Caren,

Try not to let you DD get in the middle. Your WS should not be going through her to get to you. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

Keith

Hiya caren long time lurker here. Didn't I read that you're from Ohio? I am too and not only will it not take 8 months for child support you can get help free from legal aid to file for it. Did you look into that?

C.

Caren,

Wanna know what you should be doing? Want to know how to get WH off your mind? Want to know what Plan B is REALLY about?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I'm trying to stay busy..I called the community college I was going to before the sh*t hit the fan to try to work out payment arrangements on the 500 dollars I still owe them from dropping my classes past the date, I haven't heard back from them...I need to start taking classes at least part time, because my student loans are going to come due 3/22 and I need to start back in school, so they'll extend it until I get my degree.

It so hard though. I was going to classes full time and working full time, and I'd get home whooped, and I'd have time to maybe straighten the house a little, cook dinner, do some homework and then I'd end up passing out on the couch...wasn't too great for the marriage.

I'm freaking dreading going back to work. I am making 70% of my salary because I'm on short term leave of absence, but that isn't hardly anything, I only make 8.81 an hour, and full time is 36 hours a week at a hospital (3-12 hour shifts), I won't be getting a raise in the near future, and I can't really make it on that. Especially when they take 117.00 in insurance out of my check everytime (I get paid every 2 weeks) that's brings me down to making 400ish a check, and my rent alone is $650.00 a month. So that leaves me with like $150.00 to buy food, pay utilities and anything else I may need. I get 130.00 a month in child support for DD13. I called child support about DD10, and they are sending me the papers, but they said it takes 8 MONTHS from the time they receive the papers until you actually get child support.

I am also dreading work because everyone is going to be bugging me about why I was out, what was wrong....blah blah blah.....not even my supervisors know the actual reason, so they're going to be nosey as hell...I don't know if I can deal....I need a new job, I type 80 wpm...but I hate secretarial work, I'm good at it, but I hate it....I love my job at the hospital, but I'm not making enough to survive, and I don't want to deal with the questions. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Figure this out. Improve YOU, improve your life...outside of your relationship with your husband.
You have an opportunity right now where you can put all of your energy into the rest of your life and not have to expend ANY energy on your marriage. You have everything you have to give to the other parts of your life right now. When your husband comes home, you will not have this opportunity again.

Use this time for you!! Cant you see? You need to listen to yourself. You are asking the right questions, when you arent talking about him.

I hope you can see that you dont need anyone to tell you what is right...you hae shown you understand. Question is, what are you gonna do with the opportunity you have now??

In His arms.

Mortarman......even all that stuff is so overwhelming to me.....it gets me to the place where it makes me mad I've been put in this situation.

I am going to the movies now, can't afford that either, but Oh well.

-Caren

I found these posts for you.

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=37;t=024120

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by CarenMc:
<strong> I get 130.00 a month in child support for DD13. I called child support about DD10, and they are sending me the papers, but they said it takes 8 MONTHS from the time they receive the papers until you actually get child support.

</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Just wondering, do DD10 and DD13 have the same father?

Wanna-

Nope I was married once before when I was 17,had DD19, divorced by 20, ....then I was in a relationship 5 years later and got pregnant with DD13, I had broken up with her father before I found out I was pregnant, and saw no reason to get back with him, as the reason we broke up was that we didn't get along for any length of time. I filed for child support and had DNA testing done (at his request...which did not seem unreasonable to me because when he called me for another reason after I'd found out, and I told him I was pregnant, I said "It's not yours! Don't worry about it!" .....Yes, I'm brilliant like that)child support was established, and we established visitation without the courts, he has her every other weekend and is WONDERFUL with her and helps me ANYTIME I need anything for her, he contributes A TON of money to her aside from child support, so I don't take him back for more, because there is no need, he is a fantastic Dad...just a sucky boyfriend LMAO.

-Caren

<small>[ February 20, 2005, 06:37 AM: Message edited by: CarenMc ]</small>

For the sake of people who didn't see my other post, My WH had my daughter tonight and refused to bring her home, told her to tell me I had to come and get her...I posted to ask for advice...but I only had like 20 minutes worth of time before I had to pick her up, and no one saw it in that time frame........so I was flying solo again....we need to have some kind of emergency broadcast system for me LMAO!!! Where I can get you all beepers and make you run to your puters to give me advice LOL!!!!!!!!

So....here we go. I drive over there. Pull into the driveway, call and say "I'm here, send her out" He said "NO! You can come to the door." I said "Send her out please" He said "Nope, goodbye" and hangs up on me. So I sit in my car a few minutes, I can see my daughter looking out the window, so I take a deep breath, get out of my car and go to the door and knock. He answers the door and says "Did you have fun" I said "It was okay, is she ready?" He said "Yes, have you been drinking?" I said "No, I have not been drinking" So then she comes to the door, and I said "Hi sweetheart, you ready? Let's go". So we walk out to the car (still running) and get in. He standing on the porch (the porch is about 4 steps from my car, the driveway is weird, it's like an alley that dead ends, you have to go and turn around and then head back towards the house to get back out, so I made sure I was turned around, but parked fairly close to his car, so I had to cut the wheel hard to turn out around it to get out of the driveway)I start to turn the nose of the car out of where I'm parked and he comes walking out in front of the car on DD10's side, I hit the brakes so I don't run over him and he opens her door, well the seatbelt is attached to the door, and she has it on so it will only open a little ways, so he shuts the door and motions for her to roll the window down, I think, he must want to kiss her.....so I'm looking straight ahead, he kisses her and hands her 20 dollars (for the haircut) He said "Here's some money for her haircut" I said "Okay, thank you". Then he starts to walk away. Then he walks back towards my side of the car...I'm in motion again at this point and now have the nose of the car clear of his and have started to pull beside it, my window is like 1/2 way down, he runs up beside the car reaches in the window and turns off the car. I grab for the keys at the same time, thinking he's going to take the keys out and go into his house. So his hand is on the ignition, mine is on the keys holding them into the igniton....he starts saying "You know he's married too right?" (He's refering to my friend that stopped by the other day that he's INSISTING I was with) I didn't say a word, didn't look at him, he said "You know he's married too right?", I just sighed, he said "You know he's married too right?...Answer me. I go to pull the keys out of the ignition (Away from his hand) and he thinks I'm trying to start it...he grabs the gear shift and puts it in park. He puts his hand back over the ignition so I can't put my keys in, he continues to repeat "You know he's married right?" Now that the keys are out of the ignition I have my hands free and whip out the Plan B letter I have in my purse he takes it with his free hand and throws it back into the car. I pick it up and shove it towards him again and say "You have lost any right to ask me my whereabouts or who I'm with" He said "NO I HAVEN'T! YOU ALWAYS FIND OUT WHAT I'M DOING...HELL YOU TAPPED MY GOD DAMN PHONE LINE!" I said "I went to the movies with Gwenna! We saw meet the fockers...now can you take your arm out of my car?" He said "NO!" (During this time, DD10 isn't upset and isn't scared...because I'm not getting upset (She takes her cues from me as to whether to be alarmed I think), she just keeps saying "Daddy...c'mon stop it" I said "Please take your arm out of my car." He said "NO!!!!" I picked up my cell phone I said "Okay, then I'm calling the police" He said "GO AHEAD!!!! WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO TELL THEM?" I said "That you won't let me leave." I start to dial 9-1-1 and he pulls his arm out of my car. I start it and pull away, and he just stands there with his arms folded across his chest and watches me pull away.

I looked over at DD10, I said "You okay?" She said "Yep" I said "I'm sorry Daddy's acting so crazy, he's scared" She said "I know" I said "Okay punkin."

Then the cells starts ringing, I look at the number see it's him, hit "DECLINE". He calls again.....hit "Decline" again. He calls again, I turn the phone off. I went through the drive thru and got a 12 pack of coke, and then continued home.

We get out of the car, and I'm putting the key in the door, and I can hear that someone has just hung up on my machine because the dial tone is LOUD on my answering machine when someone hangs up on it. I said "Whelp, now he's calling on the house phone" So he starts the calling onslaught on the house phone, keeps hanging up on the machine. I turn the ringer off. But you can still hear the machine....he starts saying "DD10? Honey? Pick up the phone. I just want to make sure you made it home okay." She looks at me, I said "No...we're not answering it" so I look at the phone (It lights up when the call is still connected) when the light goes off I turn the phone on, so it's off the hook. I said you can call your Daddy and tell him goodnight when we go up to bed. Are you getting tired? She said "Yes", well my DD19 was on the computer, so I started writing in my journal, about 15 minutes later DD10 says, "Mommy, I'm tired, let's go to bed." I said "Okay honey"

I take the phone with me and go upstairs with her and get in bed. She calls him (I told you before I record these conversations)....he talks to her and asks her why she didn't answer the phone, she says "Mommy doesn't let me"......he told her to ask me how I had the money to go to the movies and no money to get her hair cut. She asks me, I don't answer. Then he says put your Mom on the phone...I shake my head no. He says tell her to get on the phone or I'm coming over there. She tells me, I shook my head no. He says, okay....well you tell her not to go to sleep, because I'll be over there and if I have to drive my car over there with it messed up I'm really going to be mad.....She just says "He said not to go to sleep because he's gonna come over" then she says "Goodnight Daddy, I love you, God bless you" and hangs up with him. I rolled over and kissed her and hugged her and rubbed her back and said "You okay?" She said "Yeah, I'm just really sleepy" I said "Okay, baby, I'm sorry Daddy keeps making you tell me things, he's just scared, and that makes him mad" She said "I know". A few minutes later the phone rings, and it's him again...I said "It's your Dad again, do you want to talk to him?" She said "No, I'm tired" I said "Okay" and I turned the ringer off. I layed there until she went to sleep.

I got up to call a friend that had called to talk to me as I was leaving to pick her up and I told her what was going on, so I had to get off the phone, she had offered to go with me.....but she's at least as confrontational as I am, and it would have made matters WAY WORSE....she would have been up and out of that car and in his face....and I knew it would spiral out of control, and I'm not afraid of my WH...not at all, he's never touched me....so I didn't feel the need to go accompanied, at least not by her. But called her to let her know I was home.

So that's it. He called one more time @ 11:55 per the caller ID, and then he must have given up....I don't know, I went to sleep.

I engaged in as little conversation as possible given the situation.....I did not yell, I did not love bust, I just stayed calm, which I think made him more crazy. I wasn't reacting to the things he was saying to me, and I think that made him more goofy.

Sooooo I didn't crack guys....I did what I had to do.....I can't believe how accurately the WS script is and how closely they follow it...it's the weirdest thing I've ever seen in my entire life.

He's in pain....he's in withdrawl from me, he's grasping at straws. It really puts me in mind of an animal that's in pain, sometimes they bite you, when you're trying to help them......because they're scared.

I can imagine the impact this is having on the "A", ain't no WAY he can go from Whack Job to normal very quickly, he's going to start to piss her off. (She has her copy of the PBL, so she's gonna know, unless she's stupid {highly probable}, what's going on with him)....hey, he's got his "roadmap home" I'm still being the lighthouse......he's creating all these scenerios in his mind as to what I was doing last night....because he has no idea what I'm doing.

Well, that's all folks <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

-Caren

<small>[ February 20, 2005, 06:53 AM: Message edited by: CarenMc ]</small>

Caren,

You did a great job. That had to be so difficult but you did it.

Keith

Now you are doing it right...Greatttt job...keep it up...hang on to that wagon okay.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Caren, way tobe strong girl!

Can I tell you though, I am hurting for DD10... I was that kid in the middle of my parents nasty D and I still have not been able to completely forgive either of them for it!

My Mom would refuse to speak to my Dad, my Dad kept relaying messages and there I was in the middle. I ended up being the msot mature person in it and I was only 8, 9, 10, 11. It is simply not fair and it is very harmful!

As soon as he starts talking to her about anything other than her you need to remove her from the situation (IMNSHO). Take the phone away and let him know that both of you are done w/ this conversation, then hang up. Turn it off, take it off the hook but do not let him put her in the middle, please!

Otherwise, hang in there, you knew this part woud be bumpy but you are doing great! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Thank you all for your support <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

TX-RN, I DON'T pass messages through my daughter, and I've asked him not to, I just told him "Stop telling DD10 things to say to me, you're hurting her." But he must forget in the heat of the moment, or make it my fault because I won't talk to him.

We have a flippin intermediary (My Sister), but he REFUSES to call her.

He called this morning at 10:30, I had gone back to bed for a bit, and DD10 had fallen back asleep on the couch, he left a message that said "I just called to say I'm sorry for last night...that's all." (In a really defeated sounding voice).

When DD10 got up I said, your Dad called. So she called him back and talked to him for a minute. Then she said "Mommy, Daddy wants to talk to you." I shook my head no. She said "She said no" He said tell her I said "Please" She said "Mommy he said please" I said "No" He said "Tell her I just want to tell her that I'm sorry" She says "Mommy he just wants to tell you he's sorry" I said "No". He said "Tell her I'm sorry about the way I acted last night, and it won't happen again." She repeated what he'd said, and I said "Ok". Then she talked a few minutes longer and hung up.

I just went to the store because I was out of cigarettes and my DD10 wanted a doughnut, and I passed him on the road on my way back home, and he honked at me...I saw his car coming and didn't even look in his direction.

Okay, now I have a question. I was wondering if I should call my sister and have her call him and ask if he has or if he is planning on complying with any of the things on my list, and also to ask him again to please not relay messages through DD10.....is that appropriate? I'll wait for some responses before I do anything.

-Caren

Caren~

I have followed your story and am inspired by your strength. However, I am with Tx-Rn on this one. It breakfs my heart to see your dd10 in the middle of this. I know she says she is ok, but I'm not so sure. Of course, you know your daughter best, but she doesn't want to upset anyone, and will do her best to do that.

I like the idea of letting him know that if he discusses you or your marriage while on the phone with dd10 the call will be ended immediately. I had to do this when my dd6 was 3 and her bio dad would call. He would promise her all of this stuff, tell her she didn't have to listen etc. I made it quite clear he could only talk to her if that kind of stuff wasn't brought up, when it was the call was ended.

Do you think you could do something like this? You have to protect your little girl from this as much as possible.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by CarenMc:
<strong> Okay, now I have a question. I was wondering if I should call my sister and have her call him and ask if he has or if he is planning on complying with any of the things on my list, and also to ask him again to please not relay messages through DD10.....is that appropriate? I'll wait for some responses before I do anything.

-Caren </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">NO.............You are just wanting a little fix here for yourself here. Don't undo the awesome job you did last night. Every time you give him ANY COMMUNICATION (or fix) you set yourslef back. This is EXACTLY how you failed ypur first plan B attempt. You had a litle success and then went back to old habits.

YOU NEED COMPLETE DARKNESS TO HIM.

He knows good and well what to do if he is ready tio comply with the Plan B requirements. He knows, trust me he knows. You can't let him get a fix.

You may get tired of me saying this, but here goes again:

For the principles to work, you have to work the principles

LM

Ditto Lemonman!!!

Caren, do not let that man off the hook now. Did you see how up and down his rollercoaster is? Last night...psycho man. This morning: </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">He called this morning at 10:30, I had gone back to bed for a bit, and DD10 had fallen back asleep on the couch, he left a message that said "I just called to say I'm sorry for last night...that's all." (In a really defeated sounding voice).</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This is a GREAT place for him to be!! But, dont you dare take yourself and those kids back on there with him. He gets to ride it alone...or with the OW. Your family is DONE with all of that.

If he wants to get off the rollercoaster bad enough, he KNOWS what he has to do. He doesnt need help, he doesnt need to be shown the way. He must first say "I surrender." Then you will help.

Until then, let them man have his ride...he bought the ticket!! You just sit back and eat cotton candy.

In His arms.

Caren -- I think you have become waaaaaaaaaay too addicted to the drama going on with your H. You are *anything* but detached, and your children are suffering for it.

Go back and read your (many, many) posts from the last week or so. Then read the ones when you first began posting. It may give you a different perspective.
Mulan

Mulan is on to something here...

Caren, from now on, we are going to establish a rule here. As long as you are in Plan B, when you post...you must give equal time to what you are doing about you...as with what your WH is doing. Understand?

If you write two paragraphs about WH going psycho again, then you must write two paragraphs about what you are doing about those problems you mentioned earlier, or what things you are doing for yourself. You said those problems are overwhelming. Well, only one way to move a huge pile of s#&t...one shovel at a time!

So, gonna get you into Plan B...and away from the amusement park ride your husband is on. You are still free to come here and vent and ask questions. But, as long as you are in Plan B, we want to talk and help Caren with Caren!!

In His arms.

As part of the concern for DD10, AND disconnecting from the drama, consider strongly leaving the room when she calls her dad. Then she can't be put in the position of relaying information to you while you sit by her.

Inform DD10 to tell WH that she's NOT to pass along messages. Seperate both you and DD10 from the chaos.

Just my 2 cents worth, SD

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I actually knew that answer to that...and in a way I am addicted to the drama.......If he's kicking and screaming...I know he cares, if he stops that's when I'll start wondering...understand? I know I'm not detached, I am *trying* to detach, but I feel crappy about it......I am giving the illusion of detachment, and that's really all I can manage right now, I'll keep working on the real thing.

Can I at least call my sister and tell her to ask him not to use DD10 as a go between?? BTW, I am not always in the room when she talks to him, this morning I was out in the kitchen and she was in the living room....she will seek me out when he wants her to tell me something, I don't care if I'm pooping, she'll come in and ask me whatever it is he wants her to.

I take constructive criticism well, and as I told you before....I am going to come here and bounce stuff off of you guys before I do it, because my judgement is screwed. I think of these things I want to do, and so I throw them up here so I can find out if I'm being reasonable or not.

Let's see...3 freakin paragraphs about what I'm doing for me? LMAO Yes professor Mortarman....hell, this isn't gonna be easy. I went to the movies for *Me* last night. I am beginning to know what my *wants* and *needs* are.
I want a husband that isn't cheating on me and that thinks the sun rises because I'm around <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> I *need* a husband that is going to work on our marriage not just bail on me when he feels like it's not going his way.

I am calling the college again Monday...see if I can't make payment arrangements. I am taking my daughter to get her hair cut and her first bra....KILL ME, Just kill me now, my baby needs a bra. Not to mention that means that although I'm already swimming in hormones around here....the level should be eyeball deep anytime now....GO ME!!!!!

I wish I had the money to get my hair colored, my stupid grey streaks are back, but alas, I can't afford it. I bought myself some expensive make up from QVC's website.....it's called Bare Escentuals, and it's not quite the miracle they make it out to be LMAO...but I bought 3 tiny jars of it for like 30 bucks.....that about killed me.

Last but not least...I aspire to be the coffee..LMAO (From Trees Carrot, Coffee, Egg post).

-Caren

Caren,

You sure are speaking my language today! Hair color and Bare Escentuals. Possibly the two topics I have the most expertise on. I am a hairstylist and makeup artist.

If you lived near (you don't), I would invite you to my salon today (it's closed - perfect) and we could drink wine and make you feel pretty.

I could also show you how to use that Bare Escentuals stuff you bought. It is the MOST revolutionary stuff I have ever come across. I could probably give you some e-pointers, though. Too bad, it sure would have been nice to have some female companionship where I actually felt like I could relate to someone and not have this huge wall of secrets.

Tell me your Bare Escentuals issues. Perhaps I could shed some "clear radiance" (makeup joke).