Hi fredswife.

I can't tell you if your H is lying or not... but I can tell you a bit about my situation with my W.

My W and I were in a music group at our church together with a guy who I started to become jealous of. They were "carrying on" and giving looks right in front of me... nothing sexual, but you can tell the difference between regular flirting and meaningful. I caught my W secretly emailing and I questioned her.
She was indignant... they were just friends. I am too jealous and smothering... etc.. I accepted that and tried to give her some space. Then she started to want to go out as couples with him and his wife... choosing their company over her twin sister... her best friend. When I questioned this, her answer was why is everyone so jealous and upset when she starts to have some success in her life and have new friends. This OM was also someone I personally did not like very much.

To come to my point... I discovered my W was having an A with him. She lied to her Mom and sister when they asked her directly... she is very close to both of them and would never lie about anything else to them. She lied to me and continued to deny anything beyond friendship until I came to her with proof. Even after about 6 weeks of me sleeping on the couch because she needed space and didn't know whether she wanted to stay with me... throughout this she denied anything going on until the proof was shown.

It is normal for us to want to believe the one we love... this could never happen to me I said.

Hopefully your H is telling the truth... but your instinct is generally a good guide.

Shaden

Hi, fredswife.

Quote:
===========================
There is nothing "legal" I can do right now, and why waste money on things that are not going to change anything.
===========================

There are legal options available to you. I believe that most states have "dead beat dads" types of programs that you could take advantage of.

The simple fact is that he has left you with a mess on your hands, and lied about what he is doing to address it.

I won't beat you over the head with an outsiders view of your situation. I and others here, feel certain that he is engaged in an affair, and is behaving like every other wayward spouse before him involved in an entangled affair. That is also part of the reason why he wants a divorce.

If you would like help with your situation, just ask. There are other folks here that can help you that are a bit more on the 'gentler side' than me.

I wish you all the best,
Gimble

OK,
So, lets say he is having an affair.
If I have tried to just lt him get it out of his system, give him his space, and not accomodate him and let it just run its course, isn't that enough?
He has been calling me more and more, our communication is better.
He actually sent me a gift today, which shocked me!!
I have been standing my ground.
He made a strange comment today, something that sounded a little paranoid....he said he didn't know who to trust anymore. His friends are not acting the same towards him anymore. He asked if I had been talking to anyone about him, I said "no", which is the truth.
I said perhaps it is the type of person you have chosen to be your "friend" that may have an agenda that is not for your best interests. Perhaps you should think about that.
he just said, "I know, I know".
Then he apologized for being so grumpy,a nd said the strangest thing, he said, I really respect you.

So analize that.............. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

Hi, fredswife.

That is an easy read, and it flows from guilt and paranoia. Standard fare for the wayward spouse.

He is being nice to you because he doesn't know how much you know, but he suspects that you know more than you are telling.

The respect comment is because you haven't exposed him. I would like to believe it is because you are being so steadfast in handling the poor situation he has put you in, and there may be some of that in his 'respect' comment, but expose his affair, and you will be considered (by him) equivalent to satan for awhile.

He will get mad, but you will bust his fantasy with the truth. Truth is no respecter of persons.

Up to you. Bust his fantasy or let it run it's course while understanding that you are still risking your marriage and he may end up marrying her while you and the kids suffer. No guarantees.

You are in for some pain no matter what you do. At least ensure that your children are legally protected regardless of what you choose to do about the affair.

All the best,
Gimble

Actually he doesn't respect you even a "little bit". I would not confuse his babble and guilt ridden rhetoric for anything else, least of all "respect". The "respect" you think he is giving you is actually him thinking "Geee, I can abandon my children and wife and have an affair and she still will take me back, pretty much "as is".

You should not be worrying about him giving you respect, but should start with yourself.

Goodluck with all of this.

CAN YOU HELP ME EDIT THIS

Barbra
Finally, in response to your last email, in which you clearly state you like frankness, here goes…..
I am sick of the lies and the manipulation.
I am sick and tired of being made out to be the one with the problem.
I am sick and tired of being told that I am imagining things.
This is not my imagination, this is real.
Both you and Fred are clearly having an affair, and I am sick of it.
I am sick of the denial.
I am sick of the head games.
I am just sick of the whole thing.
Both of you are each others emotional crutch.
You thought that by getting in touch with him after so many years, it would make you feel better for the relationship you screwed up with him 20 years ago.
He being the typical man allowed curiosity to get the best of him.
Unfortunately he got sucked in to your web of deceit.
ANY time a woman gets in touch with an old boyfriend, it is only because her own marriage is bad.
And look, you were in the middle of a divorce…how convenient.
The visits, the overnight stays, your complete disregard for my feelings.
The numerous calls on the cell phone, the secrets, the lies.
Fred is married, he has a wife and 8 children.
How is your son handling your divorce?
How do you think my 8 children are dealing with this?
Does any of that mean anything to you???
It is time to stop the games, and stop the lies.
The funny thing is that you have never denied it, why is that?

I can handle the truth better then the constant manipulation.

I need to move forward with my life, and I just want the truth once and for all. Both of you owe me at least that much.

DON'T SEND IT............YOU ARE WASTING YOUR TIME !

I second LM. Don't send it. It is quite obvious that your husband is having an affair and has abandoned you and his children. I would file separation papers and get some child support.

HE DOESN'T HAVE AN F-ING JOB FOR ME TO GET ANY F-ING <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />CHILD SUPPORT.
I CAN NOT FILE FOR DIVORCE OR SEPARATION BECAUSE THEN I CAN NOT SELL MY HOUSE, THE COURT CAN FREEZE THE SALE OF MY HOUSE FOR UP TO A YEAR, AND YES I HAVE TALKED TO 3 ATTORNEYS.
HE HAS NOT ABANDONED US, HE PHONES DAILY AND IS PLANNING ON VISITING THE KIDS IN OCTOBER FOR A WEEK.
I JUST DON'T GET IT WHY EVERYONE HERE IS SO DAMN NEGATIVE.
I UNDERSTAND THAT MANY OF YOU SEE THINGS THAT I DO NOT SEE, SO EXCUSE MY LACK OF KNOWLEDGE ON THIS SUBJECT, BUT I AM STUCK.
A LITTLE ENCOURAGEMENT WOULD BE NICE.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

FW:

Well, I have to be honest with you here. I think you are your OWN worst enemy right now. Your anger and hurt and fears are all normal and 100% perfectly acceptable...however, girl, you are yelling at the WRONG PEOPLE !!! What you may think would be "support" in helping you edit this letter, would actually be hindering you.

You are gonna have real problems if you don't take off the blinders and stop rationalizing this situation. If your husband can clean dishes or sweep with a broom he should NOT be unemployed. It doesn't matter one iota if he lost his job in April...he has 8 kids, the govt (and my TAX dollars) don't give a flying ****, he HAS A DUTY TO SUPPORT THEM...job or no job.

Please understand this right now. You seem to make one excuse after another about his actions. Your letter to this OW is almost a mockery of what HE HAS DONE to you. Come on girl, you gotta "snap out of it". You say that he has not "abandoned" you...but he is indeed AT THE VERY least having an emotional affair and NOT seeing and caring for his 8 children, or supporting them financially. Yeah, you can get people too say this is "all fog" or an "alien" did this or that he is "addicted" but that doesn't change the fact that this man abandoned 8 children and is NOT supporting them emotionally, physically, or financially. There is NO rational reason why your WH should not be in your house taking care of his kids and working menial labor jobs to put food on the table. If that is not ABANDONMENT, what is ??????

You are confusing encouragement with "enabling". I, in good concsious cannot "encourage" you to be a doormat and be in denial, I cannot NOT do that. When you stop making excuses for your WH, then maybe you can see that what I am trying to tell you is not so negative at all.

Right now, you are your biggest obstacle, NOT The other woman. A letter telling her that your WH is a man married with 8 children is NOT going to change anything in your situation BUT LESSEN your power.

You are being dealt a pretty $hitty deal here, so you have to make the best of it. Writing a letter to this woman and rationalizing your WH abandonmant of his family is surely not the way to correct this.

You were given good advice of getting him to LEGALLY support his children and family, those are his OBLIGATIONS. I won't dare offer advice on winnning your WH back or doing plans A or B, but the advice you have been given about getting formal CS needs to be done.

No one posting here in reality is an EXPERT at this stuff, so we can only give you opinions. This is a board littered with vastly different opinions and view points (and that is a very good thing despite what people may DOGMATICALLY say), so take what you want and throw the rest away.

If you do not want me to post an opinion on your situation becasue it is to upetting to you or too negative to you, please say so. My "style" is not for the faint of heart and there are far more insightful, intelligent and caring people than me to help you, so just let me know...you will NOT be offending me. Sometimes the advice you least like to hear is the advice you MOST need to hear.

Goodluck in this situation.

FW -

If you file for child support, he will have to get a F'ING JOB or go to jail. At least if he is in jail, he won't be with OW.

I know you are hurting, and I'm sorry.

Hi, fredswife.

So you've now heard from lemonman, whose acerbity exceeds my own, and from believer, who is one of the most kind and gentle long time posters on this site.

I started posting to you from another BBS months ago, and you were in denial then. Others here that have posted to you have helped many hundreds of people. Simply put, you have been given good advice.

For your kids sake, please take to heart at least some of what you have been told here. Your husband has parked a tractor-trailer load of disrespect on you, and left it for you to deal with. It's time to give it back to him.

All the best,
Gimble

The plan was for him to go to CA and look for a job, then we would relocate and be with him.
Unfortunatley he has not been able to find a job yet.
He has been on several interviews, but nothing yet.
I have asked him to please come home and help me sell the house and then we can move back to CA together.
I have given him until october 1st to do this.
If not, his brother will be asking him to move out.
Then the choice is up to him, he can come home, or he can move in with OW.
I don't know at this point which one he will choose.

it sounds as though you have finally accepted that your husband anad this woman are not just friends and they are indeed having a full blown physical affair.

i wanted to believe my husband too.

my denial was even worse than yours.

my husband had an affair with this woman for 8 months and when i found out, he admitted it. when it started again months later...i believed him when he said he hadn't even talked to her...he was just not "in love with me anymore" I even dialed *69 after a hang up and she answered the phone. he said they were friends. i believed him.

he moved out a few months later. he moved 1 1/2 hours away from me-10 minutes from her. guess what i believed him still. even when i found a check he had sritten out to her i believed him. This was when i had the greatest chance to expose the affair to everyone and get my husband back from the OW and the fog.

that was 15 months ago.

i believed him all of that time. I did nothing except try to be the person he wold want to come back to.

finally 2 months ago, his sister told me the truth. that he had admitted that he had left to be with OW and had told his family he had "real feelings for her"

that is when i TOOK ACTION.

since that time, i have discovered for myself that the OW has left her husband and 4 children (she even left her mother whom they were all living with) and moved in with my husband. I got her husband's work number and have contacted him. He told me everthing.

it may very well be way too late for me now to save my marraige. the longer the affair goes on, the more connected they become. but i haven't given up. i am still fighting.

what did all of this information give me besides tons of pain?

well....

it gave me grounds for divorce...adultry.
of course i don't want a divorce but as one very wise woman here said to me "knowledge is power"

before i knew the truth and exposed the truth to his entire family and the OWH, my husband had tried to force me to sign a "voluntary separation agreement" so he could get half of everything and a divorce. then he made up ground and filed for divorce the same week that i found out the TRUTH.

guess what? when i told him i could now counter claim adultry, HE HAD HIS LAWYER WITHDRAW THE FILING FROM THE COURTS.

guess why? my husband doesn't want the embarrassment of going through a divorce charged with adultry and in many states, even though we DON'T have children, he would get less than half becuase of this.

he has offerred me an agreement that gives me most of what we had together and i haven't spent more than $250 on legal fees. He doesn't want me to file anything so he paid to have an agreement written up and i rewrote it with MY TERMS then paid a lawyer to look over it.

in your case, with 8 children.... he would be lucky if he gets to keep all of his clothes.

i still don't want a divorce but i now have the power to make some choices that I couldn't before because of lack of knowledge and the belief that there is nothing i can do about it anyway.

in most states, you will be entitled to alimony, child support and more than half of anything you own.

and don't tell me....we don't own anything and he doesn't have a job......the courts will make him FIND a job. the reason he has no job now is because he feels he can't find one. He is looking for the job he wants. the courts will make him accept a job that he may not like and may earn less than he thinks he is worth but they WILL make him get a job and support you and your children.

i believe you said he has already filed for divorce. (hmmm...wonder where he got the money to do this?)

you need to get yourself to a lawyer fast or you will not be getting yourseelf OR YOUR CHILDREN money to live.

borrow money from friends and family and protect yourself legally.

EXPOSE THE TRUTH THAT THEY ARE HAVING A FULL BLOWN AFFAIR TO EVERYONE!!!!!

you may get more support-you may not, you may have a chance of saving your marraige-you may not, but you WILL feel better about what you have doneabout this-you WILL feel empowered, you WILL respect yourself again.

and if it were me, i would send the letter you wrote. i know others here will tell you otheerwise. but for me-telling the OW that i knew and how i feltabout it was just sometin i had to do for ME.

if you ever have lots of extra time-read my thread and you will see...some people really do have it worse than you.

you will also see how the people here helped me to go from a person full of hope in a hopeless situation to a person with the power to make my situation finally have some real hope.

i wish you the best,

He has not filed any paperwork

Why should he file? It is not in his financial interest t/d so. What are the D laws in your state?

BTW, does he have to work on CA? Why can't he job search closer to home? Hm.... smell a big rat here.

L.

As I am moving out of state I have been advised by 2 different attorneys to wait until I move.
My state does NOT do alimony, but CA does.
Anything I start here will affect me in the long run.
I have sought legal councel.
I really am not an idiot, I know that I can take him to the cleaners if I wanted to.
This is not the way I wanted to handle it.

we are from CA and BOTH of us decided we had enough of NE, that it was time to move back.
WE decided this together.
I just didn't think it was going to take this long.
I asked him to file for a legal separation before he left, "just in case" he said he didn't want to.
he still says he doesn't know what he wants.

Lemonman,
and him being in jail would help me how??????

I am not a fool, I do believe however that I can make things worse by meddling.
My H is not in his right state of mind right now, and being nasty will hurt the situation.
I receive his unemployment checks, they come directly to me.
If I file for child support, I will not get the whole check anymore.
Yes, the check just covers the mortgage, but it is something.
I spent my life always living in survival mode, one of the reasons H was always angry with me, he said I make life hard.
I know I am better then the OW, and I am not accomodating him.
I do not want a big ugly divorce, especially with my children.
I need to play nice until I can move, then I can take care of business.
I can not sell my house without his signature, do you understand this concept???