I posted this in Idiotville, but I know you guys don't go over there and I wanted your opinion on what I do next. I have been in plan A for a long time, and I think it's paying off. He believes that the evidence I hold will be bad news for her in keeping her children in case of divorce. Of course, he is angry with me. What else is new? I had suspected that the A was cooling off for several weeks. Looks like I was right. Now what do I do?

IB =WH
Curly = OW
Starz = Me <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I need to know what you think. IB did not get together with her this weekend, as I feared. However BIG NEWS!!!! It seems that Curly has broken up with IB.

I was made aware that over the weekend he had been composing a letter to her. He is upset because "in the last two months, you made several major decisions about us without discussing it with me at all." Also "By my reaction to your letter, my message, our talk and the letter that I have since written, you know that I have tried to follow all of the requests you expressed." NC??

Also: "This is probably close to the longest letter I have ever written in my life, and without a doubt, the most important ever. Hence, I also hope that you will see there is a better resolution to our situation. As to our relationship being 'wrong'" .... and then he goes on in a long paragraph to justify the relationship. She must have told him their relationship was "wrong." He goes on to say that when it was recreational sex it was wrong. When he was in love with her but committed to staying with me, it was wrong. But now that they are totally "in love" it is no longer wrong. Gag me with a spoon.

I loved this one: "We both acknowledge the way Starz treated me through most of the 34 years we have been married. What our spouses had done over all of those years left them with no honest complaint about our actions with each other. " Right. yeah. rewrite the marriage, justify, justify.

He even mentioned the name of another man we both know who apparently had an affair with her also.

Then a long page about how her children would be better off with Curly and IB and with less exposure to their father. Right. It would be better to tear up a home, take the kids away from their father, and spend more time with IB. Yeah, right.

He tells her that losing her was worse than the loss of our son. She told him apparently that she was betraying her children (hiding phones, messages, etc.) Then he spells out all the great things he could do for her kids: take them to plays 2 - 4 times a year (which we have always done with our son) and then he lists every vacation we have ever taken and wants to share them with her and her children.

"To be able to keep this is worth heroic efforts on both our parts."

This part is good: "You found a reason to stop our phone conversations, stopped acknowledging many of my messages, my questions, my cd's. also "you wouldn't open my gift" and "You would promise to do something like call or pick up the phone and then not do it."

Also "My animosity towards Starz, no matter what her actions from now on, leave nothing but the shell of our existence being played out as long as it takes to shield you and the kids. ... There is no more chance for she and I to have a relationship."

It sounds as if all is not well in paradise. If she fails to read or reply to this letter, the A might indeed be over. Pray hard that this is the case. Apparently, she is afraid of me and my information - enough to make HER call it off. Pray that she stands firm. Please.

So what do you think? This is the most classic fogspeak I have heard. Straight out of the textbooks. SHE DUMPED HIM!!! (Starz does cabbage patch dance leaping in circles around the room) Pray that it lasts. Please God, don't let her give in.

He also makes mention of His Need, Her Needs in the letter. He said "By your voluntary isolation of the two of us, you did Starz's work for her. That book said if communication were cut off, we would begin to doubt ourselves and tear the relationship apart on our own."

Hallelujah, Harleys!!

I eagerly await any comments.

Sounds like a fair assessment on your part.

I have to admit I'm not current on your sitch since I don't frequent long and drawn out posts like all the "Idiots." (This is due to my inability to jump into the middle of something and catch up.)

Are you in Plan A or B? If A, perhaps stay there for a little bit longer to see what he does, e.g., see what withdrawal does to him. If you're in Plan B already, perhaps wait and see what, if any, contact he attempts with you - let him make the first move. This may take some time, huh?

He may hunker down and go into fortress mentality to avoid admitting a mistake to you. Does he have the maturity and character to be humble?

WAT

I am in Plan A. Have counseled with Steve Harley and need to do so again. He is completely incapable of ever admitting he is wrong. (This goes back our entire marriage. Everything has ALWAYS been my fault.) I have suspected he was in some withdrawal for the last few weeks. Now I know I was right. Keep your fingers crossed for me. I think there is a chance here for us. Not right now, but in a few weeks, maybe.

Please do consult with Steve. (Tell him I said "Hi!")

Patience is obviously in order. Be careful with your bank balance as you may find it difficult to give him too much time to get his head outta his butt. You may find insight in Bob Pure's threads describing how his WS reacted to being dumped by OM.

WAT

Starz, I'll reply to you here. Things get lost in I-ville.

I don't know if you know but I was dumped by the OM. I seriously wanted to leave my m and ride off into the sunset with him.

When Rob found out the A had been over for about 4 months. I was in terrible withdrawal and didn't think I could live with it all. Once Rob knew and was committed to saving ou m I used to look at him and wonder how I was ever going to get back any feelings whatsoever. I was as foggy as IB. I rewrote the history of our m, the whole 9 yards. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />


What I am saying basically is that he Plan A'd without knowing what a Plan A was, then I found MB and that was the turning point for us both.

Also what I'm saying is that I never thought we would be where we are now. Well, you've heard me on I-ville - we're so happy. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

That story was to give you hope, but you need to do the practical stuff as well and that's where SH can help you out.

{{{{{Starz}}}}} you're amazing. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Jen

Thanks for replying, WAT. I have been patient, and for quite a long time. I am just hoping that this is truly a good sign, without a lot of on again/off again stuff.

Kiwi - You say you were in withdrawal for 4 months before your H found out? How long did it last in total? I know every case is different, and I feel that since IB's A was so long (at least 2 years or more, both EA and PA) I assume that the withdrawal will also be long. It's kind of hard to tell. Although he has been showing signs of withdrawal, he also has made it a point to be nicer to me. I just don't know what to expect next. I understand that things will get worse before they get better. But I have lots of time, I guess.

A couple of weeks ago we were in a discussion and I told him that in all this, my feelings had been terribly hurt. That I was hurt. He said, "I don't give a damn about your feelings." Now I know that was fogspeak. But his next statement wasn't. He said, "Don't you think I am hurting too?" That was my first real indication that he definitely was breaking off with her. I said, "Yes, and I'm sorry for your pain."

Starz, it's sort of hard to tell when the real withdrawal ended. I was still in partial withdrawal until about April last year. So that was from June 2003-April 2004. In April Rob had had enough and suggested we divorce. I couldn't bear the thought and we started recovery all over again. That's when he rang OM's wife, mainly to stop me contacting OM, which worked.

I did reply to your reply about the "I'm hurting too" on I-ville but it got lost. It was when Rob said "I understand you're hurting and I understand what happened" that we moved forward an inch or two again.

It's such a process. I could feel the fog physically lifting from me and I could see reality bit by bit. I know I'd never have really seen it all properly without MB but that's with hindsight. Maybe we would have made it just blindly working on our own (I was reading all the books before I found MB and we did have MC) - but I doubt it.

Jen

Do you think there will be a point in time that I can point him to MB? How will I know when? I am really hoping to get him someday to counsel with Steve, but I don't know if it'll ever happen.

Starz,

So the fog is thick out your wayz, eh? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> That WS of yours follows the OW like a sick puppy.

IMHO, instead of staying in plan A, wouldn't it be better to go to plan B? After all he got cut, why not feel the real loss?

He thinks you are not worth recoverying his M and family for? He thinks losing the OW is worse than losing his child? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> What a lunatic.

Think Starz, you want this WS back or do you want your H back?

Of course, check with Steve 1st. I am sure his insight will be more tempered. Mine is flaming red right now. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Hugz,
L.

Hmmmmm.... insteresting twist. I better call Steve tomorrow. Thanks.