It's not quite a new day, Mimi but I'm up anyway. Either my fever has broken or the Nyquil is kicking in but my mind is working a little better. I felt we ended our posts on a bad note.

After reading your responses to my last thread, I decided to check on your history. I couldn't pull up the beginning of your misery but I could read a bit of the history. You're right, our stories do seem similiar. Right now, I don't have the patience to read everything but I have a few questions. I hope you don't find them too invasive.

Did you start sessions with SH by yourself or together with H?

Have you done a lot of sessions?

Do you continue to do sessions?

What was your FWH's journey to NC?

How long was the A?

Was OW from his work?

Did he live separately from you for a while? How long?

What finally "woke" H up? Was there a sudden epiphany or had the A run it's course?

Does any fog persist?

How long did it take you to get to recovery?

Did H ever do all the questionaires and writing?

Is H in the same job now? Does work have the same importance it did before?

Mimi, I hope you don't mind. As I laid in bed this a.m., I realized that you are a person who has gone the distance. That maybe if I knew more about your trip, I could understand my own better. Perhaps in the morning, I will try to read through your history more throughly. I hope you don't mind more questions then.

Anybody else who wants to chime in, go ahead.

<small>[ January 14, 2005, 03:17 AM: Message edited by: grapegirl ]</small>

GRAPE:

I'm sorry about how it ended last night. It was just that I spent a large part of my day yesterday (while working) posting to you. MULAN chimed in and it seemed all for naught. However, it was by my own choice so I should not have taken out my frustration on you. I know what you are going through. REALLY! Many days I did not feel like getting out of bed even when I did not have a cold. I will try to answer your questions.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Did you start sessions with SH by yourself or together with H?

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I started by myself. I was able to convince my H to do one session after my initial session. Steve found out valuable info. about my H during that one session with him. Steve determined that my H was highly addicted to the OW and he predicted that the A had no chance of lasting if I followed his recommendations to me. He gave me A PLAN and told me to follow it which I did with coaching from folks on this forum. H refused to continue with Steve and did not ever do the questionnaires. Steve coached me all the way through the entire ordeal and seemed to know exactly what would happen. I think of Steve H. as being a pure genius!! H did talk to Steve again after returning home this last time. That session also proved to be more helpful to me for the info. that Steve was able to obtain about my H's thinking at that time.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Have you done a lot of sessions?

Do you continue to do sessions?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I did a lot of sessions!! Weekly there for awhile during PLAN A!! Over the last year, during our recovery ,I haven't needed to continue. H has strictly followed the MB PLAN. However, I certainly plan to schedule with Steve when and if I need to do that.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">What was your FWH's journey to NC?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">That is a really long story, GRAPE. To make a long story short, I really think the ADDICTION concept is KEY. That's why I was frustrated last night. Steve H. really tried to drum this into me. He would say, "YOU HAVE GOT TO GET THIS! DO YOU GET IT, (MY NAME)? My FWH finally had to see and acknowledge that he was addicted to the OW. It was like smoking. I knew it was bad for me but I couldn't stop. He got to the point there at the end where he knew that the A was destroying his life but he couldn't get away from her. Also the MB PLANS were key in my case. I did a STRONG PLAN A and then PLAN B. He eventually got over there, staying with the OW, and missed me. He thought I was gone because I put our dream house up for sale, started working full-time, etc. The only way that I would take him back was with him clearly agreeing to NC FOR LIFE. He did this in letters 2 TIMES. Yes, 2 FALSE RECOVERIES. The last time I heard him say it to her on the phone, "I LOVE MY WIFE" while I heard her pleading for him to leave me. YUK!!!! I HATE HER!!!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> How long was the A

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Off and on, I think, more than 2 years.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Was OW from his work </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Is H in the same job now? Does work have the same importance it did before?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Work is a big issue. We got too much into the roles of H being the hardworking breadwinner and me being the wifey. We were the ALL-AMERICAN family. Big house, nice cars, soccer parents.... He began to feel unappreciated. I got my good feelings from the wifey role. The OW was able to pump up his ego and gave him a better feeling than the job did. It started off as a friendship with them. She just listened and gave him her undivided attention. I really can understand now how he must have needed that. The job had become mundane. At least, he wanted someone to appreciate him for what he was doing and not see him as just the person who provided the paycheck. She pretended like she didn't want his money. I think it turns out that he realized that she did. Really what she wanted is for him to share in the raising of her child and to make a new family for her. YUK...while he abandoned his own family!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Did he live separately from you for a while? How long?

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It turns out that he secretly bought a condo after D-Day. He was lonely there so eventually moved in with her. That was the beginning of there end since she lives in the ghetto, way below his lifestyle. He thought he could give up everything for her and live like that. He couldn't. That was the value of PLAN B. I played up my DOMESTIC GODDESS role during PLAN A. Candles in the bedroom, good food, clean house, decoration.... He tried to make her into me over there.. She did not have a clue!!!!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Was OW from his work </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">No. Receptionist at the office of a professional we frequented.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Did he live separately from you for a while? How long?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">D-DAY: 12/02; Move out: 2/03 to his condo. Back home 4/03 but we were in constant contact until then. 5/03: moved out again, legal separation and then PLAN B. RECOVERY: 9/03 until present.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> What finally "woke" H up? Was there a sudden epiphany or had the A run it's course?

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">PLAN B woke him up. Having to be with the OW 24/7 made him realize that it was a fantasy, that she could not really meet all of his needs, that she was not really who she was pretending to be. He now refers to it all as "BULLS(**&&^^&**T". I'm sure that he wishes that it had been real.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Does any fog persist?

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It gets less and less as time goes by. However, it does take a long while to go away. He seems like his old self again. There are certain issues where I see it coming in. I remind him how bizarre he sounds and he sort of laughs and catches himself. I think he is fully aware and understands what happened to him, like an addict. He knows the triggers and what he has to avoid.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">How long did it take you to get to recovery?

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">12/31/04: 2 Year D-Day anniversary. He has never was with her on another NEW YEAR'S EVE! THANK GOD! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Did H ever do all the questionnaires, etc. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">NO.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Is H in the same job now? Does work have the same importance it did before?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Without going into detail about this, no, he is not in the same job. He now puts his relationship with his family before work. It was an important and good outcome from the A. We don't have as much money, I now work full-time, but we don't live in the ghetto. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

***It was just that I spent a large part of my day yesterday (while working) posting to you. MULAN chimed in and it seemed all for naught.***

Sorry for threadjacking yesterday. Yesterday and the day before were very bad days for me and I have a few more to go. Grapegirl's situation does touch a nerve with me as I recognize a great deal of it. But I will stay out of it from now on.
Mulan

Mulan, Mulan, Mulan...you just chime in whenever you want to! Your comments provide another view point and I appreciate it. People may not like it but it IS another opinion. WS are similiar but not the same. All information is appreciated. My marriage is on the cusp. I don't know which direction WH will go.

Mostly Mulan, I feel you are in a lot of pain and it cuts into me deeply. I know you were having a couple really bad days and I can empathize. I wish I could reach out to you better. I'd like to know what Plans you've tried on your WH and how he's responded.

It's been a few days since you've posted this. I hope things have gotten better. ((((((((Mulan))))))))

I see that you did post and you totally ignored me.

It took me a long time to post all of this to you, Grape.

My life does not depend on appreciation from you at all. I do not post on here to particularly get anything back in return. My fignt is against all OPs and for MARRIAGES. A simple acknowledgement of my time and effort would have felt good thougn.

Do you have a pattern of not showing APPRECIATION?
It hurts me and I don't even know you. Do you do this to your WH? I hope not.

Hang in there! I do feel for you but I guess you are saying that you are not interested in hearing from me.

It seems like you are getting much stronger and I am glad that is happening for you.