OT, but actually, I guess sort of related to me and Phil. Hmmmn.

This morning I got a phonecall from relatives I haven't heard from in over two years. (You may remember about how my immediate family members are passed... extended family is older and small and generally disinterested.)

Well this morning I got a phonecall and I didn't even recognize the voice. OK. With some annoyance, the voice at the other end identified himself and then proceeded to ask, How are you doing? To which I responded, Fine. How are you all doing?

He said the family was fine. Then he said, The reason for the call is this, I wanted to know if you still happen to have [a particular family heirloom]? Yes? Well would you send it to us. We want it.

It took me half a second to register the request and my response was, Sure. No problem. Still at the same address? I think the reaction at the other end must have been shock. I didn't even go through the pretense of asking why it was wanted or to ask for it back when they were done with it.

I don't have many things that belonged to my family. I certainly don't have my family anymore. But they'll get use out of this thing and I guess don't really need it. So off it goes in the mail this afternoon.

After so many years, the only time I get a phonecall from these people is when they WANT some object or service from me.

It wasn't enough that there was no real interest in me as a person, I also got treated to this: Heard that your engagement was off. You two were together for what? Ten years? Did you hear John is getting married in October? He met her two and a half months ago.

Blah blah, blah blah, blah, blah.blah.blah.

Well, nice talking to you. Bye.

And I said bye.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Same old pattern and I am tired of it. Phil wanted something. I gave it. Family wants something I give it. Old friends wanted - I tried to give but it wasn't good enough, so farewell friends.

Today the pattern changed slightly inside of me. Even though it hurt a little, I'm not rebelling internally at the request at all. For me, that is a pretty significant change. In similar situations before when someone wanted something from me that I didn't really want to give, I gave, but inwardly I SEETHED.

Well, anyway, I tried to be nice and do what is right. In my two sizes too small Grinch heart I am hoping that counts for something.

Does this sort of thing happen to other people or is it just me? Is it all really about material goods? Or is there some chance that the objects are an excuse to see me, talk to me, be part of my life???

If these crazy requests are excuses because I AM missed, then how do I change things so that there is no need of excuses? If Phil makes all of these excuses to see me, then how do I change so that if he wants to see me has to admit to himself and to me that he WANTS TO SEE ME???

I guess I think the fewer excuses the better. For everyone and any situation. You want something I've got? Here it is. Take it and leave. If you want me, well then we can talk.

No?

Sally

{{Sally}}} All I want from you is YOU! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Hey! When do I get a package in the mail!? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

You still have my number, right? Call me anytime! You know I'm always up for it!

Dobie

Who are you trying to kid, my friend?

Froz has a very good point sally <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

The only time I have been contacted by my WW's family was to ask if they could still borrow our ocean condo( which I was forced to move into ).

And I am making the request seem a LOT more congenial then it really was.

Faithful, here you are posting to me on a d-day from HELLO! You are truly gracious. Thank you and {{{hugs}} right back to you! It's good to be wanted.

Dobie, you are a true friend. You're here when I need you and still here when I need you more! You name it - I'd love to send a package to ya! Forgive me for being so reclusive? I've been in a deep one. I know you're there and I really appreciate that knowing it so very much.

Froz-baby, my heart has been very Grinchy but it's nice that you haven't noticed. I've been trying to keep it all inward as much as possible. Things have been quite bad with me and I felt like it would be a worse sin to invite anyone in to witness.

dorry, I KNOW that you've noticed some dangerously negative non-Sally-like talk. Thanks for reminding me to trust. Warning, there are some more nits below. Sorry. I'm trying, but I still have questions.


Cymanca if you can believe it, just last month Phil's (WSo'o) family (by way of Phil) asked to stay at my home for a couple of days while visiting another relative in hospital. Hotel bills were adding up and as I was away on holiday they thought... Needless to say my answer was Yes. It never even occurred to me to say no.

Now, some weeks later I ask myself WHAT was I thinking? These people stood by their blood and cast me aside like I was garbage. Worse than garbage, they accused ME of cheating on Phil. They said terrible things to me and about me. And I am so dumb that it didn't occur to me to say no when they had a need.

I'm not angry at Phil's family. I am angry at myself! I repay bad treatment with good, then I wonder why Phil doesn't respect me. All I had to do to get their respect was to say no. I wonder why Phil's parents accused me of being crazy. Duh. Rational people don't give love when other people crap all over them. I didn't even have to be nice when I said yes. And I WAS nice. And what I regret is not having told them all to piss off!

This sort of thing has happened SO MANY times over the years I can hardly believe it and so often under the worst circumstances - When my parents died, when my car was stolen, when I lost the baby... and so on and so forth. Always a hand reaching for some material POS or some service that apparently only I could render.


And I still don't understand why. But I am thankful honest and true that I have anything that anyone else considers valuable in the first place. I am very fortunate and I forget it much too much.

Sally

And... in a general showing of masculine "I don't get the emotional stuff" neanderthalness....

"Yo, Sally... You got somebody's I need ta beat up??"

fahgetaboutit

sally,

ya know I love you - check your e-mail in 5 min <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> didn't want to post it up here <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Sally,

As an addendum, I also said it would be ok. She never called me again to cancel. The time she requested just came and went as if nothing was ever requested

Sorry sally....

but I don't get it....

which doesn't mean I deny you or anyone else a good ole vent now and then...

but the truth is...
is that to me your post was way to one sided..

they never call
they never care about me as a person
they
they
they...

sounds to me like it's pretty equal
you never call them
you aren't to interested in them...

and all of that is fine...
if you want a relationship with these people..then YOU have to work at it
and make it happen on then...

THEN if you get no response...
you are entitled to vent away how they don't care about you..

but if YOU haven't picked up the phone in two years to call them...
then you can't blame them for doing the same...

sounds pretty equal to me..

I'm just pointing out how we all accept roles or positions that we either...
act victim to..
or
are unhappy with BUT don't do anything about...

If you WANT closeness with these people then change the actions you can to facilitate...
if status quo is OK with distant relatives...then reconize it as thus...
and don't beat yourself up over it...

AND
most importantly...don't let my post take away from your need to vent your frustration....cause you are certainly welcome to it... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

blessings
ARK

Sally,

Believe it or not, very soon, you will find yourself going through a "streamlining"

Simplifying....

First it'll be friends that aren't really friends but aggravating aquaintances, you know the ones that always need something but never offer or show up when you need something.

many other simplifications....it will come...and your perspective of "you" will change.

Boundaries are coming Sally, it's a locomotive with no brakes so jump on or be run over. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

It's only going to be better, trust me....well try too anyway darling

ark, Firstly about the family thing -- YES, I agree with you 100%! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Of course, you're all getting this new info without having the old stuff to refer to... sorry for the lack of clarity. This sort of thing with my relatives has been going on for over twenty years! For most of that time I went out of my way to be respectful and caring - to be the person to make contact, make calls on holidays, send cards, do the travelling to visit and so on.

I did this because I thought it was the right thing to do. Even in the face of some pretty bad treatment, I thought it was up to me to keep making the effort. I didn't expect anything in return for giving BUT I didn't expect to be harmed either. So when there was no reciprocity even in the effort to make contact, when no kindness came but only harm after so many years, I started to let it go. It was the right and healthy thing to do.


RebornMan, Yep! Streamlining is about right! All those old friends sure fell out fast and I sure did fall out hard. Some days are better than others but the loneliness is tough and I find myself feeling more vulnerable instead of less. Did you know this was week two of some very deep, dark NC for me?

Interesting thing this boundaries thing. My boundaries are high. My boundaries are low. My boundaries come and go but they aren't what most other people have as boundaries and why it's the men here at MB who notice that more than the women I would like to know... It does seem that way...


All, joyful giving isn't so hard. It's dealing with the lack of respect when people perceive me as a doormat for the giving. I don't think of myself as a doormat though and that is where I am most often confused and hurt. Why should I be judged negatively for being generous?

And as far as giving begrudgingly, I don't feel as good when I am giving without gladness. Froz has said to me, isn't it better to give when we really DON'T want to? Isn't the gift that much more meaningful when someone doesn't want to give, but gives anyway? I still give that thought. I think I think - yes. Maybe that is more meaningful...

Sally

It's up to you whether you give or not, but a gift is always a gift - without the expectations the gift will be returned in favor. Any gift with expectations or conditions is no longer a gift <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Dorry, yes, I think we agree. I'm saying that when I give you a gift, I don't expect you to give me a gift in return. I don't expect you to hit me and break my nose in return either. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

So, if that IS considered a condition of my gift-giving (the unspoken please don't break my nose condition) then does that mean I am not really giving a gift? Just checking...

Sally

LOL hmmmmm - so I can break your nose if you send me a gift?

Well - here's the thing. If people are breaking your nose after you give to them- it's up to you whether you want to keep giving or not. But it's like if you choose to give someone 100$ - if they spend it on drugs and alcohol, or prostitutes, so be it - you can choose whether to gift again or not...but once it's a gift - how they treat you or that gift is their business. If you put an expectation on it - then it's no longer a gift.

Experience would say though - if people abuse the gift giving, then your gift giving would be better used giving to someone else.

So then we agree. What was it that made you think we didn't or was the clarification not intended for me??

Sal

I think I channeled Froz there a bit - don't you all think so?!?

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Hey Froz.... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Sal

cause you asked..FROZ <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> muah muah

You know, it's been at least a month since I had my nose broken! Mbaw HAW HAW!!!!

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Sal