn man I've ever known (but I love him to death). I don't think our marriage had a chance from day one for many reasons....and I know neither one of us had a clue how much work was actually involved in keeping a marriage together. He blames me totally for everything...and I accept my contribution to our downfall..but he just doesn't want to learn. He also was with someone for awhile, but that didn't last long either. That was after we separated. I also asked him last night if he would at least sit down and talk with me before the court date, and he said 'yes, If I actually have something to say'!!
I really feel as though we belong together...I know I broke this mans heart....and it kills me knowing that we didn't even try to work things out after my 'affair'.....we at least deserve a chance as well as our children....I hope you can understand this post somewhat...I just re-read it and its a bit unorganized...sorry!!

Nancy, welcome. You're in a good place.

Honestly? You say you have learned a lot. But you are blaming your STBX (soon to be ex) for your affair:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I left my husband approx. 3 yrs. ago for another man, as practically none of my 'needs' were being met. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This tells me you haven't looked at what really happened. Maybe your STBX is picking up on that?

You are ENTIRELY at fault for your affair and leaving your husband, no ifs and or buts. The marriage itself is a different thing altogether.

Have you had any counseling during this time, either IC (individual counseling) or MC (marriage counseling).?

Hi Maddyk
Thanks for responding. No...I'm not blaming my stbx for the affair...but her did play a part. We we married for 16 yrs at the time. I was alone most of that time, raising 5 little kids with minimal help. If I saw him an hour or two a day it was alot. Yes...I know, he was out working for us...but how can there be an 'us' when there is only one? He made 'large' financial purchases on his own..never talked about his day, kept everything to himself. I had no one to talk to. I would imagine I kept having children to fill part of that lonliness. I tried telling him that I needed his companionship...he come home a little earlier (self employed) for about a week...then right back to the same old thing.I eventually starting 'talking' to a male friend (big mistake)and you know what happens then. I have 'grown up' alot. Yes, I had some counselling on my own as hubby won't have any part of that..he thinks its a sign of weakness. I believe I used to think it was his job to keep me happy....but now I am comfortable with myself.
He accepts no part in the downfall of our marriage.....

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> No...I'm not blaming my stbx for the affair...but her did play a part. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Oh really? What part did he play...you or the OM? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

You made a choice to seek out another relationship. Your H had no part in you making that choice. </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I eventually starting 'talking' to a male friend (big mistake)and you know what happens then. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This is YOUR mistake, no one elses. The sooner you accept accountability for your own choices and actions, the sooner you will find the path to recovery.

Your H may have played a part in the decline of the quality of your marriage but the A was ALL you. You could have just as easily packed up the kids and left without having an A. Your H probably would have had more respect for you this way and may have been more receptive to restoring the M.

After 3 years of LBing and not accepting accountability I can see why he is hesitant. You do not seem the least bit remorseful of your actions and you are still placing blame for your actions on your H's shoulders. </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I left my husband approx. 3 yrs. ago for another man, as practically none of my 'needs' were being met. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

Hopefully more experienced MBers will chime in here as I'm not the best at advice <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> It is slow on the weekends, especially where this is a holiday weekend so don't get disouraged if you do not get much response right now.

Have you read this site? Not the forums, but the Basic Concepts, the infideltiy links, etc? If not, please do so. I definitely see hope in your situation, but also feel you should understand what happened a little more. Surviving an Affair and His Needs/Her Needs are EXCELLENT books and I think you would find them particularly useful to you.

One thing you'll learn as you read through the site and hopefully the books--get the notion that your husband has any fault in you having an affair. That one is ALL on you...completely. You could've made different choices.

It seems to me that your husband contributed to an atmosphere which made an affair possible. The difference may seem subtle to you, but it is not. This is really the first step you truly need to understand if you are to have any hope in rebuilding your marriage. The affair is all you, but the condition of the marriage beforehand is 50/50. This site and those books explain all this in a way that makes sense. I hope you'll read through the site. Your court hearing is soon so you probably wouldn't be able to get and read the books before then.

Please please please read the site. I think you'll find the words you need to say to your husband in order for him to consider stalling the divorce. Can't promise you anything, but you just may. And words MUST be followed with actions. Words mean nothing..but you're on an urgent timeline so perhaps you'll find something that is enough to stall him.

Summarising this history may not have been a good idea Nancy. We don’t charge for space so detail as much as you can to help the long time experienced Mb’ers here to advise as best they can. Perhaps it’s the way you wrote the post that I see a number of things here.

Now as with the other posters I have to agree that you still show signs that you think the affair is partially your H fault… BEEP wrong
YOU and only YOU choose that path.
Yes your H may have made the affair an easier choice for you to make by being remote in the M - my problem I think too by the way - BUT you choose to cheat and commit adultery.

That’s a tough word to swallow Nancy but it’s the right one.

Ok that said, you must therefore accept that responsibility totally as yours, don’t EVER try to say if only he did this or if only he had done that, that is just tyring to avoid your responsibility and your H will pick it up a mile away.

Now I would suggest your H is giving you some small window of opportunity to talk to him before the court case but is clearly saying I don’t think I can ever trust you and I think I want to go ahead with the divorce.

So this is where you may be getting a one & only chance to hold things in limbo to give you time to demonstrate to him YOU have changed and will not betray him again.

YOU MUST be totally honest with your H and accept the adultery was & is only yours and that you are asking him for the opportunity to show him you have changed. Forget about trying to get him to any MC right now, the aim is to stop the divorce and work on small steps to show you want the M and him and will do almost anything for that chance.

And start off with a simple sincere I’m sorry I hurt you and cheated on you . He did not deserve the pain you have inflicted on him then or over the last 3 years so if you truly feel that way tell him.
If you lie I suspect he can tell that now from a 100 feet away.

I think you have a uphill battle here Nancy as 3 years separation is a long time and I can surely understand his reluctance to let you back into his life. He may be just so worn out and sick of the pain & hurt he just wants OUT. BUT that said, we have a few stories here where couples have even divorced and the FWS did not give up but worked and worked and worked and they actually got remarried.

What I see you have going for you is the increasing good times the both of you are having especially talking about the past. A good basis to build on and you may want to work on this positive position as part of your request to your H when you ask him to hold on for a while with the divorce proceedings.
Make sure you detail to him the MC you are getting and the personal improvements you have made taking up responsibility.

The other thing you must make very clear to your H is that you will answer any questions he wants to know about the Affair, OM, whatever, even if he asks the same question over and over and over. Advise him you realise it will be very painful for him and for you to discuss this but if it is what he wants then be willing to do and tell him this. Ans honestly over and over if that is what it takes.

I did the same perhaps trying to catch her out in a lie or understand what, when and how...not sure.

Please have a good think about what you want to say and if possible maybe you will want to post it here and ask for feedback in case you are not giving the right message… this will be a tough one Nancy…
MB will help you a lot and you can get a lot of advice and feedback though its slow on the weekends.

I’ll ask my wife who posts here also to drop by and have a talk as she says I’m very stubborn and pigheaded as well. Probably true and a lot of what your H says I have too.
And it wont hurt to let him know that you realise he has all the moral right in the world to divorce you but you are asking him to reconsider to allow you to show him the new you.

Now read the pages here and consider and plan your words...good luck

Yes....the AFFAIR was my choice...and my choice alone!!! Yes...I have regretted what I did since it happened, and it tears my heart out everytime I think about how much I hurt my husband!!! I have worked on me as a person for these past several years, and I just know if he will give me the chance, we could have the great marriage that we deserved. I also realize that he has every right in the world to not want to postpone the divorce....I accept that too....and I hate myself for ever putting my family in this situation.....if I could just have this choice though....I spoke with him a couple of hours ago, and he said, yes he would like to talk tomorrow. I could sit here right now and think of everything I want to say to him...but when I sit face to face .....my mind goes blank and I talk 'stupid'....then I feel like a nervous little school girl...then I think he must think I'm crazy...!!! I just want the right words to come...I need them to come to me. I don't want to appear as if this is a desperate attempt to come back as the divorce is getting closer...as that is not true at all. Like I said, if he choses to continue the D...I will accept that...and then continue to pursue him....if he'll let me!!

Nancy, how are you at writing? Could you write out your thoughts clearly, logically and sincerely?

There have been times, even face to face with my husband, where I have written stuff down. I explained to him that it was easier for me to read what I wrote so that I did not get too confused and off track within my emotions. So I wrote what I'd say, then face to face, read out loud.

Have you read through the site yet? It might give you some ideas on you can get your thoughts and feelings across clearly.

Hi, Nancy. Checking to see how you're doing.

Have you read through any of the site yet? If so, what are your thoughts on what you've read?

Have you decided how you will approach this with your husband?

Well I spoke with my husband yesterday. I began by taking full responsibility for my choice of having an A, and how I regret each day how much I hurt him & our family. I told him that i wish so much that I could go back and fix this mistake, but unfortunatly I cannot. I could barely talk as the tears in my eyes were overwhelming....I asked him if he would consider postponing our wednesday court date for 2 months to work on us...and see if we could possibly begin a reconciliation. He told me that he had forgiven me for what I had done, and he also apologized for making the A such an easy choice for me. He also said he realized I tried talking to him many times before it actually happened, but he didn't "hear" me. He then said that he would like to put an 'end' to this...then start working at friendship, and see if we could start new. Said it wouldn't matter if we went to court this week or not. Hmmmmm....not really what I wanted to hear....I just don't want to divorce him. I wanted to beg him...but I did not do that. I told him he certainly had every right to continue with this divorce...but I also said that I truely believe we could have a terrific marriage as we both have grown so much. I told him that I wanted to be his wife again... Then he told me that he doesn't want a wife...he said he has always been so independent that he probably should have never gotten married to anyone....well....he did marry me...and we DO have 5 children....I think they also deserve the chance to have an intact family. I don't know...I barely slept at all last night. Oh...we actually wound up talking and having a great time laughing etc...for over 4 hours!!! I kept catching him staring at me...then I would just look deep into his eyes and see the feelings he still has for me....oh I could just scream!!!!
This may also sound selfish and off point here...but realistically speaking...we own a large farm, we physically built our home together...I don't want him to 'buy me out'...I still want this to be our place. Please...any helpful words would be great at this time as I am so frustrated this morning.

bump......

nancy, i'm sorry things didn't go exactly how you'd hope but I'd say they went fairly well, wouldn't you? You seemed to have handled it well, and he seemed to be receptive to what you had to say.

I agree that divorce is not the answer. Divorce is devastating even if you plan on remarrying each other. My husband said to me, "I think we'd have a much better chance between us if we divorced and started dating each other again." I think I burst out laughing on that one. Sorry bud, divorce is my 'dealbreaker'!! It could be, nancy, that this is too 11th hour for him and he doesn't see how it can be stopped this close to the date. Sort of getting married and feeling like you're too close to the altar to change the course of events.

Can you think of anything that might persuade him? I think your "timeline" of delaying for just a couple of months was a good. What if you ask him to seriously reconsider? That you will do all the INITIAL work of setting up counseling (even if you have to do it alone at first) and making a plan to work on things. What about if you promise him that you will facilitate the divorce as much as possible if that is still his wish after X amount of time? Just be careful of "begging".

Let us know how you're doing with this. Hopefully folks will chime in and give useful suggestions.

sorry...just bumping myself up again...really hoping to hear from you....

nancy, good..you should keep bumping. I bump my thread every day.

I still think you should make a recovery plan to show to your husband. Write it down. Use the concepts in this site. Show your husband...tell him that this plan is what you would like to do if he can hold off on divorce proceedings. Show him HOW you will accomplish all of this. Try to show him that you are for real.

Do you know for certain if your husband is seeing/dating someone, or not?

Pep

Hi Pep
No..he is not seeing anyone. He was for awhile, but that ended long ago.

Plan some family outings.

Work at drawing him toward you rather than chasing him down.

Expect and accept ambivilance and distrust from him as par for the course.

Be more patient than you have ever imagined yourself being.

Make a list of your H's top 5 ENs ... and work your butt off filling those needs.

Avoid lovebusters .... your first post is full of DJs (disrespectful judgments)

Pep

Hi again~
I wrote the first post rather quickly...which I now ralize I shouldn't have. Could you help me out with the disrespect? I would imaging that you are referring to when I said MY needs weren't being met? That did sound a bit selfish...
As for his top 5 EN's...thats gonna be hard. He is SO independent (isn't that one of the BIG love busters)that he always say's he doesn't need anyone...or anything from anyone....his biggest need seems to be independence.

Nancy,

I posted to you on your other thread, but independence is a form of self-protection. I would guess he has become more independent since your moving out and affair, or to put it another way, he does not trust enough to trust you with his life. This can be changed, but it takes time.

God Bless,

JL

nancy,

Independence is not always a good thing. Your H may have felt little cause to meet your ENs because he did not need you to meet his. You probably met more of his ENs then he realizes.

Meeting each others ENs helps to maintain the bond between a H and a W. Cutting that emotional tie is a recipe for disaster.

You seem to feel strongly that not having your ENs needs met was the reason for you straying. If your H does not wish to see a counselor with you perhaps you could persuade him to review the Emotional Needs Questionnaire with you.

Simply showing remorse for your actions gives your H no assurance that you will not stray again. You need to convince him why you believe you strayed and why it won't ever happen again.

You will need his help AND he will need yours if there is any chance of saving your marriage.