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Marriage Builders Forums Our Archives Archived Read-Only Posts Inactive: General Questions WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!??

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Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? Fox0r #1438656 07/27/05 07:08 AM
Joined: Aug 2004 Posts: 1,177 A aussie2 Member
aussie2 Member A Joined: Aug 2004 Posts: 1,177	Lordy fox thats a long one.... ok first thing before any comment... your plan b thing...did you do a formal plan B with the letter setting out the boundaries that you could accept, MC, etc etc or did you kinda drift into the plan b type of no contact for a while??? W 38ys H 39 yrs DS 2 yrs DD 21 yrs DS 20 yrs M nearly 21 yrs WHO DARES WIN

Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? Fox0r #1438657 07/27/05 07:24 AM
Joined: Jun 2002 Posts: 1,717 B ba109 Member
ba109 Member B Joined: Jun 2002 Posts: 1,717	Plan B? She seems to be in the dark about that one. Did you not notify her that you would be going to NC? Regardless, you can somewhat see the effects that a Plan B might have. I think that her reactions to you going dark were accentuated by the fact that she was completely clueless as to your whereabouts. I did not read the entire exchange but it seems moot to me unless you have outlined some ultimatums for recovery. Until then, she is still jerking your emotional heart strings. ba109

Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? ba109 #1438658 07/27/05 07:36 AM
Joined: Apr 2001 Posts: 4,083 K KaylaAndy Member
KaylaAndy Member K Joined: Apr 2001 Posts: 4,083	She's not ready to be married until she stops with the comments about how much she was hurt by you, and starts recognizing how much she has hurt you and how much she IS hurting you. Plan B pal - Cafe Plan B link http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2182650&page=1 The ? that made recovery possible: "Which lovebuster do I do the most that hurts the worst"? The statement that signaled my personal recovery and the turning point in our marriage recovery: "I don't need to be married that badly!" If you're interested in saving your relationship, you'll work on it when it's convenient. If you're committed, you'll accept no excuses.

Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? KaylaAndy #1438659 07/27/05 07:51 AM
Joined: Jul 2004 Posts: 10,107 England,United Kingdom B Bob_Pure Member
Bob_Pure Member B Joined: Jul 2004 Posts: 10,107 England,United Kingdom	Shannon's posts drip with self-centredness. She seems interested in you only in your contribution to her happiness or self-realisation. Me, I. You were absolutely right to say married or nothing: no friends. MB Alumni

Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? KaylaAndy #1438660 07/27/05 07:53 AM
Joined: Dec 2004 Posts: 141 V Vivivanviv Member
Vivivanviv Member V Joined: Dec 2004 Posts: 141	I would recommend continueing plan b BW-28-me FWH-27 D-Day 10-04 Together- 13 yrs Married- 4 yrs EA- 3 months -turned into a weekend PA, he came home on Sunday and told me. HS/College Sweethearts

Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? Vivivanviv #1438661 07/27/05 08:08 AM
Joined: Jan 2002 Posts: 5,575 N nikko Member
nikko Member N Joined: Jan 2002 Posts: 5,575	from that whole exchange---you would think he was the cheater.......what did i miss....other than you agreeing to a separation and her going out looking for your replacement....and you happily swallowing that! what we do in life......echoes in eternity!

Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? nikko #1438662 07/27/05 08:20 AM
Joined: Mar 2003 Posts: 2,023 T Trix Member
Trix Member T Joined: Mar 2003 Posts: 2,023	Fox, she was maybe willing to concede and inch and you jumped on wanting to take a mile. No, I don't really think she is any different than before. She was desparate for a fix from you...to fill a part of her EN's. She is still involved in whatever is 'confusing' her. I still bet on an OM... hey, but that's me. She's mostly emotionally detached from you. I still thinks she want to use you for what it to her benefit only...the perks. She is purely selfish/self serving right now. You would be a fool to transfer schools because of some tidbit she is tempting you with. You are too quick to take all the blame etc. You were too willing to bend over backwards and act like a dog after a [censored] in heat. She would respect you more if you show more self respect and boundaries. Your going dark gave you a hint of what a real plan B may be able to do. You need to be a man...standing firm, calm, and strong in what is right about the vows you made to be her husband. You did much better in the first part of your conversation before you were willing to give up everything just for a chance to be with her. She has you just where she wants you again. Not good. You can't be friends with her....stick to your guns. She should concede and move to Pullman with you..not the other way around. Your education in the right place is what is wisest for you and for her if you stay married or not. Married 1976 Me:BS Him:FWS MB Weekend March 2003 2 S's: '77 & '80, 1 D: '82

Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? Trix #1438663 07/27/05 08:30 AM
Joined: May 2003 Posts: 261 H high_road Member
high_road Member H Joined: May 2003 Posts: 261	Let's see if we can figure out exactly who this conversation was about.... Quote i felt like i was alone in our marriage you waited too long. i just wish we would have never gotten married in the first place because at least i would have still ahd our friendship but YOU BETRAYED ME TOO!!! you just dont see it through my eyes i worked hard for our marriage for a long time whether you see it or not i just wish that you would have come to me sooner you dont know how horribly bad you have hurt me i dont know if that kind of pain can go away i am so afraid that you will just hurt me again i dont want to be hurt again, and sometimes i dont know if i am willing to take the chance i cant believe you right now im not sure what i want i am going to need a lot of time to decide what i really want i cant promise you anything just yet it may take months on my end i cant take much more of this before i have a nervous breakdown its really hard for me to trust you. i really want to, but i am afraid that if i do trust you, i am going to get hurt again i am afraid of you letting me down again our relationship has brought me a lot of pain i just cant decide how i feel right now i will grant the separation for the time being, but it is going to take me a while to find out what i truly want, but patience is something that you are gonna have to give me in this time period if you cant give me that, then i know it wont work i am so confused right now what if i do meet other people? part of figuring out what i want involves that.... I DONT KNOW WHAT I WANT and i'm not hurting?? i will see what i can do i didnt feel like your wife anymore....i didnt even know who i was. i felt invisible to you...like i didnt matter anymore but you cant say that i am not trying i worked hard for us when you wouldnt but i still don't know how i will feel this is my last try....because i dont know how much strength i have left i feel like our marriage is sucking the life out of me. i will give you this last chance aaron That was a long conversation and I just skimmed, but I don't think I've ever seen so many "I"'s or "me"'s in my life. I completely agree with everyone else. She might as well have been reading from a script. I think I heard every one of those lines at least 5 times from my W at one time. I just don't understand how she can figure so much hurt into such a short marriage. She talks like you've been married for 10 years and you've been emotionally distant from her the whole time. Not that I'm belittling any hurt she actually has felt, because I'm sure there's some there, but it seems to be blown way out of proportion. Don't swallow this, cause there's a hook on the end that's gonna hurt really bad when it's set.

Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? KaylaAndy #1438664 07/27/05 08:35 AM
Joined: Jun 2002 Posts: 4,712 M Mortarman Member
Mortarman Member M Joined: Jun 2002 Posts: 4,712	Quote Shannon aaron I DONT KNOW WHAT I WANT This is the theme of her post. She is on the fence, Fox. And when on the fence, it means you need to go to Plan B. A full Plan B. You explained it well throughout your post to her. Actually, I was quite impressed with how you spoke to her. You didnt defend or get defensive. If you re-read the thing, you will see that the longer you went on like that, the more her conversation went from "It's over, I want to be friends..." to "I dont know if it is over..." But one part in there you did mess up. If you want to be married to her, and you are married to her, you must NEVER condone her seeing someone else. Never. When she said that it was a part of her figuring things out, you came back with "well, then if you have to do that, then it is over for us." Or something like that. And that was the proper response. But a couple minutes later, you write that if she goes and finds someone, that you will still be there for her. Thus, you just condoned adultery, albeit future adultery. So, never ever say that you will support her or be there for her if she is meeting or dating other men. Look, your conversation was great. It was a great Plan A conversation (except for that part about condoning adultery). You werent defensive. You stayed on script. And you drew boundary lines (no friendship post-divorce was a big one!!). She was responding to that. You were actually helping her to get up and start walking out of that fog. And then you let her sit right back down, because hse now knows she can cake eat. She will get a period of time to date and do whatever she wants...and then she can come back to you because you will always be there for her. And by the way, by saying that, you contradict yourself above that because earlier you said you cant be there for her as just a friend...that it is the marriage or nothing. And then you change that by saying she can see other guys while married to you. Okay, where to now? Plan B letter time. In that letter, you can fix that little part that you screwed up by saying that there is no way that you can allow your wife to see or be with another man or men. Fit that in to the standard Plan B letter. Give the letter to her tomorrow. And then go COMPLETELY dark. No talking, no emails, no IMs. Nothing. If you want help writing the letter, then ask. You must include in it, not only the revision that says that you are not going to be there for her if she sees someone else...but also you need to give her a way back home. What I mean by that is that when she pulls her head out, there has to be an acceptable way for her to let you know that she has pulled it out. So, you would say something like "If you decide that our marriage is what you want, then please email me and let me know." If you dont give her a way to get to you, she will either give up trying to get to you, or she will abuse it by calling you all of the time...pushing your boundaries. Anyway, write out the standard Plan B letter. Add in the stuff about her seeing other men is a No-Go. Add a way for her to let you know that she wants to come back. Then post the letter here and we will vet it. Then give it to her and go dark. Fox, there is a reason for optimism here. She is truly on the fence. You cannot squish now. You must continue to be like you were thru most of that post. Your not talking to her, the way you did the post throughout most of it, was beginning to have an effect on her. You must do this right now. She is listening. She is thinking what a life without you means. You must follow the plan to a "T" if you have any hope of saving your marriage. Get with it. In His arms.

Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? Fox0r #1438665 07/27/05 08:38 AM
Joined: Aug 2004 Posts: 1,177 A aussie2 Member
aussie2 Member A Joined: Aug 2004 Posts: 1,177	Well Fox to me her comments are still very foggy. Her whole conversation is centered on one thing "HERSELF", though she has worked around it a bit,it is..... I want to keep you as my back up, Yes I am seeing others but if you believe I'm not so much the better No I wont stop seeing others is that ok with you - and you just said it was!! Its ALL your fault [because obviously you were the only one in the M] Everything has to be my way or its the highway and oh yes,,its your fault Fox, the running around after you was her panicking you were 'gone' and she no longer had you as back up. Plan B was not really ever in place... I know it seems counter productive but if plan A is no longer possible then do a CORRECT plan B with the letter and the whole hog and let her flounder away, you rushing to the rescue every time simply lets her have her cake with either a OM or many OM's whatever on the side - and be sure there is a OM or OM's - and no she WILL NOT be honest with you until the fog lifts whenever. W 38ys H 39 yrs DS 2 yrs DD 21 yrs DS 20 yrs M nearly 21 yrs WHO DARES WIN

Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? aussie2 #1438666 07/27/05 08:50 AM
Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 2,715 O Owl Member
Owl Member O Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 2,715	Fox- I've had the same thoughts for quite a while in reviewing your thread...she's always gone on about how long you've hurt her...she's got NO sense of time! You've been married such a short time, the reality is that your marriage relationship hasn't even completely formed yet!! One thing...I'm not at all surprised that everything is about her in your conversation...this could have been cut and pasted from conversations I had with my wife while she was in withdrawl. I don't have any real advice at this point...I think you've heard it all already.

Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? Owl #1438667 07/27/05 09:05 AM
Joined: Mar 2003 Posts: 2,903 S StillHereMakingIt Member
StillHereMakingIt Member S Joined: Mar 2003 Posts: 2,903	Wow, she was negotiating REAL HARD to have her single life...and you as a friend too (I want it all!) Great job setting that boundary that you could NOT be friends after D. If she gives you a hard time about it, tell her, "I don't think my new GF or W would like that." Excellent job rolling with her and telling her you want her to be happy...just babbling back the fog to her... One thing I would change is you saying you would wait as long as it would take...you really won't, you have a limit, and it is not entirely up to her to decide when the D happens. If she waits too long you will have drained all your love for her and you will give up, that is the reality, not a threat. OK, so you are meeting her on Thursday...pizza and final fantasy. Did you have a formal Plan B letter and everything? Time to do this if you haven't. I would spend Thursday Plan Aing her, and at the end of the evening explin about the love you have dwindling and the hope you have and how it is dwindling too and you have to protect both and that means NC, then give her the letter....then NC...that means no IM (get off if she gets on), no phone calls, no messages from friends. No excuses. Life may not be the party we hoped for, but while we are here we might as well dance!

Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? Fox0r #1438668 07/27/05 09:06 AM
Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,355 G GBH Member
GBH Member G Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,355	Ready for the 2x4? First, I agree that she appears incredibly self centered. But at the same time, IMVHO, based on your posts and your sig line, it doesn't appear to me that either of you is mature enough for marriage, much less bringing innocent children into this world. You are 20 years old and still in school. Concentrate on your studies, finishing school, getting a good job, and becoming financially stable. Then go looking for a mature and ambitious woman with whom to have a mature, loving, and committed relationship. Yeah, Plan B sounds about right at this point.

Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? GBH #1438669 07/27/05 09:54 AM
Joined: Jun 2005 Posts: 169 T timn420 Member
timn420 Member T Joined: Jun 2005 Posts: 169	Great advice you have here. I can't really add anything myself. I'm going through the same thing and I could read your IM like it was from my wife. It's all about her. Do plan B and don't get too caught up in everything. You have some great help here on the boards, remember that and be strong. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> God Bless. Married 3 years Me(BS): 33 WW: 30 D-Day 5/21/05 Divorced - it's over and my life has now begun

Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? timn420 #1438670 07/27/05 10:43 AM
Joined: Mar 2004 Posts: 1,842 M Momto3Boys Member
Momto3Boys Member M Joined: Mar 2004 Posts: 1,842	Who had the affair....by the sounds of THIS conversation, it sounds like YOU had the affair??? you even said something like "have you met someone else and if you have tell me" and she said, NO i haven't met someone else.. and she continues to say how much YOU hurt her...what about HER hurting YOU... Did I miss something...I'm sorry, I dont know your story...but from this convo it is clear to me that you had the affair form the words being trascribed. dont read into this....I think you need to just move on...This converstaion is typical babble! trying to keep you in her life and sitting on the fence!

Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? Momto3Boys #1438671 07/27/05 01:12 PM
Joined: Jun 2005 Posts: 722 F Fox0r Member
Fox0r Member F Joined: Jun 2005 Posts: 722	No - I didn't have an affair; nor did I ever even think of doing so. I have caught my W talking to 2 men behind my back; one of them she spent the night at his house and even admittedly in his bed. She knew that I thought there was something going on; and she left me in the house crying - went anyways and slept at his place. She came home and spent the next three weeks telling me she didn't love me. I have never been unfaithful to my wife. What have I done wrong in our relationship? After the first OM situation I began to neglect the time we spent together for awhile; I ended up spending too much time on the computer because she was making me sad. That is it. I've never done anything else. Doesn't she make it sound like I killed her family? :\ Guys - thank you for the great advice; I'm going to start working out a Plan B letter now; I'll Plan A it up tomorrow on her birthday, and then when she gets ready to leave I'll hook her up with the NC letter. Me 20 WW 20 Friends since: December 10, 1999 Began Dating: October 29, 2003 Married Feb 13, 2004 D-Day: July 28, 2005 Separated since: June 9, 2005 Now in Plan B - headed for D. Praying on God's guidance and support But they that wait upon the LORD shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings as eagles; they shall run, and not be weary; and they shall walk, and not faint.

Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? aussie2 #1438672 07/27/05 01:22 PM
Joined: Jun 2005 Posts: 722 F Fox0r Member
Fox0r Member F Joined: Jun 2005 Posts: 722	Quote Lordy fox thats a long one.... ok first thing before any comment... your plan b thing...did you do a formal plan B with the letter setting out the boundaries that you could accept, MC, etc etc or did you kinda drift into the plan b type of no contact for a while??? Drifted into Plan B - there was no formal letter. It happened because she finally hurt me emotionally so bad on the phone I lost all desire to talk to her. Me 20 WW 20 Friends since: December 10, 1999 Began Dating: October 29, 2003 Married Feb 13, 2004 D-Day: July 28, 2005 Separated since: June 9, 2005 Now in Plan B - headed for D. Praying on God's guidance and support But they that wait upon the LORD shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings as eagles; they shall run, and not be weary; and they shall walk, and not faint.

Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? ba109 #1438673 07/27/05 01:24 PM
Joined: Jun 2005 Posts: 722 F Fox0r Member
Fox0r Member F Joined: Jun 2005 Posts: 722	Quote I did not read the entire exchange but it seems moot to me unless you have outlined some ultimatums for recovery. Until then, she is still jerking your emotional heart strings. What would be good ultimatums to set for recovery in these circumstances? I don't know if there is an OM right now and she says there isn't - I have no proof of one. Me 20 WW 20 Friends since: December 10, 1999 Began Dating: October 29, 2003 Married Feb 13, 2004 D-Day: July 28, 2005 Separated since: June 9, 2005 Now in Plan B - headed for D. Praying on God's guidance and support But they that wait upon the LORD shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings as eagles; they shall run, and not be weary; and they shall walk, and not faint.

Re: WHOA! Wife has a change of heart!!!!!! WHAT!?? KaylaAndy #1438674 07/27/05 01:25 PM
Joined: Jun 2005 Posts: 722 F Fox0r Member
Fox0r Member F Joined: Jun 2005 Posts: 722	Quote She's not ready to be married until she stops with the comments about how much she was hurt by you, and starts recognizing how much she has hurt you and how much she IS hurting you. Plan B pal - Yeah - my favorite part of the conversation was the "I'm not a violent person" joke that she made. I think it was later in the conversation and I didn't post it. She says this, yet she beat me until I bled on two separate occasions...hmm? Me 20 WW 20 Friends since: December 10, 1999 Began Dating: October 29, 2003 Married Feb 13, 2004 D-Day: July 28, 2005 Separated since: June 9, 2005 Now in Plan B - headed for D. Praying on God's guidance and support But they that wait upon the LORD shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings as eagles; they shall run, and not be weary; and they shall walk, and not faint.

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