Hi. I'm in the middle of a struggling marriage, and I believe I am currently taking all of the right steps to make things better and prevent a divorce, but I need some support right now, as my wife and I only discuss the issues for about 15 minutes a day and ultimately it comes to her statement, which has been about the same for the past 4 days, which is, "I don't know."

It started 4 days ago when I did something very bad, and regret, but would've have never found out the truth if I didn't do it, and our marriage would have deterioted on its own anyway. I hacked into her email. I've been feeling suspicious and paranoid for the past couple of months, and started making attempts to find out. Once I got in, I found strings of letters to and from some guy she met once at a concert that she frequents with her girlfriends.

I confronted her on it, and she claims she never cheated on me, never had an affair, it was just somebody she started to talk to, because they 'connected'. Push came to shove and she claims that this would have never happened if I had given her more attention for the past 10 years of our marriage. She said I never talk to her, that I take all the joy out of life, that I'm not a happy person, and that I have grounded her into the ground.

We have argued in the past, and she has claimed these things before, but I never took her seriously. I guess I always figured she was blowing things out proportion or PMS'ing. But now that the ultimate sh*t has hit the fan, I have had to really examine this, and realize that she is right.

I have told her repeatedly that I can change, that I'm not truly unhappy, but that I've just developed poor habits and behaviors and as a result, often go into a shell.

She has agreed to go into counseling, which we start in 2 days, but she has repeated that she is not keeping high hopes. I fear that she is only doing this for our girls (8 and 2 years old), and not for ourselves as well.

I also fear that I have been withdrawn for so long that she has already felt a kindred connection with somebody else and she may never regain her feelings for me. We have called each other at work the past 2 days, and I say "I love you" before we hang up, but she does not reciprocate.

I want to save this marriage, I still love her very much, and I want to change, not just for her, but for myself to.
I just hope it isn't too late. I think she thinks it might be.

Thanks for any feedback or someone to talk to. I can't talk to my family about this, and only have a few friends I can call to talk about this. I am sad, lonely, anxious about the future and feel guilty about the past.

As I stated to you over in Recovery, marriages should have no secrets. If you suspected your wife of any sort of infidelity, it was wise of you to check her e-mail accounts.

It sounds as though she may have gone for quite some time without having her emotional needs met, and feels some sort of entitlement as a result.

It may behoove you to fill out the Emotional Needs Questionnaires. You can find them under 'Questionnaires' on this website. Identifying her most important Emotional Needs would be a good start.

The fact that she has agreed to go to counseling is a good sign, and may be a good indicator that it isn't too late, at all, and even if her reasons right now are for your girls, it's still a reason and her reasons might change down the road.

Please study the principles outlined here. The more you and your wife can arm yourselves with knowledge and information , the better your chances are of building a strong marriage.

I applaud the leadership role you have taken in identifying that there is a problem and seeking out help in order to fix it.

Have you encouraged your wife to read here, as well? Have you told her that you are posting? The 'open book' rule goes both ways and informing her of the action you have taken by posting here could be a strong move towards showing her that you wish to have no secrets in your marriage and that you want to rectify your withdrawal.

Hope this helps.

Step one.

This WAS NOT BAD and DO NOT REGRET IT!!!

You have nothing to be regretful about.

Why do you regret this? Because your wife blasted you for finding out her secrets?

See? Doesn't make sense, right? So stop beating yourself up.

It's good and necessary that you have ID'd some things you weren't doing right in your marriage. Tend to them. But beware that your wife - and all wayward spouses - tend to re-write history, exaggerating problems in order to justify their affairs. Just keep this in mind when your wife lists all your failures. Disarm her by tending to them all - just grin and bear it when some may seem trivial.

Do you have any evidence that she had contact other than e-mails with the guy?

your story on here touched me personally and I want to give some help/advice..

It was so nice to see the man's side of this and to know that men do have deep feelings.
I am in a somewhat-similar situation!! I can relate to both you & your wife!
I am the wife of a man I feel is not giving me the love & support I desperately need.And although I dont have anyone else on the side, things are bad between us right now, anyway.And it makes me wonder if this is just how it has to be for the rest of my life or what..
that said -
The most important thing you can do for your wife is what you have been doing the last couple of days.The telling her that you love her & attempting to get help because you dont want to give up on your marriage.
Does she want things to work or has she already given up?? Did you ask her?? maybe your marriage means as much to her as it does to you , but she is just at her wits end because she feels neglected & didnt know how else to get attention from you.
Tell her many many times that you love her.This may be a cry for help in the last way she knew to reach you.

Thank you.

Every bit of advice is helpful. And encouragment, as well, which is what I think I need even more.

This is a very difficult time, and here, in the first several days since this started, I'm running the gamut of emotions...fear, panic, anxiety, sadness, guilt, loneliness.

I've been reading some materials that I hope will help us, including Nancy Wasson's 'Keep Your Marriage'. I'm trying to avoid the mistakes that will make things worse, and committed some errors in the first couple of days.

At first, I began to badger her with "Do you want to save our marriage?", "Do you think you can ever love me again?", etc. Then I started to change all of my behavior overnight and bent over backwards to make her weekend and Mother's day pleasant, and I know I came off awkward and probably wigged her out.

I made plans for her birthday next week, and found a great place with a great blues singer/band that I think she would like alot. I already have images of us syncing and enjoying it together, but I'm terrified that the cloud will still be hanging over us, and any attempt I make to reach out to her will come off awkward, and conversation (which she complains has been lacking in our marriage) will be minimal, stilted, or awkward. Or worse, she will be thinking of the man she has been having an on-line relationship with, and that she has already replaced her lost feelings for me with something with him.

She has told me already that if we could afford it, she would want a trial seperation. That can't happen, because we just have too many expenses and couldn't afford to pay the mortgage on our big house, etc.

I was going to take my 8-year-old daughter camping this weekend (just a father-daughter thing that I thought would be good for her), but the weather isn't looking good. I'm making plans instead now to spend the weekend at my friend's house upstate. It pains me to be away from my wife at this juncture. All I want is a sign: a kiss, a hug, a sorry, a 'we can do this', something. But it is becoming clear to me this week that I have been coming on too strong with my 'changes' and that she wants her space.

Trying to stay strong.

you read the emails to the other guy right?
what is it about him that she feels makes her happy?
Does he listen attentively? Does he give her encouragement?My point is this -
She is lacking something. It would be great if you could be the one to fulfill the need. She may just like the fact that after feeling sad/lonely -whatever it was that she was going through - that there is an answer. A light at the end.. If you can show her that you can be that light..
I don't know if you have read my post like I have been reading yours -I said I would give anything for my husband to take me serious & be the one to give me what I need.

Well, ok, I don't regret it per se. The problem is that it wasn't actually email, but an online guestbook for a band (much like this), and I logged on as her to read her private messages. I did it at work, and she tried to get in when I was on, and she saw that she was already logged on. I can see how that cause chills. But I think the larger problem is that her circle of girlfriends were a part of that, and now that the cat is out of the bag, the trust factor is even a bigger problem. No I don't feel guilty. Just bad.


No I have no evidence of this. She did meet him initially at a concert, and they talked and began the email relationship following that. He lives in Montana, we live NJ. I asked her, and she swore up and down that she would never do anything like that to me. I tend to believe her since she was married before and her ex cheated on her and then walked out on her and her 2 children. She has talked about this to me much in the past, and to her fidelity has always been very important. Also, I read another thread between her and one of her girlfriends, and there was a statement such as "It's not like you two 'DID' anything.' So I'm willing to believe this for now, but I am so hurt right now emotionally, and the trust is so damaged, that my mind can think of anything. I have to keep it in check.

The emotions you describe are all very normal. If this is NOT the worst experience so far in your life, you would be abnormal.

Right now, this instant - order "Surviving An Affair" (SAA) by Harley - available in the bookstore on this site or from just about any on-line bookseller. The affair has to be resolved before you can work on the marriage together. SAA will help you do this and help you jump start your work on the marriage while your wife is in LaLa Land.


So don't go.

Why are you going in the first place?

Whatever you do, DO NOT even CONSIDER a trial separation. Bad juju. Counterproductive. If your wife wants to really pursue this, let her - against your desires. But she has to be the one to do the separating. You're staying home and taking care of your daughter.

Your mantra should be find and fix the marriage problems for the good of the family. You can't do this separated.

WAT

I agree with what WAT just said.
I wish I could be more eloquent.
God knows you are hurting & you deserve good advice..
I think -If you come off right away & say that you think separation is also a good idea she may be confirming that you are angry enough at her to let her go. She might feel guilty right now and saying she wants a separation is the most shocking thing she could come up with as a defense mechanism to get you away from being mad at her to worried about losing her.
again - I dont know her mindframe.. it is hard enough to know the mindframe of the people pouring out their feelings on here because it is hard to separate facts from feelings. Sometimes knowing you have support & people who are willing to listen can give you the courage to do what you need to do.

Thanks for replying.

I know that what I've been doing is important, but I have to be careful. She has already told me that I'm doing to much and it's freaking her out and turning her off. I have also read an online ebook I found (Nancy Wasson's KeepYourMarriage.com), that this is a major mistake to avoid. So I'm trying to back off some. (But no too much!)

1. She has hinted that it might be too little too late, but she at least needs to give it a chance. My fear: that she is only going to give it a chance so that she does not get full blame if it does fail. Or that she is only going to try 'for the children'. But not for us. I have asked her many times, and she has told me essential to stop asking her. (Another mistake from Wasson's book.) So I have backed off on trying to get answers from her.

2. She says she has felt this way for so long, that she has become numb. She has given me plenty of hints, heck not even hints, but come right out and said it, but I ignored as I stated previously -- chalking it up to being overblown, overemotional, PMS'ing, etc. And I stayed stubbord and refused there was a problem.

3. I hope it is because she is at her wit's end, because then I actually have hope that she is doing this because she knows it is the only way to make things better. If that's the case, great. I only wished she forced me to make changes a long time ago. But if it's because she is finished and realizes that I have never given her what she needed, then my heart is dark.

What makes it so hard is that we are the typical case of 'opposites attract'. She is by nature outgoing, energetic and always on the go. I am reserved and more of an introvert. But I thought we complimented each great.
I think she did alot to meet us halfway, but I fell into the relaxed trap of staying on my end of the emotional spectrum, to the point where she couldn't take it anymore. I never gave her verbal support and encouragment, and often criticized over money matters, child discipline, and other things. At social events, I would often withdraw, and not participate, and sometimes be silently negative, make her and others uncomfortable. She would ask me things, and I would answer so often with "sure", "i don't care", or a plain yes or no, instead of engaging in conversation.

If I was her, I wouldn't want to be around me, either. But I want to change. I know that deep down, I'm not really like that -- I had to be outgoing enough to attract her when we met, courted and went through our engagement, right? I think I just really developed bad habits over the years, and forgot what's important to others and to I actually need to work to sustain relationships.

Part of it is probably minor depression, too. But I'm not going to blame it on that. Based on how quickly I was able to turn my behavior around this week (as futile and overdone as it may have been), I have already convinced myself that I'm capable of giving her the love and support that I should have done for the past 10 years.

I just hope it isn't too late.

Are things strained between you two right now?
what I mean is - ok- maybe the asking her all the time is freaking her out,
but what about just keeping things light - ya know - normal conversations...the neutral areas??
maybe she wants to be able to talk to you, but not feel that she already knows you are going to bring up that same thing.
Is there something she is really passionate about?
Maybe you guys have a common interest that you can engage in to still have fun together and release a little tension..you know - to remind her of the fun times..

Worth and Hoople,

Thanks for your replies, but now you both have me really confused over this subject of this weekend.

I can understand the advice that I do not allow a "trial seperation" under ANY circumstances, and I tend to agree with this. Even if we could afford it, I think I would refuse kicking and screaming, mainly because after my wife, I have two young daughters who I love more than anything else in the world. The most joyful act to me is tucking my 2-year-old into her crib every night, and watching her cutely snuggle with her blanket and gaze at me with these precious eyes as we say 'nite-nite' to each other and 'i wuv u'. No, I don't think I could handle this. And my stomach would be in even more knots than it is now if we were seperated.

But as far as this weekend, I thought it might actually be a good thing for a few reasons:
1) I have been overbearing this week in an attempt to fix everything at once, and she has made that clear to me. I thought by giving her some breathing room for 24-36 hours might be good for both of us.

2) She has a large circle of friends that she has been able to talk to about this as she struggles herself. I have nobody. My closest friend lives at least an hour away, and while we communicate via email and phone once in a while, I think I might need some time with him pour out my feelings, have some beers, and just talk to. My wife even suggested this the other day.

3) This is actually one of my traits that she has a problem with: I have centered my entire life around the household, the kids and her (even though I ignore her). She thinks I am just antisocial and have neglected my friends as well. She is right.

I don't know. I thought it might be good for both of us for a day or two. I was going to be away anyway this weekend, but the rain is going to make me reschedule the camping trip I think.

For what it's worth, she is still letting me cuddle in bed, and that's about the only thing that is keeping me going and giving me hope right now. She said this is okay, because she is used to it (even though I was never verbally close I was always physically close to her in bed), and she still lets me hold her.

I'm not sure if I should try initiate sex in a few days or not at this point.
One of the things in one of her emails stated to her girlfriend that when we had sex 2 weeks ago, all she could think of was the other guy. That hurts, and now that all the cards are on the table, I'm not sure what is off limits and what is not.

I can't wait to get to the counselor tomorrow. I know that the first 1-hour session isn't going to fix everything, but I need to get at least on small layer of peace-of-mind or hope.

I hope we can reach this point soon. But this has all started just 5 days ago, and is so serious, the weight is so heavy, and the cloud is so dark, that this the only subject that we've talking about. I hope we can lighten it up soon. I'm taking her out for her birthday and I would certainly like to talk about other things. But I hope I don't fall into the same old trap of becoming a bump on a log, and can find something interesting to talk about, laugh about, whatever. And I hope the weight of this crisis can be put aside for a while so we can talk about other things.

The thing she is really passionate about is the Allman Brothers, which is the area that this all spawned from in the first place (not my behavior, but hers). So I'm afraid to even bring up talking about this.

She complains that the only thing we have in common anymore is our children, and that they are the only things in our lives that cause us to laugh together when we even do that.

I have tried to start some conversations with her this week -- just bringing up light areas, like "did you hear about Freddie Mitchell getting cut from the Eagles" (we're both Eagles fans, sortof). And we'll trade a few sentences, then it fades off, and I get discouraged by her tone of voice. She probably thought when I brought it up, again, I'm doing something I never did before, and she doesn't like it.

I don't know.

Another perspective - Be sensitive to the fact that she has a past experience with trusting someone - and that trust was destroyed. Then created a life with you, trusting you would be a "partner", and didn't really "follow-through". Now , over-night, you've changed. How can she trust that this is real? It's not about blame, and it's not about who is right or wrong. Its about what she can rely on in the future. I am someone who feels alone in a marraige -(Slaghoop could be me) and I feel like the only one I can count on is me. Don't try to manage her feelings, or actions. I vote to give her some space but why don't you ask her? (You think you won't like the answer? ) If you're going to take the leadership, you have to take the lumps. And... she wasn't honest, but neither were you... so don't get caught up in playing the victim. You knew a long time ago she wasn't happy, and didn't feel like dealing with it.. Saying and nothing was also a big, hurtful lie.

Someday,

Thank you. You have hit the nail on the head with everything you said.

As to giving her some space this weekend, yes, I asked her about this morning and she said "go ahead." A couple of times this week she suggested that go and hang out with John (my friend). Part of me is afraid to depart for the entire weekend, as I may miss a small window of opportunity to work on fixing this crisis. Part of me feels like I'm racing against the clock, but then part of me feels like I should just give it time.

She has already made plans with her girlfriend to go to the shore with the little ones on Sat. and then go see a performance that night, so I would already be missing out on that.

I don't want to follow her around like a puppy dog, and she's already made it clear that she doesn't want that either.

And I'm not going to play victim. Even though I feel betrayed, hurt and still suspicious and fearful, I'm taking full responsibility for the may years of my apathetic behavior for this fix.

I just wish I could see some light at the end of the tunnel.

I have not seen this far back in the messages, so I don't know what exactly they talked. It could be that the conversations between them happened on her cell phone, and emails were more discussions lately and between her one girlfriend she confides in. That's how I found out- mostly via references, but never found the actual exchanges that constituted the 'relationship' the would tell me what it is about this guy that turns her on.

But I don't know if it matters. I know that I have not been attentive to her needs, have not complimented her, have not even conversed that much, other than taking care of business. I really let that thing happen that I always heard about but never thought would happen to me/us: let the marriage stagnate and turn into a couple of 'companions', nothing more.

Now, I'm sitting here struggling trying to find what can connect us back together, how to talk to her, and find areas of conversation that we can talk about and laugh about together. She is upset that we haven't been "a couple". I'm sorry for that and I want that back to.

I want to know how to do that.

my husband and I went on a cruise to try to get connected again. just us.. no daughter..
It was nice.
what about this ?? - Is it possible for you guys to get away together somewhere.?? you know- do it in a non-pressuring lighthearted sort-of way...(dont tell her that it is to work things out otherwise she might not want to go if she feels like she is being ambushed)
just say you want to get away & have fun for a little while & leave the problems behind you.. maybe you can take baby steps.

In time, I hope we can do this again, and I can be a good and enjoyable partner for her.

Maybe I am that bad. I mean, each day this week as it has all come out in the open, she has brought up incident after incident where I have either been miserable, non-participating or lackluster.

She mentioned our 10-year anniversary trip to Mexico last fall, and she said ok, we had a great time together when we did that all-day snorkeling trip, but then complained that I didn't want to go to the clubs at night or anything. It's true I get tired alot, and maybe I should have put on by best face and tried to do more. But I'm not much of a dancer and that's just another incident of being in social situtations and I clam up.

That is a major part of what has driven her away. She is just go-go-go and I'm more laid back. But now I see that I should have made more of an effort to show her a good time. I probably would've enjoyed it to, if I just lightened up.

And, this just reminded me of something...I KNOW that I wasn't always like this...when we were going out, I remember once going to a 'Dance Club'/Meat Market, whatever you want to call it. It was totally not my type of scene, but we played a game, and was so fun and turned us both on...we entered the place, but immediately seperated. I sat a table up on the higher floor, and she caroused down by the bar, flirting and talking with other guys. I watched for a while, then called the 'rose' girl over and paid for a rose and told her to give it my girl, pointing her out. After she got the rose, she looked up at me and smiled, dumped the guys who were doting on her and came over to talk to me and we both had the biggest laugh.

Cripes...what happened to me?
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Patience. The most important thing right now, and the hardest thing to do. Sounds like she also wants to see if you can "reconnect" with others in your life. Can You?

If she really likes the whole night club scene - see if she wants to do that.
you can be like - hey -know what we havent done in a while... lets go dancing.
she probably doesnt care that you arent the most sophisticated or best dancer..
things like that arent really important when you are with someone.I love going to dance clubs with my husband & he has a complete lack of coordination. I dont care. It is nice to be out with him.