Ok, From eariler posts I stated the fact that WS crossed the line several times. I left last night with very little plans. Ended up spending the night in my office.

I did not write a letter to start plan B. Do I need to?

I been thinking of going home tonight because missing the kids. Make me a doormat?

Could I get better prepaired and do it then?

If I come home and she says she is willing to work with me should I believe it?

Probably lack of sleep is part of it

Mutt, I am truly sorry that you find yourself in this situation, however, there is very little to go on since you first posted back in May. To say that your current 14 posts is a "bit sparse" is an understatement.

Just a couple of observations from what I have read.

1. You twice referenced problems before you were married and then "blew them off" with an "except for" sort of reasoning.

I think those "before marriage" issues may well be a the root of the problem and you need to give us the "whole story" if we are going to be able to offer help that is potentially more "on target" for you.

2. You have been seeing an Individual Counselor. Be cautious here as some of their help is good and some of it is NOT at all centered on saving a marriage. The "thrust" of most IC is to help YOU with your problems, and from what you've said, you certainly seem to have your share of personal issues that need to be worked on. But be careful, some of the things that might be intended to "help you" can also be destructive to a marriage where "caring and sharing" are integral parts.

3. Leaving the house is an emotional reaction and not very well thought out. Basically, your "excuse" that the kids always ask for "mommy" is just an easy way for you to abandon them to an adulteress who is not thinking clearly right now, regardless of whether or not your marriage has any chance of surviving. If ANYONE should leave the house, it usually should be the unfaithful spouse, since their actions have already chosen a path of "leaving." YOUR moving out sends a message to the children that you will "cut and run" instead of fight for what is right and that you will abandon THEM. They don't understand the "reason" you have left, they just see that you have left them and their "mommy." What I sense is here is a serious deficiency of "backbone," and that may be one of the root causes of your wife's straying.

Mutt, there is no "easy" way to address adultery in a marriage. You CAN "cut and run" straight to a divorce, but you are fooling yourself if you think that is an "easy" or "painless" answer. It's not, and divorce has it's own set of problems.

Your wife has said that she loves you, but you are bouncing all over the place with NO plan. Will you "fight," or will you revert to "flight" as the answer?

4. You don't seem to understand what Emotional Needs are, and if you do, you don't understand how to, or choose not to, provide for your WIFE's emotional needs. Hence her comments to her friend in the email.

mutt, Plan A is all about improving YOU, and thereby giving your spouse a "new you" to compare. As long as you keep treating her to the "old you," why would you expect her to change?

Bottom line, mutt, is that if you truly want help and a good chance at recovering your marriage, you are going to have to start posting more and make a commitment to DO many of the things recommended NO MATTER HOW HARD THEY MAY SEEM TO YOU. They WILL seem hard, because they will require CHANGE. Change does NOT come easily to any of us, but it is necessary. The "old way" has NOT worked and has resulted in an affair. Do you WANT to continue doing things the "old way" and just "hope" for a different outcome? Or do you want to step up to the plate and FIGHT, to DO the hard things, to be a man, a father, and a husband?

Hopefully that doesn't sound to "harsh." Hopefully that will get you THINKING instead of emotionally REACTING.

Looking forward to hearing from you.

God bless.

The before marriage issue is:

First I met her in college through a classmate. We spent time together on her breaks and had a good friendship. She had a boyfriend at the time but people in her class called me "number 2". Well he broke it off with her without anything to do with me (to my knowledge). He really didn't give a reason to my knowledge. Anyway, I comfronted her and we started a relationship. A few months later she asked me if I was seeing anyone else. I said no so I asked her the same. She stated that a friend wanted her to go out with his brother. I showed that I did not like the idea but never felt like I had the right to say no to her. Because I was upset, she told me that I had nothing to worry about because she was a virgin and tried to comfort me with the idea. We went out a few times the next month and I spent most of my time sitting at home waiting for the phone to ring. Well, she called me one day and asked if I wanted to go to the fair. I went and picked her up. She asked me if she looks "different". Sorry. I am going to shorten it up. Anyway. When I got her I asked how far she went with him and she tilted her head and smiled and said far as possible. I broke down and tried to leave. It was a short lived relationship. Seen each other only a handful of times until he went BACK TO HIS WIFE. Yet she insisted on maintaining a friendship with the brother who fixed her up! Despite that he threatened me! One reason or another I stayed. Fear? Love? loyality? or a mixer? don't know. Later on in the relatiionship we were walking and she wanted to avoid someone I asked why and she said he wouldn't leave her alone so she told him she was pregnant and he ran. I asked about that I found out her "best friend" was in love with this guy who no longer will talk to her so she sent my WW to go talk to him on her behalf. We my WW started a relationship with this person until her best friend found out and then broke it off for her. These two things happened between late June and Late July.
She talked me into to staying. Every summer though I seem to relive in my mind. I am not sure why.

EN wise she herself said I was meeting her "important ENs"

I do admit that I was having problems with some considering that I was just learning more truth. Admiration I knew I was lacking. I said I appreciate you doing . . . and tank for . . . . but I do believe I could have done more. However, it is hard when you just learned you were lied to from the beginning of that D-day up to that day. And even in Surviving and Affair I believe you state during withdrawl some ENs be provide would go un-noticed.

The kids is a hole I dug. And I believe is part of the creation of the mess. When our second child was born she stopped working because two kids in daycare would not pan out with her salary. I think it was the love buster war and I don't know who made the first shot. She would go out and injure finacial support need for me. In return are start to shut down on providing another.

I demand that she stop spending so much money and to clean the house since she wasn't working.
I disrepect things that is also and outburst of whatever I think would hit.

She continued her habits and who independed behavior and lied.

Since part of my tactics resulted in leaving her with the domestic support with the kids seeing her all day while I was at work I still think it would be more pain for the kids if she left. Now I can't deny that I fear screwing up with the kids.

Now this is what burns me. She gets a job. I ease up because there is financial support. She works evening shift 6 days a week. I became Mr Mom. Cooking is my worst part. Laundry and such not much of a problem. Anyway, she meets the OM at this job. I might be grasping for straws but I do believe the job was a big part of the breakdown. Limited time with me and the kids which took away a whole lot of ENs that were there before.

I do blame myself for creating the situation so how can I ask her to leave? I know it is a bad plan B. For one direct deposit of my check in a shared account. Full financial support so far. I have a problem of not making a desicion and using other people opinions. Now the voices that were telling me to leave her are still there plus that the voices that supported her now say it too.

I miss my wife.

I miss my children.

I love my wife and my children.

I just can't be number 2 anymore. And I can't stay with broken promises and lies anymore although I still fear I will end up caving.

And part of that is due to the fear of other peoples opinion.

I know I am flawed greatly. I just feel with my flaw I wonder if my children and/or wife would be better off without me.

One other thing. Anyone think it would be a good idea or a bad idea to ask my WW to read these groups and recommend her to post?

I know I am probably doing a perfect example of a plan B. AS in people should look at what I am doing and know that is exactly what NOT to do.

Why? I returned her call. She wanted to tell me what our kids are in this Friday and find out if I wanted to attend. I declined for the fear that I would breakdown infront of people. And of course I opened my mouth. ASked questions. She said she missed me. I told her that I have no problem coming home but she would need to be open and honest and no OM. Then there was silence. So asked if she wants to be together she said she doesn't knmow. Just was thinking if she read somethings she might see that we are not unique. That there is a roadmap and she can see where it heads.

I don't know.

I just feel like going home. Fix her email problem then show her these groups and request her to read some.