FWH had a brief PA too and thought he "loved" her. I got the IDNLY speech soon after she came into the picture.

He has shown very little remorse and sometimes treats me terribly. I know a lot of this has to do with my own A and his anger/bitterness over it. But, could the lack of remorse also be a bit of residual fog leftover from his A and the fact they still work together? He has rarely shown remorse and I know Harley states this is not unusual.

How long did it take for you to get/see true sincere remorse from your FWS?

Improving,

My Dear Squid has always been a haughty woman. Her entitlement dissipated over six months to apoint where she told me she regretted ever having the affair.

Then at just before a year she gave me a heartfelt , tearful full apology in Nando's at lunchtime ! It all came rolling out, She must have been CRAZY, HOW could she do that to ME , to HERSELF, that God won;t love her now, she THREW AWAY every blessing she had, and she loved me fearfully believing that I could not possible love such a deceitful, unclean wretch etc etc.

I never dreamed such would ever leave my baby's mouth, so prideful has shebeen in the past.

In fact her shame fell upon her at that time and her consuming guilt and remorse has paralysed our recovery for a while. It was needed though I am sure. She is coming out of the other side now, tanks God.

Remorse comes at different times to different WS. I cite Squid as an example because she is probably one of the toughest nuts to crack, and it took a year for her.

I believe that remorse can be shown in many ways than words. It may be too painful initially to verbalise remore, so is manifested in PRACTICAL recovery, intimacy or affection. Squid did this for months before I got an apology.

Its hard. All blessings

No remorse equates to no recovery.

Call Steve H @ MB immediately and get yourself a plan.

When mine when in and out of remorse, false recoveries ensued...... each time the stakes for his return went higher.

True remorse comes with loving actions. Willing to take the blame and shoulder the burden of marital recovery. Includes helping you feel loved and feel safe t/b in his company.

It means he is the one privileged t/b home, not visa versa. He s/b grateful.

L.

My FWH expressed genuine remorse last night for the first time. It has been 3 1/2 months since D-Day and he has spent that time trying to avoid any mention of the A. He wanted to "put it behind us" and "concentrate only on the future" and wanted me to "get over it." Finally, finally last night he asked for forgiveness, acknowledged how much hurt he had caused me, and truly apologized. My heart is so much lighter and even the sun seems to shine a little more brightly.

Bob-

Thanks for responding. I think about your sitch all the time and try to remind myself that sometimes it comes later rather than sooner. I am starting to lose respect for my H though because I am seeing a general pattern lately of blaming me-- even in regards to not having needs met. He feels it is my "issues" about SF, not that I could not feel sexual with a man who only seemed to want me for SF. I feel like I am taking accountability for my actions and that is plenty. I am not going to be responsible for his too. And, if he never gets to that point, can we really start R?
I think if he truly "saw" the pain his A caused me, then he would not be able to keep blaming me and I am not sure he is ready for that. I feel like his scapegoat right now and it is getting tiresome.

Improving (((HUGS))

I am sorry you are still dealing with this. As I told you before, H hasn't really told me he is sorry - but through his actions he has still shown his remorse by showing his love and affection everyday, adn I know you do not have that at home right now <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I agree with what Orchid said, but I don't know if he is in another A yet - you and I have talked about this - but he sounds so much like Sprint was just before he met his OW and left in his A. And I wonder if in Mr. Imp's mind he is seperated and its a matter of when and how he goes like in Sprint's mind.

Are you at home this AM? If you are I will give ya a call.

Remember to hold on to all the positives and keep up with the PLan A/180 <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I have SEEN the changes in ya girl and you are doing great. Remember no LB and keep making it confortable for him to be home. And like Orchid said -, like I said - maybe find a way to call SH on your own to get a plan - I know you guys saw JC, but...maybe SH can get a good plan going for you...maybe you can find away to push around finances?

(((HUGS))))

From the moment D-day began FWW has been very remorseful. WD phase did not last long for her but now she is grieving for the loss of a number of things related to the A (the night out with so-called friends, the activities, etc). Depression is setting in and it will be some time before she can get past this.

Both our MC and her IC have agreed that the grieving is part of the recovery process, but as long as she continues IC and we continue MC then we should be able to reach our goals.

H4F,

Undo sounds so much like me...my heart goes out to her - she will make it through.

And mR. Imp sounds so much like Sprint did before his A <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> lol

I get remorse everyday. True, heartfelt remorse....

Makes a soul feel better on both sides.

- Kimmy

It might not be particularly helpful to use other people's recovery to benchmark your situation. Your situation pushes the limits of the mantra that "BS didn't cause the A".

Your WH is justifiably angry at you for your A, as you are justifiably angry at him for his A. It is going to be very difficult to wrap his feelings and emotions into neat bundles.

IMHO, Recovery consists of (A) Ending the A (i.e., NC); (B) Helping the BS recover from the emotional damage of the A; and (C) fixing the problems in the M that led to the A.

Usually, people do (B) and (C) more or less at the same time. IMHO, you and he are never going to get to (B) until you fix the problems in the M.

His anger at you for your A coupled with the residual "fog" from the A is going to be a real impediment to him experiencing remorse for a while.

If you and he can repair the M, then the remorse will follow "like a ripe apple falling from a tree."

Orchid-

I cheated too though. He states he has a hard time showing me remorse because he does not feel close to me.

Dr. Harley states it is not uncommon to not see remorse at all because the person feels justified. I imagine it is possible my H feels I brought this whole mess on myself because my A came first. I don't know what to think sometimes.

He is in MC with me and we are making progress. He has been coming around. In many ways, I feel my H was so incredibly hurt by my actions that he needed to create a wall between us to protect himself. Well, it is taking time for it to come down, but I have seen forward movement.

Our sitch is a bit different because of both As and there is not alot of information about this, so I feel like I am flying solo at times.

Dorry-



This scares me a lot.

He does not really talk to me, so I do not have much idea of where we are at. I do not see in his actions very much remorse. I am hoping that as we get closer this will improve. I am learning that I need to make it safer for him to talk with me. MC today was a real eye-opener. It's amazing to realize how screwed up we both are <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

The further out I got from my A, the more and more remorseful I have been. I long for a day when I see remorse from my H. It was on the D-days that I got the most sincere remorse. Have not seen it in months (almost 6), and that is very hard for me.

You sound like you have a handle on things. We are both in IC and MC too. It's an interesting journey for sure. I wish we were not here. I am going to become healthier no matter what happens. Hopefully, my H and I will still be together when all is said and done. I have faith that we could get through all this. We just have to both be committed to doing so.

Good luck

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I would love that and I do not know what I will do if it never comes because the man I married, he would feel it and show it.

Jimmy- thanks for your take on things. The dual As does make it so much more difficult. I do agree that if/when we feel closer, that he will probably feel remorse very intensely. But right now, there is so much other stuff going on. I hope that you are right. Because if you are not, then I do not know that I would want to remain married to him if he never showed it. I would have a really hard time with that.

Eaglesoar, this sounds heavenly <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I pray that we get there some day.

>I would love that and I do not know what I will do if it never comes because the man I married,

It took nearly 3 years to get it. Really. There are those here that I'm sure had given up on me and my cause.

- Kimmy

Thank you for sharing this with me. I really appreciate this. Do you know why you finally got it?

Both of you need to read Trueheart's letter to the WS. It is in my signature link. Then come back and let me know where each of you stand.

L.