Well, after some very positive signs for the hope of a recovery WH and OW are in contact again and his fog is in full force. The blaming, justification, etc are back. I think I'm rapidly approaching plan B. I'm not sleeping, eating, and am extremely depressed. I'm losing energy quickly and building resentment.

I am finding it harder and harder to be around him, in danger of LBing. He walked in on me balling my eyes out the other night after I walked in on him chatting with her. It was an accident but a major LB. Tonight, I pressed him for answers about their contact and tried to point out the realities of the situation. I'm just worn out.

The danger of plan B is so great though because so far he hasn't even met her in person and she will be in town next week. But I suppose, I've already lost him and think I need to start taking care of myself.

<small>[ March 23, 2005, 11:18 AM: Message edited by: luv2bd ]</small>

bump

Don't be afraid of plan B. Expect the A t/g PA. Once it does, it isn't as exciting as the EA. The EA is harder to stop than the PA. In fact for some WS, the PA is unfulfilling and quite boring. LOL!!!

Now what do you know about plan B?

L.

I am very threatened by a PA and fear that I would lose all motivation to work on our M. Not sure I could ever get over it.

Plan B means no contact with WH at all, i have what i think is a very good plan B letter ready. I know that I would have to stand my ground on no contact with him or it would lose its purpose.

gentlsoul
You are an angel. Thank You for caring and helping me get the advice i am looking for. I appreciate it so much!

I understand how a BS feels threatened by the PA. In reality it is the EA that really whallops the BS and family. All those mind games the Ws play and the heart 'n gut wrenching grind the WS puts the BS and family through happens more in an EA than PA. Of course it is hard to realize unless you have been there/done that.

As for plan B being NC w/the WS. That is only 1 part of it. Plan B is more about the BS leaving the WS alone so that BS can heal from the hurt. Remove yourself from the chaos of the A. Plan B is more of a protective measure for the BS and family than plan A. It is safer and makes the BS stronger. Also helps the BS concentrate on personal recovery which is vital regardless whether the M recovers or not.

Please read up further on plan B. You can find out more about it in Dr Harley's books: His Needs/Her Needs and Surviving an Affair.

L.

does he say is in contact..
how does he know her
why is she coming to your town

when you ask him NOT to meet with her what does he say...

does he deny an affair and go just friends route...

what does he say about all of this...

ARK

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> does he say is in contact..
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Just Tuesday he admitted she called him after I walked in on him chatting with her later that night. He also admitted that he knows he should have told her they could not talk but he didn't. We talked long that night and he admitted it felt like an addiction, it wouldn't last if he did act on it, and he didn't want to lose this marriage. Since then, he's back deep in the fog and telling me otherwise.

He supposedly wrote her an IM that night explaining why they couldn't talk anymore but he wouldn't let me read it. He denies contact since then, but when I asked him to look me in the eyes and tell me that, he couldn't and just nervously laughed - a classic lie.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> how does he know her
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">He met her in a chat room on 12/1/04. They chatted for 3 hours and had phone contact that same day.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> why is she coming to your town
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">He originally told me she lived across the country. But only 4 days ago, he told me she also has a home out here and splits here time between the two.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">when you ask him NOT to meet with her what does he say... </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I know he has thought of meeting her because he admitted that and said he feels like he needs "closure". I told him there was no such thing and that meeting her would only make it worse adding fuel to the fire. Last night he said he has no plans to meet her, but my gut tells me he has every intention if he gets the opportunity.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> does he deny an affair and go just friends route...
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">He won't admit that it is an "affair". He has admitted that they became very emotionally intimate and things they said and wrote would be extremely painful for me to hear or read - so no, he isn't going the just friends route anymore. He did in the beginning.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> what does he say about all of this...
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">4 days ago he came clean about everything and disclosed many details about the A. This was his doing. I was shocked that he suddenly was being so honest, grateful as well. I listened, validated him, and did not get angry or LB in any way. I thanked him for his honesty and told him I would stay by his side. He said he had chosen me but admitted he resented that going on to say he felt so horrible for feeling resentful. Well, it was a major breakthrough, then the next day she called.

He is now back to giving me all the many reasons he tried to justify it in the beginning. I have done a pretty good Plan A and am very happy with the changes I made in myself and he acknowledged those changes without my asking. He also admitted that despite the fact that I did make some positive changes - he couldn't break away from the draw of this OP. So now he also is trying to tell me that the things he is unhappy about are things that I just couldn't possible change. This OP is my complete opposite personality - just very different from me - so I know that is what he means by saying I cannot change.

I e-mailed for an appointment with Steve Harley last night. However, unless I magically get an appointment today I don't think I can wait any longer before moving into Plan B. After last night, it is so hard to be in the same room with him right now, I am so disgusted and feel I just need to get out of this situation - he is sooo cake eating. I hadn't felt like this at all, and in fact felt very strong - then bam it hit me like a ton of bricks.

My plan B letter is ready and I'm thinking of giving it to him tonight. Do you think I should just suck it up and wait until after I can talk with Steve Harley?

That really depends on you.

SH will give you amazing insight, but it won't be worth much if you have alrady lost all your love for WH.

How long can you hold on?

Plan B is about preserving hte love you have for your H. How much do you have left, and how fast is it dwindling? Can you hold out?

I have soooooooo much love left for my H. I still truly believe in our M, I am just so angry right now and I haven't been angry like this yet so it is scaring me. I don't trust myself not to LB right now and have to fight it with every ounce of energy.

When he peaks out of the fog like he did a few days ago, I KNOW he has hope too. I just know him so well, and this is NOT him, it hasn't been him in 3 months - I think that's why I'm still holding on, because I'm dealing with an alien and waiting for my H to show up again. I just can't imagine that he is gone forever.

When he was out of the fog, he told me the reason he decided to stay was because of my faithfulness to him despite what he put me through - that should help me to find energy but when he turned around and stomped me into the ground the next day, I just lost it. I feel like he is just taking greater advantage of the fact that I am still here.

<small>[ March 17, 2005, 08:37 PM: Message edited by: luv2bd ]</small>

I'm having second thoughts now. I think I may have royally screwed up Plan A. I was doing so well for awile. He was opening up to me so well and I think I lost enough control when I needed it the most! I can tell this is just pushing him in the other direction ..... arrgh!! I just don't grasp how to bring him closer to NC - the signs are there that he knows he should but then he just goes back to justifying it all.

Here are the things I think I've done wrong so far...

[LIST] [*]1. He walked in on me crying my eyes out uncontrollably. I was trying to be quiet. I apologized for him having to see me that way the next day.

[*]2. Everytime he is at the computer, I walk in to see what he is doing. I know they don't like to feel like a prisoner, but isn't plan A about making the A uncomfortable to continue? I can't let him think its OK.

[*]3. I pushed him for a committment to NC last night even though I could tell he was deep in the fog. It got us nowhere but made me feel worse. I slept on the couch.

[*]4 I normally chech his cell phone but this time i did it in front of him asking him details about specific numbers. He said he didn't know and encouraged me to call them. One was our friends cell, the other was some ?pre-paid number?

Are these royal screw ups or what? Do I still have a chance at gaining ground again?

Anyone out there? Experienced MBer's?

^bump^

Do NOT give him the Plan B letter. YOU are waaay too emotional at this time. Plan B needs to be NON emotionally driven in order to be effective.

WAIT until after you speak with SH.

In the meantime .... give yourself distance .... go be busy with other things. Call your girlfriends and go play.

Ignore your H a little bit , all the while being pleasant (as possible) when you are with your H.

Is OW married? It is crucial for you to contact and expose to her H if she is married. Hire a PI to investigate her ... REALLY, this you should do today ... investigate her, she sounds like a predatory woman.

Pep

Pepperband-

Thank you, I needed to hear everything you just said. I am totally obsessing right now after being in such good control over the last 2 weeks.

OW is single and yes, very predatory. So no-one to expose to, WH said she has told everyone all her family and friends that she is persuing a MM. Crazy, huh? What good would a PI do in that situation. There is one person who doesn't know he is M and that is her boss (who is also a very close friend), but I have absolutely no way of reaching that person.

see if she has a criminal record! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Hi Luv2bd ~
Glad you made the appointment with Dr. Harley. Will your H be with you? I agree with Pep to wait until after your appointment to take any action. Do your best Plan A, and please stop beating yourself up over things like crying. Who wouldn't cry in your circumstance? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

Just do your best and take care of yourself. OK?

Call me a skeptic, but don't be entirely convinced like your H that OW is single. Why do I doubt that? Oh yeah, because A's are based in lies. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

We've been talking for awhile now, and I'm always impressed at how strong you are. Keep up your chin. You know I'm rooting for you. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Luv2bd ~
How is it going? Everything ok?
GS

bump

Luv2bd - How are things today? Are you o.k.?
GS