How to curse a WS. Pretty catchy title, eh? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

I don't mean cuss. Cussing just passes the anger. This other method has a more permanent effect and can cause the WS and OP to LB without the BS lifting a finger. LOL!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

It isn't anything mysticial. In fact it is quite logical. LOL!!!

Ok here it is:

What we know: WS don't want anything the BS and family wants. They do and say just the opposite. BS says apples, the WS says orange, BS says the sky is blue the WS say's it's green, etc. The WS expect the BS to be in pain, fight for the family, put all on the line to get the WS back.

The one consistent factor is that the WS must counter every positive action of the BS.

Ok, let's use this tool to the BS advtange. How? By putting a 'curse' on the WS. OPs also thrive on inflicting pain to the WS' family. Especially to the BS. Though it varies from situation to situation, every OP in an Affair (this means they know they are an OP and that the WS is married), knowingly and deliberately brings pain to the family (whther they admit it or not). I didn't mean to hurt them that much is no excuse for thrusting the knife and missing the heart. The crime of assault has been commited.

So putting the curse on the Ws means what? It means the BS hits the WS in the A's Achilles' heel.

Where is that heel? Right at the core of the A.

In the A the WS tells the BS they are unhappy. That the M and the BS makes them unhappy, they have to leave. Whether the A was planned or not all of a sudden (at least that is what spews out of the Ws' mouth), the WS is not happy. He/she must 'go and find themselves'. Sounds like 'self-gratification' also know as: mental masterbation. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

What happens when a BS (after the BS is ready to go to plan B with mind and heart fully in sync), what happens when a BS tells the WS to go and be happy? Let's take that a step farther.

In a very convincing way (some of you are gonna have to practice this scene a few times - <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> ), the BS sits the WS down and tells them, to go. That the family discussed it at length and that the WS is right to go 'find him/herself'. So the family is releasing the WS to 'go and be happy'. Let the WS know it is at the expense of the family's happiness but it seems that the WS' happiness is more important. Guilt tactic? You betcha ya. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> But there's more......

Let the WS know that every time the WS sees his/her reflection in the mirror (you know this has to happen), that in the background will reflect the faces of his family. They w/b sad for each smile the WS produces. Then add, for each moment of laughter the WS shares with 'all OPs', the momments of sadness will befall all the family. But that is ok, it is the price the family is willing to pay for the WS t/b happy. Wish them well in their journey through life. Give them the plan B letter. Don't tell them it is to bring you happiness (cuz it aint). Instead tell the WS you realize their selfish attitude has won and that your family's happiness no longer is of value in the WS' eyes.

Remind them the WS' happiness is more important than your family's happiness over and over again.

Look deep into they eyes...... then ask for 1 favor. Ask to see your spouse. Not the WS but your real spouse, 1 more time. To tell your spouse goodbye. Consider if the children should also but probably not.

Let the WS know that if there was anyone you could ask to go find your spouse, you would but no one else can find him/her. He/she must be scared or threatened by a very selfish person. You are concerned for the safety of your spouse and at the very least have 1 more conversation with your spouse.

Then pull back and watch. This has been done before. It worked. It isn't guaranteed in all cases but it certainly can help the BS see where they need to be and make that large stab into the fog that will 'curse' every happy moment the WS has in the A.

Is it worth the shot? It was for me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Just thought I'd share.

L.

<small>[ February 20, 2005, 10:59 PM: Message edited by: Orchid ]</small>

whoa.

wow.

wish you'd said this back in Sep 04...

Good stuff, in 2020 hindsight....

RS

RS,

I have posted this story and my thoughts before but it was a couple of years ago. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

How are you doing? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

L.

Orchid:

Well, you know me! Ol' serious 2long! ...wait, that's not correct! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Anyway, I've been the plan A king for over 3 years now. Thinking back as I started reading your post, I first thought that, no, I've never done what you suggested/did. But then I remembered. Heck yeah, I did, or at least I tried 2. Way back there in Spring 2003, when my W called me from work as she was planning on leaving that job, and said she might have 2 go away for a while 2 "find herself", what she wants 2 do with her life... I ac2ally believe that going 2 be with RM (yep, I said it) wasn't part of her plan. She was 2 in2 herself (still is) 2 be anything less than fed up with both of us - or so she said in not so many words at the time.

probably, at the time, she would have spent some time with him, finding herself in effigy or some such nonsense. But she never "got the chance" because she asked me what I'd think or do if she did that. I simply said I was done and would file for a DV within a week of her depar2re.

In thinking back on the experience, I think I would have done just that.

Thinking about similar stated desires recently, I no longer think I'd do that, at least not right away.

I'd prefer doing something like you suggest. It'd even be "fun" (such that any of this crap can be made fun). You see, I'd be here, in this wonderful investment of a historic home we have, with my son, and with my D and her STBH living in the guest house. Living our lives, getting through the good stuff and the bad stuff 2gether.

I don't think my W realizes it yet, but she wants 2 do that 2. If she has 2 go out somewhere and find herself 2 realize that, then so be it. I might even try plan B at that point. I might follow it with filing at some point, 2. Who knows?

I'll tell ya, though. If RM is still in the pic2re and I find that out, he's in for a bumpy ride. (he lives in one of those alienation of affection states, and an aquaintance of mine is a lawyer in his hometown... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> (need some mischevous gremlins!)

But I suspect none of this will be necessary...

-ol' 2long

Orchid-

VERY catchy title...LOL....I'm like hmmmm I wonder if a voo doo doll is involved.

It's a very good curse as well. You are so good at turning things around...you truly have a gift!

I hope that I am able to help someone one day like you've helped so many people. I hope to be so wise.

But alas, right now my WH keeps making this something fit for the Jerry Springer show with the crazy stuff....I never even thought about his neighbors until today, they were probably looking out the window and thinking we were crazy. I'm thinking Ughhhhh this is so TRAILER!!!!! *I* wasn't acting trailer, *I* remained calm, but he was screaming like a lunatic....I can't imagine what the neighbors thought as he's screaming "YOU KNOW HE'S MARRIED TOO, RIGHT?!?!" at me...they were probably thinking..."Oh, that poor guy, what must that woman have done to him". I mean he was screaming at the top of his lungs, like I was the one having the Affair.

I am striving to rise above it, you always keep it classy Orchid.

You're the definition of a lady......me? I'm a little rough around the edges....just a little too abrasive to be accused of being a lady. I admire you Orchid, I truly do.

-Caren

My curses and other reproaches could not be printed here. I feel too betrayed, lied to, and used, for any useful word to be used. Perhaps (^(^(*&#&)@ )*_*_*_ _+(+(#@+(#+@( +)()(%*#_$*(_#* $*()*_)#@$*)_@* +$%(#+)$(+#(#+)@(#$+#$)( _(^%+)#$_($%)_#(%+#+)($#)%*+_#@*(

Would fit.

Sorry I'm not help

David

2L,

Me thinks you know what you need to do but right now most of it resides on your wife's side. Most of marital recovery is dependent on them u know. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

BTW, the house is beautiful. Now I understand about all the work you are doing. Wow. I am in awe of your accomplishments. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Caren and David,

U 2 are in the midst of it all. When you mind and heart syncs up enough where you can move forward with a solid plan B, then scenarios like mentioned above c/b taken. It's a risk but you s/b used to risks right now. You are both BS survivors. Continuing down this path is what you must do for your personal survival.

If you expect the WS to turn to an Xws and then to the type of spouse you need, you have to have respect for you first. How can the WS/Xws/spouse respect you if you don't respect yourself? Value yourself? Honor yourself?

Don't waste time wondering about HOW guilty they are or WHAT they are doing. That 1st boink or 1st EA act to make your spouse the WS already happened. How many more times they do it is immaterial but it sure does hurt.

Easy to say and hard to do. Don't feel too bad if you find it difficult to remove yourself from the drama. It is difficult for most BS. In time though you will tire of this drama and willingly choose to remove yourselves from it thus lessening the pain. In the meantime, learn how to use whatever tools (keep them safe and legal ones <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> ) to help you keep your cool and survive. You'd be surprised how creative a BS can be. LOL!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

All the best,
L.

Now that's funny!

I can finally say that after a few failed Plan B's I am finally "IN PLAN B!". It feels sickening that I have to do this, and am in this situation, but it also feels good to have control over who and what I let into my life. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Since I am in plan B I can not do this 'meeting' as described...but I sure would have liked to.

I did tell my WH once that when he looked at himself in the mirror to see the kids reflection in the background. I don't think he replied....

Orchid, you are an amazing women!!!
Danielle

Excekkent post. It is very true. I never needed to really go to plan b, but I did tell my FWS to go if that was going to make him happy. I remember saying that we would all be fine eventually. He stayed, we recovered, but sometimes you need to let go for them to realixe. When you let go, many times they panic and turn right around. Me letting go gave him the freedom to look thru the fog and see what he'd be missing. I also continued to live and do daily activities with my kids, never missing anything with the school, etc. Pushing them away can be very effective, esp when the OP is hanging on so tight.

Orchid,
Been hanging out mainly on the recovery board since the beginning of Jan. Some of the stories here just kept triggering me and undermining my ability to remember my self respect, rather than the pain and humiliation (misplace, of course, but there just the same) of H's deeds...

Last deliberate contact was Dec 22. We've had 2 of the OW phone calls since then.

H is a FWH now and proclaims his 'in love'ness daily.

I am still 'gun shy', but try to keep it hidden while the love banks fill...

The reason I said I wished I'd read this thread way back then (and wish I'd really KNOWN the feffectiveness of it to carry it out with confidence) is that I truly waited too long in out stich to Plan B. I did 2, one for 5 days and one for 4 days, poorly tho, to break contact btw them.

That addiction thing is pernicious, and even while he'd already grown to be disgusted by her demands, he still would 'wonder about' her and break NC.

I still keep that worry in the back of my mind and heart.

Is it for real? Really? Or is he really good at hiding it from me? (I don't mean regular contact, but that desire to 'check on her') I am especially worried that once our seasonal business picks back up and the cash flow is great again that he'd be even more tempted....

Anyway,

Starting to check back in here occasionally when my faith and respect are strong and see if I can help anyone.

From a truly objective viewpoint, we are recovering remarkably well. Lot's of touch, kindness, caring, mutual fun and SF, and communication. More than in over ten years.

I sense we are detined to survive and be better than before.....


Thanks for the query, and thanks for what you do for so many here!

RS

Orchid, this post freaked me out! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> I sent the DOrk an email last week.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">And, when WH looks at OW, he will see my face. And when she does or says something "controlling" or makes a decision that he feels "forced" to go along with, he will remember what happened with us.

He will laugh with her and remember the funny things we did together. In their times of "closeness" he will remember how it was with us. And when he calls her my name, as he will, he, and she, will have me between them. Always. He will look at OW's daughter and remember that DD is not there with him. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">AND, I sent this to my best friend.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I have cursed him. I curse him to remember me each time he looks at DP. I curse him to remember our family each time he sees DD. I curse him that when he laughs, he will remember us. I curse him that when he is low, that he remembers my support and my loyalty. I curse him with full remembrance of what he has done to us. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">So, yes I, at least feel better. Not quite as good as your curse. BUt getting there.! Planting those seeds is a good thing. I haven't had the opportunity to say something right to his face. BUt, I will. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Orchid...
I did that too. I may have said it all with a bit of anger in my voice but I did the same thing you did.
My WH is so selfish it makes me want to puke!
I do believe that one day he will see what he's done and regret it but it will be way too late.
He's basically living out of his car and has no "real" home. I know that he has to look in the mirror and see what an a$$ he is...or at least I hope.

Orchid,

This is a great post that ranks right up there with WATS's Affair Exposure 101 so I hope we can keep it alive.

But for me,I did and said the *very things* you suggested in your post but it was only apparent and I was only ready to babble back like this after gaining a large amount of strength.So,when I did this,it was like at least 10 months after DDay.Looking back,I dont see where I would have been capable of doing it any earlier.Maybe other's could,but I wasn't mentally or emotionally ready.

At the very least,I felt so freed that I was letting my WH go to do what HE felt he needed to do,that I was no longer responsible for his needs or feelings,that if he wanted to start a new life and make some homewrecker his priority and caretaker of his emotions,than so be it.If you love someone let them go right? I did.I loved him so much that I let him go,to be where he thought was his "happy place"(yuk <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> )

Anyway,it didn't really work for me in the end in Recovering my marriage but it did give me a newfound strength in addition to what I already had.Thanks for your insight as always~You are a gem!


O <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

edited to add: when I think about the kind of strength it takes to not only endure Infidelity but then let our loved ones go,set them "free" to be with whomever they want and live whatever life they are after?! What a tremendous amount of love we have for these WS's.Do you think OP's would ever do this?! Not on their lives!!

<small>[ February 21, 2005, 10:50 AM: Message edited by: Octobergirl ]</small>

One of the most difficult things I do every day is to pray for the soul and enlightenment of OW. It invariably makes me cry. I really don't suppose ANYBODY else is praying for her. WH is on the prayer list too and he gets more time and from the deeper reaches of my heart. Kind of the opposite of a curse.

I love your post Orchid. You are such a shining beacon and an excellent resource.

Nothing really to add right now, just wanted to bump this excellent post up.

I did try this but (so far) it did not work for me.

Still I think in most cases it's very effective.
I think a lot of the advice here would have worked for me if I had come across it about two decades ago LOL

See more of you have done this and it may have more of an impact down the line than you realize. It took a couple of months for this to sink into the WS' mind before he reacted. The fog was thick with that one. LOL!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

The point is to take a different approach, one that will keep the BS strong and knock the WS for a loop. Doesn't matter if he lands on his/her feet or buttocks. Just as long as he goes for a loop. LOL!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> That give the WS the BS' version of the roller coaster ride. LOL!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Meremortal, sorry it didn't work out for you. But if it at least empowered you some it had some success. Remember it isn't about fixing the WS, it is about strengthening the BS. If it gives the A a kick in the pants, then good.

Small steps, good results. Can't ask for much more in the fog, eh? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

L.

"If it gives the A a kick in the pants, then good."

Oh yeah it sure DID accomplish THAT! LOL

Seems OW "never wanted to be the other woman and break up a family"... (So why was she sleeping with a married man?!? AND demanding that any contact he have with his daughters be strictly controlled by her?!?) OW said WH "assured her his family was totally out of his life" and "she won't be 2nd place" (THIS is what WH quoted as evidence that she was a good woman! - "See, she doesn't want to break up a family") In reality she was giving him ultimatum to having nothing more to do with us or else she would dump him.

WH told me he hated me for causing him to lose OW. He expected me and our daughters to sneak and see him behind OW's back and I was being "hateful" to not cooperate with that!

Whatever LOL