This is the toughest thing I have ever faced. I found out 3 weeks ago my H of 13yrs (together 17) had an affair, started out as EA then turned PA, it had gone on 7 months, and the letters I found were very deep, they were very much in love. He referred to OW as the "love of his life" and his "bestfried" My H had broken off with her about 2 weeks before I found out, he then continued contact by phone for another month, even though I knew in my heart something was going on.
We have only had 1 argument in all these years, so I'm still trying to wrap my mind around why this happened. I've been driving myself crazy I don't trust anything he does or says. of course he continued to lie about everything, even with the proof in his face. For 4 sleepless days (the 5 day I was scheduled for a major surgery) I kept begging for the truth, telling him to just get it all out so I can deal with it. H kept telling me "thats everything" only to find out more and more.
I want so much to save this marriage, but how can you when you have lost faith in someone? We have started seeing a therapist but I'm afraid I'll never get through this. will this get easier? can you truely forgive someone after you have been betrayed? can a marriage survive such an emotional affair? and an PA that was "unprotected" I keep asking him if he loved me like he said how could he put my life in danger by not using protection. (of course he lied about the protection part, that came out many days later.
Sometimes when I look at him I'm filled with such hatred and other times I feel like I love him completely and want to get past this.

Welcome to marriagebuilders. It is a great place to be under the circumstances. You will get a lot of support and help here. We have been what you are going through.

Try to check out Bob Pure's post on the General Questions forum. You will be surprised how much your situation is like all of the others. It is very miserable at first, but I promise you it gets much better.

Goldenpups,

It does get easier and it does get better. It takes patience and a lot of work.

You can forgive H. I was able to forgive my W because I realized that my life was better with her than without her.

So far, we have had time periods where we have made progress to correcting the problems in our marriage, but there have been other time periods where we have been in a holding pattern or have taken steps backward. This is where the patience comes in to play.

There are a lot of good people on this site. Read and think about what they have to say.

Vaya con dios,
ktu136

Thanks so much for the encouragement, I just hope I can put it back together like you and yours have. I guess all I can do is take it one day at a time. It just seems like the tears will never stop, and the constant need to snoop is driving me insane. I do hope and pray it will get easier like you said, I guess I should look on the bright side it can't get any worse than it is now.

Stick with us and try to read about Plan A. If you are going crazy, come here and post. Your friends and relatives will not understand unless they have been through it. They will probably give you all kinds of bad advice - like throw the bum out.

There is more traffic on general questions, and you will get more help there. Hang in there, you can do this.

Hi GP,

Welcome to Marriage Builders. I, too, have been married for 13years and we have known each other for 17 in total. And I too doubted whether I could ever really forgive my husband's infidelity. But I have. I found and am finding that forgiveness is not a one-shot thing. You'll need to forgive many, many times-- every time the thought of your husband's betrayal crosses your mind.

Very early on I decided that I would not make any decisions to leave the marriage for six months. I am very happy I did. Those six months gave me some time to heal and gave my husband many opportunities to show me that he hadn't been replaced by an alien (I had no idea who this man was that was capable of doing what he did!) The six months gave him time to SHOW me that the man I'd always loved was in there somewhere. We are forever grateful that we stuck it out.


It WILL get easier. The pain will come with less intensity and less frequency. And you'll be surprised to find that eventually a whole day will pass when it hasn't dragged you into its dark depths. And then it'll be a whole week, maybe even months (that's where I am now.)



Don't think of it as snooping. There should be no secrets in an intimate marriage, right? By verifying that contact has not resumed, you are helping to rebuild trust in your marriage. It will take time...but every time you check to see that your husband is being honest and you find out he is, you'll be one step closer to re-establishing trust.

You are going to need help with this, GP. Have you found a good pro-marriage counsellor?

Godspeed,
Nat

Nat,
This is driving me crazy! everyday I think of the e-mails between them where H claims that she was the love of his life, his bestfriend and he would love her forever. how do I get over and get on with things like that in my mind? It's been about a month since I found the concrete evidence of the A, even though I knew in my heart for a long time, and the pain has not changed one bit. I look at him and I see a liar and a cheat, and I feel nothing in my heart but hate, all consuming hate. He keeps asking for more time, but he had 17 years of complete love, trust and faith. (H travels alot, usually he spends one week with me and one week in another state, thats been going on for the last 7 or so years) and I have never questioned my trust in him. Now I question if I ever really knew him. We have been seeing a pro-marriage councellor for about 3 weeks now, and I don't really see me making any progress, it just upsets me more to sit there and hear him say how much he loves me and how sorry he is for making a mistake, and he doesn't want her, he wants to work things out with us. It just boggles my mind, we only had one argument in 17 years, I thought everything in my life and marriage was perfect. what a suprise I got uh? Thank you for hearing me ramble on it does help to know there are people out there that really understand what I'm going through and that there is light at the end of the tunnel, hopefully I can keep walking towards the light and the hate will be replaced by love again someday.

Hi GP,

I'm so sorry you're in so much pain. Sending out BIG cyber hugs to you ((((GP)))).



I don't know if you completely get over it, but you must get through it. I strongly recommend the phone counselling offered by this site. It's expensive but many people have reported that it is well worth it.



Is there any way he can change this? You really need him with you right now to help both of you to recover from this.


I know you don't feel it right now, but you and I are one of the lucky ones. If you do any reading here you'll see many who have to work very hard to "win back" their WS. A remorseful spouse is what they dream of. So take courage in the fact that you are steps ahead with a husband who truly regrets his actions. I know it seems like an eternity since D-Day (the day you discovered the affair), but you are actually very early into recovery. It takes most couples about two years to recover from infidelity, if they do the work required. That DOESN'T MEAN that you'll be in this kind of pain for all that time. Make a point of planning and doing something FUN together. Take care of yourself, too. Work-out, pamper yourself. You need care right now.



I felt the same way. And while our husbands' choices to have an affair had nothing to do with us,the state of the marriage may have made it more vulnerable to an affair. Have you read HIS NEEDS, HER NEEDS? It's a quick read and quite enlightening. I never really understood how very important some of my husband's needs are to him.

Hang in there, GP. I'd also suggest you try posting over in General Questions II. A lot of veteran posters (wonderful people!) hang out over there.

Godspeed,
Nat

Nat,
Thanks for the hug!
My H has changed his travel schedule, now its only one time a month.

'A remorseful spouse is what they dream of. So take courage in the fact that you are steps ahead with a husband who truly regrets his actions"

Is he really? I often wonder, is it just a ploy or "words on a page that he really didn't mean" in response to his e-mail to OW.

I hate that I question everything he says and does now, sometime out loud, but often to myself. I've never had to do that before, this is a strange feeling for me.

Thank god for people like you and MB site, its nice to have feedback (or validation) on my thoughts and feelings. Something I can't get from my personal journal, not unless my other personality decides to write <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Gotta keep a sense of humor, it seems to be all I have left these days!!

I had some promising developments happen last night. My WS knew I came to MB for support.
He shared with me that he is now posting himself, and shared his posts, along with the good and bad feedback. Him coming here makes me see him in a new light.
Even though he has said all the same words to me over the past few weeks, it was different seeing it in writing.
I had been suspect of every word he has said to me over the past month, now I feel a little better with whats been said and the actions he has taken.
I asked him last night if he only wanted to make this work because he was afraid to be alone, his answer was "no I am not afraid of being alone, I'm afraid of life without you" Those words meant more to me than I can express.
I'm can feel my heart starting to soften. Maybe its time to move to the "in recovery" post. Never thought I would be able to say that. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />

YIPPEE <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> !!! I'm so happy for you, GP. I'd say since you have both decided to work on your marriage that you should definitely move on over to General Questions or Recovery. Best wishes!

OT: I'm curious about your name, do you have a couple of golden retrievers?

Thanks so much for the kind words and excellent insite, I really do appreciate everything!!! When I thought I was at the end of my rope, I found you all <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Yes, I have 2 goldens, at the time of my first post I was so distraught I couldn't think of a catchy name <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I could come up with a few for my WS though!!!

The last few days have been extremly difficult for me. A few days ago I thought I was ready to start moving to recovery, but with the hurt and anger I still feel towards H I realized that its best for him to go for now.

Its extremely difficult because I see him 24/7 when he's not traveling, because his office is in our home.(where the EA began) I can't even go into that room anymore because of the anxiety I feel.

The white elephant is always in the room,I'm sure that elephant will never leave, I'll just have to learn to walk around it or ignore it, maybe someday it will move to the basement.

We discussed his leaving with the therapist, and they (we have a husband/wife team) thought it was a good idea for now, we will still continue to meet together at their office, but other than that any contact with be initiated by me.

I have told my H that I am not doing this to punish him, but seeing him right now punishes me.

After a very heated exchange, which he didn't want to participate in, he just wanted to yell at me for me feeling the way I did,not seeing how sorry he was for everything and why do I keep questioning why he did this to me. Then try to walk out while before I was finished talking, made me so angry and out of control.

I asked him to leave him for the night, he tore my life to shreds and he had the nerve to be angry that I asked him to go. Of course he wouldn't go I had to (after I left he had to call everyone and asked if they had seen or talked to me). Like I'm the one that can't be trusted.

H went right to my parents and told them that I was leaving, of course they came over and with hand on hips said " you need to think about what your doing"

I have asked him many times not to involve them, I told him from the very beginning, I was never going to say anything to them about his A, he confessed without discussing it with me, another betrayal in my eyes.

H doesn't understand that I need to scream, cry and yell at him for doing this to me he needs to "man up" and take it, he owes me at least that much.

Of course after he finally agreed to go, I start to question is this what I really want. yes, no, yes, no, I question my own sanity. Has asking the WS to leave for a short time ever helped or did it further damage the relationship? any one ever handled it this way, or am I cutting my nose off to spite my face?

Oh Golden Pups,

I'm sorry things have been so difficult for you the last few days. Have you heard about the "Rollercoaster"? That is what you are on and you will be on there for several months, at least. Things will "feel" like they are so very hopeful <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" /> one minute and then you'll go screaming down into the depths of hopelessness the next <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />. I called it my daily trips to "Hell".

Everyone experiences this. It feels like your life has been turned upside down. DON'T trust FEELINGS right now. Expressing them to your husband is very important; it's essential. But do it without "lovebusters". You can read up on them on this site.

Separating from your husband WILL NOT help you heal as a couple or as an individual at this point. You need to process this, as painful as it is.

Have you told him what you need from him, GP? Have you told him that to get through this, you need to be HEARD. And that it's going to take TIME. Have you told him that you'll need comfort and reassurance from him. That you'll need answers to all your questions. That you may even ask the same question over and over in order to process this terrible trauma? Has he done any reading on recovering from infidelity?

I know right now it "feels" like he "did this to you", but trust me, he wasn't thinking of you. You had nothing to do with his choice to do this. Something in him, some flaw, made it possible for him to do this. He has to work to uncover that flaw. And the two of you will need to work to strengthen your marriage. You'll need to discover what was missing in your marriage that made it vulnerable to an affair.



From an objective viewpoint, Pups, I see only love in these actions. I see a man who does not want to abandon you or your marriage. I see someone who is very concerned about you. I don't think it's distrust; it's love and concern.



I know it seems like he is making decisions for you again. You weren't given a say when he decided to have an affair and it looks like he's making decisions without you again. BUT, from my vantage point further down this road, I see a man desperate to preserve his marriage. It must have taken a lot of courage (and love for you) for your husband to "man up" and confess to your parents what he did. It sounds like your parents are supportive of your marriage. His decision to include them may prove to be helpful.


Separation is generally only advisable, pups, when the WS (wayward spouse) refuses to give up the OP (other person). I can tell you that I asked my husband to leave a few times and now I am very grateful that he never did. In a way, I think I was testing him and perhaps trying to punish him by asking him to leave. Recovery would have been near impossible if we were not together. We needed to spend time sifting through everything and very importantly, HAVING FUN together. I know it seems like you're rewarding him, but think of it as a way to help you heal. If you do decide that the marriage is unsalvageable in the future, at least you will have better skills to take into your next relationship. But honestly, I just know you two are going to make it.

Again, GP, consider posting on General Questions II. You don't need to be in recovery to post over there. Most people posting here are just "finding out". All the veteran perspectives you're looking for are over there. Also, this is just my opinion, but your counsellors have said a few things that I know may be lead you down the wrong path, well-intentioned though they may be. I've heard nothing but good things about the Harleys. They do telephone counselling. Contact information is on the home page.

I urge you not to make any long-term decisions about your marriage at this very emotional time. The pain is too blinding to really allow you to see what's there.

Take care, GP. I'll be thinking of you.

Natalie

Just a little update. It's been a little over a week and the WH is still out of the house. I don't feel as angry toward him, the anger is still a little below boiling, which is better than it had been. (I did get a little peeved last night when he was suppose to be spending time with me and he fell asleep on the couch for about 2 hours)

We have gone to MC together,(I went once alone, actually I was on the way to a lawyer) eaten meals together, he did stay this past weekend here, our son was gone all weekend so we had alot of time to talk without any interruptions.

It's still very tough on me and even though H claims that he's told me all, the feeling in my gut is saying something different.

I have told him I'm not asking anymore questions, it's now up to him to tell all without being interrogated. Yes, thats what it feels like when I have to keep asking. I am not asking in a threating way, I stay calm and collected even though my insides are screaming!

I told him this evening that he has to be the one to volunteer the info, or I can't heal and we can't go forward, the hotel could be his home for quite a while. I hope that isn't the case.

BTW WS sent OW a NC letter and she sent it back unopened, with "leave me alone and STAY OUT OF MY LIFE" written on it, I want this B**** to read it, any advice on this?

I would really like to do an open letter in her hometown newspaper, that's just my revengful alter ego speaking I know thats not the right thing to do. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

Just a quick little note...
GP, You said in one of your first posts that you and your H had only had one argument in your marriage. Read up on "conflict avoidance" couples/person. That was my H and myself. No one wanted to "rock the boat", "make waves", or make the other spouse feel unhappy. I thought we were happy too, for the most part. Really makes one think "who are we really married to?"...both sides.
Ask each other what makes you each happy and try to accommedate each other...keep working on it. It will get better and better. Also read "Love & Respect" by Dr Emerson Eggerichs. Explains in a great way how to talk to one another.
holiday

holiday,

yes, thats it, one argument, it was a big one too. I've never said that we didn't disagree on things, we just never had full blown arguments or fights.

I thought everything was fine, obviously it wasn't, now H claims that he never wanted to make me unhappy by saying anything,make waves or possibly hurt my feelings.

We weren't communicating and thats why he had his A. But everything else in the marriage was perfect, makes no sense to me. I see this as his excuse for his A.

Update on WS being out of the house, well I let him come back a few days ago, with the understanding that H has told me the entire truth, well guess what, 1 step forward and 10 back! out comes more "truth" today. While going through work document archives, theres emails dating back about a year.

I'm sick of the truth according to him. It looks more and more like this A has been going on longer than the 7 months H claims. OW picking him up at airport, drinks, ride back to hotel another visit to her town offering to take a later flight home so they can "grab dinner". Of course "nothing ever happened then".

I have even asked (over and over again) if H had given her gifts, flowers, anything, "NO" H said, guess what, he had.

H doesn't seem to understand plain english anymore, is it time to learn a new language? wouldn't know the truth if it bit him on the a**. I was hesitant in letting him come back here. I guess I should of listened to my gut.

How do you deal with this? Just when I think I'm getting somewhere, bam! angry all over again. How do you get the WS to tell the truth and just get it over with? H has even told MC that he has told me everything. Why go to therapy if he cant even tell the truth there?

I keep telling H that it can't get any worse, no matter how insignificant he thinks it is, just tell, get it out and get it over with. Nothing can be worse than having an A.

gp..I can tell you why you're not getting the full truth..it's no safe for him to tell you the whole truth. You make the situation so volatile. You kick him out then let him come home to work on your relationship. He reveals more of the truth and you want to kick him out again. It's not safe to speak the truth with you! Have you considered looking at the whole truth is as unpleasant to him as it is for you? He numbed out in the addiction of the affair so much that I'm sure how truly horrible the whole thing is has just now occured to him.

He told you that he has been afraid to make waves throughout your marriage and turned to someone else. I can see that. He was afraid to communicate with you and now you're proving him right. Don't belittle his feelings as an "excuse" and not viable. He'll go back into his shell for fear of what your reaction will be instead of having a real relationship with you.

He's doing the best he can. Don't expect perfection. Give the poor guy some slack. He's making an effort and you're so angry that you can't see that he's trying. If you continue in your bitterness, it will end up being your only company.

Do you remember in the Bible when the crowd was going to stone the woman for having an adulterous affair? Jesus said for the one who was without sin to throw the first rock. Of course, no one threw because we all have sinned. He then told the woman to go and sin no more. Remember that in dealing with your husband. But by the grace of God, this wasn't you involved in an affair.

You have no idea how many people here would give their right arm to have a spouse who is making an effort as your husband is. Instead of appreciating the fact that he's trying, you're expecting mountains to be moved and a pound of flesh. He had the affair and there's nothing he can do to change that. The choice is yours-calm down, be patient and grow or go ahead and end the marriage. But know if you do end the marriage, you'll spend your life regretting that you didn't give the poor man a chance. I can envision him cowering in the corner for fear of your anger. Stop it.

Wow, powerful post jph.

I just read GP's reply on her H's thread in recovery and did a search on her name to try and find out more details and wound up here.

That was my advice there as it will be here. I had the feeling, from posting to her H that no safe haven had been provided for him to tell all. He's scared.

GP, I do believe he is sincere in his efforts of recovery. provide that safe haven, I know it's hard, But it's necessary.

GP,
I agree with jph and Racer X.

Breathe!!!!!

I felt something was wrong after picking up my H's cell phone late one night while we were sleeping and I heard a woman's voice. I noticed the area code was out of state. I told my H after he stated it was "co worker's wife, going through divorce", that "I will" find out who called!
When I found out "the truth" after seeing a cell bill the following month.

I promply went to our local gym where he was playing racquetball, sat quietly outside the glass courts watching him, so quiet he "knew" what I was there for. We took a walk and I asked him calmly "what's going on?" as I had called the cell number and a got a woman's voicemail. He then started to tell me what happened, not everything at once as he was emotional as he spoke. I guess one realizes "exactly" how hurtful their selfishness really is as it's replayed out loud.

I continued to make it "easy" for him (extremely hard for me) to give the details that I asked for. I had to give him a "safe" place to let it out or I don't think I would have gotten all the information "I needed"...meaning, sometimes I think it's best we don't get every little detail as the hurt now has kodak moments to connect to it, if you catch my drift.

So try to ease up and you will have all the information, eventually. Your H sounds like he wishes to work this out just as my H did. That's what I wanted in the long run anyway.

We are roughly 7 months since d-day and we work on our communication daily. We try very hard not to be afraid to make the other unhappy with requesting our needs. If I see my H shutdown I call him on it and vice versa.

Perhaps you might try giving your H a written list of the things you want to know. Ask him to be as honest as possible and that to answer in his "own time" and that you won't throw him out on the curb for his answers.