Today I did exactly what all of the divorce buster style
experts advice against.
I went to see my ex to ask him if he was having any kind of an affair,emotional or otherwise.
I wasn't in an angry mood.I did however cry and talk about how I felt,the relationship etc.
I did ask my partner if he would give me a chance to see if we could work it out.
I did accept responsibility for the things I now realise I did wrong or could have done better.

He kept saying he was sorry but his mind was made up.I gave him a long hug and we both cried.
I left feeling destroyed and cried for hours.

Tonight I decided to call his long term female friend because I thought perhaps she might indicate to me if there was anything going on between them.(I saw her number on the phone account).
Luckily she was very friendy(I approached her in like manner),I suggested she didn't have to talk to me but it would help me if she did.I thanked her for her time.

I then called my ex to tell him that I was so hurt that he had called her staight away to tell her he was now single.
I wasn't angry but very direct and strong and said I now know for certain that I must move on completely.
Sell our business,cut all ties and move from the area so I don't have to see him ever again.
I told him this is what my counselor suggested.That I needed to do in order to move on.( a slight bluff).

Instead of him saying.......if that's what you need to do etc.

He said I had it all wrong and that after being with me today he realised that it felt good and he enjoyed my company.
He had been feeling lonely and it reminded him of how nice it was sometimes to be with me,especially the hug.

Anyway he asked me to give him a few days to rethink things.He said he would ring me.
I said it was ok,take your time and maybe contact me after you go on your sking trip(in about a week).
I told him it would do him good to go on a holiday and I was hoping to go on one with my daughter when I felt a bit better.

He started talking about his sore kneee and his worry about it.....I listened and showed concern.
We left it at that and I said it felt good to be friends and not fight......I called him by his nick name to help remind even though we had problems we used affectionate names for each other.

Ok so I broke all the rules and guess what it felt good.
I think it was the hug and I also stroked his hand gently(he always liked my soft touch).
I admitted that I too had room for improvement and was willing to do my share of work.

Who knows what will happen,we still might be over but at least I followed my instincts and gave it one last effort.

Wish me luck,you guys.
I need to brush up and how to handle it if he asks me for lunch or something...........slow down I'm getting ahead of myself.

Love BrandyB

It could be good news....or he could be "Cake Eating". Letting you and someone else meet his Emotional Needs. Why would he want to give that up? As many have suggested...first do a Plan A where you try to meet his needs and refrain from Love Busters. He will see what he is giving up. If he doesn't come around, you go to Plan B where you don't meet any of his needs at all. You remove yourself from him so you don't lose any more of you love for him.
If you have already done Plan A, then it may be time to move to Plan B otherwise he will just have two women meeting his needs.

One of the last things I did was say my peace to my WW. I told her how I really felt about what she had done to me. I needed to do this to voice my feelings to her and gain closure. My WW used to call me during the day as well, or send me text messages, voicing concerns about her job etc. I realized that she still needed me to fulfill her needs, because I was always attentive and listened. It reached a point where I had to end contact with her in order for me to move on. Once contact ended, my WW all of a sudden started going through the grieving process that I had/am still going through.

BrandyB, I would say that your WH is cake eating as well. He still needs you to fulfill his needs that he has. During this time WS’s are extremely selfish and it’s really easy to get mixed signals. My WW would tell me she missed me, loved me, etc. but still didn’t want to get back together or try an recover our marriage. She was still heavily involved in her affair. Perhaps your husband will truly have a change of heart. If he is having an affair though, it will be impossible for him to do so.

Slowing down is a great idea. He's got some work to do on himself before the two of you can work on your relationship. He's changing his mind 180 degrees in the span of a few hours, which can only mean he's confused or he's manipulating you. If he asks you to lunch, and wants to discuss reconciliation, there should only be one take away goal from the meeting: that the two of you immediately enter marital therapy and do the preliminary work with the therapist to identify problems that need to be resolved and to formulate a reconciliation plan. All too often, couples in trouble try to forego this vital step and they almost invariably fail.

He is not having an affair,not of any kind so it's not the cake and eat it too situation,there is no way I'd be into that and he knows it.

I was on a high last night but woke up this morning after not getting much sleep feeling less optimistic.Today I feel really down again.
I'm so scared that he will think about us and maybe even talk to the wrong person and ring me in a couple of days and say he has decided to stick with his original decision
of leaving me.

I realise that there is no way we could go forward without some help and a fair amount of work on both sides.

If he thinks that I'll be doing all of the changing,well it's not going to be.
He is already in therapy for anger mangement and his pot addiction.

As for couples counseling,I think it would be too early to push this even though at some point it would have to happen.

Anyway,I don't think he will want to try again.I don't know what happened yesterday?
He seemed so convinced that we were beyond help,not that we have ever seen a good counselor(rare as they are).
Yesterday he said for the first time since he left he saw a glimmer of hope.
He seems to have a few of those relationship myths that Dr Phil mentions...........like people have to have things in common etc.

So now I'm just waiting for that phone call I don't want to get.
I can't stand the thought of going straight back into the grieving process,the pain has almost killed me and honestly if he says no again I will have to finally let go something that has been impossible for me to do so far.

Part of me wishes I could be strong enough to say look if you can't see I'm worth hanging onto and fighting for then screw you.
I'm not that strong.

I did have a dream the other night that we were back as couple being loving............only in my dreams I guess.

He also said he wanted to think about us because he doesn't want to give me false hope.
Yes he is confused.Keeping my distance made him realise it wasn't going to be as easy as he thought to move on.
At the same time,he knows he can do it.

Love BrandyB

Brandy, People who have been there and made the mistakes are giving you there best advice, but I'm not sure you are hearing.

He left you and he's been toying with your heart. (yes, he has) If he decides he wants to come back, it has to be for the right reasons. And, yes, you most assuredly do push on therapy. You don't take him back without it. Period. He doesn't get to make the rules on this.

I'll make another suggestion. Given his on-again-off-again whatever it is he's doing right now, I wouldn't meet with him today. I'd tell him that he needs to take some time and carefully consider what he wants. Not one or two days, but a couple of weeks. During that time, there should be no contact between the two of you, and if you must communicate, your relationshi is a forbidden topic. Then when it's time, the two of you meet and discuss what it is you want and how you going to go about making that happen.

Read you posts again. His waffling has rubbed off on you and it's hurting you.

BTW, I don't know if you use the word "councelor" as a catch-all phrase for a psychotherapist, but there are two types of help you can get for your marriage: a councelor and a therapist. The former doesn't require a great deal of training, and can be useful in addressing minor marital problems. But the scope of their practice is limited to giving advice. When a marriage is on the verge of dissolution, the underlying problems are nearly always beyond their training. In such cases, a marital therapist, someone witha PhD in psychology, examined and licensed by the state to practice clinical psychology, and with specialized training in marital psychology is a must. Unfortunately, in some areas such resources are not available, so you have to go with what you have. But choose carefully. Some marriage councelors are not pro-marriage.

Thank you,I do appreciate the help and support that is offered to me here.
Particularly you checkurheart <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
I realise I may not be handling this in the best fashion but with my pain,fear and feelings of low self esteem I'm dong the best I can which I know is not that well mostly.

I'm confused as I read Michelle Davis's book last night(Divorce Remedy).She suggests not to push for therapy straight away to wait and let the other person have their space,take their time and see if in the near future you can both agree to go into therapy.

When my partner said he would ring me.
I did say why not wait until after you come back from your holiday,which would have been after 2 weeks.
I think this surprised him to see I wasn't pressuring him he said no he would ring before then,he would only need a few days.

I feel that I'm walking on a very fine line.
It felt like an amazing breakthrough that this man even gave one ounce of consideration to a possible reconciliation.

I know that it is not for me to say what is best for another person but after doing a fair amount of reading about divorce I can see where my partner's thinking is one very sided.
He does not believe that we can be helped or that we can help ourselves,he thinks our reltionship has too much bad history that can never be repaired.

Once again I didn't sleep last night.I kept imagining when he calls it will only be tell me that he is still not willing to consider any form of reconciliation.
I think with him,time to think only means that he will keep telling himself the same old story that he will be happier without me and that our relationship was the cause of his misery.

Thanks people,you have all been so wonderful and kind.
I wish you all find the love you want one day.

Love BrandyB

It's been 3 days and no phone call <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />
I figure at this stage he doesn't want to call me because he doesn't won't have to listen to my dissapointment and cause me more pain.

I'd say he's had enough time to think and is sticking to his original decision.

I believe for him,with absence the heart actually detaches further.

I really can't take this,I've been so anxious.
I try not to wait for the phone to ring but I do and everytime i pick it up my heart sinks.

I'm a mess,I want this man back in my life so badly and yet I try not to want him back.........why can't I close my heart down?

Love BrandyB

No, I wouldn't think that three days is long enough. It sure took more than three days to get into this mess didn't it? So it will should take more than three days to decide. In any event, you aren't a mind reader and you really have no idea what he's thinking just now. Never assume, but act only on facts.

Give him a bit more time. However, I will say that he told you he'd call you in a few days. Even if he hasn't made up his mind and wants more time, he should keep his promises. At the very least he's being disrespectuful and inconsiderate of your feelings. Too damned bad if he doesn't want to hear your disappointment; be a man and live with it. When you cause others pain, you can't run away from the discomfort you feel as a result.

In the meantime, you do not contact him. He's the one who's crawled into his cave to think, so he must be the one to come to you.

In the meantime, you need to start getting yourself to a mental place where YOU can make the decision to let this relationship go and move on. It's possible he's not going to be able to do this, but will leave you hanging in anxious limbo. You cannot live like that; it's horribly unhealthy. If you can't do this alone, go get some help doing it.

thank you once again checkurheart,
hey mate I don't know if anybody has ever told you this but you are a very caring, unselfish person.
Not to mention clear headed and practical <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />I am very grateful that you have reached out to whinging stranger as myself to offer support.

I will not call him.

There is no doubt that I am not moving on.I just can't let go.
I speak with a relationship counselor by phone every so often.
He tries to encourage me.He told me to keep reminding myself that the reason my ex is leaving me,the way he speaks and actc are all due to his extreme self centredness.
Which is true as his own sister described him in the exact same manner.
The phone councelor tries to get me to focus on the negative aspects of our reltionship and all the areas where this man was treating me poorly.
There is no doubt that he was,it's not just sour grapes.

Some how this doesn't make the pain any easier.I get angry for awhile and then I feel more pain because I feel that I put up with so much......too much and yet he left me?
More so I recall all of good times,the times when we were close and loving.....dumb of me I know.

He said the other day that being in a relationship with me was killing him............oh pleeese!this kinda talk does my head in.
Must women who witnessed his cruel and selfish behaviour toward me would suggesed that this man must be making my health worse.

Well he has now.I've been so much more ill since he left due to the stress,so ill I've had to spend most of the time in bed.
I have been in a great deal of physical pain,ear infections and another pain condition I have that has flared up.
This morning as I woke at 4 am in pain,I felt so angry that he would soon be going on a nice holiday with his friends while I can't even make it out of bed to see a doctor.
I felt so angry I wanted to hurt him back.
So I lay awake fantasising about taking him to court and claiming half of is money and property...........boy would that give him a few months of sleepless nights.
My lawyer said that due to my ill health and not being able to work if we sell our business,the courts would most likely grant me more than half.

Hurt,anger,grief around and around.........yucko,this sucks.

Ok going to ring the doctor today and leave the house,good for me huh?

Love BrandyB

You are, of course, most welcome. I'm going to suggest you change a modal verb in your thinking. You say you can't move on. This isn't true and you know it isn't. Instead, tell yourself that you won't move on. "Can't" means that it isn't in you to take this action. "Won't" means you're not ready yet. Never tell yourself you cannot do something, since you defeat yourself before you even try.

My update,
Spoke with ex yesterday on the phone(he called me)to mostly discuss some business.
I probably should not have but I did ask if there was anything else he wanted to talk to me about..........after all I'd been waiting days to know what all this thinking of his produced.

He talked about his personal struggles,I listened.I didn't talk about mine or me.
He is seeing 2 therapists and a psychiatrist.He is sincere about getting off pot and sincere about trying to control his anger.He is doing it for himself,which I guess is the right reason.
He said that he had been thinking and had decided that he was almost certain that he wanted to look into giving our relationship another try.
I saw him briefly at work,for the first time in a couple of months he reached out and stroked my arm,looking a bit scared and a bit sad.
He still needs more time,which I totally agree with.
He said he will talk to me again before he goes on his holiday next week.

I am not as dperessed as I was.I can see some hope but I'm very very scared and have some reservations.

At some point I am going to have to let him know that he needs to do some major changing as well as myself.
I'm not sure if he is thinking that finally I have come to my senses and I will change.

Yesterday a young women who works for me spoke about my relationship.She was very sweet and tried to comfort me.
Everybody who knows me admits,he was not treating me with respect.
My ex husband(we are friends) told me that everyone who he has spoken to assumes I had left him(current ex)and had all wondered what took me so long.

This is my delima.
Yes I want the relationship to work and I'm willing to do my part and accept the areas I need to work on.
No I'm not willing to put up with ongoing anger,verbal abuse,controlling behaviour and lack of compromise.
I will not be anyone's door mat.
I do not want to spend the rest of my life with a man who people wonder why on earth I put up with.
I don't want to put up with any longer,I'm too tired for wars.

Love BrandyB

He must not be missing me because he hasn't called again.
He said he would before he went on his holiday which is soon.
I'm trying to keep busy and not wait for his call but I'm getting angry and sad.

I so much would love to spend a little time together,no heavy relationship talks,just a little light chat or to just listen to what he's going through but he obviously isn't feeling the desire to be with me <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I'm so afraid that he will change his mind and say it's off again.
I know it's best to give him time and space to work it out but I also feel that we can't move on or heal if we don't at the very least see one another for short periods and try to simply be pleasant.
I feel what he is doing to me is cruel even though I'm sure he doesn't think so.
He has left me hanging and it is making me sad.I'm losing hope again because he's not giving me any.

I know I'm not to call him,it feels like the hardest thing I've ever had to do.

I'm struggling with anger and depression again.I want more contact but I'm too scared to ask in case he feels pressured.

Love BrandyB

You are still assuming what he is thinking, when you don't really have any idea, Brandy.

He's already told you it's off, but also that he's waffling on it. I think that, inasmuch as he didn't tell you that he was going to do, no contact, his lack of contact at this juncture is pretty much an indication that he's made his mind up. He could at least have had the decency to tell you and not leave you hanging.

Brandy, I think you may need to pull the trigger on this yourself. By that, I mean that you need to decide now whether you really want to go forward with a man who has so little regard for your feelings and health that he would ever think about treating you this way, much less actually do it. You say you believe that what he is doing is cruel. Do you want a life with a cruel man? I know I would have told a woman doing this to me that I'm finished.

He IS NOT involved with your moving on and healing. That's your job. You really need to get some help if you are becoming depressed. Sorry, dear, but you aren't a toy that can be cast to the back of the closet for possible future play. It's time to end this relationship and move on. You're putting control of your life into the hands of someone who doesn't seem to care.

Another update,
We talked,he does want to try again.He suggested couples counseling.
He agrees we should take it slowly and talk more when he gets back from his holiday.
He wants me to stay over at his house for a couple of nights when he gets back.
He agrees we both have some work to do because he wants things to change for the better.

Who knows,I guess like anybody else we can only do our best.
Both of us want the realtionship to work so that's a big move forward.

Love BrandyB

"We talked,he does want to try again."

Not TRY, but DO. A red flag.

"He suggested couples counseling."

To accomplish what stated goal?

"He agrees we should take it slowly and talk more when he gets back from his holiday."

No. If he's serious about his relationship with you, and knows it's in trouble, he cancels his holiday trip and gets to work with the woman he loves. This one's a major red flag for me. Expect a flip-flop unpon his return.

"He wants me to stay over at his house for a couple of nights when he gets back."

Absolutely not. Is this "taking it slowly"? No booty calls until much later in the reconciliation process. Talk about having his cake and eat it too! "Yeah, honey, I've broken your heart and made you ill, but maybe I want a chance to do so again. Now, I'm going to take a little holiday and when I get back, you can come over and spend the night with me. Dismissed."

"He agrees we both have some work to do because he wants things to change for the better."

What are these "things"? What are some of the core issues that brought you to this state? You may not be able to express them all, but you should be able to for the more serious ones. How is HE willing to change for the better? How are YOU willing to change?

I hope for all the best, Brandy. Yet something still doesn't seem right. This sound more like the lame "let's get some counciling and give it one last try" exit strategy my ex (and so many others) use to ease their guilt. The have no real intention of saving the marriage, but they want to be able to tell their friends/family that they tried everything. I hope this isn't the case for you and that in a few weeks you give us a happy report.