After the A was uncovered my W stated that she was relieved and that she feels UNSTUCK. Now there's movement to her happiness. We are talking for the first time in months. We discuss mainly the divorce, but also some minor things about her day and recently we've begun talking about what damage we did to each other during our marriage. I very much love her and my daughter. She says there is no choice but divorce but is willing to live in the area, invite me to dinner, let me have my D when I want, invite me over for Christmas so my D could have her parents. It all seems very strange to me. We seem to cooperate much better when discussing a real divorce then we ever did married. There is still anger, but receding and betrayal, but I genuinely love this woman. How do you have an amicable divorce? I am not really comfortable being the dad in practice. I have to get over my desire for this woman - but I chose her to be my partner. We damaged each other along the way, but she still the woman I love. Counsel?

Today is my first day of counsel - I have tried twice before so has she, but we've never gone together. This counseling center is faith based and I really want to find some peace. I would love it if she would go, if your spouse goes there is hope. I am having a problem adjusting to the fact that for her there is no hope, for me I see hope, just don't know where the path will lead. Nice friendly divorce (don't think there is one), or reconcile. Feel like I'm banging my head into the wall, but going fwd anyway.

[color:"green"] DD - My marriage is in the same situation. WW wants to keep the marriage and I don't now after a long time of trying to get her to come to her sinces. We both r trying to be friendly through the D with as few of demands as posible. It's still to be seen if that is possible. I do my best not to tell her things that hurt her even when she does me. Not much advise I can give you yet but I will post experiances here as food for thought. [/color]

GET IT IN WRITING IN THE DECREE...... You may not be as friendly 6 months or a year after the divorce. My X said that stuff all the way to her atty's office and then she saw that she could bend me over in court and chose the path with the most $$$ signs at the end......

As for the counceling alone, I disagree with you. The positive changes that you impliment in your life can cause her to see you in a different light and lead down a different road.

We discuss mainly the divorce
Why are you discussing divorce? Do you want one? If not, don’t talk about it.

She says there is no choice but divorce but is willing to live in the area, invite me to dinner, let me have my D when I want, invite me over for Christmas so my D could have her parents.
I’m confused?
Why is it you that has to do the visiting?
Why couldn’t your wife visit you and your daughter and why couldn’t your wife come over on Christmas to see your daughter?

Wow, what great advice and thoughtful insight. Thanks so much. You're right; talking about a divorce all the time is silly when noone wants one. In fact though, she has stated that she wants to be divorced, but is willing to stay for a year (10 yrs married by then), so my career isn't harmed. I think it's a scam to push us over 10 years and make here eligible for more $. I do not want to divorce her, but I also have to look reality in the face. She says she would stay and work it out if there was one speck of hope, but the next breath says there is no hope. I have hope and that's why I'm going to counselling. I have hope for me and the kids. For her I also hope she finds what ever happiness is for her. I don't want to be bitter. I'm confused too. I just can't put the two thoughts together. I have female friends that all say she is gone but she wants an amicable divorce - and that can happen? Hard to see the future but I just don't place me having cozy meals and holiday gatherings with the X. I want 50% phyiscal custody so that is a real possibility for a reversal. The reality of a divorce is brutal and I do not think she is ready for it. It takes both parties in honest f to f exchange if there is going to be reconcile. I've told her I want that and she steadfastly refuses. Maybe she needs space and time. More to follow.

First day of counsel went well; moving to legal action now but it's not with a full heart. It really is very sad but when faced with the legal realities of accepting a WS it's not good. It's separate or retain. If you retain you accept. That is just not possible but I have my D to care for and my two boys for the summer. I have primary kid care and her moving out will likely be very harsh and ugly. It has to be done though. MTF

Hi DogDad,

Have you thought about retirment accounts?
In my state, retirment accounts are untouchable in marriages less than 10 years.

For us, my retirement accounts amount to 65% of our net worth. I'm 20 years older than my wife, and I'm going to need that money. That's part of my motivation to pull the plug on the marriage now.

Check out the laws in your state.

-AD

DogDad,

If you want to try to save your marriage, you might try posting over in the "General Questions II" (GQ2) forum. It sounds like you are very early in this thing. Your W's attitude is likely to change over time. No gaurantees, but if you want to save it, there certainly is a chance.

Is the other man married? Have you informed his wife? Exposure is a powerful tool in many cases.

-AD

What counsel are you doing and why are you moving to legal action?

AD, no the OP is not married according to W. She is very protective and says I will never know, not ever. Obviously it's someone or something she wants to protect more than she values our marriage. That's just the way it is. The legal action is going well along. Over time the W has clearly and repeatedly stated that she wants to be divorced and there is no hope for this marriage. OK, I don't quite agree, but I am seeing very clearly now that holding on to someone who doesn't want to be here is just slightly psychotic. It's also evident that the A is still going on even though she protests to the opposite. How do I know - motel conf #s and simple followup. I am following Plan B, break contact and really trying to be nice to her. She continues to seek my thoughts on what she would want in a guy (strange questions), and how she looks and other personal type questions. I am trying to be cordial about the replies and tell her that we can talk about the kids but private lives are not open for discussion till there is complete honesty. That is the one thing that has to happen!! Without a complete total recounting, no matter how much pain it will cause, it's the right way. That will not happen with her. She's very self righteous and indignant. So for me legal action is a logical and thoughful next step if there is no possibility with the W. I would like to continue with a Christian counseling center, but right now the $ is demanding and I need the $. I really think I need to find a new counselor though, the one I have is just not clicking with me. More to follow.

AD, oh yea, the retirement accounts are an issue, a very big issue. For this circumstance we have very little as the W focued on the NOW in our marriage so she has a little 403B and my retirement and gov't TSP acct. It is a big deal and the layer is on it. I am trying to make things safe and peaceful but every day that we wait is another day that she continues the A, lives in our home, I pay for it all and get nothing. It's self-destructive for me not to move to legal action. Don't get me wrong, I can bear the strain emotionally, but for my/our kids future I cannot bear a catastrophy. I still have to provide for them. MTF

How do I know - motel conf #s and simple followup. I am following Plan B, break contact and really trying to be nice to her.
Plan B does not involve being nice, tracking phone numbers, etc.

She continues to seek my thoughts on what she would want in a guy (strange questions), and how she looks and other personal type questions.
Did you give her a Plan B letter and tell her no contact?
Or are you just thinking you are doing Plan B by trying to minimize contact?

What legal action is going well?

Plan B does involve a complete break of contact. However, since we have pretty much agreed that she is out as soon as possible, and that divorcing is in our best interest there is no reason not to be agreeable to a divorce. It is silly to go thru all that noncontact and other stuff when the other party does not want the marriage. Maybe I am doing Plan B light, maybe not at all, b/c the marriage is ending in divorce. So maybe you're right, Plan B is not what is happening. OK, admitted. So we are divorcing, and I am initiating as the complaintant. I really believe this is the best path to take. I believe in this divorce.

divorcing is in our best interest
???

Absolutely, why would you continue to push and try for a reconcilliation when the other person is still in an A, and they say there is no way ever. That's just plain self-destructive to continue to work for something that cannot be attained. Originally I did not want a D and wanted to reconcile. She has always maintained she wants a D. She does not want the Marriage but is willing to derive the benefits from the marriage until she is able to leave. What is the sanity in that. If she even mentioned once that there was hope things would be different, but that's not reality my friend. Thank you for the conscience, Lord knows I need it. But divorcing does make her responsible for her own actions and allows her to do what she wants. It also allows me to see my dau on my own terms. MTF

Yea I think so. A D is what she wants; I am beginning to cave to her resolve. She's much stronger about this than I am. She will not move out until she has enough $ for the rent. She says she'll move within a couple miles so I can see our Dau. Is a month enough? I don't know, but the tone hasn't changed. She's unstuck and finally moving toward her happiness. That's what she's focused on, and I;m a fool to believe waiting and hoping and trying will work on her. When is the time you face it - that your WS doesn't want you and just doesn't. Gotta be a time, not necessarily time in # of days, but feeling. She's there. So what, I let her file? You know the realities there. After the D she even stated that she would keep the keys to our home so she can come over and have dinner with my dau and I. I should get shared physical custody. I just don't think the reality of a D has hit her yet. I am not the one to bring her to that reality, but for me it's slightly self-destructive to want and need/depend/share with someone who flat out tells you they do not want you. Why continue to try. Maybe Plan B will work when she leaves. I just don't know right now. I'm dragged in so many different directions, go/stay, wait/stop/divorce, have convo/ignore her, focus on kids/care for myself, protect self thru legal action. Ya kina know what I mean.

why would you continue to push and try for a reconcilliation
Where did you read anyone telling you to push for a reconciliation?

when the other person is still in an A, and they say there is no way ever. That's just plain self-destructive to continue to work for something that cannot be attained.
Which is why you delay the divorce. Again, you don't pucs for reconciliation.

She will not move out until she has enough $ for the rent.
Good. That gives you some time.

She says she'll move within a couple miles so I can see our Dau.
Why are you letting her leave with your daughter? Why can’t she visit her daughter at your house?

She's unstuck and finally moving toward her happiness. That's what she's focused on, and I;m a fool to believe waiting and hoping and trying will work on her
So we are just a bunch of idiots thinking that marriages can be saved when a person has an affair?

After the D she even stated that she would keep the keys to our home so she can come over and have dinner with my dau and I.[/b[]
You would let her keep the keys to your house after a divorce?

[b]I just don't think the reality of a D has hit her yet.
Again, this is exactly why you delay the divorce. You don’t have to go to extraordinary measures to do this either.
By agreeing & participating in it willingly with her, it shows her that you do not belive the marriage is worth fighting for, so why should/would she even think about stopping it, let alone actually stopping it?

I just don't know right now. I'm dragged in so many different directions, go/stay, wait/stop/divorce, have convo/ignore her, focus on kids/care for myself, protect self thru legal action. Ya kina know what I mean.[
Yeah, I do.
Study your options and stick to one. One that you will not regret doing.
MB is designed to lessen the pain & regret on your part.

She will not move out until she has enough $ for the rent.
Good. That gives you some time.

She says she'll move within a couple miles so I can see our Dau.
Why are you letting her leave with your daughter? Why can’t she visit her daughter at your house?

She's unstuck and finally moving toward her happiness. That's what she's focused on, and I;m a fool to believe waiting and hoping and trying will work on her
So we are just a bunch of idiots thinking that marriages can be saved when a person has an affair?

After the D she even stated that she would keep the keys to our home so she can come over and have dinner with my dau and I.
You would let her keep the keys to your house after a divorce?

I just don't think the reality of a D has hit her yet.
Again, this is exactly why you delay the divorce. You don’t have to go to extraordinary measures to do this either.
By agreeing & participating in it willingly with her, it shows her that you do not believe the marriage is worth fighting for or that you even want it, so why should/would she even think about stopping it?

I just don't know right now. I'm dragged in so many different directions, go/stay, wait/stop/divorce, have convo/ignore her, focus on kids/care for myself, protect self thru legal action. Ya kina know what I mean.[
Yeah, I do.
Study your options and stick to one. One that you will not regret doing.
MB is designed to help you do this because not all marriages can (or should) be saved.