I found out that my WS and the other M are still communicating, although she claims it’s strictly business and the email confirms it. She originally stated that she would let me know when ever they had contact but has since changed her mind stating I don’t need to know every detail.

She has made it clear that all romantic interests are over but she still has feelings for him. She has also made it clear that if I demand no contact she’ll still have some contact. I’m not sure what the correct course of action should be?

If I’m too harsh, she’ll talk any way and if she is already lying about talking, she might meet the OM and leap to seeing etc…

Allowing contact can be bad for similar reasons, but she might keep me in the loop?

Any suggestions?

As long as contact continues, you can just consider the affair still ON. They will never withdraw from each other and the affair will be on again, off again. The affair is over when contact ends. It's not too harsh to expect your spouse to NEVER EVER contact the OP again, it's the LEAST your W can do to recover your marriage. Your marriage cannot EVER RECOVER until contact ends.

This is why Harley recommends even moving to another state if need be, to end contact.

Thanks ML,

I do agree with you but knowing my wife, she has made it perfectly clear that business is business and he has contact with her company. If I push too hard I’m going to create one big negative LB. Which is my dilemma and such asking for suggestions as to how other people have handled it?

Never see or communicate with a former lover

Once an affair is first revealed, whether it's discovered or admitted, the victimized spouse is usually in a state of shock. The first reaction is usually panic, but it's quickly followed by anger. Divorce and sometimes even murder are contemplated. But after some time passes (usually about three weeks), most couples decide that they will try to pull together and save their marriage.

The one having an affair is in no position to bargain, but he or she usually tries anyway. The bargaining effort usually boils down to somehow keeping the lover in the loop. You'd think that the unfaithful spouse would be so aware of his or her weaknesses, and so aware of the pain inflicted, that every effort would be made to avoid further contact with the lover as an act of thoughtfulness to the stunned spouse. But instead, the unfaithful spouse argues that the relationship was "only sexual" or was "emotional but not sexual" or some other peculiar description to prove that continued contact with the lover would be okay.

Most victimized spouses intuitively understand that all contact with a lover must end for life. Permanent separation not only helps prevent a renewal of the affair, but it is also a crucial gesture of consideration to someone who has been through hell. What victimized spouse would ever want to know that his or her spouse is seeing or communicating with a former lover at work or in some other activity?

In spite of career sacrifices, friendships, and issues relating to children's schooling, I am adamant in recommending that there be no contact with a former lover for life. For many, that means a move to another state. But to do otherwise fails to recognize the nature of addiction and its cure.


http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5060_qa.html

No, it is not a lovebuster to set boundaries, HLR. It is what you are SUPPOSED to do. You need to set boundaries now or prepare yourself for years of on-again, off-again infidelity. If you take the easier, softer way NOW, you will pay dearly because you will die a death of a thousand cuts. Your marriage cannot ever recover until ALL CONTACT has ended.

If it were me, I would express this boundary to her in a very firm manner so that there is no misunderstanding. If she will not end contact, I would suggest exposing the affair at work. If that doesn't end contact, then I would move to Plan B until that is effected.

You will damn yourself to years more of this hell if you settle for crumbs she is offering. Might as well take a tough stand now instead of damning yourself to years of hell.

So take your pick, a little discomfort now or ALOT of discomfort for years to come.

OK..ML..here's where I posted the same issue: link

Now every situation is different. If you established this boundry keep it. If you have not established it... DO SO QUICKLY...

As far as my XW EA at work that went PA AFTER our divorce goes, that died before I rentered the picture. I reference it because it caused me great pain..that is all. We were both with other people during the time frame we were divorced. I was not with someone who once presented themselves as a family friend as her coworker once did...

anyway...I hope it helps...

You'll see Melody repsonded to mine also...she is pretty consistent <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Thanks ML,

Her is my dilemma exposing the A at work would push her over the edge. She has been confiding in me that she has feared that someone there would find out, almost as much as me fining out. The other M is the former COO and very well connected in the industry, her career as a senior level executive would be ruined not only at her current company but any future company in this industry as well. She has worked very hard to achieve her stature, which was done before the other man was at her company.

Back again to my quandary, I believe her, yes I know that sounds funny and for the most part I shouldn’t. But I also know how driven and motivated my wife is. I need to find some middle ground that sets the boundary without forcing her to lie. Because no contact would force her to lie…She has told me that…She also has stated that she has agreed to do everything else I have asked and agrees she can have no face to face meetings but they well be on conference calls and emails, some in a group setting some sent directly to her. They live over 2000 miles apart, but he does travel to our state once a month, so I realize the potential to reignite the A, but wouldn’t pushing her to far have the same affect?

We argued for two days when I found the email, not because it happened mainly because she feels I was holding her hostage and trying to keep her in a jail…Which is something I can’t do.

I need her to trust me and feel safe enough to confide in me…She has expressed her remorse and told me the PA ended months ago. But to me it was just days ago…So now I’m forced to find away to impose limits but keep her as my confidant, friend and lover. What a task…So I’m asking is a middle ground acceptable under these circumstances or do I destroy the rest of her life by putting boundaries that she can’t live by and exposing her at work where she well truly hate me the rest of her life!

So far, I prefer to keep my marriage and find another solution.

Send,I am not sure I am following you, are you recommending that he tolerate her continued contact with the OM?

HL, I think what you are trying to do is not find a "middle ground," but appease your wife in a very unreasonable demand. It is unreasonable of her to ever expect that you would live with her continued contact with the OM. That is just crazy thinking, HL. And what is even more crazy is how willing you are to accept it.

If she were truly interested in ending the affair, she would gladly do so. But she is not. However, since you are willing to live with continued contact, that is all that matters. It is your life to live and you have been forewarned and know that you can expect the affair to continue. That is your choice.

No Mel....

My XW had a PA with someone AFTER we divorced. They had an EA that ended about a year and a half prior to our divorce. at that time I was unaware of NC principles including quitting work. So my point in mentioning that deal at work is that we were divorced when she had a PA with someone that remains in contact with her but ONLY for business. That PA died it's own predictable death before we reconciled. She grew quite angry at the "how are you e-mail" from him...after the NC letter to him..it's all business or she'll have him fired for harrassment....

My posts were in relation to the other guy...I said and meant NC....ever..even though the affair ended long agao..no business..no nothing..

I mention this because my situation doesn't fit the mold.....I'm at MB as a divorced man....recovering with his XW....there's not a bunch of us around <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Does it make any sense??

First let me explain the boundaries I set. I understood there was going to be some group contact, mainly via the phone and some emails. I told her she was to try and have his communications go through another party where possible and inform me of any incidental contact.

I told her as long as she was honest with me, I would try to believe in her again…She was very shocked that she needed to win my trust back. I told her as long as we both are committed to our marriage and IN-LOVE with each other I would help her and try to be understanding.

She had an indirect contact that I saw and blowup about, which inflamed everything. She told me that because how she had been feeling do to some of our current discussions she didn’t want to inflame them by bring up his contact but was trying to find an opportune time. Which is totally in character with what she would do, she knows I can expose at her employer and to our families. Which I told her I would only do if she was no longer honest and they continued personal contact. Her email included business items.

I would be a hypocrite, if I changed my stance a month latter. But, I do want to reinforce the boundaries with out it becoming a LB and another traumatic experience for her. So I’m faced with how to explain the boundaries and when to present them?

Ok, HL, it is NOT a lovebuster to set boundaries. I get the feeling that you think that anything that does not APPEASE the WS is a "lovebuster. " That is not how it works. A lovebuster is:

1. selfish demand
2. angry outburst
3. annoying habit
4. independent behavior
5. dishonesty
6. disrespectful judgement

See, nowhere does it say that being firm in reasonable boundaries, no matter how much they may upset the WS, is a lovebuster. MB is not the Appeasement Program, it is the marital recovery program. And a marriage does not recover from infidelity when the affairees stay in contact.

And contact is contact, whether you call it "business" contact or whether you call it a baloney sandwich. Contact is contact. And Willard Harley, the founder of MB and one of the most successful marriage counselors in the US says:



He never qualified that statement. He didn't say "except when it upsets princess." Or "except when the BS is too chicken to rock the boat." He didn't say "except when it's "business."" He said CONTACT. And contact is contact. And any contact will prevent your marriage from recovery because the affairees will not recover, you will not recover, your marriage will not recover.

Do you imagine that an alcoholic can recover if he just has "business" drinks? Of course he can't. He will never recover unless he has complete abstinence. It is the same with affairs.


This has nothing to do with being "hypocritical." It has everything to do with making a DUMB promise. And the only thing worse than making a dumb promise is keeping a dumb promise. This is a promise that should be broken, HLR.

But, I am not going to say anymore about it, HL. You seem determined to live like this, and like I said before, you are the one who has to live with it. You were forewarned.

Thanks ML,

You gave me a lot to think about!

One last question, if you would ML,

I’m in the mist of changing my career, this all started before D-day.

My choices are:
Choice one; would have me working for the same company as the OM.
Choice two; the other position would not.

The first company is very large; he works out of a different office and division. Meaning I would not see him but would know what projects he is assigned to and if he was in our state.

I am going answer your question with another one.

Why would you want to work for the same company as the OM???

To check up on him? Worry about your wife and you and put the other man out of the picture...You do that with no contact...


I know that I do not ever want to hear of an attempted contact again. While I put on my game face they hurt....and the OM does not ever want to meet me...and he will if he breaks her request...

it's a 7 hour drive (hour flight for his private jet)...either way I'm still going to be really pissed off when I see him...

Agree with Send, why would you want to be perpetually reminded of him?

First off let say I’m no longer threated by him and I’m a much better man than he is!

As for working at the same company, I have been in the market for the last two months and my discovery slowed down my process. My former boss works for the same company and asked me in for an interview. Like I said the OM is in another area of the country and I would have no contact.

So I really wanted to get your opinion.

It’s a very senior level position, but until I receive an offer it won’t matter.

Gotcha! Thanks for the clarification! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I don't understand the Quote?

HLR,

Weren't you going to expose to OM's W? Did I miss the fireworks from that?

So your W's career is more important than her marriage? Sounds like it.

She is doing her own version of cake-eating.

k