Is it crazy for me to want my STBX to tell me he is so sorry and to ask for my forgiveness? I don't want him back but it would make me feel good to know that he was sorry and felt truly bad for what he's done. Is this just crazy thinking on my part?
I wouldn't forgive him but just want to feel that he knows he was wrong. I guess maybe in time I will hear that ......maybe not.
I was with my friends this weekend. They were with thier kids and husbands. I looked at my friend and said "I miss seeing my son with his dad and watching them play together...I will never have that again." I told her it made me very sad. She looked at me and grabbed my hand and said..."honey, he'll never have that either and it was his own doing...he will have to live with that for the rest of his life." I know she's totally right but it still hurts!
Anyone else having these thoughts?????

bump

Trish
you know how important my 'sorry' was from Squid - and we're together in recovery.

I think your WH has behaved SO very dispicably you want to know that he has a shred of decency within him that he has to override to behave like such a tosser.

You would know then at leats that he is not in denial ove rhis hurtful actions.

I thik it sperfectly reasonable Trish.

But I doubt very much you will ever get it.

With your H wearing his own [censored] as a hat for a year now, without any sign of coming out for air, I don't expect he'll start behaving decently any time soon.

He is truly delusional.

bob...you are right. I just want to know that he has some decency but like you said, I doubt I will ever get that sorry. I know how important it was to you to hear those words. Sometimes it's all I want. I just want to know that he didn't mean to hurt me so deeply. It's been a long year and here I am still lost. I am moving forward but it just boggles my mind that he can still continue to treat me this way. We were together for 18 years. Was all that time just one big lie???

Yeah, TR. I feel that way, too. And oddly enough, after more than two years, I'm going to get my chance to hear it next week. After all this time, I don't even know how I feel about hearing it. Almost as if it's pointless. I'm past the things my ex did in most ways. It may be that there really isn't anything she can do to make amends. Because I no longer want to forgive her. Even if she grovels before me and begs my forgiveness. Even if she said she wanted to come home. Even if she handed me completed adoption papers for our daughter.

I don't know that it's there in me to do anything other than look at her and then turn away and go on with my life.

I don't like that about myself. I would like to believe that I can forgive her. When it gets right down to it, I don't know whether I can.

We separated two years ago, and we've been divorced seven or nine months, depending on how you count it.

I guess I'm posting just so you know how your feelings might change over time.

Tree - I know how you feel. My WH will never realize the pain he has caused. And if he ever did, "I'm sorry" would just not do it for me. You say "I'm sorry" when you accidentally hurt someone. To me this goes way beyond "I'm sorry".

I struggle with this as well. I've had conversations with friends where I express my desire to want to forgive (but not reconcile) but I right now I know I am unable without hearing those words.

At this point it is all business with WW and as far as I can tell will stay that way until I hear those two very important words that Bob talked about. In fact I don't have anything else to say to her until I hear that.

Asking for forgiveness would also help for some closure for me but I'm not expecting that any time soon. I'd be happy with just an "I'm sorry..." to be perfectly honest.

Anyways... you're not crazy. If you are, check me into the asylum too. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> I think about it lots...

Take care,

Miker

It is surely NOT crazy, but perhaps unrealistic. Someday you will need to forgive the rotten sack of $hit, no matter what the level of his contrition is. You have to do it for you...NOT HIM. You are not there yet, but you will be someday.

Sour.. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Wow...I'm glad I'm not alone in these thoughts.

JustJ...I too don't think I can forgive....at least not anywhere in the near future. If I ever do hear those 2 words I think I will do the same as you. I will just look at him and walk away and move on with my life.

believer...you are SO right. I'm sorry isn't enough. I honestly don't think there is anything our WS could say to make any of the pain go away.

Miker...I hope you get to hear those words one day also. Well, who knows we all might be in the asylum before too long. :-) I'll save ya a seat. LOL.

lemonman....I know that forgiving him would be for me not him. I just feel that to forgive him would be to say "what you did wasn't wrong." I know that's not so but it's just how I feel right now. I know in time I will feel differently. I look forward to that day.
Since I haven't been getting anymore crazy notes from him I am finding some peace. :-)

Without reconciliation, how much is an apology worth?

The person says, "I'm sorry," and does nothing more to participate in your healing. The person does not offer to hear your pain, maybe even resists further acknowledgement of his role as creator of your suffering, deep as anything you can imagine.

What if he says, "I'm sorry?" Or even worse, offers the non-apology apology: "I'm sorry if what I did hurt you."

It's there, it's gone. Has your pain changed? Has this simple gesture actually done something to heal you?

Your perpetrator owes you everything you wish he would give you. But the debt is so great. What is "I'm sorry?" Two words.

Are those words, a simple little expression of contrition--a tiny thing--as hard to say as,

I forgive you

???

GC

I'm not sure how much "I'm sorry" will do for you?

For me, nothing at all. An apology also comes with making amends for the wrongs done.

It's kinda like getting kicked where it counts on purpose, hearing "I'm sorry" then getting kicked there again.

GC & TTSi....I see what you are saying. I guess I just wanted to know that he felt bad about what he did. You're so right...it won't change a thing. A part of me just wants to know that he regrets what he did and isn't happy.

Tree, you might have noticed that most of my post consisted of questions. Maybe leading questions, but still questions.

I don't necessarily believe I know the answers to them.

Maybe an apology is the first step down a slippery slope for a WS.

To be contrite, to say with sincerity that he is sorry for what he's done, he has to abandon the ideology of I didn't choose this, but it's what I had to do to be happy.

That ideology has become his theme song. It's like his life support.

He can only breathe on his own if he's smoking it.

That's why a sincere apology is probably next to impossible for him. The non-apology apology is much more likely. Not, "I'm sorry for what I did to you," but rather, "I'm sorry what I did to you was painful."

Big difference between those.

GC

After many years, I'm still looking for "I'm sorry." from my 1st W. Not that I need it to go on with my life, but for her to finally realize and admit what a self-centered, uncaring woman she was/is.

I dont wanna threadjack here but this thread has got me thinking. I really dont think an apology matters to me. I dont know why, but it doesnt. Is it going to make me feel any better? I doubt it. If WW wanted to apologize I almost feel like it would be more for her than for me. It would allow herself to feel better about what she did.
All that being said, I have been listening to Roger Creager lately. He is another one of these Texas music artists that has a real country party type sound. One song has lifted my spirits lately. It is an upbeat tune and here are the lyrics......

Roger Creager Moving On lyrics
Roger Creager

You packed up your things and then you said goodbye.
You'd think after all we shared, you could tell me why.
The flames were burning hot baby, too hot to hold.
Bu, now I see your love was burning cold.
But don't you worry about me.
I'm feeling sorry for you, and when I sleep tonight,
At least I'll know my love is true.
Baby I'm better than you.
I'm moving on to a place where love is strong.
I'm moving on.
Does this sound like a sad country song?
I dusted myself off and I'm back in the saddle again.
I lost in love with you but now I'm ready to win and I'm moving on.
No more trying to win you back.
No more crying over what I thought we had.
When I said, "I need you" and that I was all alone,
Good old compassionate you slammed down the phone.
But don't you worry about me.
I'm feeling sorry for you, and when I sleep tonight,
At least I'll know my love is true.
Baby I'm better than you.
I'm moving on to a place where love is strong.
I'm moving on.
Does this sound like a sad country song?
I dusted myself off and I'm back in the saddle again.
I lost in love with you but now I'm ready to win and I'm moving on.
So save your money and save your time.
Save your ragged little mind.
You turned your love off like a switch.
Just think of all this love you missed.
Girl you're such a dirty little ........
I'm moving on to a place where love is strong.
I'm moving on.
Does this sound like a sad country song?
You probably thought I'd write a sad country song.
Does this sound like a sad country song?

Like WNCT, I'm not sure that an apology is what I'm after.

My WH is still deep in the fog, and doesn't think he has done anything wrong. He did say 'I'm sorry' when he first left after I asked him how he could do this to us (me and our two children). But that wasn't really what I was after!

Now, after he insisted that his leaving wouldn't hurt the children, he admits that he has done them harm. But this is still justified, apparently - he shows no signs of wanting to end his A and come home.

I want an admission of wrongdoing. I want his A to fail. I am on the verge of abandoning hope for reconciliation, but would like to hear, one day, that WH thinks what he did was a mistake. I want to hear him say that the things he said about our marriage, all those things he blamed on me, were lies and excuses.

I wonder if I can move on without knowing he feels remorse, without hearing him say he was wrong. But WH is a very, very stubborn person (even before he began the A). Now he is foggy, defensive and stubborn. I'm sure that, if he admits the truth one day, it's going to take a long, long time.

Alph.

GC...Will any of us ever have the answers? I doubt it. :-)
I have heard the "I'm sorry that I wasn't happy" crap. It's always about him.
I guess it really doesn't matter if I hear it or not. I just want to know that he regrets what he did and isn't happy with the OW.

RAG......I hope you get that sorry from your first W one day for your own peace of mind. It's hard I know!

WasCrushedNTexas...Thanks for the song lyrics. I need to go buy that song.

Alphin.....My STBX is very deep in the fog still also. He has also said that our son will be totally fine and better off with 2 holidays and such. Crazy talk!!!! I hope for my son's sake my STBX snaps out of all of this soon. I don't want him back at all but I do want him to be a good father.

I had been thinking about his very subject not long ago and the fact that I want him to acknowledge the pain his actions caused me and our children bothers me.

Why is it so important?

I think one of the reasons, at least for me, is that I was told so many times that the A was my fault or because our marriage was so bad.

It wasn't.

Having him acknowledge that his ACTIONS and his SELFISHNESS caused the pain in our family means more to me than I wanted it to.

I kind of feel like, "Well, I have accepted my part in the problems in our marriage. Where is your accountability?"

I want him to realize that it wasn't all my fault. I want him to realize the pain in our childrens hearts was put there by selfishness.

He won't though and that is what I had to accept.

Why was it important to me? I wanted to be right.

I wanted to be the bigger person who fought for a reason.

It can feel like the fight was for nothing because we divorced. I went through all that crap... the affair... the lies... and still ended up divorced.

Why?

I hurt, my kids hurt and he stands back and acts like it was all okay.

I sometimes feel like the fact we divorced was some sort of proof to him that his affair was justified.

As the BS who doesn't save their marriage, we have no prize at the end of a FWS who acknowledges their wrong doing and our pain.

I redefined my definition of winning.

I got out of a relationship with a selfish man who WILL NOT change. To not be able to see and acknowledge pain...especially when it is caused by you... is a sign of a very narcisitic personality.

You did too.

It still bothers me that he doesn't acknowledge it or accept it. I think it's natural and a natural part of healing and moving on.

It's gotten easier though since I really looked at my own reasons for it bothering me. Now when I feel that way I remind myself of the gifts in my life that could have only come to me through the ending of our marriage.

Tree,

I think it might be we need for them to show some remorse, so we can go on with our lives. They blamed us for everything and didn't take responsibility for their own actions.

In my case, I just want closure. I would love the chance to just sit down with him, tell him how I feel and maybe their will be something inside him that will wake up. It might be too late to save our relationship, but it would be nice for him to own up to his part in this whole disaster.