How do you follow plan B when young kids age (7 m., 2 y., & 3 y. ) are involved? My Husband changes his mind a lot. Just recently he has started calling me at work to ask about and check up on the kids. Before I was on plan B I desperatedly wanted him to call them. Now that I am on plan B he is starting to call about them. How do I handle this? I want my children to have the best possible relationship with there Dad, but I do not want to cave in and let him come home while things are the way they are (currently living with other women, very addictive personality, sex addict, & most likely using drugs again).
Thanks,
Stormy

I am only restarting plan B now but this time I am sticking to it.

As far as communication about the kids, try only emails or leaving voice mails to each other if you do not have a mediator(I do not have one). I prefer text messages because I do not hear his tone of voice and he does not hears mine so I stay darker than using voice mail. But I try to avoid phone contact as much as possible during plan B.

As far as visitation I can not help you there. My WH pick them up and takes them to his hotel. I hope someone else can advise you better.

Love

Thanks for trying. I have posted this question under 3 different strings (emotional needs, plan A/B, & now General ?'s). You are the first response I have gotten. I am trying to stick to plan B, but already feel weak. I am afraid I will cave in and the unhealthy devastating roller coaster will start all over again.

Stormy,

My children were 6 and 2 when I started plan B. WW lives in her own house less than 200 meters away. I’ll let you know what I did, but yours may look differently. It’s not so much about how to do it…that’s not too difficult. It’s about self discipline and achieving a goal.

First…if he has a plan B letter that maps out the new relationship he has with you he needs no further explanation. Phone calls….easy, don’t answer them, get call display. He wants to chit-chat about the kids…sorry, he can come home and be a parent or visit with them. I hear my WW’s voice at the start of a message; I delete it without listening…simple as pushing a button. I don’t believe in a semi-plan B.

Emails…OK, I use an intermediary, he filters out the emotion and the extraneous stuff. If you can communicate in a business manner via Emails, OK, text messaging is better as one cannot leave too much info. Writing may be an option as well. The thing is that they should look like something that is printed by a machine. No “Hi…how are you today….I’m fine. (cause I’m shagging the local fluzy while smoking a dube)” sorta stuff. Simple transfer of necessary information only!

Arrangements to visit the kids can be done at your home at specific regular times. Just don’t be there when he arrives. He comes in the front, you out the back.. I’d suggest he come take them and you have a sitter to send them off and receive them back, but there’s another issue.

That issue is his choices. You used the plural of woman…there’s more than one? And drugs? Your children need to be protected from him if that’s the case, not encouraged to have a good relationship. Any bozo can propagate the species; but the privilege of parenting has a minimum threshold. Drug use and serial adultery is below that. Figure out whether you want your children to have a “positive” relationship with the dope or a relationship with a parent. Dopes don’t deserve to influence their offspring, parents do. I’d run to a lawyer to have the custody of them spelled out if he’s back into the drugs and women. The courts have an ability to write a fairly rigid “plan B letter”.

Do not let yourself cave in! We are here to help and support you. It is not easy but the roller coaster is much worst.

Come here and ask, vent, read and write as much as you want. It does helps. Some days are slower than others.

Good luck!

I will be around again tonight after work.

Love

Thanks, right now there is one OW. There have been others. I believe he is using drugs again. He calls me at work. I have no caller ID at work and do not have a way to screen my calls. I know they deserve a good Father and one that does not have a drug problem. At the same time I know he is ther Dad, the kids definitely love him, and when he is clean & acting right he can be a great Dad. Then on top of everything for some crazy reason I still love him and worry about him. I am not comfortable with him taking them for unsupervised visits, but if there was a way to do it would be fine with him calling them. They get so happy when he talks to them. And I am trying to stay strong. I am getting IC & checking out information for Alanon & other similar groups. I so badly just want a miracle from God where my Husband truly gives his heart to God and becomes new in Christ. I know it sounds crazy to some, but I have seen people who completely change when they give their hearts to Christ.

Stormy,

Binder gave you some good thoughts there. I know that when kids are involved there is a BIG temptation to let yourself talk to your spouse "about the kids" but in reality, you are connecting with the WS. Don't fool yourself, okay?

Here's how I did plan B, and my exH was a HARD person to plan B. He was a controlling, abusive, sex addict, and when he caught wind that I was not going to participate in his game anymore, he DID NOT LIKE IT! Like CarenMC's H, my exH started doing bizzare stuff when just the month before he was so wrapped up in OW that he didn't care if the kids and I lived or died! It was the losing control that was driving him nuts.

Anyway, I sent a fairly "typical" plan B letter with the conditions being NC, going to IC for mental illnesses, going to SA for sexual addiction, and going to IC for raging. He flipped out and started basically stalking us. He showed up when we were at the movies and deleted my harddrive. He came into the house at night while I was sleeping and sat in my room until I woke up. He'd say stuff like, "I could have just taken the kids and gone away and you would have never known." He took a sledgehammer to the walls one night while I was at work. NUTS! And he'd call like 50 times a day, and if by accident we did answer, he would scream and threaten--it was HORRIBLE. But, almost all the time his hook was that he would try to guilt me into accepting that I was taking his kids away from him, lying to them about him, making them hate him, etc. -or- he had something that he just HAD to talk about, schedule, etc. (it couldn't possibly be that the kids were mad at him for abandoning them or leaving them for a slut...oh no!) heehee <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Finally, to end the chaos, I did get a restraining order, and that settled him down a LOT in a hurry. I think then he knew that I was serious and not just bluffing. Second, we set up regular times every day when he could call the kids (to say good night, to wish good morning, and right after school) AND we set up regular times when he would either have the kids or be with the kids. Now, like many typical WS's he did not want to accept the consequences of his choices to continue to cheat and not seek recovery. He complained constantly and would try to drill the kids with questions, but I taught them that if he asked a question they felt uncomfortable answering to just say, "Dad, stop asking me those questions; I feel uncomfortable," and just keep saying it over and over until he heard it. He also kept trying to do the "can we switch?" or "can you watch them on my day?" or "they have to go to practice--can you take them?" and I just kept telling him "No. This is your parenting time and you chose to leave me. I can not help you. You have to figure that out just like I do when you are no longer around to help me."

Eventually, it didn't take too long for the kids to see that their dad (exH) was cancelling their scheduled visits, or "forgetting" to call. You don't have to bad mouth an unrepentant WS to the kids--their actions speak clearly enough.

So hang tough, stormy. Don't give in to your addiction to call him and communicate with him. Show him that you mean business and that you intend to protect yourself and your kids if he is unable or unwilling.


CJ

I read your story. You are a very good writer and you have a stroy to tell that helps others. Have you ever thought about writing a book to share your story and what you have learned from it, how you have changed, etc.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by stormydakota:
<strong> I am not comfortable with him taking them for unsupervised visits, but if there was a way to do it would be fine with him calling them. </strong>
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Is there a 3rd party that would do the "supervision" for you. Like a gov't agency or something? I know where I live I've heard of such a group that helps with supervised visitation.

Obviously you can't do a Plan B if you have to supervise his visitation with the kids. Getting sorted out when/how visitation occurs and when/how contact with the children occurs is important for you regardless of whether you want Plan B or not.

I think you need to decide if you want to do it within a Plan B context or not. If so its going to take a bit more planning and likely involve some 3rd parties.

Good luck and stay strong.

Miker

At this point I am not really comfortable with Plan B because we have kids involved. I just do not think it is healthy for them to see Mom and Dad can not even say "Hi, Daddy called an misses you and wants to talk with you " then pass the phone to them. I know there are situations where the two spouses for whatever reasons can not handle talking to each other even for the sake of the kids. But, I am not for sure if I fall into that category yet. When he does call and talk to the kids he is always nice to them. He nevr says anything ugly or inapproriate to them. The hardest part right now is when he talks to me (for the moment/it could easily change next time he call because he changes his mind a lot) is that now he is saying he loves me and wants to come home, but he is still living with her, only calls from work, and has shown nothing at all to show me that he really wants to change. If he would truly change I would love him to come home, but I do not want him to come home to just do all of this to me again. this is not the first or even second time he has cheated on me. In fact he has even cheated with this exact same women in the past. On top of all of that I worry about his other addictions, issues, and problems.

Stormy,

I totally understand where you are coming from. If the marriage isn't worth saving then plan B may make things worse for the kids. That's exactly what I decided. I didn't want to save things enough to put my kids through plan B. If it was going to end anyways, I thought I'd save them having to go through that and try to salvage whatever relationship they could with their mother.

But also be aware that a happy, recovered marriage is ultimately the best for the kids. I believe MB and Plan A & B gives you a better opportunity of that than doing nothing.

Its all up to you and your situation.

At any rate even if you don't decide to do Plan B putting in boundaries regarding communication and visitation will definitely help your piece of mind.

Cheers,

Miker

I do want to save the marriage. I just wish there was a way to do it without hurting the kids.

Just a suggestion...

How about a really short time limited Plan B? In some cases you hear about it working almost instantly and in others it seems to drag out forever. That way you minimize the impact on the kids?

I don't know. Just a suggestion. Or you could do a "sort of" Plan B. I think the experts here would say that a "sort of" Plan B really limits the effectiveness of Plan B and your chances of success.

Another option is wait it out and see what happens. Its a proven fact most affair will die anyways. So if you can handle it, you can just wait for it to die and pick up the pieces afterwards?

None of them sound very good do they <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Miker

<small>[ March 10, 2005, 01:45 PM: Message edited by: Miker ]</small>

Thanks for the ideas. I guess I have been doing a limited plan B when he calls at work to check on the kids I try to keep it very short and then I always say I am busy I ahve to get back to work. I have not called him or bothered him at all. I only know his work number, but I do not even call him at work. If he were to call the kids at home I would put them on the phone with him, but I would not stay and visit with him. Now I just have to give it some time and wait and see what happens. Waiting can feel like torture! I appreciate all of the help and ideas.

Hi Stormy,

What you suggest is pretty much exactly what I did.

I'm 8 months since DDay and my kids are doing great. They seem to have adjusted really well.

WW on the other hand is still seeing OM (as far as I know) and has not even approached me for reconciliation or even admitted any wrong doing.

Not saying you'll get the same results in your case, but that's what happened with me.

Take Care,

Miker

I wonder how often a plan B is effective. Our stats. on this available anywhere on this site?
Thanks,
Stormy

Depends on what you mean by effective...

I think it is effective 100% of hte time, when done right...

Plan B's effectiveness is to remove the BS from the chaos and every day drama of the A. It allows the BS to preserve what love units they still have in their Love Bank. It gives the A time to die a natural death. Plan B can help speed that along by forcing the WS to have all their EN's fulfilled by the OP, but sometimes it doesn't happen before the BS gives up hope and moves to D.

But number 1, the Plan B is FOR the BS, NOT to illicit a response from the WS, or to exact revenge, or to manipulate the situation...it is to remove the BS from the equation.

When a BS comes on here and questions the effectivenes of the Plan B, it means they are looking at Plan B as a fix to the situation...a maybe the time is not right for Plan B for them.

The mistake I see many folks make is to wait too long to move to Plan B...when the BS has very little love left, and they move to Plan B as a last ditch effort before moving to Plan D...don't wait too long!!!!

I understand what you are saying. unfortunately, I am still focused on trying at save my marriage (may be too late for us). I was curious how often plan B leads to marriages getting back together and making it.

If I wrote NEVER, would you do it for you?

If I wrote ALWAYS, would you do it for your M?

If I said half hte time, would you do it, or find an excuse not to?

Honestly, we just don't know...so many folks on here are using MB principles but not posting their stories (lurking) and of those that do, many stop posting after D or Recovery, so it's hard to tell.

My question....why do you ask?

Just hoping the answer was more than 50%. But, regardless of the anwer I would still try. It is comforting to me to hear success stories that involve plan B. It gives me some light & glimmer of hope at then end of the tunnel. To me plan B is a little scary. I ask myself a lot of different questions. What if it just pushes him away from our marriage? Ia m just not ready to deal with/acceptt that my marriage might not make it.