I have read this board for a long time, and been encouraged and enlightened by it. Here's my story....

My H and I have been married for 11 years - the only marriage for each of us. No children. I have never really been exposed to divorce as I was lucky enough for my parents & grandparents to all be married for years. My H's parents never married but they did all live together until his mom died when he was 12. This was obviously a very difficult thing for him and I think a lot of his current problems stem from this. We had been married about 3 years when I first found him lying to me. He had movie stubs in his pants pocket from the night before, when he had supposedly been spending time with his dad (who doesn't go to the movies). He gave me a song and dance about how he decided to go to the movies with his uncle and didn't tell me because he didn't want me to feel left out. Well, I knew that wasn't true and ever since that day things have gone down hill. I feel like if I had been smart I'd have told him to get out then, before we had invested so much in our marriage. Later I discovered that he was seeing a woman he worked with. Of course he would deny it, I'd cry, he'd say things would change, they didn't, blah blah blah. Eventually (about 4 years later) though I felt like things had ended between them and tried really hard to meet what I thought were his emotional needs and get our marriage back on track. About 2 1/2 years ago he started seeing another woman from work. At first I think they really were just friends - she would even call the house and the two of them would talk while I was around. Then she stopped calling the house and he started making cell phone calls (which I saw on the bill). I confronted him, of course he said they were just friends. I eventually got into his e-mail at work and saw e-mails back and forth. When confronted with that he tried to deny it at first, blamed me for snooping, then said he would end things with her. Of course I didn't really believe it, but things seemed to get better. We went to a counselor a few times. She definitely wasn't the right one for us so we stopped going because I thought things were going to be ok. Last October H and I had a long heart to heart talk where he supposedly told me everything about his relationship with OW, that he had ended it, and that he wanted to change himself - go back to church, get counseling, work on our marriage. It was the first time in a really long time that I believed him. He started counseling, was much more attentive at home, etc. but soon something didn't feel right. Just 3 weeks ago he tells me OW had their child in February. He said that he hadn't talked to OW since October except when she called to tell him his son was born, and once to go see them. He said he wanted nothing to do with either of them, except of course to pay child support. This of course devestated me - not so much about the baby since H didn't want anything to do with him, but rather that he had seen them behind my back. After some thought we agreed to try and work things out - he would continue therapy, I would go to the next session too, he answered questions about both old relationships that he would never answer before,etc. Strangely it was the best time of our M in years. Well, I looked at a cell phone bill yesterday, and see that he has been calling OW for hours at a time ever since October and has been to visit her and baby several times (she lives in another town and the bill shows where he makes calls from. I called her to get her side of the story and she wants nothing else to do with him - she knows what a liar he is. She said she'll let him see the baby wherever he wants, or will be fine if H never sees baby. She even tells me that H wanted to make plans to visit baby at her house this weekend. Well, I confront H last night with all this and he pretty much tells me he's a grown man who can do what he wants, and that if I think everything he says is a lie than he just won't tell me anything, etc. I threw all his clothes out of our room and into a spare and told him to stay there or get out while I think things through. I wish I was a bigger person, but I can't be with him if he wants to involved in OC's life. That should be OUR son, not his and OW's. I never wanted a child with him because of his infidelity. I wanted to wait until we put that behind us and then have a family when it could be really special. I feel like he's cheated me out of all that. Even if we patched things up and eventually had children, none of our child's "firsts" would be as special to him after this other child has already called him daddy. I know that's selfish of me, but that's just how I feel. I don't know what to do other than give myself some time to think. I think I would be willing to work on our M if he agreed to have NC with OW & C (and I think she would tell me if he was calling if I asked her to), but I don't know if I can ever trust him again after so many years of lying. I should also add that I make more money than he does and that he could never afford to maintain our lifestyle on his own (not that we're rich or anything, but we are comfortable). Its in the back of my mind that this is the big reason he has stayed. Any advice would be appreciated!

Disbelief, welcome to MB. So sorry for the situation that brings you here. My first question to you is did paternity get legally established with DNA? Did OW file for CS through the courts or is your H just taking her word for it that the child is his? I don't know..from my perspective unless you are willing to spend the rest of your life with OW/OC involvement, it may be best to move on. To bring a child into your M with all these problems would be a shame and good for you for realizing that! I am not advocating D by any means, I am just saying since you do not have children together it may be the best thing for YOU.

I know we're not supposed to give advice here, but from what you have said, I would move on. Years of deceipt, the fact that you have no children and you make a decent living on your own. Besides the fact that you have had doubts about his faithfulness all along. It doesn't sound like he's repentent or that he is willing to do whatever it takes to keep you. I think you are a bigger person than him already.

Thank you both for your thoughts. There has been no paternity test,though I did suggest it to him. I had the same thought - why should he believe she was faithful to him? He has asked her not to go to court over CS. He works for the school district in our small town and if a support order came to his employer everyone would know about the baby. He has created this persona of a great and dependable guy to everyone else. Even if he does choose to be part of his son's life, I know he would never bring him around his family and friends because it would destroy that image. He's ashamed of the child - how awful would that be for the boy to grow up with? My head keeps telling me to leave, that I'd be better off without him. But my heart holds me back. I need to find the strength to let go of my dream of having a happy, life long marriage, and it scares me to death. I keep beating myself up over not having left him years ago, but I know I need to stop that because I can't change it and I know that I did the best I could at the time. This isn't really on topic, but he did start going to church in January. He actually calls OW on his way home from church. I had to laugh at that! If anyone has any other suggestions I'd be glad to hear them. Thanks again for your support.

Disbelief,
Sorry you have found yourself in this situation but you have come to a good resource in this board. People here will listen, share their experience, give their perspective on your sitch, make suggestions and back you up on your choice. You won't recieve criticsm here -- only support. So you came to the right place.
Here are my thoughts on some of what you wrote:


H has alot of issues he needs to work on. He can't work on M with you until he takes the first step of owning up to what he has done. He can't live this double life and expect you to go along with.


It is true - you do have to grief the death of this dream marriage in your mind. I chose to stay in M and I still had to go through griefing what I felt like I lost - the life long commitment to only each other. It was a hard process (much like when my best friend died over a year ago) but it did end and I did find a way to make peace with it. You will too. And you will dream again and hope again and yes, you will be happy again. You did do what you could when you could in your M so don't beat yourself up. You are doing what you feel you need to do now and it is scary but you can do it.

Hang in there -- it is quite a rollercoaster ride but you will make it!!!!

Beth

Thanks for the support Beth. This board has already given me a lot of comfort and perspective. Over the past two days H and I have talked a lot, more than we have in a really long time. He has been answering more of my questions, and it feel that he is answering them honestly. He has been seeing a counselor and will continue to, and we are both open to joint counseling. I am leaning toward trying to give this one last shot. But this time around really feels different for me - I feel like I am gaining strength and taking ownership of my own issues and feelings. Our previous attempts at "fixing" our M always seemed to be on H's terms but I am determined that this time around I set the ground rules and that I have the conviction to end the M if things don't change. As in past reconciliation attempts he said yesterday that I can't expect him to be perfect, that he will make mistakes. My response was that I realize that, but there are different types of mistakes. I can deal with him thinking about his son, but I will not tolerate him seeing him and that the first time that happens I will be contacting an attorney. That really seemed to get his attention that I was serious.

You are very correct that H needs to get over his shame of the A and OC. The OW knows his feelings on this and I think is using it to control the situation. H has agreed to have NC with OW and OC. He and I are discussing how and when he tell her this, and specifically what he wants from her as far as OC is concerned so tehy don't have to talk again(amount of CS due, how often to review the amount due, if he wants to know about any serious medical issues, etc.). I told H that I would not have a problem with him seeing OC one last time to say goodbye and hopefully provide some closure.

OW has been e-mailing me now that she knows I know about OC. At first it made me feel better to hear her apologize for her role in this, and she filled in some of the blanks for me before H was ready to talk. I made it clear to her that I have no ill will towards her son but really just want nothing to do with them. I made the mistake of e-mailing her back that H was going to be calling her to tell her about NC decision. That must have hit a nerve with her even though she has had nothing good to say about him and that she wants nothing more to do with him because she started saying how disappointed she was in him for that, and that maybe taking the CS to court is the best thing if that's his decision, that I'm a fool for staying with him after everything that's happened, etc. That set me off - how dare she tell me how to live my life, her of all people? Then she made a veiled threat of asking if I planned to tell anyone about the baby - that while she wouldn't make a point of telling people who the father is she wouldn't lie about it. I told her I don't care if she shouts it from the rooftops or takes it to her grave, but that she had better think this whole thing through about what she plans to tell her son about his father when he starts asking questions. With her desire to be honest does she plan to tell him his parents had the morals of alley cats and that his father chose to be with his other family instead of with him? That just seems like a harsh reality for an innocent child. But as she was quick to tell me, only a mother can understand what's in the best interest of her child. I am also thinking it would be best for this to be handled in court so that she has no more control over him and we don't have to deal with her directly.

My H really is an idiot though - he agreed to have his name put on the birth certificate when OC was born. I asked him if he had given any thoughts to the ramifications of that, and of course he really hadn't.

Sorry to go on so much. This whole thing just aggrevates me. Now that I know he has had unprotected sex I have asked him to have an HIV test and I plan to go to the dr. and be checked for every bug known to medicine. It hurt me to know that not only did he have no regard for my emotional well being at the time that he obviously had no concern for my health either.

So for now I am taking one day at a time, reading all I can about how I can get through this, and trying to take care of myself. I am trying to be as open and loving as I can be when H answers my questions with things I don't want to hear because I know my reaction will determine how comfortable he feels with continuing to be honest. If anyone has words of wisdom or coping strategies that worked especially well for them I'd love to hear them. In the meantime I will keep reading all these boards for ideas and support. Thanks again.

When he says something really dumb a$$ concerning A/OW/OC, come here and SCREAM and we will all scream with you!


Hang in there -- you are doing great. You sound like you are really working things out in your mind of what you can and can't handle. Counseling w/H is a good option to have a third party present in discussing alot of these issues. I am glad to hear H is getting IC. At some point with at least some people that are close to him (family or whoever) he will have to come clean about this -- that will be part of the rebuilding/recovery on his part . . . to take responsibilty and not be entitled to a secret life. Not to say that he needs to tell every Tom,[censored] and Jane in town -- and it's true in a smalltown it would spread like wildfire. But surely there are trustworthy confidants in his life that he can have some accountability with by sharing.

One thing I don't think people that have never been in our sitch really understand -- just because H did something so stupid as to have an A and end up w/OC, doesn't mean he is a monster and couldn't be the nice Christian guy next to you at church. They also don't get how you stil love the man you married even when something as horrible as our sitch has happened. It is very complicated and people on the outside can't truly factor in all the components of it.

Anyway -- hope you have a good weekend.

Beth

Beth

Thanks for the support Beth, and its funny that you say that about coming here to scream. Over the weekend I felt that H and I had some good discussions, and that we were moving in the right direction (however slowly). But last night was terrible. His dad is elderly and lives alone, so H visits in the evening to make sure he has eaten, taken medicine, etc. This isn't a big deal as he lives only a couple minutes away. However, I know that H has used these visits as an excuse to park the car somewhere and call OW. Anyway, last night I was watching Everybody Loves Raymond (alone) and the show kind of made me think that life is too short to not show your love and be happy with your family. But I wasn't sure if I felt like that meant I should work extra hard on my M to make it better, or that I should throw in the towel, stop wasting my life on my loser H, and at least give myself the possibility of happiness later on. When H finally came home he was very distant both physically and emotionally which made me wonder if he had called OW while he was out. I asked and he said no. Then we started talking some more and I told him that one of my EN was to feel special and cherished by him. Then I gave him a few examples of how I thought he could show that to me. His reaction was not what I wanted. He rolled his eyes while I spoke, gave excuses as to why he couldn't/wouldn't do the things I suggested, etc. Obviously this upset me but I tried not to lash out, so I changed things around to what EN did he have and how could I better meet them. And he proceeds to tell me he doesn't have any needs. I say obviously you do because you had to find somebody else to meet them for you - if you don't tell me what you need, how can I try to meet that need? His attitude just totally pissed me off. I am hoping yesterday was just a blip on the screen and he was just having a bad day, but even if that's the case, how many "bad days" can I allow? In retrospect I think I should have ended the conversation as soon as I felt I was not being heard (when he first rolled his eyes for example) and told him I would be more than willing to continue it when he was ready to be serious. I wish I had thought of this then, instead of now. He also mentioned that he will be calling OW today to see if can vist OC on Wednesday night to say goodbye. I understand that will be a difficult thing for him to do, and I keep stressing that must be HIS decision. I just don't want him resenting me for that decision.

Thanks, I feel a little better now after venting. Keep your fingers crossed for me that tonight is better.