Our MC has given me materials on forgiveness. Just to add some of the finer details, our MC is licensed and is part of a Christian counseling center so forgiveness carries with it the Christian view of forgiveness as well as the secular. My WH and I are both Christians, active in our church.

So, one of the exercises I have been encouraged to do is journal using the prompt "I am beginning to think I can forgive you because..." Only problem is that I am not ready to forgive. I pray about this multiple times daily and I truly love my WH. I have spent the 2 months since DDay working very hard on changing myself to meet his EN.

I am chagrined at even posting this here because the injury I have experienced is small potatoes indeed compared to some of the hurts suffered by some of you. So why can't I forgive? I have not gotten to the place of hardening my heart against WH, which would be a tragedy and a sin IMHO. I just can't move on.

Does anyone have something - a book, a technique, a certain perspective - that allowed you to forgive your FWS?

Eaglesoar,

Here is a thread on forgiveness I want you to read (just click on the link). It’s an extraction from a book e.g. ”The trap of forgiveness”. Many BS’s have posted to that thread. The bottom line is that forgiveness is important, but people should do it at the conclusion – not at the beginning – of their emotional housecleaning. People need to first get angry about what happened to them. They need to grieve over what happened. The above thread will give you more insight.

What you're going through right now is perfectly normal. You need to give yourself time & patience.

Blessings,
Suzet

Hi eagle!

I don't think you can rush forgiveness. I think that during your healing process you eventually reach forgiveness but I see it as the last stage.

I discovered my H's A on 6/20/03 and just forgave him on 7/13/05. I worked through my anger, pain, and co-dependency issues for the past two years. I am happy that I was finally able to forgive him.

I am also a Christian. I know I struggled a lot...especially in the last year...with forgiveness. I felt I was taking too long. As Christians we are taught to forgive others as Jesus forgives us <immediately>. Do you feel the same way?

But I've realized that during my healing process, I had to be able to forgive myself first (for my past sins) and work through my issues in regards to my H's drinking and A's before I could forgive him.

Since your d-day is just 5/19/05, it seems like a rush to forgiveness at this date. Have you truly had time to work through your pain?

Take care.

sss

Suzet,

Many many thanks for the link to that thread. I now understand my reluctance. I have no need or desire for vengeance, and my WH has expressed remorse for hurting me, but he hasn't taken responsibility and therein lies the rub.

Dear SSS,

Yes, I agree totally that I feel compelled to forgive because it is what we are to do as disciples of Jesus. Also, as I mentioned, our MC is part of a Christian counseling service and I feel she is pushing me to forgive as well.

Thank you for the affirmation that right now may not be the right time and that I still have work to do.

Our sermon at church yesterday was abut forgiveness. Our pastor emphasized the Christian duty of the victim to forgive his debtor. There was no mention of what the duty of the transgressor was. Needless to say, WH was very happy with sermon topic, is convinced he has nothing he needs to do for me to forgive him because after all, that is what Ephesians 4 says, and I am unfairly withholding forgiveness from him.

We discussed this today in MC and counselor tends to agree with WH. I am feeling a little pressured here, especially since after counseling, my WH asked me to explain to him tonight my "novel theory" on why the debtor has any needs to make amends in order to be forgiven.

Okay folks. I really don't feel like I'm just being stubborn here but if I need to be hit by a 2X4, let me have it.

Hi eagle!

Was wondering how you were doing.

You are not withholding anything from your H...forgiveness is for you.

Our pastor just had a sermon a couple of weeks ago about forgiveness and he spoke of when a person never forgives, it eats away at them like cancer. In fact, my H gave his testimony at this service...just prior to the pastor's sermon. His testimony was about the fact that it took him 50 YEARS to forgive his mother for abandoning him and leaving their family when he was 12 years old. This anger, resentment and pain caused my H to act out in many ways...he drank (to bury his feelings) and had A's (trying to fill up the hole in his heart left by his mother).

H's unforgiveness wasn't eating his mother alive, but was eating him alive.

The way I interpret scripture about forgiveness is to forgive as quickly as possible...or as soon as you can. And forgive as many times as it takes. HOWEVER, your 'quickly as possible' may not be right now...but after you've worked through the shock, anger, pain, etc. of being betrayed. And, it can take as long as two years or more to work through all of the grief stages you'll go through because of your H's betrayal.

If you forgive too quickly due to pressure or because "it's the right thing to do", I believe you'll end up even more angry and resentful because you did not allow yourself time to heal.

AND, in everything that I've read about forgiveness...the adulterer is key in you being able to forgive him. Being remorseful and making amends is key to your healing and the ability to be able to forgive him.

Forgiveness is for YOU, not your H! You have to be ready to let the past/A go knowing that it's a debt that can never be repayed. And, in my experience, that only comes after working through the betrayal.

I wonder...is your MC telling you not to ask any questions about your H's A also?

I'll check in tonight with the names of some good books about forgiving. Maybe it will help you and your H (plus MC) to read them together.

Take care.

sss

Dear SSS

Thanks for the post and the offer of book titles. I would be very interested in those. If I could get WH to read it with me (or any "relationship book" for that matter) I would be very happy.

The MC has not suggested I not ask questions about the A, it is more that WH resists talking about it. Today in MC, he said it was "looking back" too much and he wants to look forward. He said he really doesn't have anything else or new to say about it and doesn't see the benefit of continuing to bring it up. MC gently tried to urge him to put up with my desire to talk about it.

And actually, this all ties back in to WH not considering his A to be that bad becuase it was not physical and did not violate his own internal moral line in the sand. (He doesn't consider his actions to be infidelity because it wasn't physical.)

So, he is sorry he hurt me and feels terrible for my pain but doesn't think he has anything to make up for. I can't move on because I feel he's minimizing the injury he caused.

OK (((ES))) let's cut to the bottom line here, what do you feel that you need in order to forgive?

eaglesoar, I don't think your issue is one of forgiveness, you seem perfectly willing to do that, but one of "forgetting." And forgetting is impossible. You can't turn off a switch and not be wounded anymore. That is unrealistic. You must go through the grieving process in order to recover from any traumatic assault.

That will take alot of time and work on the part of your H. He can help you recover by answering all your questions. He owes you that much. Just his willingness to do that will go along way in your recovery and in rebuilding trust.

So, please explain to him that a) it will take 12-24 months for you to recover and b) that is in the best scenario with him being as open and honest as possible with you.

Suzet hit it dead on, you are trying to bypass the grieving process here. Recovery won't come until you go through all the grief phases.

You may want to read, and have your H read, Torn Asunder by Dave Carder. In fact, tell your MC to read it.

There is a very good section in the book on the process of forgiveness of an affair. Carder shows that it takes a while and properly comes only after your anger has been completely processed. In general, in his experience, forgivness takes as long for the BS to process as the WS was in the affair.

Sheesh, in my case that will be 10 years...

BTW, Carder also has a Christian outlook on all this.

ES,

""because the injury I have experienced is small potatoes indeed compared to some of the hurts suffered by some of you.""

You should not think your hurt, pain, and grief are less than others. All BSs have our open chest wounds and the obssesive poison flooding our brains. We all feel that pain acutely.

""Only problem is that I am not ready to forgive.""

Of course you're not!! And you shouldn't.

A very wise MBer said that there are two types of forgiveness, one with your head (logically) and one with your heart (emotionally).

We can logically see the reasons for the A and how "maybe" we hold some responsibility for it and "forgive" from our brains...but the betrayal and pain is much harder to forgive from our heart, which is actually still beating in the WS's hand after being torn from our chest!

It is the emotional forgiveness which will take much time. This forgiveness goes hand in hand with trust, which was also shattered.

YOU HAVE TO HEAL BEFORE YOU CAN FORGIVE.

Your MC can ask you to forgive, but until she has walked a mile in your mocassins, she doesn't realize what she is asking for.

k

TIME!!! I'm not even close to wanting to forgive my STBX. That could take the rest of my life to get there. I wish you the best!

Here's something I posted a while ago,
Hope it helps.

from:

FORGIVENESS THERAPY


l2Y: David W. Schell


1.


Forgiveness means being strong enough to withstand the heavy weight of injury but resilient enough to recover.

Life is often unfair. Forgive life's inevitable failures.

Forgive yourself: for not being fully yourself and for being only yourself.

Out of self-forgiveness comes the power to extend forgiveness to others.

You have the right to feel sad, betrayed,angry, resentful-when- you've been injured. Understand, accept, and express your feelings. Pushing them below the surface only means they will erupt in
another place, at another time. .

Confront those who have hurt you; tell them how you feel or speak to them in your imagination.

Forgiveness does not mean accepting further abuse. Establish boundaries.

Justice may right the wrongs, but forgiveness heals the hurt.

Sometimes people hurt you because, like you, they are learning and growing.

To refuse to forgive is to continue to hurt yourself.

Recognize how you've refused to forgive.

Victims are helpless, at the mercy of the offender. Take charge by forgiving.

Know that forgiveness is possible even when someone doesn't seem to deserve forgiveness.

Forgiveness is the only real prescription for the pain you feel over someone else's behavior.

Think of forgiveness as a powerful survival skill.

If you find it hard to forgive your parents, remember: they were shaped by the imperfect parenting they received from parents who were shaped by their own parenting, and so on and so on ...

Forget about forgetting an injury.

Forgiveness sterilzes the wound, which permits healing, which releases energy for growth.

No loving relationship is free of hurts.

No offense is unforgivable--unless you make it so.

When you are having a difficult time forgiving, recall a moment when you wanted to be forgiven.

Forgiveness takes practice.

Forgiveness is a lifelong process. Forgive over and over--even for the same offense.

Forgiveness may seem futile when you see no immediate results.

No one can make you feel bad. Take responsibility for your feelings; claim your power.

You cannot change someone for the better by holding a grudge.

Ask yourself whether "I can't forgive" means "I won't forgive".

Forgiveness takes courage and determination.

Allow forgiveness to open the door.

Past offenses can be bulldozed and buried and a better life built atop the debris.

Don't put conditions on your forgiveness, or your inner peace will depend on the decision of the person who hurt you.

When someone won't forgive you, refusing to forgive in return is no answer.

To help you forgive, picture the other person surrounded by the light of God. See yourself stepping into that same light, and feel God's presence with you both.

Forgive even when there has been no apology or restitution.

Forgiveness is not something you do for someone else;. it is something you do for yourself. Give
yourself the gift of forgiveness.
* * * * * * * * * * *
Who is/are the person(s) that 1 find difficult to forgive?
Do 1 want to forgive him/her/them?
What will be my first step towards forgiveness?
Am 1 truly aware of the fact that forgiving someone does NOT mean allowing abusive behavior to continue?
To forgive someone else is to give myself a gift.

JUST A THOUGHT FOR THOSE WHO MAY BE NEEDING THIS RIGHT NOW!
all blessings,
Jerry

--------------------
We can only be all that He wants us to be, after we die to ourself.

Matthew 6:14-15, "For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses."

Mark 11:25-26 (Amplified) "And whenever you stand praying, if you have anything against anyone, forgive him and let it drop--leave it, let it go--in order that your Father Who is in heaven may also forgive you your (own) failings and shortcomings and let them drop. But if you do not forgive, neither will your Father in heaven forgive your failings and shortcomings."

These verses are perhaps some of the least applied Scriptures in the Kingdom of God. Somehow, many of us are deceived into thinking that we do not have to take them literally. However, Jesus emphasized this principal over and over again in His parables and teachings. If we receive God's forgiveness, it is our duty to forgive those who have wronged us. The two are inseparable. Jesus said plainly that God will not forgive us, if we do not forgive others. Many Christians are full of condemnation and guilt because they still feel the weight of their sins, even though they've asked God to forgive them. Could it be that they have not been able to receive God's forgiveness because they still have bitterness in their own hearts toward others? Sometimes, we may carry bitterness and hurt so long, that we no longer even recognize it as a problem. It becomes a part of our very nature. We may not scheme for revenge, but our souls are clouded with a quiet, persistent bitterness.

Some of us have been betrayed in devastating ways, and have suffered profoundly at the hand of abusive people. Others have been horribly mistreated by those of other races, nations, and religions. If you are suffering with deep unhealed wounds, know the Lord has also been hurt with your pain. He loves you and wants to heal you. It is because of His great love for you that He is calling you to forgive. It is your only release from the emotional prison that you are now in.

You do not have to live in a continual state of submission to evil emotions. You can be free of them, through the power of the cross. "Behold, I make all things new" says the Lord. You can be made new on the inside, and no longer staggering under a load of bitterness, hatred, pain, and depression. God wants to set you free right now!

Dear Bill,

Thanks for the question. I want my WH to acknowledge that while he didn't think this was such a big deal to him, it is a VERY big deal to me. Every time I am upset by a trigger, I want him to understand that I am still in pain and be patient with me as I go through this.

Also, I am still so frightened by the thought of going through this again. My dear WH says he was feeling totally worthless which is why he started his internet affair. He wanted anyone to chat with him which would make him feel better.

His internet affair corresponded with a period where I planned a special anniversary vacation for us - our first trip alone without the kids in about 15 years - the stated purpose of the trip was for us to get away from distractions, reconnect, renew our love, etc. Our first night away we had a romantic dinner and spent the entire time holding hands, speaking of our love for one another, laughing, talking and reminiscing. The next day, our 21st anniversary, my WH went down to the hotel lobby to use their internet connection to accept an invitation to a "date" from his internet OW. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

So, my efforts to show my WH how much I loved him, wanted him, needed him were fairly well rejected. And he continued to hide all this until I discovered it.

During the entire time he was hiding his A and writing rather mean things about me to OW and half the known world, he still said "I love you" to me frequently.

So how do I know he means "I love you" now when I thought he meant it then? He won't lie to me when I ask him a direct question, but won't volunteer anything. His motives, his feelings then and now, his plans for OUR future are as much a mystery to me today as they were on DDay.

Thanks for that Shinethrough~~~~~

all i can say is that i wish i had been able to forgive faster and learn from the experience what I could do differently.

i held onto anger and did not forgive.

i wasted time and an opportunity to rebuild.

i hope no-one makes the same mistakes that i did.

i suggest asking yourself:
Do i love this person?
Do i want to have a relationship with them?
Do i see any way i can do this without forgiving them?

nothing makes an affair right. but understanding how it came about made it easier for me to forgive and put it behind us.

good luck



a

Bill:

Thank you for the scripture passages. In fact, the Matthew verses were part of what our pastor spoke on yesterday.