Now he wants to start going to counseling and try to start over. He says he still thinks we should separate for 6 months or so because he wants us to take our time and he wants to earn his forgiveness.
Is separation in this case a good idea?
Other issue, he says he is working on making OW hate him so she'll break up with him. He promised that if within a month she has not broken it off with him he will cut off all ties to her. I don't really like this part at all, but at this point, I will take whatever I can get. I guess my hope though is that next week at counseling, MC tells him NO, absolutely he has to cut if off NOW. He just has a big heart and doesnt want to hurt her, when he left her b4 it hurt her so bad she ended up missing work and nearly lost her job. Her job is still in jeopardy at this point and he doesn't want her to lose her job. Also, he feels like if she breaks up with him he won't have to worry about her trying to track him down later and keep begging him back.
Any input?

Oh, he has requested to move to a different worksite, which will require him going out of state for 2 weeks at a time with a week off in between. He requested this because as it is now, he is only 20 minutes from OW's house and his motel is only 5 minutes from her house. He realizes that is a bad situation, so wants to go elsewhere to work to remove any temptation to "just stop by and say hi"

That is the biggest bunch of horse doo doo I have ever heard! Why would you accept this? No, do not seperate that is so he can continue the A without being under your watchful eye. Oh poor OW almost lost her job! puleeze!

BTW, what are you telling your kids about all this coming and going. This instability is NOT good for them. Either he is in or he is out. He cannot continue to hurt these kids on his whim.

>Is separation in this case a good idea?

Nope.

>Other issue, he says he is working on making OW hate him so she'll break up with him. He promised that if within a month she has not broken it off with him he will cut off all ties to her.

Bull$hit. Look at your above statement about him moving out and compare it to this one. It's a load of horse hockey. He's stringing you both along and NEITHER of you are putting a foot up his butt about it.

According to you: you'll take what you can get. That's what he's giving you. What do you think he's telling her?

How about:

WH: I'm telling the wife I want to seperate so that it'll make it easier when I D her.

(c)OW: duh. Okay. I'll take what I can get of you cos I LU-HUV you so very much. (my eyes are rolling so far back into my head, I just saw my brain)

Is this okay with you?

- Kimmy

It sounds to me like a change of strategy, not a change of heart. If you'll take what you can get, don't you think he knows that and plans accordingly?

He wants to earn your forgiveness? Tell him the only way to do that is to write a NC letter to OW, stay in your home, and go to MC with you. Nothing else will work.

I know you all are right...this was my fear, but I just wanted to make sure.
I will make it very clear to him that its all or nothing if he wants to start earning my forgiveness. We'll see what happens.

LimboLand,

You have an excellent opportunity to judge the veracity of your WH's true intentions. If after you tell him YOUR groundrules, he accepts them with a minimum of fuss, he was probably being somewhat honest in his stated intentions towards you and your M. If that is the case I apologize for myself and the above posters.

If he pitches a hissy fit( and he will), not only register his reaction but file it away so that when next confronted with his manipulation, you won't have to come here to ask his true intentions.

I agree with all those that posted already...there is NO reason why he has to let HER cut off the relationship. It's up to HIM to do it...PERIOD.

And there is no reason to wait...none at all. Tell him that if he's the least bit serious about wanting to work things out with you and rebuilding the marriage, then he starts NOW...by ending the relationship with OW in a way that YOU can see...a NC letter written by the two of you, with you copied so that you can see it went to OW as well.

Seperation is out of the question too...it won't rebuild your trust. Because living seperated won't allow you to VERIFY that he's being trustworthy. He has to SHOW you that you CAN trust him...and that's not possible when he's able to hide everything he does from you.

Time to establish some clear boundaries here, IMHO.

Ok, well before I even had a chance to talk to him about this and tell him NC letter, no separation, counseling, etc., today, he broke things off with OW. He just called me and told me he'd just picked up the last of his stuff from her house and told her it was over.
I still don't know what to think...he said he promises he won't talk to her anymore, won't visit, won't answer if she calls. I guess only time will tell if he's for real or full of crap. I will still have him write a NC letter to her though.
I just wish I had some way to get into his brain and see whats really going on in there...

LL, be sure and tell him your boundaries, no contact, no seperation, etc. Ask him to send a no contact letter and commit to absolute no contact. You are right to be wary of his "promises." Talk is cheap when it comes from a WS, only ACTIONS matter.

Not to correct a more experienced poster than myself, but he needs to show you the NC letter and then it needs to be sent without contacting her. No last time meeting or any crap like that. But you need to review the letter and OK it so it speaks for you as well.

hello Melody <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

hey Pat. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Thanks for making that excellent point.

Having been in a similar situation, make sure you see the letter and that you get to mail it. Then formulate a plan that the two of you can implement together to INSURE no contact. Specifically, it should include you having all of his passwords, probably changing his phone numbers, access to cell phone bills and any other way to check on incoming and outgoing calls. He will need to account for all of his time. Re-read SAA to anticipate what will happen next. He is going to have to go through withdrawal and you will need to be strong and the leader in this part of recovery. Learn the lesson that I learned the hard way---specific ways to insure NO contact whatsoever. The OW continued to contact my FWH loooong after he went "no contact" and he felt that as long as he wasn't calling her and was back with me, contact shouldn't matter. The fact is, she drew him back in and later on greatly inhibited our recovery efforts. Since real no contact (when I threatened her with exposure to every person in her life) things have steadily improved. Please, I beg you, take these important precautions.

Thanks, that is the first thing on my list, to do whatever it takes to ensure NC. He is already willing to change job locations and is just waiting for the word from his supervisor, he changed motels today, he is willing to change his cell number, and I plan to install key logger on both pc's as well as get his passwords. We have vonage telephone service so i can go online and see all calls that are made, either incoming or outgoing.

Just curious though, is it appropriate to send NC letter via email? Knowing WH, he doesn't know OW's address, so short of having someone hand deliver the letter, we'd have to email it. Oh, and she's not listed in phone book, so can't get her address that way.

And I will be sure to read through SAA again...I also bought lovebusters and his needs her needs and will keep those handy too.

I think it is fine to send the NC letter via e-mail. Then you can have your WH cc: you, so that you will get a copy of it too, and can verify that the letter was sent.

Keep strong and stick to your boundaries on this.

I thought they had lived together, wouldn't he know her address then?

They lived together for a month, but he had his own po box, and didn't use her mail. I know him too well, it usually takes months of us living somewhere b4 he knows the address. He knows where she lives of course, but he is really bad at remembering addresses and phone numbers (I don't know what he'd do without speed dial).

LOL, well then e-mail it is. Good luck.