Yep, just checked and it came back. I'll try again but I do have the correct addy.

Weaver:

Okay, I don't know what's wrong with that E-mail, I just sent it something, and you're right, I didn't receive my own letter....lovely.

How 'bout c_mcmannis_68@hotmail.com that one works.

Sorry,

Caren

P.S.: He's coming over this morning to take a shower.....I'm gonna dress all sexy, hope he takes the bait...keep your fingers crossed.

Okay, for some reason my "pieces" email account wasnt working, but it appears to be now, for what it's worth....lol.

-Caren

Caren,

That post about your interaction with your WH is an EXCELLENT description on how to do Plan A!! This is the first "adda boy" I have given in awhile. But you get one.

Yes, it is draining to do though. Why? Because you are having fun, you are laughing, you are thinking sexual thoughts...only at the end of the day to go back to your home, as if nothing has changed. But you have to believe me on this...EVERYTHING has changed. You see, he was calling you it seems like every hour. Over little, stupid stuff. You think that man cant find the soap in a grocery store? Pulease!?!?! It is an excuse to tell himself so that he can have contact with YOU!! To give himself permission to contact you, hear your voice, laugh with you.

At the end of the day, he will tell himself that it was nothing. That he just was being friendly...getting along for the sake of the kids...and other nonsense that WSs tell themselves (straight out of the WS Babble Handbook). But you know what? He is lying to himself. He WANTS to talk to you. He WANTS to laugh with you. He just doesnt want to admit that to himself. But you KNOW better.

You want off the rollercoaster during all of this? Then you need to be able to discern between truth and babble. Between what is real and what is addicted mind is telling himself (and others). Once you can see the truth and discern it from the lies, then you need to ignore the lies! And concentrate on the truth.

The truth of your interaction with him is that he wanted to talk to you. He is comfortable with you. And you can bet your bottom dollar that when he left, he missed you. And so, if you keep this up, he will try again.

Now, do not make the typical BS mistake by educating him. What do I mean by that? Dont go up to him days from now when he has a relapse (and he will) and wants to be mean and nasty again. And then you say "But I thought we were getting along so well. You showed me that you want to be with me." And stuff like that. He will deny it, or change it around to reflect something else. You see, the WS has no ability to discern truth from babble (fogese). But you do. So, just let it lie. Each interaction like this one that you had, will build units in his love bank.

Now, let me tell you what happens with that. What you wont know for awhile...what he will keep from you...is as those love units build up, he will be in PAIN!! He will be on his own rollercoaster, as he lashes back and forth between wanting to be with you, and fighting those feelings. But, since you WILL ignore the babble, ignore when he is nasty...he will be left with his pain alone. The OW cant help him with it. You know why? Because she is not YOU...and your husband is addicted to you. She cant meet the needs that you do. There is no way possible. You have history...children. You know each other. You are family. The OW is none ofthese things.

So, you have the advantage here. It may not feel like it at times. And he may not show it many times. But you have to trust that he is going thru pure hell right now. He is asking himself "What in the world am I doing? Do I really want to leave my wife? If I go back, will she accept me? What about all of the damage I have caused?" And so on.

He will be all over the place for a little while longer. And one of two things will then happen. Either he will accept what he has done, and see where he should be...and come home. Or, you will build up a ton of love units in his love bank, he will be in extreme emotional pain and missing you...and then you will go to Plan B. And then he will have none of you.

Ever seen what happens to a druggy going thru withdrawal? It isnt pretty. And if you continue to do what you did that day for the next 6-8 weeks...and then pull it all out from under him, guess what will happen to him? He will be in so much pain, that he wont know what to do with himself. He will try to get you to re-establish contact. But you wont, without the OW gone. He will run to her, pleading with her to meet his needs. But she cant...and she actually will become angry because she doesnt want to meet those needs. He will look needy and clingy. It will definitely turn her off to him.

Each time he tries to contact you under Plan B, you will just hand him another copy of your Plan B letter...and remain dark (no contact with him). And within weeks, he will most likely break.

Caren, not all of these things go this way. But MOST do. Mine did. And so far, your husband seems to be a prime candidate also. So, keep up the good work. Keep posting here. Weed out the babble and concentrate on the truth. Actually, as much pain he has caused you, you can get a little "enjoyment" out of this because you can sit back and watch him on the rollercoaster...the one you refuse to ride anymore.

You have ALL of the power now. You are using it well. Now, get off the emotional rollercoaster and realize this. Then you wont be thinking about suicide...but see that everything is going according to plan.

Of course, remember...God works all things for the good of those who love Him and obey.

In His arms.

Okay, so he's here right now....in the shower. He didn't even call before he came over...hmmmmm, oh well I knew he was coming. I made a big hairy deal about the plant he'd bought me flowering (it just bloomed today) I was like "Look! My plant bloomed...it's so beautiful!".

I'm all dolled up, but he's ignoring that I'm walking around in a camisole...lol. I just talked to him like I always walk around the house at 10am in a red camisole with make up on and my hair done..LOL. Maybe he's waiting until after he's clean to hit on me.....*crosses fingers*. I don't know, I may have to go and make the first move, or try to rather....if he turns me down I'll just have to find a way to be happy anyway....

Wish me luck!

Caren

Caren,

Good luck! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

But, remember...even though you may not get the overt reaction you want...inside, your flower deal (and especially the camisole!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> ) will have their effect on him. This will take time. Count on, even if he hits on you, that there may be a backlash tomorrow due to guilt.

This is a long process. Stay in control. Stay with the truth. You are doing great!! You remind me a lot of Mimi and what happened with her husband and her. And they are happily together now. Go back and read her threads. They will show you how it all works.

In His arms.

Caren,

The help you are getting from Mortarman and others is 100 times better than what my email said. I just wanted to keep in touch with you in case you stopped posting again (which you are very good at doing BTW, so stop it and stick around for awhile).

I LOVE reading what Mman is saying about what is going on in Whubby's head.

Pay attention and stick around girl! Rooting for you all the way to come through this like the beatiful creature that you are! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

edited to add - go ahead and delete second email if you like cuz i got them, and we don't want to give up your anonomity in case OW starts reading here.

<small>[ January 04, 2005, 10:29 AM: Message edited by: weaver ]</small>

Today's Score: Caren 1 - FogMan 0

LOL, well...he was playing it off for about a 1/2 hour, then he came downstairs before he'd shaved (to smoke a cigarette) he leaned up, and I acted like I saw something on his back, I said "Oh hon...lean up a sec" He always liked having his back "picked" (I know that's gonna gross people out..lol) so I am back there looking at his back, then I was looking at his shoulder, and I said, "Hang on I can't see this one" and straddled him, but still kept pretending it was all about the zit LOL!! Well that got a reaction (physically) but he still didn't make any moves, so I said, "will you look at my back?" I turned around and he was looking (As if....I don't have bacne....there was NOTHING to pick on me) then he slid off the straps of the camisole...and that was all she wrote. Yippee...go me.

He left 2 shirts over here in my laundry (accidentally - of course) and I was talking to him about them, I said "What happened to that white shirt...it's got mud on it" He said "Does it?? Sheesh, the dogs must have stepped on it" He's REALLY picky about his clothes, and I said "you know there's some anti-persperant build up on it too....do you want me to try to get that out for you?" He said "Yeah, can ya?" I said "sure". Then I asked him if he had other shirts at home that needed any work, he said "Yeah, but just wait and see if you can get the stains out of that one." I said "okay" So I am going to be scrubbing the heck outta that thing.

I also made him the Brats, and he ate like he hadn't eaten in a week....lol. He has a convertible (it's kinda a beater) and it's been raining the past few days, and apparently the rag top has a wicked leak so both front seats are soaked. So while he was in the shower I stuck my head in the bathroom door and said "Hey...I have my friends upolstery cleaner over here, you wanna try to suck up some of the water from your seats?" He said "Yeah!"

I also went on about the flower some more (I suck at taking care of plants...I kill them). I said "Do you think the plant needs more water now that it's flowering?" He felt the dirt and said "No, it's good for now" I said "Okay, thanks...It's so pretty I don't want to kill it" Then I looked around the living room (he hung my pictures up when I was gone too) and I said "Thanks a lot for hanging those pictures...it looks a lot different in here with something on the walls." So then he starts telling me about when he and my daughter we hanging them....(he made her go and take a screwdriver off the next door neighbors porch to pry out the nails left in the wall from the last tenants) I said "Yeah, Brooklyn told me that you had her get that screwdriver...she said 'Daddy made me steal'" He started laughing I said "She said 'Daddy said, go get that screwdriver, and made me steal it'" (I'm laughing) I said "I told her it wasn't stealing it was borrowing, they're our friends and would take something off of our porch if they needed to use it".

He went out and tried to suck the water out of his seats, but it didn't really work very well, I said "Do you need a new towel for your seat?" He said "Yeah this ones soaked" I got him a big beach towel and said "Here let me have that one and I'll wash it for you"

Then he said "I gotta go" I said "Okay....have a good day at work" He said "Yeah right" (Hmmm isn't this where we see HER??!) I giggled and said "Well...try to have a good day" He said "Okay, I'll talk to you later" I said "Okay" and walked back in the house.

So he spent about 3 hours over here this morning...and it went well. I will be aware that the backlash will be coming, and try not to let it bother me.

I hope the OW wants to know where the towel came from LMAO, it's blatantly a childs beach towel, it's Disney....LOL!!!

Momentarily Victorious,

Caren

Weaver...what are you trying to say?? LOL I know, I'm bad about posting for a while then dropping off the face of the planet for a month...I'll work on that...lol

Does anyone have a link to Mimi's story?? I tried to just pull it up by her name, but she's posts so much all I got was stuff from Dec 28th forward.

Thanks,

Caren

Okay, while I was at the Crisis center my pastor came and talked to me, and he called me a few minutes ago and told me he was going to go and talk to my husband....I'm understandably freaking out, but this man is on a mission, and he's understandably concerned about me, and there was going to be no stopping him from going up there, so I just took a deep breath and decided I'd have to roll with it.

Well, he went up there, and my H just called me, I debated about whether or not to answer the phone, and decided I probably should, so I said "Hello" He said "What are you doing?" I said "Getting ready to go to the doctor" he said "Oh, well, guess who just came in to see me?" I said "Who?" He said "Well who have you been talking to lately?" I said "Sheesh a lot of people...who came in?" He said "Your minister." I said "Seriously?" He said "Yeah" (Not too thrilled tone in his voice) I said "Oh, what'd he say?" He said "He wants me to come and talk to him....he said he's been counseling you, but he wanted to hear my side of the story, because it was hard to counsel you only having your side..." I said "Oh, well what'd you say?" He said "I'm gonna meet with him, I'm going over there tommorrow before work." I said "Are you mad?" He said "No...but what does he want? I hope he's not trying to get us back together" I didn't say anything, so he continued and said "I'm gonna go talk to him, and tell him my side, if it'll help him 'counsel' you, is that what he's been doing? Have you been going to him for counseling?" I said "Well, not exactly...I told you he came to see me at the clinic" He said "yeah" then he said "Did you tell him where I work??" I said "Well I don't remember, but I must have, otherwise he wouldn't have known" (Really don't remember when or why I told him that) I said "Well, do you want me to call and talk to him?" He said "No, I'm gonna go up there tommorrow" I said "Well, okay, call me when you get back" He said "Okay I will" I said "Well, I'm sorry he ambushed you" He said "That's okay" Then he said "Well I'll let you go so you can go to your doctors appointment" I said "Okay" and we hung up.

I am FREAKING OUT! I don't know if this puts a snag in plan A or not. I mean, I really did want him to talk to him, he makes a lot of sense....and I have been working with the minister, and praying A LOT. I don't know what he's going to say to my H, maybe he can say something that my husband's never thought of...who knows, but I seriously doubt my H is gonna stroll in there and tell him he's having an Affair. My husband isn't a really religious person, he doesn't attend church, but he does believe in God, and so I'm wondering if this may not be a good thing....who knows, I'm sure I'll get the brunt of it if it makes him mad.

I'm going to have a coronary!!! The doctor better give me something to sleep, or I won't be sleeping tonight.

-Caren

Caren,

This is GREAT!! You did perfect. Your husband is going to sit down with your pastor, who knows everything...and try to explain the unexplainable. And your pastor is going to have time to "counsel" him. The very fact he is going should be good news to you. Many WSs wont even go.

Even if your husband doesnt readily accept what your pastor says at the time, the seeds will be planted by him. More Plan A stuff, isnt that great. And this time, someone else was helping!! You are building something here, one brick at a time. This can only help!!

So, take it easy...you are doing great. Now let the next step be tomorrow with the pastor. Then you can move forward a little more.

In His arms.

Hi caren:

I'm trying to get an understanding of your situation if you don't mind.

Why are you and your H not living together?

You are doing a GREAT PLAN A, BTW.

Also, how old is your H and how old is the suspected OW?

I will check back later.

Mimi:

My husband and I don't live together because when this all started and he told me he loved me but wasn't in love with me...and I suspected this OW, I moved out, I couldn't take staying there knowing he loved me but wasn't IN love with me. This is of course PRE-MB's, I didn't find this site or the books until after I'd moved here. Some people advised me then to move back in with him, but he wouldn't have let me, he was satisfied that I was outta there.

I am 36, I'll be 37 this month, my husband is 35 and the OW is 33. I'm glad she's no younger...sheesh.

I try not to think about her a whole lot, but she is so opposite of everything he ever found attractive, she's short, has long brown hair...straight never curls it or does anything but put it in a pony tail, she wears no make up, (not that this is a bad thing except he LIKES makeup)....I dunno, if I think about her too much it almost makes me physically ill, I don't hate anybody in this world, but she pushes the envelope. (When I think of hate I think of someone I wouldn't care if they got hit by a bus, and lemme tell you I have a great deal of trouble trying to care about her getting hit by a bus....I mean as long as I'm not driving the bus...it wouldn't be my fault...LOL)

Mimi can you put a link to your story on here for me, I'm told it's a good read.

Mortar - thank you for your input, I really hope this is a good thing, and he wasn't irate like I'd expected.

Oh....1 other thing, I have never told the pastor I suspect that there's another woman...I don't think, sheesh I'm not even sure, my brain is so scrambled...I think I didn't tell him that because I had no hard evidence.

I'm such a freak about calling someone a liar unless I have concrete evidence they lied, I know I'd never want anyone to think I was lying, so I hate to prejudge anyone that way.

*sigh* Okay, I'm going to the store now, I have to try to eat something today, when they weighed me at the doctor today I'm down to 120...I'm going to disappear here soon, I'm like 5'7" tall.

-Caren

Oh also on the OW, she's never been married, never had any children, just bought her own home.

Her last boyfriend was an older veterinarian...makes me wonder now if he was married too.....stupid skank

--Caren

Hi Caren:

I'm sorry that I may not have much time over the next 24 hrs.

I don't know much about the computer stuff but I think you can do a search using my name or number.

I have another question. How can you afford to live separately from your H?

I had that same script of "I'm not in love with you anymore". It's all fog talk! My FWH tells me that he loves me all throughout the day now.

You'll need TIME AND PATIENCE and belief in the MB SYSTEM.

Hang in there....

How can I afford to live on my own? Answer is BARELY, I'm barely scraping by....and the really cool thing is that I probably going to lose my job....I have been taking this so hard, that I have missed like 7 days...all excused, but they're all being hard nosed about it...so whatever, I really can't worry about that...I just can't. I mean I'll try to contact my Employee Assistance Program and see what they can do, but I think I'm screwed.

On the up side my H is actually still speaking to me, I don't know if he will be after he talks to the Pastor or not. Also on the upside (which I'm sure he thinks is a downside) my husband's pet shop that he works in is most likely going out of business..which means...he won't be working around the OW, so that works perfectly for me.....skank that she is.

I really think my husband considers coming back, or getting back together rather....but then he decides against it. I think if he seriously sat down and wrote down the pros and cons of the situation I'd win out, I have to have more in the pros column than the OW. (Gosh it's really hard not to call her all the nasty names I'm thinking of calling her).

-Caren

Caren - Sounds like you are doing much better. Have you told the people at work what is going on? I didn't for a long time, but when I did, they were very understanding.

Yeah, unfortunately the buttholes do no exactly what's going on, I went in there shortly after I'd moved in to my new place, and hadn't slept in a few days, and I went in like an hour and 1/2 early to talk to them, they were not very understanding. They know all about what's going on and they frankly don't give 2 $hits about it. I work in a hospital, and they're probably going to take this latest suicide thing, where I had to go to the center, and use it to their advantage "We can't have Caren working around the sharp things...she's suicidal".

I'm just mentally cooked, I can't even think of how to approach them, they called and left a message today asking me to "Come in and talk to them about my absences" Well lets see, I am scheduled to work in 2 days, why would I need to "come in" before then...so they can tell me not to bother? Like I said, I'm going to call my employee assistance program guy tommorrow, see what he can do, I don't even wanna friggen talk to them, I really don't, I don't think I can handle it.

-Caren

From a legal perspective, you might need to go back home and let him move out if he wants to. Where I live, if I had moved out, I would not have gotten spousal support which you will qualify for if you do not have a job.

I would tell him that you can't afford it and move back home.

Of course you have more pros than the OW. You are his wife, his teammate. He won't realize that until he is out of the fog.

You have to protect yourself and your children from a legal point of view! That's a major priority since your WH is not able to think straight at this time.

<small>[ January 04, 2005, 07:19 PM: Message edited by: mimi1254 ]</small>

Well, we don't own our house, my husband makes the big $7.00 per hour. So I'll be lucky to get a decent amount in child support, much less spousal support.

I consulted an attorney before I moved, and asked him if it would hinder my case in any way by moving out, he said "He wants the divorce, right?" I said "Yes" He said "Nope". Whatever that means.

He did tell me he wanted a divorce when the $hit first hit the fan, I told him "no". He said "What do you mean no?" I said "No!" He said "Umm all I have to do is file for a divorce!" I said "And all I have to do is contest the terms until you're 80". He has only mentioned it a few other times, and each time I have told him he can try. His "plan" now or rather last time we talked about it was to wait until we'd been separated a year, and then file...he said his attorney told him that would be grounds, I have since heard that being separated a year is not grounds....I don't know for sure, it makes no difference to me, because if he indeed does file in a year, I will just contest it. This I have let him know. I will absolutely, under no uncertain terms divorce that man, I will make it my lifes work to screw up his plans if he chooses to take that route with me. I assume the divorce pressure comes from the OW, well I'll be damned if I'd give her that pleasure....let's see how long she wants to wait.

I mentioned before that she is 33, never been married, no kids. I tell you what, if that *Expletive deleted* gets knocked up, well, lets just say I hope they have their plots picked out.

-Caren