I have a problem. I seem to have become the 'poster child' for a recovered infidel to a few of my friends. Now, I've always been open about what I did and that I am not proud of it. But I have also always been very vociferous about what I have learned from what I did, and the struggles to try and 'right' as much of the 'wrong' as I could - both in my M and in myself.

So here's the crux. In the past 2 weeks, 2 of my friends and 1 of theirs have all confided in me that they are involved in affairs, or had SF outside of the M and are thinking of getting D'ed. One friend I have known for 3 years, and he is 'in love' with a 21 year old girl (he is 42) <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />. One friend I have only known for about a month, and she has been in an A for 3 years with a single guy <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />. One of her friends called me asking for advice because she slept with a guy once, and wants to continue seeing him, so now she wants a D. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

I have spoken to a the girls at length, and to the guy for about 45 minutes (because I just found that one out today), and to be honest.....it's VERY emotionally taxing. I feel like I'm saying the same thing over and over and over (it won't last, you are not giving your M a fair chance, you must look at why you are doing this, you are addicted, etc). I am hearing the same d*** justifications over and over and over. I am getting angrier and angrier by the moment.

I spoke about it in counseling yesterday, and it's almost as if I'm feeling 'defined' by my A - when I have tried so hard to define myself by me.

Now I know it is my decision to help these people. But honestly, I'm feeling run down by all of this. In fact, I'm actually getting somewhat depressed. On the other hand, I don't feel right just letting them 'fend' for themselves. It just doesn't feel right to have this knowledge and do nothing. And if I can help even one of them to come out of the fog enough to realize that what they are doing is not a solution.......then perhaps they might end up doing the right thing. But I feel it's a HUGE uphill battle. (Can't tell I'm a 'helper' by nature, can you? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />)

I'm just really tired right now.......

Any suggestions?

(I should also say that for the girl in a 3 yr A, currently, she is working on NC, and I would like for her to have her own chance to expose. For her friend, I do not know her H or even her last name. For the guy friend, I work with him, do not know his wife or even her first name. So with the exception of the first, exposure is not an option. Blech.)

I think you answered you rown question.

You're a helper, but you can't help everybody. Nothing keeps you from being a good listener, w/o getting sucked into "assisting"...

Just like people on this forum have to pick and choose who they respond to, you can do the same thing and nobody can fault you.

Look after yourself first. The other people have made their choices...

L.I.T. I can completely relate to what you are saying. Jaye is right on the money. (as usual <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />) You do need to safeguard your own wellbeing and counseling people in real life is a whole lot different from doing it on the Web. On a forum such as this there are others to share the burden and you can choose to drop it if it's too much.

In real life, once you've opened the door to "being there" for a friend, it is not so easy to walk away. The fact that you know the people personally also makes it difficult because you find yourself mentally wieghing both sides. Sometimes you feel tugged in two directions. Sticking to MB concepts helps with that end of it but sometimes what people tell you is a huge trigger.

H had two friends who came alongside after he discovered my A. One of them was a BS with a real horror story. Although it had been many years, supporting my H (and later, me) was so triggering to him that he sought out the man who had helped him through. What dear, dear people these are to go out of their way to help others in need. If they hadn't come along H could have ended up confiding in people that just wanted him to stop hurting already.(You know, the "dump the awful WS" types) These guys never once spoke poorly of me, just kept him focused on his ultimate goal, recovery. I love these guys! H and I will always be grateful to them and have several opportunities to pay it forward as a couple. It is emotionally taxing stuff though.

If you do decide to support your friends, here's one thing I wish I had learned sooner: people want shortcuts. You may find yourself spending tons of time verbally explaining and reexplaining everything when you have already given them access either to here or to the appropriate reading material. I let that go on waaaay too long with BS and I should have known better. People need to OWN their own stuff, they need to invest the time to read or get on MB or whatever. Beware the overly-dependant friend.

Another pitfall is the trap of listening to too much spousal complaining. I read an interesting article about why marriage counseling fails: MC allows focusing on complaints wich fosters further alienation. MB is totally different: the focus is on the present and how to become a teamplayer whether to ensure postA recovery or simply a better marriage.

Good luck in your decision L.I.T. You have a good head on your shoulders, your friends will be lucky if you decide to wade on in. KB

I as a Bs have op come to me. I send then to this site. I do not want to go through the stuff I have been throw. Someone I work with got mad even. and said I would dump his [censored] - why the [email]h@ll[/email] are you staying -your nuts ect ect. So I no longer tell anything and keep away from the grapevine. I only told one person -guess that is all it took.

Hey LIT,

What you describe is sort of like being here for a long time. I have a suggestion for you to see if they are serious or not. Suggest that they come here and post and read the material. If they don't at least do that much, what have got to offer them? Not much because they don't want fixes they just want to feel better about what they have, are, or are willing to do.

By the way you ARE defined by what you have done and that is why they are coming to you. But, what you don't seem to realize is what you have done is not so much about the A or your divorce. What you did was be honest with your H and FIGHT for your marriage, they know that and they KNOW that you KNOW how to save them. The only issue is are they willing to save themselves.

You know LIT, it is time you realized you are a good person, and you did your best to correct a mistake in judgement. We all make them to one degree or another, but many don't work at addressing them, you did. You are a special person that is why you are attracting all of these people.

But, just remember you cannot save them, only they can do that, so go slow with this, make sure they do something constructive between talking to you so that you can measure the "baby steps" and separate those that are serious from those who are not.

Perhaps one of your friends will post again. I hope so. I don't know if she got anything from her previous posts but maybe we planted a few seeds.

Must go.

God Bless,

JL

God works in mysterious ways...

Thanks you guys....In my heart, I know that they have to help themselves. And two of them I have directed here (both the girls). The guy I will see at work on Friday, and will also refer him to this site.

I don't know what it is exactly, but it really makes me sick to my stomach to hear their 'foggy' speak and see them act all 'giddy' over something that they know full well is ruining their M. I really don't know why I am reacting so strongly that way. I don't usually have such a reaction here on the board. Perhaps it's just SO much closer to reality?

I am lucky in that two of them at least 'listen' to what I am saying. One of the girls today even said that she 'respected' the way I had done things after my A (which was almost as much <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> as it was flattering), and realized that she needs to spend some time working on herself, and in a year, she will reevaluate how she feels about her M. In the meantime, she and her H will be going to MC - although they will probably be living separately.

They guy friend listened, but I am unsure if he will be able to resist.

I'm going to try to help them by referring them to books that helped me, and by telling them about this website and asking them to post here. I do have to admit, though, that if they do not take advantage of the resources, I will probably have to tell them to keep their A talk away from me. It's hard enough not knowing what is going on with their A's - but I think it will be even more difficult if I were informed of how they are not ending their A's.

Thank you all for the input.

LIT

JL,

I wanted to respond to your post separately.

The two girls have been referred here. You, of course, met one of them. The other has read the material, but not posted. Her situation has infidelity on both sides, and is a little more complicated. But she is at least in IC and planning on MC with her H. As far as I know, that one has ended the A....but is in pretty heavy withdrawal.



I agree completely that I am defined by what I have done. And I agree that it's not all about the A or all about the D. I have made many internal changes, and truly begun to feel happy with life again. Happy with myself, even.

But with so much focus on A (found out just now that my manager's H left her today b/c he is involved with an OW <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />), I feel like my life is revolving around the history of my A and what happened shortly afterward. Almost like the other things I need to work on (trusting again, speaking up, maintaining my independence in a R) are all being put on hold b/c I am so ademant about telling these friends that an A is NOT the answer.

Thanks, JL. Actually, I am truly OK with myself. I no longer live under an umbrella of guilt, and I like myself probably more than I ever have in my life (course that's not always saying much! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />). No, really, I was just telling one of the girls today that I have forgiven myself. I know that I made a mistake, and I own that. But I also know that I fought tooth and nail to save my M, and to 'right' as much as I could about the A. And that has helped me to understand the remorse for an A vs the guilt for an A.

I'm getting tired <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> - I'm beginning to ramble!


I hope she will, although I am doubtful. I truly hope that she will prove me wrong. After her last post, she has given me few details about what's going on. Oddly enough, it's her silence that frightens me. I tend to believe that she would post more, or at least talk to me about withdrawal....IF she was really out of her A. And I don't know what to do about that one.

Thanks, JL for replying as well. I'm exhausted. I have to be up in 5 hours for a surgery tomorrow morning, so I am going to head to bed. Hopefully this post made some sense........I am fading fast! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />