Oh, well, I thought we were drinking out of cans, so I thought I'd be polite and ask. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Caren, I still have a feeling in my gut that this isn't about you, and it isn't about OW, and it isn't about anger management, and it isn't about how you pay the bills... or clean the house...

My opinion may not be popular, but I'm NOT disagreeing with ANYthing anyone else is saying... I just think this is 99.5% his issues (within himself, and nothing to do with anyone/anything else!).

Through the course of your relationship... did he open up to you and share his worries, and hangups, and insecurities... did he show a healthy sense of humility?

Other's have suggested that he may be insecure with the possibility of me making more money than him, and I have asked him, and he insists this is not the case.....always has.

I just talked to him on the phone, and he's acting like nothing is wrong.....he said "I'm going to go get a movie for us to watch after work, do you want to order a pizza?"

I dunno, I've been disinterested in him at best the last few days, maybe he thought I'd beg him to sleep in the bed.

Bramble, you weren't cryptic, I was having a pity party and that was my lame attempt at sarcasm.

I have looked into anger management, but it seems to be a *counselor* thing....and I have no insurance anymore.

Mimi you mentioned something about the courts having one earlier, but I'm not sure how one goes about having anger management through the courts, unless I assault someone.

I have been through MASSIVE counseling, and believe it or not, I do handle myself a lot better than I did before....I was a raving looney with the anger. I translated everything into anger......now I am able to at least be *hurt* and have a small breakdown about it, rather than do something strange like slash someone's tires. (Which I've never actually done, but ya never know with me)

I am more angry with myself than anyone else.

My husband and I saw a marriage counselor a long time ago, and this was his analysis....and I believe it still holds true.

He said "You two need to get to a point where you can have a disagreement or an arguement and not have it be all or nothing....not have it have to be someone moving out, you are both very passionate people, you're relationship is hot, so you tend to boil over"

I would say that is still the case, I cool down, he heats up.....it's a vicious cycle.

I've been trying to lure him in, I think.....make him fall back in love with me.

And I think in absolutes......he either loves me or he doesn't love me...it's very hard for me to see gray areas...like "Caren you stupid A, he stopped his affair, and had you move back in.....doesn't that count for anything?"

I guess I'm the equivalent of a vampire.....I won't be happy until I suck him dry.

-Caren

You are both unhealthy.

1 unhealthy person + 1 unhealthy person = unhealthy marriage

So, best way to improve the marriage is to improve Caren dontcha think? That you can control right?

As long as you are focused on what he is doing or not doing you don't have to look at Caren.

And the worst part is that when you don't get what you want, you are willing to beat it out of him. Until you deal with that, you are not going to have a chance of any relationship.

Pick up the phone book Caren, I found plenty of free counseling when I needed it.

I'll check it out Rose.

Gotta jet, he'll be home momentarily.

Catch you guys tommorrow.

-Caren

Caren, how about this...how about you work on YOU...forget the marriage for now, forget him for now...focus on YOU...Just let what he does and says slide off...you work on YOU...controlling YOU...I am not saying to take any abuse, but do not give it either...

I am in a much better place now for myself because I have worked on ME for the past month...I cant tell you how happy I am now...When my H verbally abuses me, I kindly ask him "is there anything else you need from me" and if he continues with the cussing and such I say "wel, thanks for calling, when you can be more mature, I will be glad to discuss this"...

NO ONE can control YOU except YOU...NO ONE can make YOU happy except YOU! Try it for a while Caren, I think you will very happy with the results!

Caren,

Hon, you have a lot of work to do to make you H realize that your changes are permanent. It took a long time for you to get where you are, and will take a long time to get where you need to be.

Just keep showing H the changes that you have made. I know you have a taker, but your taker was in control for a long long time. It is your time to give.

In my humble opinion, I know that when I started meeting my H's ENs, he eventually started meeting mine. It took awhile, but this is my gut feeling for you.

Look to the Lord and read your Bible hon. You say you are a Christian. But I know there was a verse that hit me hard, and it still is with me now. It is about calling names. Like that [censored], you jerk, whatever. If you want me to quote it I will, but it does say in the Bible, that if you say RACA (you fool) and you are a believer, that you are in danger of hellfire yourself. Yikes. Please, stop calling names, and you have confessed that you are guilty guilty guilty of this. For a long time. Please stop this. It hurts me so much when people call names. I did. God really gave me a 2x4 with this passage. So I don't do it anymore.

I suggest you read up on what a wife needs to do. Which is be obedient. Maybe you need to work that double shift for awhile to meet your H's needs. Work 4 doubles and have 3 days off to look for work with benefits. Heck I work 4 doubles, and they value me so much where I work that I have benefits, however, it does come out of my check. Oh yes, I am a waitress, have been for over 10 years, and it does put food on the table and pay the bills, and oh yeah, my H is a musician, so you know it is feast or famine on his end. I raised my family on this. Double shift, double money. Hard work is nothing to be ashamed of.

Go for it. Get some hours under your belt and then look for someplace that you make lots more tips. You can do whatever you want.

I am sorry your H is unsympathetic. Stop being the pot calling the kettle black. Both of you are doing this. Kick your taker to the curb, start making that money for the short term, and good will come later. Do what you have to do with what you have. If doubles are available, do it. Help out.

Change you and it just might change your marriage and your whole existance. Plus, you cannot expect your H to support your kids that are not his. Mine did, as best he could, but if you have your other kids living with you still, you need to get some financial support from their fathers, and deal with it, it cannot be how you want always.

Surrender, Caren, to God. You will get those en's met if you keep on giving.

Have patience, and step back. Do what is healthiest girl.

Love in Christ,
Miss M

Caren,

Stoppin' by to see how you are doing and welp, your words ring a very familar and scary reminder of my past. Like yourself I am a giver by upbringing. What I now realize is the WS play on this (knowingly or not). The WS in them loves to suck out the life of the BS.

Don't let him do this to do. My H came back because I stopped giving to the WS and pulled back. H's characer had to fight to regain control of his life. The WS' side of him died because I stopped giving.

Oh sure, I did the laundry, cleaned the house, took care of our child, paid the bills, cooked, etc...... but I still did less. When it came to him, I did less and I asked for more.

The WS would never think of helping around the house (cleaning and stuff), much less cooking.....YIKES!! Yet that is what mine does now. Not like I would like it but gotta give him A for effort not affair! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

You are highly frustrated and your taker wants it's turn. Only fair. Can't survive in the giver mode when there is a WS around. Even your children can see that.

So don't be so catering to him. You take care of Caren and your family but NOT the WS. When your H's character appears let him know you love him (your H). Acknowledge to him when his WS side shows up and treat him accordingly. No catering to the WS. Even if it means stopping mid stream. You know like in the middle of a convo or in the middle of making his lunch?!?!?? He cops a WS attitude, all help stops. COLD!

Got it?

L.

That's a good way to look at it Orchid, and that's really what I've been doing the last couple of days, just cleaning the house, cooking the meals, but not catering to him as I usually do, not rubbing his feet....not jumping up to let the dogs out so he doesn't have to get up...etc. and last night was actually pleasant. We watched Slingblade on TV (He had bought National Treasure to watch, but let me watch Slingblade because I'd never seen it). We ate pizza, we laughed a bit, then after the movie, I got up and said, "Well goodnight" and went to bed. He slept on the couch again.....but he was acting like he didn't really want to. He was being quite courteous actually (Refreshing change).

Regarding the double shifts, I think I will do that. I could conceivably make enough money to pay the bills if I did that. The only problem I have with that is my kids are home alone all day, I hate doing that, since my husband doesn't get off until 9 pm.

I hadn't thought about the name calling thing....that's like 2nd nature, but you're right, I shouldn't do that, it isn't very Christian, and I'm learning something new everyday about being a Christian.

Thank you all,

-Caren

P.S. I am taking my daughter and my neice to the pool today, that should be fun <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Took the girls swimming.....got burnt to a crisp...LOL, I am about as lily white as they come, and even though I had sunscreen on, I still got burnt. But on the upside, they had a lot of fun. I don't have a bathing suit that fits anymore, as I've lost mad weight, so I sat there in a spaghetti strap top and shorts.

I went to the grocery store afterwards and bought some chipped chopped ham (Very cheap...but good) so we could have ham sandwiches and I bought some cocoa and peanut butter and made no-bake cookies (A family favorite...especially my husband). Then we ate sandwiches and chip and watched *National Treasure*, and then I went and took a shower and had hubby put some aloe on my back, which started a chain reaction that led to SF and him sleeping in the bed.

Today he called and wanted to know if I wanted to go to Wal-Mart with him after work, so we could get some groceries (I am broke...so oddly enough he's buying). I told him that I was going to work 3 doubles this week and hopefully that would be enough to get us caught up on the utilities.

I am less angry now, I have decided to take it day by day, and not obsess about the goofy little stuff like being told "ILY" (Which I'll have to admit, is something I truly crave), and if he decides to sleep on the couch tonight...more power to him.

You all have been so right, I have been relying on how he interacts with me to make me happy. I have to be happy with me....and I am beginning to be. I had a wonderful time with the kids at the pool, my friend came and joined me, and we just sat around and talked and people watched. My friend obsesses about her weight (Her baby is 1 1/2, and she still hasn't lost the baby weight), she sits around and compares herself to me. I said "Look at all the women here Casey.....do you see any supermodels????" (The pool is mostly mothers with children) So I guess she felt a little bit better. What it boils down to is, I didn't think about my husband or my relationship once....I was just happy being there with my friend and the kids. It was fun!!!

Soooooooooooooo I guess that's what I need to do, I'm taking the magnifying glass off of my husband, and putting it on me <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Also, as a side note......here is a source of stress in my husband's life, that he didn't share with me. I found a letter that his son wrote to him. It was just laying on the dresser.

The letter was his son saying that he felt abandoned by his Dad. That he felt cheated because his Mother had passed away when he was 3, and he never felt as if his Dad wanted him, and that he had a lot of frustration about that, and that he cried himself to sleep more nights than he can count, and that he was able to mask his feelings with drugs, but now that he's in rehab, and sober, he had to get it off his chest, and that he's sorry if this hurts his Dad's feelings, but that he loves him and he always will.

(He lives with his Great Aunt and Uncle on his Mom's side, and has since he was 3. My husband lost custody to them. He was only 17 when his son was born (The mother was 26) and the courts didn't feel like he was stable enough to take care of the kids (He also has twin boys that were only infants at the time).

So, I'm sure that is weighing heavily on his conscience, and the little electric bill fiasco was probably just the icing on the stress cake.

-Caren