My wife believes she married me as a safty net. I had all the qualities she wanted...except she never really had the deep emotional connection. We connected deeply enough to have 2 children over a 14 year marriage (7&9). She believes that she can't live with me anymore because she's missing out on finding true love. She had an affair at work that I discovered 2 weeks ago & she ended it when confronted her with an e-mail i found. This forced her to tell me her feelings about us.

I love her and my family very much. I want to prove I can change & meet her needs. We are staying home from work
Wednesday to talk about it.

Can some one give me their thoughts on this? This is my 4th post with no response. Whats the secrete to starting a conversation?

I'm sorry SJCC. Sometimes we get wrapped up in our own troubles or in the back and forth that sometimes goes on here.

Have you read the web site? Have you read the books? Make sure you read and reread the Basic Concepts.

I would also caution you against asking your wife to make a decision/committment right now. The answer is too likely to be "No."

Instead, emphasise your desire to change for her and ask her for information about what you need to do to become the man of her dreams.

Keep in mind that the "fog" of lust that comes from an affair is still cloudying her mind. You may have been a safety net, or she may be reinterpretting history in light of today's situation.

Also, if you've read posts around GQII or JFO or EN, you'll know that often there are lapses. Your wife may not have really ended the affair for good. That's not to say she's choosing OM over you. It's that affairs are so intoxicating they are hard to end.

You know an affair is over when your WS is moping around the house, irritable and even unpleasant. WS often blame the BS for ending the affair. I'm not saying they are justified, just what often does happen.

You're putting alot of pressure on both of you to expect great things from a day of conversation.

I would encourage you to devour everythign Dr. H has written on this site about infidelity and recovery. If you can ask your W to read it too, and if she will, so much the better.

But the two of you need to have "safe negotiation" down, and several other basic principles well grounded for a serious relational conversation to have any real significance.

If you go ahead with Wed and a marathon session, at least read Dr. H's material on how to have a conversation about this stuff. No LB's, stop if things start to turn ugly and take a break. And all the rest of his stuff...

Thanks Greengables,

I want so badly to feel better right now. I just want to get her to realize there's a chance. She is so convinced that if it's not there, it's never will be. I try to tell her about this site, but she gets mad that I could possibly think what is in her heart can be explained on the internet!

I will take your advice and not push for a decision wed. We have an appointment at her psychologist that afternoon.

How can I find a Councelor in my area that uses MB? is ther a list somewhere?

Thanks all for the support.

SJCC, Steve Harley does MC over the telephone. You can find his office number on the main site.

A couple of suggestions. Do not recommend your wife look at this site just now. If she's interested in what you've been reading, tell her, but do not recommend she read this or even the books right now. Too much pressure.

My second suggestion is you put a time limit on how long YOU will discuss the relationship. I know you want answers, hope, change, reassurance. I doubt you'll really get that tomorrow, as JM said.

So have a couple of items you want to suggest. Post them here first. We'll help vet them out. Discuss them for no longer than an hour. Then, plan something fun that your wife loves. Use this day off to your best advantage by reminding her how much fun she used to have with you. That will do more than hours of discussion about the Marriage that leave you drained and exhuasted.

Greengables, that sounds like a good plan. I've been thinking that her finding me mopeing around the house, looking for her sympathy isn't very attractive. I guess I was hoping that her seeing me in such pain would snap her out of it. I know it won't work like that now.

Now, I'll try to narrow the thousands of thoughts down to a few for the day.

What do you think about telling her I need her to be honest about her affair status even though she has said it is over and that this is about us, not him.

Also, asking her to try to call/come to ME when she feels like she needs someone to talk to, or someone to grab a drink, or lunch... instead of someone at work.

Hmm. That's tough. I wouldn't ask her about the affair again. Either way, she'll think you're harping. Right now, you're in Plan A, and while you can make her feel uncomfortable about an ongoing affair, she's not sure yet she even wants to work on the marriage. I'd stay silent, but keep a look out.

As to the other, I think you can say "Dear Wife, I want to become the kind man that makes me the FIRST one you think of when you want to talk, have fun, grab a drink. I'm working hard to become that man." No pressure on her, makes clear what you are going to do, and let's her know what the objective is.

You know what you could do, you could ask her what she's looking for in a man. Now, that would be productive. You want to be working on the things that will get you the most points.

Now, what are you going to do that's fun? Hmm?

Oh, yeah. You might want to consider spending the day way from the house. It offers some emotional protection for everyone. No one can make a scene in public.

Greengables, That does sound better. One of the struggles that I always had throughout our relationship, is that she really does't have any hobbies. She is a high level exec & very driven. She enjoys fine dining, Aerobics, work, & relaxing. The only thing we have been able to share is dining out & relaxing. I guess I need to get to know her needs/wants better.

This is very helpful! Thanks soooooo much for the time.

Listen up, you have gotten great advice.

Remember, you can't change her. You can tell her you want to change - you want to learn to meet her needs.

Cinderella, what do you mean by inner teenager, me or her?


Thanks!

SJCC:

Remember to stay calm, no matter what she says, no matter how much it hurts you will not cry, she has seen you doing this and it hasn't gotten you anywhere. When you start, start with what YOUUUUU want to do to make things better for YOUUUUU and for the relationship, make sure you do not say MAYBE IF YOU .. focus on your part of the "blame", she MIGHT follow, when you have finished make sure you have not exceeded 10 minutes, ask her if there's anything she would like to add to your mistakes, let her talk, if she does not say anything, tell her THAT YOU WILL COMMITT TO LOVE HER AND WILL GUIDE HER THRU.

Just don't forget that you are not there to feel sorry for yourself for not being loved, you will be strong and will not cry, leave her alone when you see her thinkig, find something to do other than spying on her every reaction, that will make her notice that you are there instead of on her back or begging for attention.

Do not expect an immediate gratification,it's about being gentile,giving her a soft look,a quiet moment,a smile, blowing kisses,a rose,cooking dinner ... it's not material is what's in you that she misses.

(It is a quote from my daughter. She is 14 years old. I was reading something and a passage caught my eye - the author said something about an inner teenager. I asked my daughter if she knew that even parents had an inner teenager. She said, "Everyone has an inner teenager unless they are an old fart and don't know what is good for them."

That is the origin of my signature.)

So, I can't speak for you but I can speak for myself and I [color:"red"] DEFINITELY [/color] have an inner teenager.

Hmmm. She says she married you as a safety net, but never made a deep emotional attachment to you. Yet, she's been with you for 14 years and borne you two children. Seems like she took an awful long time to get buyer's remorse. Or is it possible that everything she's told you is rubbish - the standard issue cheater's rationalization for their behavior?

What precisely is it about yourself you want to change? Other's here will disagree with me, but having been there, you shouldn't change anything just to make yourself more attractive as a partner than her lover. Why, because she's probably not going to be entirely truthful just now and she will manipulate you if you let her. If you see that you need to make changes in yourself in order to become a better man, husband and father, make them, but do it for yourself, not to trump her lover's ace.

Do not allow her to make YOU responsible for HER affair. The two of you may have issues in your marriage that need resolution, but do not accept these as valid excuses for her infidelity. I am a strong believer that efforts to resolve marital issues are pointless as long as the affair continues. She has to end the affair and get over the emotional fallout before the two of you can make any real progress can be made to make your marriage better.

She says that she doesn't know if she can remain married to you because she's missing out on true love. I'm rolling my eyes a bit on that one, since true love isn't found, but made. The ball is in her court. She has to decide if she wants to remain married to you and work with you to make your marriage better or go off and chase that rainbow. If she chooses the former, she must end her affair immediately and sever all contact with the OM. Since her OM is someone she works with, she must change jobs. Ouch, but that's the way it is. Until she makes up her mind, you can use some of the tools and advice to be found on this site. But you must also go into marital therapy immediately. You cannot get through this without professional help. If she won't go, go alone.

Your's is a waiting game right now, and unfortunately a very painful one. Sorry that you are having to go through it.

SJCC, If you subscribe to CheckUrHeart's theory that the ball is in her court, you could be waiting a long time. Your wife does not really want to be married to you right now. You do want to be married to her, therefore, you have the motivation to make change. Your wife does not have this motivation.

If you make changes like Dr. Harley prescribes in Plan A, you may be able to create motivation for her to change as well.

If you wait for her to decision, she may decide to work on the marriage or she may not, but you'll have done nothing to influence the outcome.

I remember back to when I finally left my husband. When we eventually got to marriage counseling, my H kept saying "She has to change." Hmm. Well, I had made lots of changes, he'd made none. I wanted out. Why should I change? I wasn't the one who wanted to stay married.

Again GG, you make a good point. Definietely if SJCC wants to save his marriage, he must do what he can do. But he cannot climb into his wife's brain and flip a switch. My statement that the ball is in her court is not a theory; it is a fact as SJCC has stated her position. She's told him she doesn't know if she can stay married to him because she wants true love. She's even gone outside the marriage seeking it. He cannot resolve this inner confict for her. This is her problem to come to terms with, not his. All he can do is continue to be a good husband and father. If he identifies things about himself that he can change (and there will be), then he should do so. But, as I said, he must do these things for himself, because, if she stays or goes, he still has to live with himself. If that isn't enough for her, well, it just isn't.

A cheater really isn't focused on his or her spouse and they will continually find new reasons to find fault, assuming, of course, that they care at all. As long as they are having a ball in their affair they will not be motivated. A plan A may work, but based on what I've read here on this site, they almost never do. I think a plan A will only work if the WS really does have valid issues that the BS has been refusing to address. But when the WS is having the affair for their own selfish reasons, I can't see what a plan A can possibly accomplish. The WS simply couldn't care less. So one should probably go straight into a plan B. This sends a clear message that you are willing to stick with it, but will not enable them to continue committing adultry. This should be sufficient to send a wake up call to a WS. That's should be. All too often, unfortunately, it isn't.

The problem with going straight to Plan B is the WS's last image of the BS is one of someone who has no deposits in the old LoveBank. Plan A sets the stage so that if Plan B is implemented, and the affair implodes or explodes, the WS will naturally turn back to someone of whom he or she has pleasant memories.

Dr. Harley also says that Plan A works more often with a female Wayward Spouse than with a male one.

Like you, Check, I believe there are at least two categories of cheaters. The chronic cheater cheats because he can and/or because he needs the thrill of illicit sex and/or romance. These people show little remorse, often have multiple OP and would cheat no matter what their spouses did. Then, there are the others. The ones who's needs aren't getting met, or who have had so many LB's inflicted on them that they won't let their spouse meet their needs, or a combination.

For them, a complete Plan A has a chance of working. This includes the dreaded "Exposure." A lot of people avoid exposing their spouse's affair and this tends to drag out the recovery process, often extending Plan A for months and months, and allowing the WS to have his cake and eat it too.

Exposure has a way of speeding up the process. Sometimes it drives the WS into OP's arms, and sometimes, that ends the affair. OP may not want WS full time, in front of the limelight. Or, WS decides the marriage is more important, or saving face is more important.

Greengables,

Well, we had our talk today & I stuck to the plan as best I could. I told her I was done harping & going to work on me. I told her I wanted to find out what needs were not beeing met & try to be the one that could meet them. I told her I love her very much and was not going to give up trying to be the man she needs.

I don't think she was expecting all that. She told me that prior to this she had decided to leave. She could not go on pretending to be in love. She aknowleged that we owe it to each other to see if there is anything between us still.

I didn't here much belief in her voice, but she is still here. She is sad and probably 80% sure she wants to go. Now I need to figure out where to go from here. We are stuck in grief mode, & need to get into positive conversation some how.

Thanks for the help!

Try adding some fun. Have a date night once a week. On the date, you do not talk about the marriage... unless she wants to. The idea of date night is to enjoy Recreational Companionship. Movies don't usually count toward the 15 hours of alone time, but when one spouse is withdrawn it may be the best you can do for a bit.

Give the grief time.The hard part for you will be accepting her grief not only for what she did, but also for the loss of the affair. I think that must be one of the hardest things a BS has to do -- stand by as the WS mourns the loss of the affair.

A good marriage counselor who has a proven track record with affairs is a must.

Thanks GG, I think I'll suggest it. When we told each other we needed to find out if there was any thing left between us, she said she felt like she should do something? But didn't no what. I think a date night could get us out from under the cloud for a few hours. If I could get her to look forward to it eventually, we might have something together all of the sudden. I hope she'll go for it.

Do you think I should tell her "we owe it to each other to make this effort" or is it best to just suggest it & see how she reacts? I'm not sure I should guilt her in to it, but I feel like we need to do this soon or I may miss the window of opportunity.

How do any of you think it should be approached...I just don't want to blow any of this again!!