CheckUR, you assume I'm upset. I'm not. Never have been. You haven't seen me in person, heard my tone of voice, etc. So how do you reach your conclusion? Projecting?

You made numerous evolutionary statements including numbers & the traditional "book values" and tennants that one can read everywhere in core evolution texts. That isn't "addressing the theory of evolution?"

I would recommend you go back & reread your own words before you accuse me of things you are actually doing.

Let's just drop this. You aren't listening apparently. I'm not wanting to hijack this guys thread any more. It isn't going anywhere.

Big Guy! That's a good one I've laughed over too. Well, since a belly button is a direct byproduct of human birth, and since the Creator said He made us with His own hands, I would doubt Adam or Eve had them. Only humans to not have them apparently.

The amazing thing is that one day, in my mind, if we follow God's path to eternal life, I believe you & I can have the incredulous opportunity to actually SEE for yourself the answer to your very question. It ought to be stunning to behold!!!

And a specific apology to Jimmy for jumping on your thread. My original response was to you alone. Then my fellow MB'er CheckUr directed his words to me & it went into a discussion between us as you can read for yourself. Sorry!

Best,
High Flight

If I might interject: evolution is about how man evolved from a more primitive mammalian species. It is NOT about cultural development pre-Christianity. It is NOT about sociology. You may want to re-think your stance, High Flight, at least your terminology. Check is right in stating that he is not arguing about evolution. He IS however, arguing about something that science thinks they have proven but some Christians choose to believe otherwise about. Each side has its right to opinion and each its merits in some respects. Neither is absolute. You can no more "prove" your claims than Darwin could prove his. Stalemate.

CS

You are exactly right, CS. Science and religion often find the same truths. It's a case where religion asks why and science asks how. The two approaches compliment one another and give us a deeper understanding of who we are and how we came to be this way.

CS ~ I appreciate your attempt to clarify. However, I must respectfully disagree with you when you say Checkur was not using evolutionary tennants to support his statements. Let me give you a sample quote from an earlier post of his:

""The speicies Homo sapiens, however has been on the Earth for over 60,000 years. This isn't a "theory" (as you use the word, which is not the same as a scientific theory), but established fact. There was no such concept of marriage way back then. So I don't assume, I know it as a fact.

One must understand the biology that gave rise to the sociology of love and ultimately our modern concept of marriage.""

He chose to use terminology here that is straight from evolution's tenants. Moreover he concludes that one must "understand the biology that gave rise to the sociology..."

Sounds like he's linking his BIOLOGICAL evolutionary understanding to sociology & culture to me.

Your conclusion that no one can prove his position because neither is absolute is EXACTLY what I've espoused all along. It takes faith to be an evolutionist. It takes faith to be a Creationist. It is Checkur that has continued to pound away that his position (based on evolutionary theory) is correct and apparently in his mind based on provable fact = absolute. It is not - just as you agree.

Therefore, I merely wanted to point out in my original post to Jimmy that in my opinion, one cannot expect to have truly intimate sex outside the institution of marriage. Why? According to the Divine Creation Account, Sex did NOT pre-exist marriage. And the marriage covenant relationship is the only safe place given to us by our Creator in which to experience His gift of sex. In short: monkeys didn't invent sex....GOD INVENTED SEX!!

I simply ask two questions: When did the first marriage take place in recorded human history? And WHO performed the first marriage ceremony?

I agree that religion and science can co-exist, indeed DO - given the right mindset. In fact, I say that TRUE science & religion MUST find the same truths. However, when you choose to espouse a point of view that plainly violates the tenants of Creation, and you advance as truth something that has not been proven, you do violence to BOTH science AND religion.

Regards,
High Flight

High Flight, you truly do not understand that you are not in any way talking about the same thing I am talking about. This ismply is not about the theory of evolution and your insistence that is is doesn't make you any more correct. You yourself have suggested that this be dropped and you most assuredly have highjack this thread. So why won't you drop it?

One final note this and then I will not repond to you further. I have not in any way forced my viewpoint on you or anyone else. I mererly stated it and you went off. Read your own posts very carefully. It is you who is forcing your religious view on us. I do not judge them, since they are yours and you have a right to them. Why can you not show me the same respect? Especially when you do not know what my religious views, which, BTW, I also will not discuss here, as this is not a religious forum.

HOW DID THIS TURN INTO A SCIENCE VS. GOD THING?

BACK TO THE POINT.

Sex w/X is stupid. Plainly stupid.

It can confuse the kids.

It can keep you from moving on with your life as it is intimacy at a "safe" level.

It can hold you back and keep you from wanting something else...or you could catch something from a former WS...with the mentality still of a WS.

I refuse to sleep with my xh. Not even if we both wanted to b/c my brain might be forced to switch onto the "on" position...

Let the x go find themselves a Fbuddy. Do you really need a fbuddy?

If you're looking for an answer rather than a debate (that will go nowhere), here's the answer.

SLEEPING WITH YOUR X IS A WASTE OF TIME, EMOTION, ORGASM, AND INTIMACY. BEEN THERE, DONE THAT...BOUGHT THE TSHIRT...AND TRYING TO RETURN THE DAMN TSHIRT OK?

Er... so do monkeys get married before they have sex?? Naughty naughty naughty monkeys...

Checkur,

1. Your own choice of words refute yourself. All it takes is a simple read-through.

2. It takes 2 to hijack a thread & have you noticed who the other is besides me? I responded to Jimmy. You responded to me NOT Jimmy. You've written back to me just as many posts as have I. It's above in black & white. Read it.

3. I'm the one who uses the words "in my opinion" not you. Therefore I haven't forced anyone to accept my religious views. I've clearly & repeatedly stated it's a theory vs a theory & each of us makes a choice. You've NEVER said that one time - so who's pushing their view on who?

4. I'm glad you're through responding. I am through as well.

I don't wish you any harm, only a good & continued recovery.

Peace,
High Flight

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> ~ High Flight

God invented sex, but monkeys invented Hot Monkey Sex.

JimmyBoy,

Here is my question to you? Would you pay for sex? If so then you might as well still have the f sessions with your ex-wife because it is cheaper and you consider sex just a physical thing anyway. However, if you would feel guilt from paying for sex then you attach emotion with sex and having sex with your ex will prevent you from truly moving on emotionally. Moving on emotionally is what this site should be all about (though it is pigeon holed into moving on emotionally with your spouse) and you need to move on especailly since the divorce is final. Don't forget all the bull5h1t you went through to get to the point of divorce with her. She is a wicked being, f her if you would pay someone for it and have no regrets, otherwise stay the he11 away!!!

THIS NEXT PART IS EXTREMELY IMPORTANT!!!!!!!!!

Do not do it in the same city that your kids are in. Rent a hotel, do it in a car, outside in the woods, at a beach, something but do not do it anywhere near your children. You will scar them for life and you two have already done a fine job of doing that--don't make it any worse on your children.

And Just Peachy, my whole point all along to Jimmy before my response to Jimmy was countered by our fellow MB buddy Checkur with his own viewpoint, was simply DON'T DO IT!!

Same as you've said.

However, following my point of view that God created sex & it is to be experienced and enjoyed ONLY within the sanctity of a marriage commitment would prevent any of us from having to experience the scarring emotional pain & soul-loss of "been there, done that, bought the T-shirt, trying to return the T-shirt", etc.

Personally, I'll opt for a gentle but firm, preventative lifestyle adjustment vs traumatic & potentially lethal ICU therapy any day -- you?

Best,
High Flight