Sorry for the harsh language, but that is how I see my wife now. She slept with my best friend while I was passed out from drinking on the floor about 8 feet away from them. To make matters worse, she had a threesome with he and his wife. It is so unnatural, a threesome! and the fact that I was right there in the room. Can I ever see my beautiful wife again instead of a *****?

<small>[ February 21, 2005, 08:11 PM: Message edited by: Justuss ]</small>

Can I suggest that while there is no excuse for her adultery, that something like this was bound to happen when you hang out with swingers? And you didn't just hang out with swingers, you were getting DRUNK with swingers. You were openly having SEX in a room with swingers.

I don't understand why you hang out with skunks and then act surprised when you get sprayed.

<small>[ February 21, 2005, 08:13 PM: Message edited by: MelodyLane ]</small>

you make a good point. I think about that all the time. I somehow thought that we were " above" that, and could weather any storm thrown our way. That being said, I could have been in a room with ten naked women, my wife passed out in the room, and I never would have done what she did. Just because your parents are losers, does not mean that you are destined to be also. So your analogy does not always hold true.

I just don't know why you are surprised that this happened at all. You had already broken down any barriers to decency by having sex together in a room with your friends right there. Since those barriers were already dropped, I don't see it being a huge leap to having sex WITH those folks. Y'all were already there having sex anyway.

I know you are hurt, but you willingly put yourself and your W in this situation. If you don't recognize that, then you are doomed to a repeat performance.

Again, if you hang out with skunks, don't be surprised if you get gassed.

Hi DM,

To answer your question, if you and your W can rid yourslves of "friends" like this couple, both recommit to your M, and find a good pro-marriage Marriage Counselor, then it is possible to work through all of this...

If you expect all of this to just "go away"... well, I can tell you from personal experience that it won't.

Semper Fi,
RIF

You are right melody. We should not have been in this situation. And what you said about "not being that much of a leap", that is what a person close to me said. However, to me, I was at the complete and final limit, there was no way I could go any further. My wife intiated the same-room sex, and I went along with it to please her ( it was exciting at first ). But,l I knew that was it for me, and I could not go any further. My wife on the other hand did not have that same limit, and was curious about it. Her curiosity lead to the rest. Do you beleive that viewing someone have sex and actually having sex with others is the same thing. You watch people havinhg sex on television all the time. That does not mean that you would actually have sex with those people. Is it really the same thing to you?

Unnatural?

The reason you were in the same room is because you and your W had sex in the same room as this couple, no? You and your W knew this couple to be swingers, no? You think this is natural?

How about drinking yourself to oblivion and passing out on the floor? Is that natural too?

You have admitted pushing some boundries with your W...under the influence of alcohol no less. I don't understand your disillusionment.

Before you start condemning your W for her actions, perhaps you should look in the mirror and ask yourself how the stage got set in the first place.

Although she is responsible for her choice, you both chose to enter into an environment that was unsafe for your marriage.

Before you make any irrational decisions for a course of action, I would suggest that you seek alcohol counseling and as a couple seek marriage counseling.

It was New Year's eve and I thought I was with friends. Yes I knew they were swingers, but thought that everyone would respect my wishes since they all knew that I did not my wife and I to do that. I do take responsibility for drinking too much and will never forgive myself for that. I am just very bitter that noone considered my feelings about anything.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by destroyed man:
<strong> Do you beleive that viewing someone have sex and actually having sex with others is the same thing. </strong>

No.


<strong> You watch people havinhg sex on television all the time. That does not mean that you would actually have sex with those people. Is it really the same thing to you? </strong>

I don't honestly see where you are going with this one.

You weren't watching television. You were having sex IN THE SAME room with real people. Television is not reality. Those people aren't really having sex...unless your watching a porn. Of course it's not the same thing. Reality vs. make believe.

You and your wife put yourselves into that situation with real people. You got so drunk you passed out and neither one of you were probably acting as you would have if you were stone cold sober.

Comparing having sex in the same room with another couple to watching sex on television is a very far reaching attempt at self-justification if you ask me.

That said, you do have the ability to overcome the situation. You need to look at your own responsibility in this situation though. You didn't protect yourself, your marriage or your wife from what happened. How are YOU going to make things safe and different?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by destroyed man:
<strong> Do you beleive that viewing someone have sex and actually having sex with others is the same thing. You watch people havinhg sex on television all the time. That does not mean that you would actually have sex with those people. Is it really the same thing to you? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Of course its not, but you weren't watching TV, you were a live participant - you were drunk and having sex at a party - openly. You threw all moral standards out the window when you got it on in the same room with swingers while stinking, passed out drunk. In for a penny, in for a pound.

I don't know why you suddenly get all moral when it comes to her swinging with swingers. [people who have no respect for marriage vows in the first place and you knew this] It's about like a booze hound proclaiming moral superiority over a crack addict. It just.....doesn't work.

The bottom line is this, I doubt she would have had sex with other people if you weren't getting stinking drunk and having sex at a party with swingers. Instead of trying to blame the whole thing on her, why not take this as a lesson and hang out with some decent people? There are lots of decent people out there who DO have respect for their friends and would never dream of having sex with their wife.

<small>[ February 21, 2005, 08:43 PM: Message edited by: MelodyLane ]</small>

you're right faithinme. I am responsible partially, and I will never forgive myself for passing out. But several of the last response though seem to justify that just because people are having sex near you, that is ok for a married person to go have sex with the others. Like we are animals just migrating to wherever the closest sexual organ is. In my book, married person should never have sex with somone outside of the marriage. Are we animals?

Hey DM,

You asked a question and I tried to answer your question as best I knew how... yet you seem obsessed with trying to justify bad behavior...

Bad behavior is just that... Bad.

Are you looking for ways to rebuild your Marriage, or are you looking for someone to agree that having sex with other couples is OK, as long as you don't have sex with the other couple???

Semper Fi,
RIF

It's certainly NOT okay under any circumstances to do that.

Just because people are having sex near you doesn't make it okay.

She was wrong. Period.

You were wrong to be there to begin with if faithfulness, monogamy and respect for your wife and marriage are important to you.

Two wrongs do not make a right. Adultery is wrong.

You win. No contest there.

What you do need to realize and what may help you to move past this image you say you have of her now is to realize that YOU HELPED THIS SITUATION TO ARISE.

Okay. You didn't mean to pass out.

You did.

She may not have had sex with this other couple if she hadn't been drinking and you weren't passed out.

She did.

What are you both going to do to change it? How are you going to approach this?

Personally, I have a problem with the terms you are using in your feelings for your wife when YOU BOTH put yourselves in that situation.

What did you expect?

Honor among drunk swingers?

Look at it. Seriously. You're upset that no one took your feelings into account? You were with swingers having sex and getting drunk.

No she shouldn't have had sex with them. It was wrong. But I can't help but wonder how you expected the line not to be crossed when you all but erased it yourself?

Talk to your wife and get some counseling. You both probably have some serious issues to get over in this. Good luck to you.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by destroyed man:
<strong> you're right faithinme. I am responsible partially, and I will never forgive myself for passing out. But several of the last response though seem to justify that just because people are having sex near you, that is ok for a married person to go have sex with the others. Like we are animals just migrating to wherever the closest sexual organ is. In my book, married person should never have sex with somone outside of the marriage. Are we animals? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I don't think there is any justification for what she did. But nor is there justification for what you did. [having public sex with your W in a room with swingers and getting drunk - very animalistic] You are even, as far as I am concerned.

I would just take it as a lesson and vow to hang out with a better class of people. When you lie down with dogs, you are liable to wake up with fleas.

DM,

I'm thinking what is bothering you has NOT been articulated has it?

Let's see if my take on this is closer to what is bothering you and THEN discuss it.

First, you both new they were swingers.

Next, your W wanted to have sex in the same room with them.

YOU drank too much, but it was known to your friends and your W that swapping was NOT on your agenda.

However, what bothers you was that it was on your W's agenda and she waited for you to pass out to continue with what she wanted to do.

So you did NOT get to participate, your boundaries were violated with intention, and they did this when you were vulnerable.

It would seem to me the sex would be the least of the issues. To me it would be that she could not be trusted if you were ever in a weakened or vulnerable position. If you became ill, she could not be trusted to do the right thing. If you were not there, she might seek further experimentations that are beyond the marriage covenant.

So am I getting closer? You two went up the edge at her request and when you failed to protect the marriage, she violated it with her friends.

The sex could be forgiven couldn't it DM? But, the deceit can not. You are not completely sure you were not set up that evening are you? And now you don't know who to trust. You cannot trust your best friend. You cannot trust his W. And you cannot trust your W. They have all been with each other, and you are on the outside wondering how deep this thing really is.

Am I getting closer? So perhaps you need to refine your issues abit. I am guessing it is not the threesome per se'. It is the betrayal, the fact that they took advantage of you and did it while you were there. The issue is could you trust your W if you ever had a problem and could NOT meet her needs.

If you refine your issues, then you will be able to speak about them more concisely and you will not be defending yourself as much.

I agree with others, that this situation was not well thought out given your views of marriage and mine as well. You basically handed your W a chance to betray you and she did in fact do that.

But, the issues are about why she felt she could do this, why your best friend and his W felt that way to. It is about you feeling like a fool isn't it?

Must go.

God Bless,

JL

Just learning, you are exactly correct. Wow, I wish I could have explained myself and the way I feel just as you have. It is almost unbelievable that you captured so many of the feelings I have.

It is the betrayal. I do feel like I may have been set up, or at bare minimum, my wife's agenda coincided with our friends without being shared with me.

It is the fact that I was completely vulnerable. It is almost like they were waiting for an opportunity for me to be less than myself so that they could all pleasure themselves.

My wife says that it was not planned, but she also told me that she and the woman had talked about it. She said that the woman said to her " if we can only get your husband on board then we could all have fun". This implies to me that the woman thought that my wife was already on board, as I guess she was.

This is the part that hurts me because it seems like all three of them were just waiting for the perfect opportunity. And if they could not get me to turn to the " dark side", they would try to find a way to do it without me.

This really hurts, that my wife could plot against me like this. My wife never expressed any interest in participating in a "swap". In fact, she agreed with me that it was totally disrespectful for the marriage. However, after the fact, she tells me that she did have some curiosity about it.

She did not communicate her desires to me. If she had, I may have tried to give her something close to what she needed. But the intercourse is way to much.