Hi to all,

I'm sure that, if you read my recent post on another thread, you are already scared off. However there may be a person or 2 around to help. And if not, at least I've gotten things off my chest, without doing amymore damage to M.

H and I have been having a hard time lately. Actually we've had a hard time for the whole of our marriage. It's a very complicated thing. But then aren't they all? I, after being molested by son's psychiatrist 2 years ago, have finally been working on all the issues I realize I have in my life from a lifetime of SA (especially in childhood). A quick rundown for any who haven't heard of me before.

• Something happened to me when I was 4 or 5. I can't remember what, but I know there's something there. Don't know if I want to remember or not. What purpose will it serve? However, is there someone in my life that I'm still trusting who has done something unfathomable to me?
• When I was 7, my 3rd grade teacher emotionally abused me. Long story. Just don't ever call me Kimmie.
• When I was 8, a cousin put his hand up my dress.
• When I was 14, I was gang raped by 3 older teenaged boys.
• When I was married the 1st time at 18, my ex wanted to have a 4some with a neighbor couple. Lot's of other problems,
• When I was 16, youth minister where I went to church molested me.
• When I was in my 20's, an uncle propositioned me.

Now I tell you this, not to gain sympathy, but to let you know that I have a lot to deal with. If there is a silver lining in what happened 2 years ago, it's that it finally woke me up and forced me to look at myself and get help. I can't live like this anymore. I can't be numb, vulnerable anymore.

In working on things the last 2 years, I have been rather numb to feelings. Actually, I think you could say that I dissociated myself. I always knew all things happened to me, but it was like watching a movie or reading a book. Well, I took a break from counseling for a couple months. I kept forgetting appts. Avoidance, I guess. Anyway, the anger hit within the last month. Of course this is also big trigger time for H, as you can see by reading my signature line. So all h*ll has broken loose.

Anyway, H thinks I'm not sorry enough. I have no where to go wtih this anger. So it's one blow up after another. To top it all off, there was an article in the local paper about a woman who's husband almost killed her. In reading the article, it sounded just like my H. It had a list of "Danger Signs". H fit all but one. Now before you go thinking that I'm just making this up to make excuses, forget it. I'm not. However, in working on me and learning about how my reactions, while they enabled me to survive all these years are also going to destroy me if I don't heal, I have learned that I can't continue to allow anyone to treat me badly. If I don't respect myself, I can't expect others to respect me. I have had several friends over the last 12 years tell me that my H is emotionally abusive. It's unfortunate that I didn't wake up sooner, but that's something I will have to deal with along with other everything else.

So back to the subject at hand. H went off on S about cell phone usage. S didn't realize that if someone calls him, it costs him minutes and money. We were having dinner and my stomach immediately tied up in knots. I walked away, but heard H continue til I couldn't stand it anymore. I went in and yelled for him to stop yelling at S. So they both left the house to avoid me. The next day H didn't come home. I called and he wouldn't answer my call till about 11 pm. I asked if he would be home that night and he said no, he's staying at his mom's. I asked him to please let me know when he wouldnt' be home. he said ok.

To make a long story short (sort of) he hasn't been home except once. He took a shower and left, saying that he has to go to work. Not unusual to work late. WE are building a house and today, the entry door was being delivered and someone had to be there. I asked if he would be able to so that I didn't need to take off work and he said ok. Well, he didn't come home last night. I assumed he worked all night or possibly got a motel room. I called to make sure he could still meet the people with the door. After the 2nd , and I had left work, not sure if he had worked all night he called me back and said he was on his way. I asked about work and he said he stayed at his mom's. I asked would he please call me. He said that he's staying there indefinitely. I asked about common curtesy. (I was VERY polite). He informed me that I have never given him any respect or common curtesy in the 15 years of our marriage. All I've ever done is abuse him. I asked what he would like for me to tell S and he said that he already told him. Now at this point I'm seething. However, I have to say that I stayed very calm, cool and collected. I didn't say anything.

Now before all the BS's out there start telling me how I deserve this, just stop. I would agree with you to a point. Unfortunately, this is the way our M has been from the beginning. He has done things like this to me for years, except for staying gone all night.

But what do I do now? I have stayed all these years because I love him and because we have a son together. I don't know what I feel sometimes. I don't want to be divorced a 2nd time. Just the thought of it makes me want to throw up. However, I don't know that things will ever be better.

I have begged H over the years to go the MC. We went 5 sessions about 8 years ago. It was a disaster! Everything was fine as long as we talked about all the things I did wrong (trust me it was a pretty long list, mostly true). But then that last session, counselor brought up that H might have a few issues of his, he was very nice to her, but when we got to the car,he blasted me because, in his words, all we did was talk about what he did wrong. Of course we never went back. He always said things when no one was around. He never raised his voice when he told me that I didn't need nice clothes, or that I p*ss away money, or that if I didn't do what he wanted me to he would divorce me, or that he was moving back to the farm with or with out me, that it was my fault that S had problems in school because if I would move everything would be fine, or that buying him a card is stupid, or that I'm just an f'g sl*t. The list goes on. The problem is that I allowed this because I felt I deserved it. So, in case you can't imagine on your own, when the incident happened 2 years ago, it just reinforced my already low self-esteem. And it gave H the excuse he needed for the rest of our lives. He could now call me a n***er f'er and why would that upset me because, after all, it's only the truth. Anytime something was bothering him,after me asking him for 2 or 3 days what's wrong and him telling me over and over nothing and laughing at me for being so stupid, I would relax, think it really was my imagination. I'd put my head on his shoulder and be content. Then it would come. H says, "So when you were f'ing your ni**er....". The question might change, but it always started the same. But what recourse did I have? I had hurt him, irregardless of who's fault it was. I'd come here and be told that I'm not sorry enough and I can't expect to look at the M in general till I'm sorry enough. But you know, I tried to do all the things that MB says to do. I'm an open book. I tried to get H to come to MB-no way. I told him what my name here is. He wouldn't "invade" my privacy. We even had an appt with SH. H said that SH was trying to manipulate him. Well, I am sorry. I've started to forgive myself now for the last 40 years of my life.

I'm not sure what to do. I still think that S would be better off with his parents together, but maybe I'm just fooling myself. Am I the only one who thinks that I at least deserve common curtesy? Maybe I don't. Should I do a plan A? Not sure I can without coming here to vent. I do have another appt scheduled with IC next week. It's time to get on that band wagon again. Especially now that I'm feeling some of those feelings I probably should have felt years ago.

I'm precious

Precious,

I think you need to figure out what your boundaries are and then don't sway from them.

He starts saying hurtful things to you, you walk away and do not engage. And you stay disengaged until he acts lovingly again. Repeat as necessary.

That's all I have to offer. Probably you have heard a hundred times before. But it take two to dance.

Stop dancing with him.

Change yourself and hopefully he will change as well.

If someone called me a derogatory name (and disrespected a whole race of people in the process) I like to think I would walk away, and that would nip it in the bud.

Boundaries. Hard I know.

And stop asking him to please let you know this or that. He left, let him be gone until he figures out that leaving is not going to get him his way this time. You get on with it, with him being gone. He is playing a childs game. Don't play with him.

As far as him screaming at your DS, I would have reacted the same way as you. You can not just walk away and let him do that. I don't see how else you could have handled it myself.

Maybe someone else can see another way to handle situations like this which involve your kids.

Thanks Weaver,

I appreciate the response. I know what you mean about boundaries. I don't think I've ever had them. I'm learning. It's a difficult thing. I'm sure alot of people don't understand just how hard it is. But then whoever said life is easy?

The reason I kept asking him about things was that I didn't know he had actually left until today. He told everyone but me,I guess. But now that I know, I won't ask him again. This will be hard, also. It triggers a lot of fears, but I know it's part of the healing process for me. Somtimes (very briefly) I think things would be easier if I just went back to being the me of before I started on this juorney. But Pandora's Box, so to speak, has been opened and can never be closed. Was that a bad example to use? It's just that it's the only one I could come up with. I know it signifies something bad and healing is not a bad thing, just painful.

Thanks for taking the time to read and respond.

I'm precious

Precious -

I hope you will try to find a women's survivors of sexual abuse group. I think it would REALLY help you. When a person is abused as a child, they don't realize that they can say no. Their body belongs to whoever wants it. They have no boundaries.

Whatever happens in your marriage, I think a womens group like this would help you in your personal healing.

Hang in there.

Thanks Believer,

My current IC is at a Women's Sexual Assault Center. It was nice to have someone in my life finally tell me that it wasn't all my fault. But to be fair to everyone, I never told anyone what happend so what were they supposed to think? Thanks for the encouragement. Thanks,

I'm precious

I still hope you will get into a group. There is nothing like sharing with others who have been through it.

Thanks again believer. I know there is a group or 2 that meets there. Not sure I was ready for it before. It's still a scarey proposition, but I will definitely talk to IC about it when I'm there Wed. I guess I'm just not sure I'm ready to share with anyone else. I spend a lot of time being sorry that I've told the people I already have. I wish I could heal without having to tell anyone. But then that's what caused a lot of the problems to begin with. Not telling. It's just a vicious (sp?) cycle that spirals downward. I do hope that I am able to get to the point in my life that I am able to help others. It will be such a turning point I think.

Precious,

I'm not usually a teary one but I can't help but shed one for you.

I don't have any advice I just want to let you know somebody cares.

{{{{{{{{{{{precious}}}}}}}}}}}

RebornMan

Sweetie -

There are lots of other women that are going through the same thing you are. They will understand, and I think you will get great support from them.

Many women never talk about this stuff, but that is not healthy. So get going, and start getting this taken care of.

You might want to consider reading and applying Michelle Weiner Davis's Divorce Busting 180 Degree List before you consider pulling the plug on your marriage.

TMCM

Believer is right Precious.

Getting into a group, making friends with women who have been through childhood/adult SA, and preferrably some who have become strong and whole might be the best thing for you.

I like the way Believer said that women with childhood SA issues often feel that their body is not their own. The lines have become mucky and they don't really even know what the lines are.

Good luck Precious...and you are precious!

Dear Precious,

While I am not experienced in this area, I would like to offer a small suggestion. Maybe understanding how to communicate with the other gender would help. I know it did for me.

The book his needs/her needs by Dr W. Harley was very helpful. Even when interacting with other males, I have learned how to act and react.

For me pulling back and doing less has gotten better results. It is helpful that you have a support group where they can relate to your inner issues and offer support and encouragement.

Wishing you all the best on your personal recovery. I have in-laws (2 in particular) who have caused and been the victims of similar trauma. Both are sisters and the effect is still lingering in their adult lives. The sad piece is that one of them craved and created the drama and the other one was the victim and then tried to take out her anger on those who tried to help. It is sad.

I am glad you are getting help. My SILs refuse to get help.

L.

Weaver,
I have read several books on CSA. It was such a relief to know that, while not healthy, my reactions and ways I've coped are normal. I'm not a freak. The boundaries issue is difficult, at best. I'm 44 years old and this all started 40 years ago. It's such ingrained part of me. I've tried to set boundaries with H and he gets angry because he feels I have a lot of nerve to set boundaries with him when I've never set with anyone else before. It's hard at that point to stick with it. Maybe he's right. And engaging is a very hard thing for me to stop. I have such a fear of being abandoned. I've always had to change to be whatever the other person wanted. I've allowed that fear to rule my life. I wish I had a dime I've heard, "If you don't do..." or "If you stop doing..." "You don't deserve....If you did I would have done it for you." I'm not feeling sorry for myself, just learning what I need to work on.

Believer,
I've said it a couple times already but I'll say it again. Thank you.

TMCM,
Thank you for your response. I haven't written off my M. I just feel rather hopeless about it at the moment. I read the Divorce busting list. I think I do or have, at some point, done all of them. Food for thought.

Reborn,
Thanks for the cyber hug. A person can never have too many.

Orchid,
Thank you. I have His Needs, Her Needs. I can't remember if I read. H and I have both done the questionaire. We did it when we had the coaching with SH. Unfortunately, we never got to the point of discussing them. I did ask H what his #1 EN was. I know this sounds awful but I don't remember anymore what his #1 was. I think it was admiration. I admit that I don't do the best job in the world with that one. Mine was Family Commitment. His response was "Hum, I would have never guessed that." A few years ago, I bought "The 5 Love Languages" by Gary Smalley. It's a similar concept but with only 5 choices, instead of 10. Hence the name, you think. (Bad joke I know.) Anyway, I'm sure it's time to revisit the communication thing. The hard part is not withdrawing when meeting his needs but not getting my own met. It's a reflex.

Thanks again for everyone's input. I will continue to check in here and probably vent to keep from blowing up somewhere else.

I'm precious

Excuse me for playing the devils advocate but looking at your post, raises huge questions in my mind. People end up in abusive relationships and to me the very thought is a horror but that begs the questions as to whom has been abusive to whom in this particular relationship. Is it possible that this is not a one way street? Can it be true that your husband is the total vile and mean spirited individual that you paint him to be or is this just your perception of who he is? And your friends of course agree? So it must be true right? Is he like this with every one or even any one else or is just with you?

At the beginning of this post you gave us a laundry list of painful injustices done you that is almost unbelievable in the content of acts perpetrated. And I’m not saying that your not telling the truth…I’m say that this list is mind boggling! Did you never once speak out? Did you never once run away screaming and crying? A teacher abuses you? Were you the only one treated in this fashion? You were gang raped by there teenagers? Did you never see these boys again? Tell anyone, make any complaint? What was the after math? Nothing? At 16 the youth minister at your church molested you? And again you never said anything? And did any one ever come forward to complain that he had done this to them as well?

Ms. P, the kind of people that do these kinds of things don’t often quit after one try! Especially when they’re successful. Their sickness usually drives them to seek greater and greater thrills till they get themselves caught…so did that ever happen to any one of the group of 7 you listed.

Then you get married and your ex-wants to orgy with you. Share you with others…So what was your feeling about this? Did you ever participate or was it he, trying to force you to do something against your will…that caused you to leave the marragie?

And then you had an affair with your son’s therapist. How did your H find out? You admit to enjoying the relationship and not having any regret:

Me-44
H-47
M-14 years
Kids (yours, mine, and ours) S-26,24,22,13 D 21
Incident lasted approx. 6 wks
D-day 6/24/03-glad of it.
Perpetrator was 13 year old son's psychiatrist who offered to do MC for H and me after this happened.

I mean when you say “glad of it” what do you mean? Glad that it ended or glad you did it or what?

And so, your H is angry and you are angry and you say he is abusive and he feels that you are abusive…and, and, and? Sorry precious but things don’t add up here. And NO I’m not picking on you! I’m saying things don’t add up to the way you are making them sound. That’s all I’m saying.

You’re describing a relationship that has been so dysfunctional that for it to even last 15 years would take a miracle. Yet it has.

So tell us, what is that you want to happen now? Save a marriage what?

You can’t possibly believe that growing up with such rancor is good or healthy for you son so how much worse would it be to totally separate for good? And just for the record, why caused your H to suddenly run for the hills? Besides, if you fear for your life, why ask him back?

Precious, this is all very sad but my feeling is that a lot of this is more surreal then real if you get my drift.

What should you do? Be alone for a while. A very long while I would guess, and into heavy therapy in the process. But hey, that’s just my most uneducated opinion.

Coach

Hi Coach,

To start with, I'm sorry for whatever pain in your life brought you here. Unfortunately, it seems, very few people come to MB BEFORE they have problems.

Thanks for your response. I've been waiting to a response like this and I'm trying to stay very calm which is very difficult for me right now.

To start with, I'm not sure I understand what you mean when you say "people end up in abusive relationships". What is your point with this statement?

As far as my friends agreeing with me, you do need more information. 1st of all, I don't have the kind of friends, or family for that matter, who pat me on the back and tell me that everything is ok, that I'm perfect and other's are the bad guys. Sorry to disappoint you. I never thought about being abused as far as H is concerned. I had one friend point out to me after being around H and I that she and her H were concerned about the way he treated me, things he said to me. The other friend who told me this has been around H and me a lot also. Both have also talked to me about things I could do differently. And actually, many abusers pick on one person at a time. Many fathers who SA their daughters, do so with one at time.

As for my list, it is mind boggling isn't it. No I didn't ever once speak out. How do you figure that is so wierd? It's the forbidden topic. My IC at the sexual assault center says that, even today, when she's at a party or in a group of people and is asked what she does for a living, she tells them and the room gets silent. Do you think that makes me feel safe? I don't know if any of the 7 ever got caught. I don't even remember who the person was when I was 4 or 5 so I obviously don't know if he's ever gotten caught. The 3rd grade teacher went on to finish here teaching career. I never told anyone. She actually told me that I wouldn't want my parents to know what I did, now would I. The cousin when I was 8, I won't go into. Just suffice to say that I haven't seen him in 25 years and that's fine with me.
Yes, I was raped by 3 teenaged boys. They were 15, 17, and 17, I think. I know they were a couple years older than me but not sure exactly how much. But you know what, I never screamed, there was a few minutes in between each incident and I didn't run. I just remember curling up into a ball and trying to keep my pants. Is that good enough for you or should I have done more? Actually, one of the 3, who is really stupid, was bragging about raping me sometime after it happened. A friend of mine's brother overheard and told his mom. She called me and encouraged me to report. There was a girl in the house at the time it happened. My friend's mom said that allthe girl would have to do is verify that I was there or some such nonsense. I called the girl who proceeded to tell me that she wouldn't say anything. I didn't scream, or try to get away. I obviously wanted it. I gues the 2 of you come from the same school.

As for the youth minister when I was 16, he's dead now. He was killed in a traffic accident when I was 21 years old. No I didn't tell. I assumed, like everything else in my life that it was my fault. No one told me. I just knew. I heard people talk. It's always the woman's fault. You can't expect a man to actually control himself, can you? God what a racket you men have had going since the beginning of time. Can't be expected not to sow your wild oats, but you're the superior being?!

My marriage to ex-H was a disaster. I was 18 and he was 20. I should have never gotten married. I wasn't ready. I was stupid. And no I didn't do the 4some thing. I ran out of the apt and never mentioned it again. He followed me shortly after, because I guess he didn't like the idea of a 3some. I don't know, maybe the whole thing was my fault. But I didn't just jump right into another marriage. I waited 10 years. Didn't want to do somethnig stupid again.

Now I'm sorry if you think that my reactions and defense mechanisma were wrong. However you weren't there to help me at the time. And I'm thinking that you probably wouldn't have been the one to turn to anyway, as you would have blamed me. I don't need that. I already did it myself. People like you are the reason why people like me don't report abuse.

Now on to H. I'm sure he's not he mean, vile person I make him out to be. I'm sure it's all me. Just ask him. As a matter of fact he tells me now that I have abused him for the last 15 years, I have never done anything for him, I'm mean, I'm evil. However, if you ask him to name all these mean things I do, he says that he doesn't keep score. Now I will tell you that I do yell. I always have. It's something I've worked on. Unfortunately, it's just one more thing that I'm a failure at. I'm not a perfect person. I know that I have a lot of problems and thankfully I'm getting help for them. I've known for years that H and I need help. I begged him to go to MC. I've encouraged him to post here or just read. I told him what my name is. He won't come here. I'm sure if he came here and posted the way he feels, he wouldn't have anything nicer to say about me. But he wouldn't say anything bad about me here or to you if you were his best friend. He only says things to me when we're alone.

As for the incident with S's psychiatrist, I don't know what to tell you. Irregardless of how it happened, I'm sorry. There is not anything in my signature line to indicate I didn't have any regrets. I wrote glad of it after I said when dday was. I've apologized to H. I have allowed him (and according to you I should) to call me names, yell at me, etc. I never went' into S's psychiatrist office to have and A of any kind. I took my son there for help. Part of helping son is helping family. No one lives in a vacuum. I didn't tell the a-hole anything I shouldn't have. His office was SUPPOSED to be a SAFE PLACE. My H was invited to go every single time there was an appt. He chose not to. Actually, he did go once or twice. The A-hole brought up a problem H and I were struggling with and H said, when asked what about me, that he didn't care. I stopped the R the morning before admitting to H that it had been going on. I have heard from the A-hole one time since and that was when he called my work to tell me that he hoped I would keep things, including this phone call, to myself. We were employed by the same company, although not in the same building. I had turned him in to employer. He told employer that I was delusional and made up the whole thing. Well, don't I wish? I also turned him into the state licensing board and the investigation is pending. As a mental health professional (or as a medical professional of any kind) you don't prey on your pt or their family members for "dates". Now I know this is a difficult concept for the folks here at MB, but that's not my problem. That's yours.

Actually, coach, I don't get your drift. What DO you mean by surreal?

Now to my H. I never said I fear for my life. He has never threatened to kill me. I also don't maintain that ALL of our marital problems are his fault. However, I will not accept blame for all of them either. My H hasn't suddenly run for the hills. He's been escaping there for years. And it's not a big mystery why. There is no pressure. No one cares if he comes or goes. If he doesn't show up for dinner, no one cares. Nothing is talked about. No one says, "I love you." Everyone just knows. EVeryone pats you on the back, no matter what you do. Everyone knew the neighbor beat the sh*t out of his wife and kids regularly, but he died without anyone ever saying or doing anything about it. I guess because they didn't ask for help, you think? Actually, she was probably really the abusive one, now that I think about it. My FIL, when H was a kid, threatened to kil MIL every time he got drunk. Usually even got the gun out, but H has chosen to remember the good and forget the bad. And it hasn't affected him. I've had all 3 of his kids come up to me at least once and ask me, "Why is dad the way he is?" My response is always that they have to understand what he grew up in.

Now one final word about my abuse. You have no right to judge me because of what I did or didn't do. I did the best I could. Actually I'm proud of myself. I AM A SURVIVOR!!! and you can't take that away from me. I will no longer sit back and listen to you or anyone tell me that I should have done things differently. You have no idea and if you can't be supportive, keep your mouth shut.

So that you will rest easier, I am in therapy. I'm sure not the way you would like but I'm getting there. Just so you know, you should have found me 2 years ago. I would have shied away from you, skulked away, and beat myself up because you validated all over again what a piece of sh*t I am, but I won't be treated that way anymore.

Just want to point one more thing out to you. Did you notice in my original post, that I said H and I had appt with SH and H didn't like that SH was trying to manipulate him. Does that not tell you anything about him? Oh well, probably not.

I'm precious

Precious,

Good for you for sticking up for yourself. I am not quite sure what Coach was getting at, but hopefully there is a point to it and he will be back to explain.

One thing that keeps jumping out at me, which you have agreed to is that the relationship problems between your H and you are a two-way street (the dance).

You also said that you yell alot. Okay that is something we can work with. No more yelling. Work on this non-quality of yours Precious. When fear and anxiety rear their ugly head and yelling is your defense, this is going to be to hard to change. But it is reactive and you can stop it.

I would continue along the lines of what the others have said with the change in your behaviour, treat him with respect, no DJ's or LB's when you do talk to him. And when he starts on you, gently excuse yourself and walk away or hang up the phone.

Try to change the dynamics from your end Precious, and maybe he will change also. Best to live apart until the dynamics are changed though, in my opinion. Otherwise it will be just too eash to slip back into old destructive patterns of behaviour with your H. For both of you.

Remember like Star or someone has in their sig line, we cannot change anyone else only ourself. Sometimes Precious that is all it take.

Bless you and hang in there!

Precious & Weaver, (in that Weaver didn’t seem to understand what I was getting too),
I am here and will be glad to further explain my post. And I promise to not get defensive (well…maybe just a little bit!) But neither will I apologize for my post. We,…all of us here,…come to this place to discuss issues that are volatile by their very nature. Some more so then others but all painful by definition of what they’re about.

So precious I first would like you to understand that I really went out of my way to not be judgmental or arbitrary about responding to your sadness. I would also like you to know that it is not your sadness that I was questioning…or your right to be angry hurt or feel so many other emotions that your life is inspiring in your current conscious attitude. Nor would I ever blame a victim for an injustice done them. Never!

It must be obvious to any who has read your post that you hurt….dreadfully! But in my post I made a special effort to not address that hurt. I am not a cheerleader and I don’t encourage people that I know and love to avoid pain and painful situations…I encourage them to confront those situations and make the changes required to end that pain. And so when I come to this place, I try to bring my conscience, MINE, along with me and treat those I post to with same the same love and respect as I bring to those people who I know more intimately.

In defense of myself, I cry at sad movies just like so may others here do (I’m sure). I condemn violent and selfishly inappropriate behavior because I believe there is no place for it among decent civilized people. And what I read here is sometimes so painful for me to “witness” that I swear to go and never return!

And yes, my personal pain is with me and will be with for all the rest of my life…but it is my pain….MINE…and you may be surprised to note that I CONCOUSLEY do everything in my power to never allow that pain to taint my approach to others, their pain or how they live their lives. And so my defense rests. I am comfortable at last with who I am and what my life is to be.

But I am not the subject of your post. You came to a public forum seeking help; in your own words. If I misunderstood and it’s really just pity that you are seeking, then indeed, my previous post back to you was inappropriate…and I will now apologize for my misunderstanding. However, if your post was a cry for help then the questions I asked and the points I made were valid. And if you will please re-read my post above more carefully, maybe you will see that I made no assertions as to the validity of the things you said and I made no judgments about what you did or didn’t do about the things that have happened to you in your life. Very simply put, I’m a believer! That means I always believe what people want me to as long as no action on my part is required. If what you wrote is what you want me to believe then I am happy to give credence to your words.

This willingness on my part however, does not obligate me to accept blindly and with out question, all that is placed before me…especially when my opinion has been requested….and make no mistake about it…when you put your business on the street, you’re asking others to butt in! And if you’re not, then shame on you for being so foolish. In effect, you wrote, I read, I responded.

As to the substance of my post, I posed questions to you regarding your story, that I found troubling. And I did it as delicately as I could while still communicating to you what those questions were. Further, at no point did I condone the behavior that you ascribed to your H. I find the things that he said to you to be deplorable at best, totally reprehensible at worst. But my questions, I believe were valid, as were my conclusions.

How you’ve responded thus far to the horrors that have affected your life is a question that a reasonable person would ask. Not to be mean to you but to understand. Not to place blame on you but to understand. Not to deny you your right to justice, but to understand.

And when I wrote that what you wrote, seemed to me, to be more surreal then real, I meant that it is incomprehensible to me that one person could be, for her whole life, the target of such consistent deviant behavior. And that I find it troubling that you seem to be singled out for such attention.

The unasked question that was implied when I wrote that last line was, “what is it (do you think) in you or about yourself, that may be sending out signals to those who would treat you this way? Why is that you have been such a target for this kind of abuse for your whole life? And before you go off half cocked again on me, understand that I am neither implying nor accusing you of being at fault. I am asking you to think bout who you are and what it is or may be about you that attracts this kind of assault on yourself by others?

Maybe if you can identify and fix that (whatever it is) you will finally have some peace in your life.

In spite of what you think, I only wish you well.

Coach.

Precious,

Just had to echo Weaver's post--good for you standing up for yourself.

And just for the record only about 5% of all children that are molested and/or abused report. Same statistic for rape. Being sexualized is dehumanizing, disempowering, terrifying and humiliating. It's no shock to me that kids and women don't report.

Life is stranger than fiction sometimes and 'who would believe me anyway', is what I always thought. And if they don't believe me, then I would have to deal with the rage of my stepfather for making him look bad. And the couple of times that I told teachers and other adults that my step dad was mean to me, they just shock their heads and chalked it up to me being upset about being disciplined and labled me as a liar. Now that made me feel like yup, keeping it to myself and just trying to stay alive was my best path. The truth was that he would sexualize me, then beat me, a never ending horror-go-round. That is until I started to develop as a young woman, then the sexual abuse stopped and the beatings took on a new found cruelity.

Sorry, I am not trying to thread jack, just want you to know that you aren't alone in not telling. Most never tell.

And Coach I am hopeful you had a purpose in your response, because honestly your reaction is the kind I was always afraid of in childhood. No one would believe me and would blame me for making up wild stories about such *good* people.

And can you imagine a child telling you that stuff??!! We don't want to believe it but it is true that people do horrible things to each other and the suvivors most of the time do not have the tools to defend themselves, tell what is happening to them or make the perpetrator stop. Although, all that survive did have what it took to save thier life and that may have included not telling, not fighting back, even complying hoping that it will be over soon. Like me, I found that to avoid beatings I could flirt with my stepdad. Now does that make it my fault that he sexualized me? Nope, cause he was still the adult and I believe that anyone can control their sexual urges.


Tig

Coach



It is incomprehensible!! Imaging living it. I remember thinking I had a target on my back or something. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

What it was though with me was several things. Boundaries was one of the biggest things for. I didn't know what they were, so I certainly didn't know how to have them, let alone enforce them. Another thing that was crucial for me was that I was clueless what healthy looked like. I just didn't know. And when you don't know, it seemed that I gravitated to what I was used to since healthy was like a foreigner to me.

And another one that seems strange to me now, is that I had to get ticked and stop projecting myself as terrified, which I was. I had to fake that one for awhile but predatory people can sniff out weakness and seem to be able to spot the one that is more vunerable.

Not to put words in your mouth Coach, but maybe that is your point, that their are new ways to deal with things. I had to relearn a lot of things and throw out the some of the old tools that got me through childhood. And maybe it is just me but when I read your first post it did sound to me like you were questioning the validity of what happened to Precious. But, after reading your clarification maybe it is just so shocking to you and you are just trying to understand. And I agree that to find out what is attracting this junk is important. I had to figure that out, as I mentioned in the above and it wasn't easy and it tooks a few years. Sigh.

Tiggy

Here are few statistics to throw in the mix....it might help shed some light on how many sexual abuse victims remain silent.

Women are victims...

* One out of every six American women have been the victims of an attempted or completed rape in their lifetime (14.8% completed rape; 2.8% attempted rape). [Prevalence, Incidence and Consequences of Violence Against Women Survey, National Institute of Justice and Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, 1998.]
* A total of 17.7 million women have been victims of these crimes. [Prevalence, Incidence and Consequences of Violence Against Women Survey, National Institute of Justice and Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, 1998.]
* In 2003, nine out of every ten rape victims were female. [NCVS 2003]
* While about 80% of all victims are white, minorities are somewhat more likely to be attacked:

Lifetime rate of rape/attempted rape (women):

[NVAWS 1998]

All:


17.6%

White:


17.7%

Black:


18.8%

Asian/Pacific Islander:


6.8%

Am. Indian/Alaskan:


34.1%

Mixed race:


24.4%

The Dangers of Youth

15% of victims are under age 12
29% are age 12-17
44% are under age 18
80% are under age 30 [SOO, 1997; 1999 NCVS]
Men, too…
+ About three percent of American men —- a total of 2.78 million men—have experienced an attempted or completed rape in their lifetime. [Prevalence, Incidence and Consequences of Violence Against Women 1998.]
+ In 2003, one in every ten rape victims were male. NCVS 2003]

And, of course, kids…
+ About 44% of rape victims are under age 18. Three out of every twenty victims (15%) are under age 12. [Sex Offenses and Offenders. Bureau of Justice Statistics, U.S. Department of Justice, 1997.]
+ Seven percent of girls in grades five to eight and twelve percent of girls in grades nine through twelve and said they had been sexually abused. [Commonwealth Fund Survey of the Health of Adolescent Girls, 1998.]
+ Three percent of boys in grades five through eight and five percent of boys in grades nine through twelve said they had been sexually abused. [Commonwealth Fund Survey of the Health of Adolescent Boys, 1998.]
+ 93% of juvenile sexual assault victims knew their attacker; 34.2% were family members and 58.7% acquaintances. Only seven percent of the perpetrators were strangers to the victim. [Sexual Assault of Young Children as Reported to Law Enforcement. Bureau of Justice Statistics, U.S. Department of Justice, 2000]
+ In 1995, local child protective service agencies identified 126,000 children who were victims of either substantiated or indicated sexual abuse; of these, 75% were girls. Nearly 30% of child victims were between the ages of 4 and 7. [US Department of Health and Human Services, Administration for Children and Families, Child Maltreatment, 1995.]
+ Age 12-34 are the highest risk years. Risk peaks in the late teens: girls 16 to 19 are four times more likely than the general population to be victims of rape, attempted rape or sexual assault. [2000 NCVS.]

The Color of Rape
+ Among people 12 and older, about 83.5% of the US population is white, and 82.5% of rape victims are white; 13.3% of victims are black, compared to 12.3% of the population; and 4.2% of both victims and the population are of other races. [2000 NCVS.]

Silent Victims…
One of the most startling aspects of sex crimes is how many go unreported. The most common reasons given by victims for not reporting these crimes are the belief that it is a private or personal matter and that they fear reprisal from the assailant.
+ In 2003, only 39% of rapes and sexual assaults were reported to law enforcement officials — about one in every three. [2003 NCVS]
+ Of sexually abused children in grades five through twelve, 48% of the boys and 29% of the girls had told no one about the abuse—not even a friend or sibling. [Commonwealth Fund Survey of the Health of Adolescent Girls, 1998.]

The rapist isn’t a masked man…
+ Approximately 70% of female rape victims and 74% of male rape victims know their assailant. [2003 NCVS.]
+ Approximately 50% of female victims and 44% of male victims are raped by a friend or acquaintance; 30% of female victims and 26% of male victims by a stranger; 12% of female victims and 30% of male victims by an intimate; 8% of female victims and less than 1% of male victims by another relative; but in less than 1% of cases the relationship is unknown. [2003 NCVS.]

And he’s not hiding in the bushes…
[Statistics in this section are from: Sex Offenses and Offenders. Bureau of Justice Statistics, U.S. Department of Justice, February 1997]:
+ About four out of ten sexual assaults take place at the victim’s own home. Two in ten take place in the home of a friend, neighbor or relative. One in ten take place outside, away from home. And about one in 12 take place in a parking garage.
+ More than half of all rape/sexual assault incidents were reported by victims to have occurred within one mile of their home or at their home.
+ 43% of rapes occur between 6 pm and midnight. 24% occur between midnight and 6am. The other 33% take place between 6am and 6pm.

The Criminal
+ The average age of rapists at arrest is 31. Fifty-two percent are white; twenty-two percent of imprisoned rapists report that they are married. [SOO, 1997]
+ Juveniles accounted for about 16% of forcible rape arrestees in 1995 and 17% of those arrested for other sex offenses [SOO, 1997]
+ In about one out of three sexual assaults, the perpetrator was intoxicated—30% with alcohol, 4% with drugs. [Alcohol and Crime. Bureau of Justice Statistics, 1998]
+ In one study, 98% of males who raped boys reported that they were heterosexual. [Sexual Abuse of Boys, Journal of the American Medical Association, December 2, 1998]
+ In 2001, only about 11% of rapes involved the use of a weapon—three percent used a gun, six percent used a knife, and two percent used another form of weapon. 84% of victims reported the use of physical force only, and 5% were unsure. [2003 NCVS.]
+ Rapists are more likely to be serial criminals than serial rapists. In one study, 46% of rapists who were released from prison were rearrested within 3 years of their release for another crime -- 18.6% for a violent offense, 14.8% for a property offense, 11.2% for a drug offense and 20.5% for a public-order offense. [2002 RPR94]

The Punishment
+ 61% of rapes/sexual assaults are not reported to the police. Those rapists, of course, never serve a day in prison. [2003 NCVS]
If the rape is reported to police, there is a 50.8% chance that an arrest will be made.

If an arrest is made, there is an 80% chance of prosecution.

If there is a prosecution, there is a 58% chance of a felony conviction.

If there is a felony conviction, there is a 69% chance the convict will spend time in jail.

So, even in the 39% of attacks that are reported to police, there is only a 16.3% chance the rapist will end up in prison.

Factoring in unreported rapes, about 6% of rapists—1 out of 16— will ever spend a day in jail. 15 out of 16 will walk free.

From the Rape and Sexual Abuse National Network:



[Probability statistics compiled by NCPA from US Department of Justice statistics. See ]www.ncpa.org/studies/s229/s229.html]

Women are victims...

* One out of every six American women have been the victims of an attempted or completed rape in their lifetime (14.8% completed rape; 2.8% attempted rape). [Prevalence, Incidence and Consequences of Violence Against Women Survey, National Institute of Justice and Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, 1998.]
* A total of 17.7 million women have been victims of these crimes. [Prevalence, Incidence and Consequences of Violence Against Women Survey, National Institute of Justice and Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, 1998.]
* In 2003, nine out of every ten rape victims were female. [NCVS 2003]
* While about 80% of all victims are white, minorities are somewhat more likely to be attacked:

Lifetime rate of rape/attempted rape (women):

[NVAWS 1998]

All:


17.6%

White:


17.7%

Black:


18.8%

Asian/Pacific Islander:


6.8%

Am. Indian/Alaskan:


34.1%

Mixed race:


24.4%

The Dangers of Youth

15% of victims are under age 12
29% are age 12-17
44% are under age 18
80% are under age 30 [SOO, 1997; 1999 NCVS]
Men, too…
+ About three percent of American men —- a total of 2.78 million men—have experienced an attempted or completed rape in their lifetime. [Prevalence, Incidence and Consequences of Violence Against Women 1998.]
+ In 2003, one in every ten rape victims were male. NCVS 2003]

And, of course, kids…
+ About 44% of rape victims are under age 18. Three out of every twenty victims (15%) are under age 12. [Sex Offenses and Offenders. Bureau of Justice Statistics, U.S. Department of Justice, 1997.]
+ Seven percent of girls in grades five to eight and twelve percent of girls in grades nine through twelve and said they had been sexually abused. [Commonwealth Fund Survey of the Health of Adolescent Girls, 1998.]
+ Three percent of boys in grades five through eight and five percent of boys in grades nine through twelve said they had been sexually abused. [Commonwealth Fund Survey of the Health of Adolescent Boys, 1998.]
+ 93% of juvenile sexual assault victims knew their attacker; 34.2% were family members and 58.7% acquaintances. Only seven percent of the perpetrators were strangers to the victim. [Sexual Assault of Young Children as Reported to Law Enforcement. Bureau of Justice Statistics, U.S. Department of Justice, 2000]
+ In 1995, local child protective service agencies identified 126,000 children who were victims of either substantiated or indicated sexual abuse; of these, 75% were girls. Nearly 30% of child victims were between the ages of 4 and 7. [US Department of Health and Human Services, Administration for Children and Families, Child Maltreatment, 1995.]
+ Age 12-34 are the highest risk years. Risk peaks in the late teens: girls 16 to 19 are four times more likely than the general population to be victims of rape, attempted rape or sexual assault. [2000 NCVS.]

The Color of Rape
+ Among people 12 and older, about 83.5% of the US population is white, and 82.5% of rape victims are white; 13.3% of victims are black, compared to 12.3% of the population; and 4.2% of both victims and the population are of other races. [2000 NCVS.]

Silent Victims…
One of the most startling aspects of sex crimes is how many go unreported. The most common reasons given by victims for not reporting these crimes are the belief that it is a private or personal matter and that they fear reprisal from the assailant.
+ In 2003, only 39% of rapes and sexual assaults were reported to law enforcement officials — about one in every three. [2003 NCVS]
+ Of sexually abused children in grades five through twelve, 48% of the boys and 29% of the girls had told no one about the abuse—not even a friend or sibling. [Commonwealth Fund Survey of the Health of Adolescent Girls, 1998.]

The rapist isn’t a masked man…
+ Approximately 70% of female rape victims and 74% of male rape victims know their assailant. [2003 NCVS.]
+ Approximately 50% of female victims and 44% of male victims are raped by a friend or acquaintance; 30% of female victims and 26% of male victims by a stranger; 12% of female victims and 30% of male victims by an intimate; 8% of female victims and less than 1% of male victims by another relative; but in less than 1% of cases the relationship is unknown. [2003 NCVS.]

And he’s not hiding in the bushes…
[Statistics in this section are from: Sex Offenses and Offenders. Bureau of Justice Statistics, U.S. Department of Justice, February 1997]:
+ About four out of ten sexual assaults take place at the victim’s own home. Two in ten take place in the home of a friend, neighbor or relative. One in ten take place outside, away from home. And about one in 12 take place in a parking garage.
+ More than half of all rape/sexual assault incidents were reported by victims to have occurred within one mile of their home or at their home.
+ 43% of rapes occur between 6 pm and midnight. 24% occur between midnight and 6am. The other 33% take place between 6am and 6pm.

The Criminal
+ The average age of rapists at arrest is 31. Fifty-two percent are white; twenty-two percent of imprisoned rapists report that they are married. [SOO, 1997]
+ Juveniles accounted for about 16% of forcible rape arrestees in 1995 and 17% of those arrested for other sex offenses [SOO, 1997]
+ In about one out of three sexual assaults, the perpetrator was intoxicated—30% with alcohol, 4% with drugs. [Alcohol and Crime. Bureau of Justice Statistics, 1998]
+ In one study, 98% of males who raped boys reported that they were heterosexual. [Sexual Abuse of Boys, Journal of the American Medical Association, December 2, 1998]
+ In 2001, only about 11% of rapes involved the use of a weapon—three percent used a gun, six percent used a knife, and two percent used another form of weapon. 84% of victims reported the use of physical force only, and 5% were unsure. [2003 NCVS.]
+ Rapists are more likely to be serial criminals than serial rapists. In one study, 46% of rapists who were released from prison were rearrested within 3 years of their release for another crime -- 18.6% for a violent offense, 14.8% for a property offense, 11.2% for a drug offense and 20.5% for a public-order offense. [2002 RPR94]

The Punishment
+ 61% of rapes/sexual assaults are not reported to the police. Those rapists, of course, never serve a day in prison. [2003 NCVS]
If the rape is reported to police, there is a 50.8% chance that an arrest will be made.

If an arrest is made, there is an 80% chance of prosecution.

If there is a prosecution, there is a 58% chance of a felony conviction.

If there is a felony conviction, there is a 69% chance the convict will spend time in jail.

So, even in the 39% of attacks that are reported to police, there is only a 16.3% chance the rapist will end up in prison.

Factoring in unreported rapes, about 6% of rapists—1 out of 16— will ever spend a day in jail. 15 out of 16 will walk free.