Hi Milkshake, SVC, Drucilla,

Sorry to join the club, but I guess I'm in the same
boat. My H also has emotional/mental issues, although
I'm not sure to what extent, and how much they have
played into our situation.

H was diagnosed with depression and OCD about five
years ago and has been on numerous meds since-
has probably tried 7-8 different AD's, and even
some meds for ADD to see if they made any difference.
(None really have). Everyone he's seen has also
stressed to him that he needed to do therapy as
well as meds, an idea that he has really resisted.
He did, however, try to different therapists, and
didn't have good results, which has really soured
him on the idea.

Four years ago, H had an inappropriate internet
friendship with OW in a nearby town. I found out
about it, called her, put an end to it, and that
was the first I knew of H's discontent with the M
and me. Within a couple of months, he had started
EA with an older, recently widowed woman (strange
choice), during which I moved out of the house
because I couldn't stand the lying, secrets, and
very bizarre (fog) behavior.

About this time, I discovered MB, read all the books,
looked hard at myself to discover that I really was
guilty of lots of LB's, tried to figure out his
EN's, etc. OW ended the relationship, so H started
to come out of the fog, and asked me to get back
together. I moved back home, and we seemed to make
a pretty good recovery.

For most of three years, things went pretty well,
however starting last year, there started to be
little things and signs of problems (although I didnt
really see them at the time).Things would then
improve for awhile, so I would hope things had
"blown over" and would improve- a form of denial,
I guess !

We had a very nice Christmas, but seems like this
whole year has been a "downhill" slide right into
the pits. Started to find slips of paper with women's
names and numbers, cash in H's briefcase, catching
him in lies about his whereabouts, subscriptions to
some questionable internet sites, and suspicious
charges on his credit cards. Realized he seemed to
be going from an occasional look at porn, to checking
out websites, and think he may have been even gone to
using escort services eventually. (so gross !!!)
Did some reading and research and found about SA,
which seemed to fit H. Tried to talk to him about
it and urged him to get help, but, of course, he
totally denied that he could have any such thing.
I tried to do a good PLAN A.

Since June, things really have declined. H started
going out more, doing "binge" type drinking for several
weekends and very nearly getting in an accident and/or
arrested ! (This seemed to scare him, so he's not been
drinking since that I know of). H stayed at his office
long hours, which I suspect was his time to be on the
internet (has used sites like Lavalife and Friendfinder)
and/or cell phone, and was increasingly secretive,
dishonest, inconsiderate, etc., all FOG type behaviors.
Still, we spent lots of time together- ran errands, went
to eat, movies, made future plans for travel and our house, and still were sleeping in the same bed. (no SF for ages) It made me think H was still somewhat invested in the M.

In early Aug, H announced he was going away for the
weekend, saying it was with a co-worker (male) and for
business purposes. I didn't believe it and didn't want
him to go, but he did anyway. I later saw his CC
bill, and found charges for an expensive resort and
restaurants in a different town, so I definitely felt
he had A going on with one or more OW.

I got access to the cell phone bill and found numerous
calls to one number, so called and it was a woman who
said my H had called her a few times but nothing more- (internet "friends") She said he had told her he was single, no kids, successful businessman and wealthy (all
not true) so was angry to find out he had lied.
(what did she expect in dealing with people on web sites?)
Thought that might have put an end to the issue, but
his strange behaviors continued- he would say he didn't
want to be with me, didn't want to be married, wasn't
happy, wanted to be "on his own", but then call and ask
if I wanted him to bring home something for dinner.)!!!??
Might say we couldn't do anything together on a Saturday
because "we're not together", but then the next day want
to do things together all day. VERY confusing and eratic.
Not sure if that's all FOG or mental/emotional issues too!?

Found a receipt indicating that H went to the courthouse
and picked up a packet of separation/divorce paperwork,
but he it sat in a drawer in our house for several weeks,
until H announced he was again going out of town for a
weekend. Wouldn't tell me any details, where he was
going, with who, etc. When he left, he sat the paperwork
packet out on the desk. I looked at it, horrified and
had the worst weekend of my life, realizing H must really
be obsessed with someone, really living the "fantasy"
life in the FOG, and that we really might not make it
this time.

Had a call over that weekend from H's credit card company
trying to reach him to verify use of his CC in LAS VEGAS
and realized that he had flown there for the weekend !
He came home in a very agitated, hostile, aggressive mood
and proceeded to fight with me every morning before I left
for work, and each night before bed, absolutely insisting
that I HAD to fill out the divorce paperwork, HAD to do
it that day, that he HAD to file it immediately.
Don't know what brought on the sudden rush, but it made
me wonder if H's OW wanted proof he was separated or
something ??? H threatened to have me served with the
paperwork, probably knowing I wouldn't want it brought
to my job, continued to fuss, (almost like a child's
tantrum) and finally, I agreed I would sign it and
have it notarized. He then calmed down, and left to
go out of town again. Before he left, he calmed me
with what I guess was a "guilt" call- said he wasn't
trying to be difficult, wasn't trying to be hard or
unfair, just wanted to proceed and get things done
and wanted me to realize it was hard for him too.
(WHY would I think that when it was all his doing ?)
I did sign the paperwork, had it notarized, and left
it on our desk, as he said he would pick it up and
file it when he got back in town.

Well, I got home, expecting the paperwork to be gone
and everything to be done, and there it was still at
our house. H hadn't even come over, didn't call,
didn't know if he was even okay or back in town.
He called the next day to say he was "back" -
but wouldn't be coming back to stay at the house.
I had a very long, sad weekend- H and I used to
do everything together, so really missed him as
a companion. Did some things away from home Sunday,
and came home to find him car on the driveway.
Didn't want to see him, so stayed away until he'd gone,
and to my surprise, the paperwork was still there
and he had taken his wedding ring from his jewelry
box (had not been wearing it regularly for a couple
of weeks). This was very confusing, also made me
wonder if this meant he wasn't so sure about the D
after all ?

Although I know the MB plans don't necessarily work
with people who have emotional/mental issues or SA,
but for lack of knowing what else to do, and because
MB principles seemed to help previously, decided I
would consider his moving out as a PLAN B, and also
read "Love Must Be Tough" to help me set boundaries
and be "tougher".

I decided to go out of town for Labor Day Weekend,
and when I got home, H had been at the house to take
a few more clothes, and had taken the paperwork, so
I felt very deflated. After not calling him at all,
asking any questions, or trying to talk about anything,
I did ask H if he thought there was a chance we could
work on things, have a "fresh start" ? Instead of
the immediate "no", I expected, he said "he doubted it",

which seemed to leave the door open just a bit-
He also told me he'd be going out of town again, but
this time told me where he was going and with whom.
(business related, with a male co-worker).
He also seemed much more "clear", calm, and our
conversation was more pleasant.

Found out he had run out of the most recent meds he'd
been on (which I thought had made him worse) so
thought this might be a why, and be good thing !

Had an okay weekend, and he called Sun night to tell me
he was back. Saw him briefly Mon night, as he came over
to the house to switch vehicles. Nothing has been said
about the paperwork, but he has apparently not filed
anything still.

Yesterday he was at the house when I came home- was
picking up a few more clothes, and initially our
encounter was fine. Then he told me he had found a
buyer for one of our vehicles and wanted me to
immediately sign the title so it could be sold.
I was surprised, as thought we had decided to
keep the car. We discussed further, and seems like
it actually would be a good business move, but
as soon as I asked questions and didn't just go
along with "his plan" he was back in the hostile,
loud, agressive and ugly mode- just like with the
paperwork. Does this seem like it is a control/
manipulation issue ?

He proceeded to tell me how we need to get moving
to finish house projects so we can put it up for
sale, as he doesn't want to pay house payments
when he doesn't live there. I reminded him he's
only been gone 3 weeks, so not like he's paying
payments for months ! Also reminded him I and
dog do not have an alternate place to stay- but
his response was totallly uncaring and "not
my problem". He seemed to think I should just
rush out and find a cheap apartment in one day
to suit his time schedule ! He left mad,then
called a few minutes later to say "he's not
trying to be difficult or give me a hard time,
he just wants to move forward and "get on with
his life" and it was hard for him too"
(same guilt speech as before).

Very frustrating, mad, hurt, and sad to realize what
a fog he is in, that he's totally re-written our history and special times together, has totally closed down all feelings and just appears to be a cold and unfeeling,
stranger while I am losing my (used to be) best friend
spouse, lover, lifestyle, house, and car. (he makes far
more money than I, so I will be one suffering
financially).

H won't admit anything is going on with anyone, but
I just really feel he has something happening- either
enjoying "playing the field" with people on the internet
to whom he can make himself sound like a wonderful,
wealthy bachelor, or if he's hooked up with a specific
person. All my channels to research have been closed
down, especially since he's now out of the house.

Should I write a Plan B letter, or is there any point
since he elected to move out, and is (sort of) pushing
towards the D ?

I realize there have been ocassions where the WH has
changed their mind, even after D is filed, but H seems
so foggy and D only takes 3 months here, so may be too
late. Any suggestions, input, support ?
Thanks,
Anne

--------------------
Me-38, BS
H- 34, WS
A- June-Oct 01
Recovery begun- Nov 01


___________________________________________________
(by Dru:)
Hi Slammed,
Best to start a new thread, you'll get more replies... but...

He's at best a serial adulterer, SA seems possible, but the big thing is that he has no remorse or shown any intention on changing. Have you gotten his family and close friends involved?

Trips to Vegas worry me, financially speaking... I'd get that D finalized asap. He's spiraling downward, quickly. Since he's showing no signs of stopping, I'd get clear, in every way possible. I was about to type, 'I dont know why seemingly normal people change like this', but your H has a long history of this type of behaviour. I cant imagine the toll it's taken on you. I hope you have a good support system of friends and family you can lean on. You need to start taking care of yourself and let him sink on his own. He sounds scary, to me. Please take care of yourself!!

I am very sorry. If he gets his life straightened out, I'm sure you'll be the first one he apologizes to. But I wouldnt wait... - Dru




________________________________________________

(by slammed1)
Thanks Drucilla,
I'm certainly glad that you beat the odds and were
able to recover with your H. I sure would love to
do that too, but am feeling that my situation is
pretty hopeless.

H doesn't have any close friends (wonder why ?)
and is not at all close to his family, so didn't
really have anyone to "expose" to. I thought of
talking to his family, however, his Dad has just
been in the hospital with health issues, and may
have lung cancer, so I didn't really want to add
more to their problems, for the time being anyway.
My family and friends do know, and I have good
support from them ,as well as seeing an IC.

It's just so hard to remember that we were doing
things together and making plans for our house,
holidays, etc. just a few weeks ago and now are
having these ugly confrontations and contemplating
D. I know that I've never been perfect, but have
loved my H with all my heart for the 10 years we've
been together, and have tried to do everything I
possibly could to make it a good marriage.
I guess I felt like being patient and putting up
with a lot would earn me some reward,, and this
crap isn't it

Also hard because before we got together I had a
paid-off car, owned my own townhouse, had no
big bills, money for things I needed, traveled,
and did things with friends- basically content
with my life. Now, I have a high car payment,
can't afford to keep our house so will have to
move, and will have a very tight budget, and
have our dog to care for as well. (I am happy
for her company and companionship, but does
add expense and complications to housing,
etc.) Fortunately, my parents do live in the
same town and are trying to be as helpful and
supportive as possible. Likely I will stay in
our house until it sells, then stay with them
for a little while so I can get my finances
in order and look for my own new place.

Sorry,guess I am feeling sorry for myself today,
it's just not where I ever thought I be, and
feels like going backwards instead of forwards
in life. Right now, it is taking all my energy
to make it through a work day, eat a little
something, play with the dog, keep up the house
and get some extra sleep. Does anyone else feel like
they have lost their own identity ?
I feel like I was so busy being "wife"- keeping up
the house, doing the laundry, shopping, errands,
cooking, paying the bills, and "Taking care" of
H that I don't know what to do with just myself
now.

I don't know how to move this to a new thread, if that's
possible. If anyone does, it would be fine with me...
Thanks !
Slammed (Anne)

Good morning Slammed,

Looks like some hits, but not a lot of advise... I'm sorry. You might try searching for threads on Serial Cheaters... but I think the advice is pretty universal: RUN. The HUGE about of introspection, therapy, and healing needed to REALLY change these types is hardly even attempted by the Serial Cheater. I think the best you should do right now is focus on getting a new life going, ASAP. If you need to move, get a job, finalize the D, start thinking about steps you need to take to get these done. I'd seriously get some IC started, too, pronto. You've been traumatized, to say the least.

If you have specific questions, we can help. There is a Divorcing board, too. Please take care of yourself - Dru

Wow...the trip to Vegas followed by an IMMEDIATE need to get divorced?? I'd almost wonder if he got married while he was there, and was trying to legitimize that marriage?

I don't have any good advice on how to deal with this, though you have my good wishes. Hopefully some of the 'experts' here can give you some sound advice!

It's really nice of you Dru to start the thread for Slammed.

Unfortunately, also in my case, if it appears WS's are serial cheaters or have addictions, you do not get a lot of responses. But some may get back to you so keep your eyes open!

Milkshake, Owl, Drucilla- thanks for your replies.

It's definitely a very sad, disappointing and
frustrating situation. H is SO very different
now than when we first met and got together that
it's hard to even comprehend. We dated for 2 1/2
years before we got married, and had about three
years of marriage before any problems or issues
came into our lives.
I've asked my IC if H's apparent mental/emotional
problems are showing up now due to age, some outside
influence, or what her thought are, and she has
suggested that it's most likely just that he's
had issues for a long time, and is having a harder
time "covering" them or dealing with them now,
and may also have some mid-life crisis adding to
them.

H stopped by our house last night to pick up
a couple more items of clothing and to have me
sign the title to a vehicle we are selling today.
As opposed to the night before, he was calm,
quiet and pleasant. I will probably see him
briefly today, as he is to give me my share of
the money from selling the car.
Unless there is some change today, he has not filed
the D paperwork, even though he was in such a huge
rush for it 3 weeks ago- very strange !

Remembered last night that he has just gone
"cold turkey" off the AD's he'd been taking for
three months, so the adjustment to that may
account for some of the bad mood of a couple
of nights ago. I don't know whether or not to
believe that the DR really agreed he didn't need
to be on meds anymore, or if he may have just said
that. As we all know, there is nothing I can do
to get him help with his mental/emotional issues,
possible SA, depression or whatever else he has
going on, that will be up to him, IF and WHEN he
ever decides he'd like to get his act together.

I am doing my best to do a good job at work, keep
up the house nicely, take care of the dog, and
keep my health up. I am also looking into options
for a second or different job, as I need to make
more money. As things get settled, I will know
all my options as far as keeping or selling my
car, and what I'll do about housing.
I am trying to get out a bit more too- doing things
with friends, going to the gym, some social activities,
although I'm can't do too much since my budget is
tight.
Thanks to all for suggestions, thought and support-
Anne (Slammed1)

Nothing too new to report- H's behavior still
really seems very "back and forth" with no clear
pattern or logic I can figure out.

WH called me Friday to see if I would be available
for lunch. I assumed he wanted to finalize the
dealings over the sale of our vehicle, which he
was in a big rush to do. Went to lunch, and it
was pleasant and calm, but he hadn't done the
vehicle sale yet, and didn't appear to have any
particular purpose for getting together- don't
know what was up with that ?????
Went to dinner and hung out with a friend for awhile
that night, and when I got home H had left a message
regarding our dog- again no purpose ????

Didn't see him or hear from him day Saturday although
I expected to see him, as with sale of the vehicle
he'd been driving, I figured he'd be by to pick up
his other car. He was in such a rush to get the
title signed and said he needed to do it quickly,
before the buyer changed his mind, but then didn't
show up until last night. Got dropped off (couldn't
see who) and came in the house briefly. His cell
phone rang, and he disappeared outside for about 10
minutes- I guess he didn't want me to hear the call !
Came back in, looked at his mail, played with the dog,
and left again- seemed in a big rush, as usual, and
said he had to get "home".
I still have not been able to confirm if there is
for sure a OW, but I definitely suspect it since his
behavior is so much Babble and Fog. I also do not
know where he is staying (has been out of our house
for a little over 3 weeks now) but it's either in
a hotel, he rented a little apartment, or is somewhere
with some OW. I lean more towards a hotel or apartment
as best I could tell from his cell records, phone
calls to a particular number (who may be the OW) only
started in August, and I'd think moving in would be
pretty premature- but who knows !!!??

Weekends are especially hard, as the days seem long
and hard to fill. WH and I used to do everything
together, so I very much feel the loss of his
companionship. I did try to make some plans so
I'd have some things lined up to do, also cleaned
out the garage, washed my car, did laundry, errands
and housework, but just feeling alone is never out
of my mind.
It's hard seeing all his things in the house (less a
few clothes and toiletries) but him not being there.
It's hard to see the dog get so excited in the brief moments he's home, then looking for him when he's gone.
It's hard feeling like I'm just there feeling the loss
of my whole life, while he's out having a great time.
Slammed (Anne)


BS- me, 41
WH- 38
Together 10 years, married 7 years
No kids (H has d12 from previous relationship)
Beloved dog is our kid !
2000- H diagnosed with depression and OCD. Has been on
variety of meds, some therapy since.
2001- H has inappropriate internet "flirtation" for 1 mos,
followed by EA with older, recently widowed woman (strange
choice) for 6months). I moved out of house for 1 month.
2002-2004- Recovery (?) Things much better
2005- Strange behavior begins again- H has no interest
in SF, secretive, lies, suspicious websites, begin to
wonder if H is SA in addition to other emotional/mental
issues.
Aug 05- H moved out of house, in huge rush for D, but
has not filed the paperwork.

BUMP for ideas, thoughts, suggestions please

Bumping for Slammed...