Hi, Sleepless.

We are having fun, cheap fun! The total for our adventure yesterday: $6 (park admittance and ice cream). We may not get to be so 'extravagant' every day, LOL. I have coupons for miniature golf. In college I survived on Top Ramen and peanut butter for several weeks when I ran out of money. I suppose I can do it again, although I don't want to put to kids through that. I can always ask my parents to invite us over for dinner.

It's great that your parents will help you. I don't like to ask mine for help, either, but I'm learning to swallow my pride, for the kids.

I think you'll end up turning blue and passing out, if you hold your breath waiting for that. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

You can just keep on saying that, LOL. Yeah, a 40-year-old woman with two kids, two dogs, a low-paying (but very rewarding) job, not a cent to her name, and tons of emotional baggage from a 15-year marriage. They'll be lining up at my door, LOL.

The kids are home from their first Wednesday overnight at WH's apartment. I asked WH to let the kids out at the curb in my Plan B letter. WH walked the kids to the front door, and not to help them carry their things. WH had rented some Game Cube games for the kids and apparently wanted to ask me to return them to the rental place. He could have asked the kids to tell me to return the games, like he's done before. The front door was open only enough to let the kids in. I didn't see WH and he didn't see me. Daughter had closed the screen door behind her. WH stood there with the bag of videos for a moment, then called in to our daughter, "See if someone can return these by Monday, please." Daughter took the bag and brought it to me.

*Edited to add: Today he wants to ask me to return games? Last week he wouldn't even look at me or acknowledge me. What the ?????*

Progress for the kids! Son asked WH about the weekend camping trip he's been invited on. Daughter asked about her sleep-over party for the same weekend. Son told me WH's exact words were, "But that's Father's Day weekend (in a teasing tone)." The kids said WH did not give a definite yes or no answer. According to son, both kids told WH they 'really wanted to go' to their social engagements. For an added touch, uncoached by me, son told WH, "Mom already said I could go when it was on her weekend, but they had to change the date to the next weekend."

When we were working on the visitation order with my lawyer, she told WH he would have to have a seperate bedroom for our daughter (WH has a two-bedroom apartment). Son sleeps on a fold-out bed in the living room. According to the kids, daughter refuses to sleep in her room and sleeps in a reclining chair in the living room, where her brother sleeps. They stayed up until 10:30 last night. My daughter is extremely cranky today.

Hi, Pebbles.

I'm sorry that your children are being affected so. You are handling it well.

Here is a fun suggestion for you.

Next time it is hubby's turn to bring the kids home, just in case he comes to the door again, have some 'musk' incense burning. It has a very pungent, masculine smell.

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Today he wants to ask me to return games? Last week he wouldn't even look at me or acknowledge me. What the ?????*
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He is just returning your serve from last weeks match :-)

You are doing well, Pebbles.

God bless,
Gimble

Hi Pebbles! ***Neak waving***

Hi, 'Neak. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

So, when are you going to update your thread, hmmmm? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Hi, Gimble.

Or maybe I could have a big ole steak grilling and let the smell waft through the front door screen. That would drive WH wild! Although, it was 8 a.m. when he dropped off the kids, so it might be a tad early for either smell. If he doesn't come around until his next scheduled visitation, I won't have to deal with WH until Wednesday evening of next week.

Ahh, yes, I forgot - think junior high. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

Thanks, Gimble. This is all uncharted territory for me. I am thankful I have so much help and good advice here. No one in my 'real life' has ever heard of Marriage Builders or the 'plans.' They're more of the 'dump the jerk' school of thought or the 'he has to follow his heart' school of thought.

I called my lawyer today to see if she had heard anything from WH about the divorce/financial support papers. She said that Monday, the 13th, will be 30 days from the date of service, the deadline for him to respond without the terms of the financial support going into effect by default. She did say that if he ends up returning his part of the paperwork within a few days after the deadline, the default terms may not go into effect. I wonder if WH knows this or if he is just delaying things yet again. Maybe one of his enabling buddies or MOW has told him not responding would be a good thing to do? If WH finally got a lawyer, wouldn't a lawyer tell him to get his rear in gear?

No matter what he does, our court date for financial support stays June 29.

My lawyer is exasperated with WH. She said he just sent in his portion of the fees for the filing of the custody/visitation order (several weeks late). Following my lawyer's advice, I paid WH fees weeks ago out of my retainer in order to have the order filed with the court (WH does not know I did this). She even said that for someone so adamant about wanting a quick divorce, WH is doing everything possible to delay the proceedings - again.

WH was always such a responsible man regarding money and deadlines. Is what he is doing what many people do when served with divorce papers? Or is it just something WSs with thier heads firmly planted in their intestinal tracts do? What benefit could there possibly be for WH by delaying or not turning in his part of the paperwork?

My, I am full of questions today. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

Hi, Pebbles.

He is probably getting bad advice, he probably doesn't have a lawyer, and he probably doesn't want a divorce.

Looks like a conflict avoider hard at work to me :-)

Too bad that John doesn't give a rip about what his wife is doing. Then you could find out what she is planning. My guess is that she has told Bam Bam that she is divorcing, while she hasn't even mentioned it to John.

I am really beginning to think that Bam Bam is a victim of lust and John's wife's revenge affair against John. I would be surprised if she had done anything divorce wise. My guess is that she has told Bam Bam that John is doing all their legal work towards divorce, and that all she has to do is wait and sign.

There is your insight into today's cheater's tryst, brought to you commercial free by "AFFAIR BUSTERS. You name 'em, we brain 'em and bring 'em back home to you and by Cheaters Legal Services of the law firm, Dewy, Cheatum and Howe."

:-)

Gimble

Hi, Gimble.

I'm sure you're right, but WH is going to have to deal with this - it won't go away. What could he be hoping will happen - that the mothership will return and wisk him away from all this mess?

It's funny (odd funny, not ha, ha funny), John's wife is the exact opposite of what WH has always found attractive. WH must be lusting after the emotional need(s) she is filling - or else he has turned over a completely new leaf in his preferences as to what is attractive, physically and in personality. She is even of a different race than I am. It really seems like he was looking for the polar opposite of me.

From what John said when I talked to him, she is a serial cheater and he doesn't really care. But I don't know their history, so it could be a revenge affair.

My lawyer's legal assistant has taken an interest in my case. She checks occasionally to see if John's wife has filed for divorce. As of last week, neither John nor his wife has filed.

Funny! Thanks, Gimble.

Hi, Pebbles.

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It's funny (odd funny, not ha, ha funny), John's wife is the exact opposite of what WH has always found attractive.
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That is so normal among wayward spouses that it is 'script'.

Quote:
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From what John said when I talked to him, she is a serial cheater and he doesn't really care. But I don't know their history, so it could be a revenge affair.
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I remember when you said that before. His lack of interest is what gets my attention. I wonder if John doesn't have a side interest himself. There is nothing at all odd about a wayward spouse lying, and I am beginning to wonder about John.

So, what are the plans for the weekend. Did you manage to feminize that pair of goggles?

All the best,
Gimble

Hi, Gimble.

Nothing would surprise me at this point. John owns a fairly successful business. Maybe he doesn't want to divorce the hag because she'd get half (community property state)? And maybe she doesn't want to divorce him because he financially supports her? And their son lives with John, letting hag live the single life. I'm just supposing here. I have no idea what is really going on with them, except for the fact that they have not filed for divorce.

The goggles are on the back burner for now. I decided to plant flowers in the front yard, not an easy task with the hard pan we have about 2 inches underneath the top soil. Dynamite would have been helpful for digging the holes. I got an explosion of color for the flowers. I didn't even worry if they would be what WH would like. It's my house right now, and my yard! I think they look pretty, and the nursery man said they would be almost impossible to kill. We'll find out. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

What should I do or have the kids do for Father's Day? WH took the kids out on a shopping trip for Mother's Day and helped them get me a really nice gift. I know I shouldn't do anything for WH because I am in Plan B. I also feel like helping the kids pick out something for him would be like me buying him a gift - a mixed message for WH?

With the way the kids are feeling right now, I don't think they will be motivated to do something for WH on their own. They aren't exactly feeling warm and fuzzy about their dad right now.

WH has still has not given the kids a final 'yes' or 'no' answer about whether they can go camping or to the sleep-over party on Father's Day weekend. They both would rather go with their friends than stay with him at his apartment. WH will not endear himself to them if he doesn't let them go. I have suggested that the kids call WH to ask him for final permission, but neither one wants to call him. I guess they'll find out at the Wednesday overnight visitation - short notice for their friends.

I keep seeing commercials for Father's Day gifts. They are heartbreaking to me. WH really was a great dad. I don't think he should be expecting a 'World's Greatest Dad' coffee mug this year, do you? Will this be another major dose of reality for WH? Will anything?

Hi, Pebbles.

Fathers day is just a merchant's holiday. If it doesn't mean anything for the kids this year, and it can't mean anything to you since you are in Plan B, then let it go.

Sucks for hubby, but then again, it was his choice, he gets to eat it.

We are not big holiday people, but I really don't need to be reminded that my daughter and wife care for me. I get that daily, and give it back.

I firmly believe that you will get that back in your life soon as well. There are no guarantees, but your hung dog looking hubby is getting a dose of reality that he never really knew existed, and he doesn't like it one little bit. Stubborn is as stubborn does, and he is exhibiting no exception.

Stay dark, take comfort in your kids and the peace in your home. Trust that time and circumstances are doing their work on your hubby. Ask the Lord to pop him upside the head every once in a while for good measure, so that he will come around a bit quicker.

It will be okay, Pebbles.

Tell me the names of the flowers you planted. I won't remember them long enough to walk in the other room and repeat them, but my wife reads here daily, and she knows all of them, and the latin too :-)

God bless,
Gimble

Hi, Gimble. Up late again, I see. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Yes, it was his choice. The thing is (letting my soft underbelly show here) part of me doesn't want his feelings to be hurt. I know he's not himself now, but he has always loved his kids - and, until now, his family, including me. Don't worry, I won't wimp out of my Plan B.

Oh, how I miss that! I'm glad you and your family are happy. You certainly deserve it.

I don't think WH and the Lord are on speaking terms right now, but I'm praying on WH's behalf. I know he's in there somewhere, under the cement encasing his brain.

Thanks, Gimble. The kids and I will be okay, no matter what. I am pretty stubborn, too.

I am not nearly as knowledgeable about flowers as your wife. She knows the Latin, too? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> I asked the man who worked in the nursery for suggestions. I needed flowers that could take mostly direct sunlight, 100+ degree temperatures, very little water, and less than optimal soil. I bought Rose Moss, Salvia Blue, and Chinese Woolflower. The Chinese Woolflower has blossoms that kind of look like large feathers or paintbrushes and come in yellow, pink, red, and orange.

I want to do the back yard next. WH always grew the best tomatoes. I don't think I'll do tomatoes. I am thinking of a flower garden - wildflowers of some sort. I'll have to wait until my next paycheck, though.

I'll be good and go to bed now. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Hi Pebbles,

I can't remember a time when I've disagreed with Gimble, but I do now. I'm a firm believer in doing everything we can to avoid putting kids in the middle or using them (even unintentionally) as pawns.

"Fathers day is just a merchant's holiday. If it doesn't mean anything for the kids this year, and it can't mean anything to you since you are in Plan B, then let it go."

In my opinion, it is your responsibility to offer a means for the kids to acknowledge Father's Day (it doesn't have to be a present). If they don't want to, then I wouldn't force them to--they're already being forced on the visitation by the law. He is your WH, but he is still their father. I encourage you to let the kids decide how they want to acknowledge Father's Day and support them in their decision (unless they want to collect dog poop and gift wrap it--then you can't help them LOL).

Take care Pebbles--you're doing good so far!

Hi, LovingBoundaries.

Actually, I think you and Gimble are pretty close in your opinions on this, at least the way I am interpreting it. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> What I am hearing from both of you is I shouldn't do anything just on my own or force the kids to do something. I will ask them if they would like to make him a card or if they feel like doing anything for him. If they do, I will make the materials/money available to them and let them take the lead.

Right now, I think the gift-wrapped dog poop is what they might have in mind. They are pretty angry. Besides, the dogs could be involved in Father's Day that way, too. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Thank you, LovingBoundaries.

"I will ask them if they would like to make him a card or if they feel like doing anything for him."

Pebbles, in my opinion this is too much "help" to give them. One, they might not want to put that much effort into making a card for FD and if you suggest it they might feel obligated. Two, to ask if they feel like doing anything implies that what we "feel like" doing (or not) should be a major factor in making decisions--too close to what their dad has been doing imo.

If they have suggestions like dog poop, go ahead and laugh with them but also say something to the effect that you know that they wouldn't be disrespectful even though it might seem fun or even justified at the time (kind of like their father is doing?).

Just leave it to them Pebbles. I'm sure they'll come up with what they want to do (or not).

It's not easy, is it? You're doing great so far Pebbles. Keep it up! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Pebbles,
I read your posts regularly and I think you are doing very well in plan B. It seems like your personal recovery is taking hold. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> Good for you!!!I don't have any advice for you just wanted to lend my support. ((((((((pebbles)))))))))

Take care, you remain in my prayers

I have a different take on the Father's Day stuff.

As parents, it's our job to teach our children to express themselves honestly, but to also consider our future regrets.

My husband hasn't always been the best father. He really truly tries. And in the past the only exception to his trying was in areas that required him being a bit uncomfortable. But now, I see him stretching into those areas as well, so all around, I see him stepping into the struggle of being a better man and overcoming his faults...

What would have happened to our son, if the first time he really noticed his dad's mood swings went beyond normal into the bi-polar zone, and we went for a drive to talk about the alien in our home... if I had encouraged disrespect in return for my husband's less-than-stellar behavior, or remained neutral on his relationship with his father? If I hadn't encouraged him to take this as a way of learning how to manage moods and feelings more productively for himself? I mean, our son was only 8 or 9 years old at the time of this crisis - about the same as Pebble's youngest. This could have damaged that tender father-son relationship and no one would have pointed a finger at me and said I was wrong for letting my son see his father's behavior in the darkest of lights.

But I took the high road instead. I knew that some day my son would see what mental illness does to people who aren't so close to him - friends who get depression, or who get caught up in drugs or bad relationships who start acting bizarre... So I focused my son on the positive things his father does, and the good man that he is, worthy of honor. I became a soft place for our son to land when things get a little too thick on the mental side of things, and at the same time taught him that you can still honor a father, for the sake of his own soul, not necesarily to make things easier for his father...

Pebbles, I guess what I'm saying, is that this week should be a time of helping your children honor the man they remember - and tell him that they miss him being that man in their own sweet honest way.

This is not a week to allow them to indulge in pettiness that will shame them later. They can behave honorably and hold their heads up that they are learning to be good kind people without accepting bad behavior on their father's part.

It's a fine line, but this has to do with your children learning a great lesson in a time of adversity. That giving respect to someone has nothing to do with whether or not the respect is earned; that it is a way of honoring themselves and who they are.

Teaching them this lesson this week will not in the least way violate your Plan B.

Thank you, confused42, for your support. I can't tell you how much I appreciate it. It makes me feel better to come here and see people are listening to me. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />