It has been three weeks since I packed all of my stuff and moved out of the apartment I shared with my WH and into plan B. The first weekend into plan B was our anniversary weekend. I received flowers at work on Friday morning before the anniversary which was on Sunday. And then WH drove out of state to see OW and spent the weekend with her.

Today I received a long email with the truth behind his relationship with OW. It was only an EA until that first weekend of plan B and then it became a PA. Yes, on our anniversary weekend. He used the excuse that I had left/was leaving him and that is what he told her. He says that last week he told her that he can't have anything to do with her ever again...and she was upset because she thought I was leaving him. Keep in mind that this whole time he knew all I wanted him to do was end contact and that then we would talk about things.

Well I guess now he's ready to talk. Handling the news of the now PA isn't so difficult because I had already assumed that was happening. It was that assumption that made him feel like "well she already thinks I'm doing this anyway". I made such a huge mistake there. But he was probably going to do that anyway. And here it is...6 months after WH met OW, 5 months after the flirting started, 2.5 months after D-day...THEN the PA starts...and 1 week later he tells her no contact via phone...one more week later I get the truth. Did he just want a piece of a$$? Is that what it was going to take for him to realize the seriousness of what he was doing?

He says he's sorry. I've already begun to deal with pain and emotions associated with the fact that my marriage is over. I actually am not even sure that I want to go back and try and recover. But if I don't I know I'll regret it later. Oh, god...what to do????

***Today I received a long email with the truth behind his relationship with OW. It was only an EA until that first weekend of plan B and then it became a PA. Yes, on our anniversary weekend. He used the excuse that I had left/was leaving him and that is what he told her.***

Hon, please -- you don't really believe this, do you? Sounds like just some cruelty to try to make *you* feel guilty. You can bet your new apartment that if it's a PA, it's been a PA long before you left.

Either way, a PA was his choice. And either way, what a rotten thing for him to throw in your face.
Mulan

newlywed -

I hope you really don't believe his cr*p. Of course the PA was going along all the time. He is trying to make you feel guilty.

Ask if he will send her a no contact letter.

I think it is possible that that weekend was the first and only time. She lives out of state so the affair consisted mostly of phone calls and email. I am trying to be realistic about this but I think this could be the truth. Regardless, I'm not sure what to do now. He says he'll do whatever it takes if I come back. I'll ask about the NC letter. But a part of me just wants to walk away without trying to recover but I know that if I do I'll regret it.

Please ask him about the no contact letter. That is kind of a litmus test. There are some that will write it and still have contact, but 90% refuse to write it.

WH has agreed to write no contact letter. I’ve also told him that I expect radical honesty (all passwords, access to all accounts, etc.) and he must go to MC with me. He said he would do all of this if that’s what he “has to do”.

His email that revealed some truths (I say some because I suspect there are more) also said that he wants to be the husband that I deserve for as long as I allow him to be and that if I leave now he knows why. I still don’t get the feeling that he’s really into sorting this out and recovering. Perhaps he is …I know he’s in a foggy withdrawal state. He cried the whole time we talked on the phone yesterday.

I warned him that it would take at least two years before we can figure things out and move on happily. I can’t help but wonder if that time is better with my getting to know someone else. I had already resolved that it was time for me to move on with my life on my own. I was already preparing myself emotionally and mentally for life after divorce. A part of me still thinks that this is the only option. I’m not sure I love him anymore and I think he can tell. He asked me yesterday if I did and all I could say was, “I love the man I married. I don’t know who you are. You are a stranger to me.”

I received advice from several of you to just leave and move on. Even though we were married less than a year when this started, my WH and I had lived together for a total of 4 years with combined finances and everything. We even raised my young nephew together for 9 months of that time. I think maybe I need time to just think about things. Even though I suspected a PA I am really having a difficult time with it now because I saw it written in black and white straight from him. If you think something is hard to hear, it’s even harder to read…and re-read…

If it seems so obvious what I need to do, then why am I so confused?

You can give this M a try. It's up to you.

Make sure all your boundary and protective measures are gladly agreed to by him.

You will not recover emotionally right away. It takes years. this is not something to be brushed under the rug. it is something to be examined and deconstructed. Every affair has a meaning ... you will need to discover the meaning of this affair, even if you decide to give up on the marriage.

Have either of you read Surviving An Affair?

both of you need to read it and discuss it together ...

recovery is a process and ~ending the affair~ is just a step in the process ... not the whole deal by any means.

Take care

Pep

Newlywed55,
What does your gut tell you? If you walk away now will you have regrets?...will you bring some of this to your next relationship? Take your time sort out what you can live with and without. Make your boundaries strong and stand up for yourself. This is something I have a great deal of difficulty with and I accept less then I want because I have 2 kids and I KNOW I don't want to lose this family. Close your eyes and breathe what do you KNOW in your heart?
It sounds like the fog is thinning. Good luck. God Bless.

Mulan and Belever - I'm starting to think you could be right about a PA all along. Obviosly I don't know what to believe when he talks anymore.

Pep - I have read and re-read Surviving An Affair and the contents of this website.

Confused - I am afraid that I may have regrets if I walk away at this time. I am at a point where I can very easily stand up for myself because I was almost ready to just walk away altogether.

I feel like I really have nothing to lose anymore. It has all already been taken from me and I'm left here putting the pieces of me back together. My gut tells me that there is no way he's going to do what I need him to do. I do believe he really wants to, but I don't think he is capable of it. He has always had problems with verbal communication and it was his actions that spoke so loudly to me. That's how I knew what he was thinking and feeling...that's how I felt his love.

Well, you can hang around and see what happens. I will tell you one thing. Like the Harley's say, the greatest danger to the marriage is the betrayed partner. If he keeps on like he has been, you will lose every last ounce of love and respect for him.

Actually, it is much easier. Then you won't have to agonize over what to do. It will be very clear to you.

Believer - WH is making it very clear to me. I have no respect for him and the love is questionable.

So WH wants to fix things and says he’s trying. Well on Sunday night he said he’d call the next day (yesterday) and he didn’t. Now who is the stupid one here? Me. Because I called him and when I asked him why he didn’t call he said ‘I didn’t say I’d call today’. I know I should not have called him. Heck, I didn’t even want to talk to him but somehow I let him pull me back into his stupid game.

He insists he wants me back and that he’s going to do what it takes. Well how about pursue me a little? Give me a little attention…call. I’m not sure that I even want to try and recover our R but I have a hard time controlling my emotions and the overwhelming urge to question him, to try and find out why? Is it more difficult when your relationship is shorter? I mean if we had been married 10 or more years like a lot of you would I have more patience? I guess that I just expect someone who recently married me (well, not even just recently, but you know what I mean) to still want to make me happy. How about a little groveling? Or perhaps some sign of gratitude that I’m even still willing to listen to what he has to say? He has told me that if this were the other way around he would be gone and wouldn’t look back. I guess he’s having trouble understanding why I’m still here. He told me a couple of weeks ago (before his now supposed NC) that he had no intentions of ‘coming after’ me.

It’s just hard because this has happened so soon into our commitment. I think that what I’m dealing with now is I’m not sure I want him … but I don’t want OW to have him either.

Nothing new to post because, as I suspected, I have not heard from him. Why does he waste the time to say he wants to work through this? Oh, I know,....he doesn't want to look like the bad guy. He wants to be able to say he tried and I left him.

All I know is two days ago I was in a pretty good place and cheerfully moving forward with my life. Now it all hurts again. God, this pain sucks. All I wanted was for him to let me love him.....now I don't even like him....I miss my dogs.

I know this is most likely against MB principles, but yesterday I gave WH an ultimatum. I don't understand why he attempted to 'come clean' 5 days ago and then not contact me again. He said he wants me and the marriage and then...nothing.

When I spoke to him yesterday he said that he was taking the time to do the things I asked of him. ???? And that I said we shouldn't communicate until he's done those. Well, yes, sort of....except those things involve me too. I told him I have to see something HUGE in the next day or so or I'm throwing in the towel altogether. I told him that he's been carrying on like this for 6 months now and that I feel that I've been more than patient. And he said, "Yes you have..." I said that this is all incredibly unfair to me. I have been absolutely faithful to him, yet I feel isolated from 'our' friends because I'm not comfortable around them while our relationship is this way and that I won't live in this state of limbo any longer.

He seemed upset by it...even a bit choked up. I'll send him an email or a letter in a day or so and tell him that I expect him to take care of the legal paperwork and all of the associated fees.

This not what I want but I don't see how it can be any other way. He just doesn't care...he says he loves me, but I guess he doesn't love me enough.

I've been working on myself as much as I can but I can't help but think....shouldn't a marriage come with a warranty or something. I mean, couldn't I have had one year of wedded happiness?

I know that someday I will have a faithful husband who will each and every day be as thrilled to come home to me as I am to come home to him.

I'm so sorry newlywed.

I totally agree with the marriage warranty idea! If it breaks within 1 year then both parties agree to go in and find and fix the problems - together.

What are you asking him to do? Be careful that you aren't LB'ng. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I can't seem to get this one thing out of my head that my WH said to me once when we were dating. He told me once you get married, I'll never be single again. I said of course not, I'll be married. He said that's not what he meant, he said you'll either be married, divorced or widowed, but never single.

So now I feel like if I get divorced, does that mean I'm a failure? Did single somehow = pure to me? It's weird. I may need to look at that further.

Ok, well since none of that was of any use <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I'll end this now.

STWP, Your WH is sooo right. We will never be single again. It's another one of those things that really bother me when I think about it...I would have to check the box next to the word DIVORCED...

The failure issue is another one that I think about a lot. Am I a failure because my husband's interests drifted months into our marriage?

The things that I have asked of WH:

1) No contact letter - to be reviewed and sent by me
2) Counseling - MC & IC
3) Full disclosure of the truth - past, present, & future
4) Transparancy - all passwords, access to voicemail, etc.

An interesting development today...

WH and I spoke on the phone for 1.5 hours. He has had NC with OW for 2.5 weeks. He said he told her over the phone NC ever again and she hung up on him. I believe this but he said he will still do a NC letter.

For the last 20 minutes of the conversation he sobbed and sobbed. I sat quietly while he did this. The whole time he kept saying 'I have to go...'.

I asked him if he wanted to meet up tonight and he said he wanted to be alone...that lately he hasn't wanted to be around people. I said, 'I'm not people...I'm your wife.'

I think he is starting to really face the reality of his decisions. We discussed the fact (and he acknowledged) that the decisions he made were conscious decisions. He said he doesn't want to see me because there are things that he has to fix about himself first. He wants to figure out why he did what he did and how he's going to make sure he doesn't hurt me again. I told him that this is a step that we have to take together...we need to heal together, regardless of whether or not it ends up with the our marriage intact.

He said he'll call later. We'll see.

My WH is saying the exact thing. He's also added he can't work on us until he fixes him. Of course, that was earlier before I made things worse.

If he's going to IC, that's good. A real NC letter would be good too, but you can't make him write it. If he won't write it there is nothing you can do.

If there really is NC between them then that's good, he's probably going through the withdrawals. Be patient. It does suck having to do that, especially when we want them to focus on us at this time. I don't know what to tell you to make that any easier. I only wish I had watched and waited instead of trying to push a decision.

Have you learned any of your WH's EN's yet? Mine said something last night during his tirade-o-fury that caught me totally off guard. He said that I haven't learned anything about him since he's left. So now I am forced to sit back and wonder what it is that he's been trying to teach me about him since he's left? Or, is that just fogbabble. Hard to tell.

I think providing him a safe place where he can talk to you and even become vunerable enough to cry is a good thing. It means you are trying to protect him. That's good. Keep it up.

Remember to do your best to not be his source of unhappiness. His unhappiness now is due to the A and the fallout. Try not to let it come on to you.

{{{{{{{{newlywed55}}}}}}}}

Hi Newlywed.....

I haven't posted - or looked at this site for some time. But your post made me want to jump up - and yell!!!!!

Of course you know your WH better than anyone. You know if he is being REAL or not.

However, I have found that after listening to sooooo many lies, that I cannot tell REAL from FALSE anymore.

All I know, is that my WH said many of the same things, made the same promises, and then, around 3 weeks of his being back home, he started backsliding on all of his promises.

He has done NOTHING!!!! I repeat - NOTHING to calm my fears, cough up the truth, or (like Pep said) do ANYTHING that he promised gladly. I repeat - GLADLY!!!! I have a picture in my mind of a lot of butt kissing and so forth going on.....but none of that has happened.

I tell you this from my own experience. A NC letter was written, but I never sent it. It was not written in the spirit of "I'll do ANYTHING" to get our M back together. Indeed, WH asked if I wanted it signed in blood.

He thinks I was being as mean as I could be. He didn't happen to look at his A as being mean to me, or the horrible way he has treated me for nearly 4 years now (that's how long his A went on - or is still going on, I don't really know).

If I had it to do over again, I would surely take my time in taking him back. Let his actions speak for him BEFORE you take him back, or make any effort to believe him.

Everything he does to get you back should be done GLADLY.

K

After receiving the email a week ago I guess I thought that I would begin to see some real effort from him. I think he honestly believes that he is making that effort. I do acknowledge that he is, however small I may feel it is.

Now, at the risk of being scolded by you MB pros, here are the latest developments:

I have already come to accept that my M is over. As far as a new (recovered) one with my WH in the future…I don’t know. I am emotionally at a point where I can walk away from this with little regret and with time I know that the remaining regret will begin to dissipate.

I have not exactly been in a strict plan B this weekend. As I mentioned in an earlier post, I, more or less, presented him with an ultimatum. I feel that as a result of the brevity of our marriage I am making decisions on how to handle my situation that vary from the MB plan. Anyway, I am guilty of several LBs this past weekend. I pressured him on Friday to discuss our R (or rather, lack there of). I discussed this in a post further up. I know that I don’t want him to feel forced to return to our R because ultimately it will cause future problems but I needed to see his reaction to this. On Saturday I received a text message from him asking about my day. I responded and then he asked why I didn’t call him back Friday night. Well, I didn’t realize he had called but he seemed bothered by it. Anyway I called him b/c I hate having a whole conversation via text messages. Again, I asked if he wanted to meet for dinner or something and again he said he couldn’t. When I asked why he said he had no plans but wasn’t ready to see me. Then he suggested we meet up Sunday. This, of course, hurt my feelings and I got upset and accused him of trying to pull me back into his games. I told him that my Sunday was booked and asked what the difference was between Sat. and Sun. Needless to say, that conversation didn’t go really well.

So a little later that evening I sent him a text that said, “I give up. You win.” He responded, “No, if you give up I lose”. (Personally I agree with that.) Then he invited me to join him to eat. I did not respond. Why should I? I was done with his games and he needed to know that I meant it.

In the middle of the night (around 2:30) I woke up when I realized my phone was beeping. He had sent me 3 texts. He was asking me to come over. I responded…’why?’ And he just kept saying ‘just come over’ … ‘can’t you come over’. So, I went. When I got there it took him forever to answer the door and when he did he barely looked at me and I don’t remember him even saying hello. Yet again I felt like an idiot. I asked what he wanted and he said nothing. So I walked out…but then came back and confronted him. Again I asked what he wanted and he said he just wanted me to be there. I told him I couldn’t do that and somehow this escalated into another argument. He said he knew that that was going to happen…all I do is argue with him…I came over there just to fight with him. I said that I didn’t…he didn’t even say hello to me…he asked me to come over…again I have extended my heart to him to have it pushed away…that I should just leave…what was I thinking by coming over…? Then he said, “Go ahead leave. You’re good at that!” Yes, I moved out but he didn’t leave me much of an option at that time.

Somehow we both ended up out on the back deck. He was smoking and I was standing several feet away from him and facing away from him. He finished his cigarette and pulled me into a hug. He held me and started sobbing. We stood there like that for a few minutes and then he went inside for a tissue. I followed him in and sat down on the sofa. He sat down at my feet and hugged my legs and cried for a long time. I let him cry…I was aloof, but not cold. As he calmed down he removed my sandals and rubbed my feet while we were both silent. We fell asleep that way.

In the early morning (a couple of hours later) I woke up and left. He walked me to the door, hugged me, and kissed me on the forehead.

Sunday evening (last night) I invited him to dinner. We met up and then went back to his apartment to watch some tv. He was very affectionate (very similar to the way he treated me when I met him several years ago). We cuddled a little…again he kissed me on the cheek, forehead, shoulder… I gave him a quick kiss on the lips. Again we fell asleep and I left in the middle of the night.

Okay…so not plan B but I did a horrible plan A and felt that I redeemed myself a little by having an evening with him free of LBs and R talk. I know that he is hurting…probably at this point more than I am because I’ve been dealing with my pain for months now. My plan B requests have not changed. I asked about the NC letter (on Sat.) and he said he hasn’t written it yet.

Any thoughts? Do I return to a separated plan A? I’m pretty positive there hasn’t been contact with OW in 2.5 weeks. I will stand by my requests. However, I’m still trying to figure out if this is what I want (a M). Either way, this will be good closure for me.

k7----, Thank you for your post. I am looking for the work to be done 'gladly'. However because my plan A wasn't very effective (I was too emotionally devastated, couldn't avoid LB's, etc.) I feel that it is necessary to acknowledge his small steps. They may be small, but for him they are quite large. I will only accept them for this short time frame...because I have acknowledged them and have told him that he needs to do something HUGE because my love bank is nearing empty.

He’s trying but he’s not. We spent a nice evening together on Sunday night. Dinner, no R talk…just chitchat. We went back to his apartment and watched some TV and then I went back to my place. He seems to really care about working through this – he’s showing me little signs (very small gestures). However, I’m still letting my moods be affected by his. I guess I want him to do something really big…a grand gesture.

Yesterday he asked me to meet up for dinner tonight. I just called him to make arrangements and he was at the car dealership getting an oil change. Apparently they were taking a really long time and he was annoyed. He didn’t sound happy to hear from me (he sounded indifferent). He asked me if I still wanted to meet for dinner (with little enthusiasm). Could it be all that he cares about is getting from me my half of our car insurance payment? That’s been my thought since he invited me. I think I’m quickly approaching that point of indifference as far as he is concerned. When we’re together I feel some love for him. I want him to hold my hand and hug me. But we have absolutely nothing to talk about. It’s uncomfortable at times.

Question - Is it indifference or is it possible that I am just very guarded right now?