... candle from California. [okay, so it's a light bulb - ain't it the thought that counts?]
I also read the walkaway wife article. re-read it actually. The last several months I was trying to do things to keep my H content, and I refused to be baited into any kind of argument .... Yep, he was surprised. Fainted dead away onto his face. Not once, but twice, after he was served the papers. Stayed in bed a week, couldn't keep food down or in. Yep.

And I just wanted to crawl into bed next to him, put my arms around him, tell him it would be all right ... but i didn't. Because it will never be all right.

What I couldn't understand was, why was he so surprised? Hadn't I told him and told him, tried and tried, explained, wrote to him, tried educating him, even suggested he do internet search for Emotional Infidelity. None of it did any good.

Candles, candles, for you dazed. So your wife will wake up and find her way home to you again.

DAZED...

WOW!!! I have to say I'm surprised and the good... no GREAT few hours you've had..... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

I mean AFTER the LBs with her female friend.....

[color:"red"] My heart still belongs to you and it makes him so jelous. He don't understand why its so hard for me. I openly tell him I love you and it kills him.
[/color]
[color:"blue"] My heart still belongs to you and it makes him so jelous. He don't understand why its so hard for me. I openly tell him I love you and it kills him.
[/color]

[color:"green"] My heart still belongs to you and it makes him so jelous. He don't understand why its so hard for me. I openly tell him I love you and it kills him.
[/color]

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" /> THAT IS SOOO AWESOME DAZED!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> PLEASE DON'T THROW YOUR WIFE OUT...
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> PLEASE DON'T DIVORCE YOUR WIFE....

You have been in Plan "A" for less than two months...and let's face it... yesterday should have set you WAAAYYYYYY back.
BUT IT DIDN'T!!!!

I know they mean well...BUT...I can't believe the MB'ers that keep telling you to go to B.... go to D....


One little setback... and they go running for the broom....
(no offense but THIS setback was because of YOUR LBs)

You're stronger than that DAZED... you have GOD working in your marriage... YOU CAN DO THIS!!

They say...NOTHING'S CHANGED.... what about what she said today???? That HER HEART BELONGS TO YOU????? When was the last time she said that?????

And if she REALLY does tell OM that she loves you.... THAT IS HUGE!!!

If you go back to when things were really good a couple of days ago I TRIED to warn you that the BAD side would pull back hard (Maybe your LB's the other day were MY FAULT....I put it in your head I'm sorry...)

And really... what happened the other day? She MAYBE was meeting OM? Well shut my mouth.. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

THIS IS WHAT WSs DO!!!

But look at today!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I think your Plan "A" has more affect than we could have hoped for because....she still is loving today!!!


And let me say you handled today like a superstar!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

I'm SOOOOOOO glad you have a PC with Steve H. tomorrow.... be sure to have some stuff printed so you won't forget anything... LIKE WHAT SHE SAID TODAY!!!


I'm proud of you brother.... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />
Stay on course.... you're doing great today... one day at a time.....

GOOD LUCK & PRAYERS (and candles <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />) FRANK


P.S. BTW.... so what if she files (or filed today) what does that mean??? Maybe to keep OM's big mouth shut (not the best way but....she's so confused) It doesn't mean she can't change her mind right??

I have been reading this thread recently dazed and I think I got most of the picture. You have been taken on a rough ride, my friend, and it is one I know you want to get off soon somehow.

What exactly does she say when you tell her your concerns about the OM's "real" personality? This is something she cannot gloss over or get out of. There is someone out there (the OM's W) who is making some disturbing claims about him. Does she think they are not true? Does she think she can change him? Tell her to take a step back and look at everything. Tell her that she needs to begin getting MC from someone other than OM or other than someone who will tell her what they think she wants to hear. Tell her that she owes it to you to give the OM a break no matter how hard he begs/orders/insists against it to think about all the facts of what is going on. I don't know how she can do this. One way may be to send the D somewhere and take a weekend trip with NO cell phones. Find a B&B somewhere that doesn't even have phones in the rooms. IMO, if she is away from OM for even a short length of time like a couple of days, her attitude will change. He has control over her and you need to break that contact even for just a couple of days. When she comes to you crying about loving you/missing you/whatever, that is the time to ask her. I was in deep to my A. However, after a couple of days of NC, I was feeling a lot different towards OW. I think a lot of what you are saying sounds true. There is a psychological bondage going on here that only a separation can break. Nothing you say or do can convince her of anything while she is still being fed lines by the OM. You can't be nice enough to sway her back to you.

I know you are avoiding Plan B-ing her right now and maybe that is the best decision. However, I am just telling you a fact. The fact is that while she is in contact with the OM - unless he goes wacky psycho on her - you don't have a chance. It is not going to be easy convincing her to go cold turkey on OM. Almost as hard as telling a crack addict to stop. But it can be done and just like a crack addict, she can't wean herself off the OM. It has to be definitive.

Like I mentioned above, plan a getaway. Is there something that she LOVES to do? Hiking? Skiing? Plan a weekend or something revolving around that. Get separate rooms if that makes her more comfortable. Just make sure there are no phones in the rooms and make sure she doesn't bring her cell. I just can't help but think that a couple or three days away from OM will help her clear her head a little. It sure did with me.

You can't trust what is coming out of her mouth. All those "my heart is yours" or whatever are likely not exactly 100% true. I mean they can't be if she is desiring this OM. Don't let down any boundaries because of those things she says. BUT, the next time she starts in with them, ask her about going away. Just make sure it is something she can't say no to - like skiing or other activity!

Keep praying about this dazed. God will lead you if you ask Him to. I was talking to my W about that tonight. That I felt like I was wandering forever. Now, that I have added prayer into my life, I really feel like I am moving in a guided direction. Is your W someone who prays? Have you asked her to pray with you?

Just some ideas, buddy. Take them or leave them. I will be thinking about you and praying for you.

Always, though, protect yourself and your child.

SNT

HEY DAZED....

I just thought of something that might be important... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

My Niece had an A on my Nephew..... She was madly in love with OM and actually went to a motel to meet him to leave before she changed her mind....I shared Plan "A" with him and all the other stuff here....

I now talk to BOTH of them and they are doing MUCH better... NC..... she's honest with him when she misses OM (rarer and rarer..) And she tells me EVERYTHING just before she tells him to be SURE he can handle it...then he talks to me about it after....

This is what I think is important.... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

One of the times my Niece was asking me if she should tell my N something... she told me that she almost went to the OM because....
HE THREATENED TO TELL MY NEPHEW EVERYTHING ABOUT THE AFFAIR...

The Lies.....
The Plans....
(To move out of state and take her/their kids with them...)

All the terrible things she told OM about BS....
All the wonderful things she said to OM...

and the one she hadn't told BS yet....
ALL THE SEXUAL DETAILS.... WHERE... WHEN.....HOW.....HOW MANY TIMES...... WHAT SHE SAID.... WHAT SHE DID TO HIM....
EVERYTHING.....

My Niece told me that THAT alone almost made her "Follow Through" with the A plans because.....

She was SURE that once BS found out THESE THINGS... THEN.... HE WOULD LEAVE AND HATE HER FOREVER.......

Think about it DAZED.... what else does OM have...????
Your W seems to want to come home... BUT... like she said today.... HOW can you forgive her?.....WHY... would you forgive her..
Maybe what she's REALLY saying is...
IF YOU ONLY KNEW......YOU COULDN'T !!!

But she doesn't know what YOU know....that it isn't real and she is being controlled by a dark force that,... well,... you kind of made her vulnerable to....

The sex thing was hard for me... I was lucky my WW OM is 68 years old... so there wasn't much...
But of course it still hurt...the way I dealt with it was:
Neither of us were virgins when we met...
and although her sex was after we married and I have never cheated.... it still isn't something I have been the only one she shared that with anyway.... a little weak... but it helped...

So... MAYBE... when she brings up HOW COULD YOU FORGIVE ME.... if you GENTLY tell her that yes....you are an adult and you are fully aware of what has happened between her and OM..sex and all....

And what they actually DID do... was probably not half as bad as what BSs IMAGINE is happening....NOTHING YOU FIND OUT IN THE FUTURE WILL CHANGE HOW YOU FEEL ABOUT HER....

This WILL help if OM is trying to play that card... (which a lot of OPs use before D day to keep the A going)

GOOD LUCK AND PRAYERS....FRANK

DAZED,,,,

Did you talk to Steve yet?

Dazed.

Ugh. You've jumped all over the place from A to B back to A.
There needs to be a limit on this.

Plan A is supposed to last until you feel your love draining.

I personally believe there is also a point where the WS is no longer receptive to it. I think your wife is there. She is going to feel that your Plan A efforts are pressuring her.

She doesn't want you to be nice to her. Every nice gesture, romantic overture is going to be met with ANGER.

My BS gave me one of our wedding pictures in a new frame, that I was supposed to have at the office. I HATED IT! I stuffed it in a drawer.

What you did with the pictures would have angered me greatly. I would have clammed up just like your wife did. If you would have just said "these were nice memories" she might have listened and agreed. But by throwing her words ("you said we never had a family, and we were never happy...") back in her face and trying to prove her wrong -- UGH! GRRRR!

Do you want to be right? Or do you want to be married?

Stop being superior and flaunting your wisdom at her. Stop trying to educate her. Stop attacking OM -- she HAS to defend him then.

Everyone here tells you to Plan A as long as you can until you run out of energy. I think you need to get out of Plan A because you're starting to do damage with it. You're committing some subtle love-busters with trying to teach her.

I can't thank you all enough for all you help.

At this moment I think its all over for me. I just don't see her ever coming back. That article that Daisy posted is us exactly. My wife reached for me for so long she thinks there is just no way to be happy with me. I have was not there for her and she can'r forget that. My promises for a new life she just can't let in. OM and our bad history work to defect anything I'm doing. I feel there is just no way she is going to see the way home. Even if wants to come, it looks so painful and scary to her.
I have so much to tell you about last night. So much happened last night and this morning.

Last night she left a note saying she would be home at 9:30. While daughter was a practice I decided to go all out and make a setting for us to openly talk and yet be relaxed and even fun.
I cleaned the house, bought a bunch of new candles, a new DVD player, rented some movies including the "story of us", bought her favorite pop, set up the stereo with some good music. I showered and prepared as if it was a date. That was the atmosphere that I was wanting to create. One that the WW would feel good and comfortable being in. I daughter to bed ASAP. I set and waited and waited until 11PM when she came in. Holding a big manilla envolope. She looked around the room and was very surprised. When she came in she set very timid looking on the end of the couch cushion. I whispered for her to come over here as I held out my hand. She walked over not really knowing what to expect. I had her set down on my lap side ways and just held her. The entire time I spoke very softly with her and we set in and listened to music. She was very calm and relaxed being with me. I asked her about going with me and Daughter this week end out of town to daughters swim meet. She gave me a look of confusion. I repeated my offer adding that if you will get into trouble by going with me, then dont tell him. She began to cry. She said she would like to go. (I'm not counting on it).
I caressed her face, hands, and hair. We even shared a couple kisses.
We made some small talk. She thanked me for the house and the jesture with the candles. We moved to the couch because her back was now hurting. I rubbed her hair as we talked. There was no talk about the papers in the that envolope until.... While nearly as sleep she jumps up and says she has to go to the bathroom and put on her PJ's. That's where see used the cell phone to check in with OM.
I did not want to follow her to the door and spy so I did not. I found out this morning she was on the phone with him texting.
I will write to you the messages I found on the phone.

2:56 PM
WW reply to OM-
Yes, I'm gonna go... I'm really doing it... I'm going

12:52AM
WW wrote_
Soon my sweet baby it will be me and you, goodnite c u n my dreams.
OM wrote-
I wish you were here safe from him.
WW wrote-
I'm ok. gonna go 2 sleep now. He will sign the papers. thanks 4 all you have done. I love you. I'm okay.

When she came back out and laid on the couch there was not open and easy conversation. She says, so you know where I was at this afternoon? I was at a law office. Can we go over the papers in that folder. I don't want nothing from you at all. Just joint custody of daughter. No money at all. I said, why now WW. Why did it have to be today? Did you do this for him. She teared up. We talked about his control on her. I asked if he pushed her to file and if he had not pushed would she had done. She said, yes I did tell me it had to be today. It check up on me until I was at the office. I said, why are you letting him control you and set all the rules. He makes you call and check in with doesn't he. She said yes. I asked if he makes her spend lunch with him. She said yes. I asked if she liked being managed like this she shrugged her shoulders. I said, do you like being told what to do and given rules to do it by? She said, he wants me and my time. I like the attention and maybe its nice to know that some one thinks about me and wants me that much.
I asked so you would rather be controled that be given complete freedom that I gave you. She says he is 180 degrees the opposite from you. You did not care where I went and when or who with. He does...
I said, WW do you think he is going to better as time goes by? Why do you like being told what to do now? It makes me feel i count. I said, I know you think my opionin is bias and maybe don't trust me. Please see a IC ASAP. If I pay will you go. She agreed. Maybe just crap.
I asked her to give me the details on the papers.
Still not yelling or speaking loud. Even over the talk about OM. I asked that she come up to stairs and sleep our bed. She said she was fine. I told her I'm not asking. Come upstairs with me. She got up and got into bed. Even smiled at me and laughed when I made a comment about our little dog following her around the world. I rubbed her hair as see went to sleep.
When we woke we hugged several times. WW says, life is like the alarm clock. You know when it goes off and you just want to stay in bed and not go. I feel like that. I just want to stay here in bed with you and not face the world. I wish we could.
We held hands and I told her we can shut this alarm off. She said I no. Just because we have the papers don't mean I have to go through with it. I don't know if it what I want. I just can't keep hurting everyone and myself.
This talk just upsets me and I was not feeling so friendly so I suggested she get in the shower so I can get daughter ready for school. While in the shower, I found the phone messages. I was crushed. Destroyed. I knew that he was pushing her and control freak big time. She used to call me her sweet baby. That really hurt me.
I did not react. I wrote the messages down on a piece of paper in the office. Ran out the door and took daughter to school.
I balled like a baby just as soon as daughter was out the door. With tears still running down my face I opened the door to the house. There was WW balling like a baby and shaking life a leaf. Why do you do this to yourself. Why did you have to read my stuff and just beat yourself up. I'm so ashamed of myself. I'm so sorry. She ran around the house wildly cring. I set at the stairs crying.
After a few minutes she calmed down. Said, I'm sure you hate me now... I asked her if this is what she wants...100% honest no crap. She puts her head down and cried. I asked again, Do you really want a divorce or do you just see no way to overcome the pain. Honest. She said, I don't want to stop seeing him and the pain is to great between us. We are so broken you and I. Look at what I'm doing to you. I can't stop myself. I want to be a good mother but I'm not. I feel sad and worried about you. I feel sick for what I did to you and us. I think its easier for all of us to just move on.
I gave her the Daisy note to read. She read it all and said yes. I tried so hard for you. What so long. I can't get those feelings for you back anymore. I care about you. I'm sad for you. I love you inside and wish this all never happened. I can't go back either. I think its too late for me to have those feelings again for you.
I said, as long as OM is smoothering you will not. Why do you think he is so scared to let you come home to me. He must make you follow rules. He don't trust you. He knows he is a fraud and is so scared you will see through him and come back to me. If he new your love was right and pure he would give you the space to let you think and make your own descions. He knows he can't let you up for air because you might just breath again. I hope someday you see this.
We could have a new life together and love but, not while he is holding you down.
She says, I will have 60 days to decide what to do with those papers. (I didn't by this at all).

Got to run. Be back soon.

Stop this mess!

Dazed, while the runaway wife is true...my wife was one of them...and is home now.

Stop askign if she wants a divorce. If she wants it, let her go get it. You see, as long as you have pushed back and been loving, she has come runnign back to you. When you allowed her fog to be considered (ie the divorce), then she has been given tacet approval by you to continue.

Stop this nonsense. No talk of a divorce ever again unless YOU want a divorce. Who cares what she wants? She is in the fog...she doesnt know what she wants! You are trying to make sense out of nonsense.

In His arms.

Please Please listen to me. I think those are my posts you have been referring to. I was a "walk-away wife." I feel like your wife is my double. Go back and read the last few replies I've done to you.

Give her what she wants -- but on YOUR terms. Make her leave. Shut her out. Take those papers to your attorney. Do not allow her custody of daughter. If your state is like mine, they will take into consieration your daughters wishes because she is 12.

It also sounds to me like she has lied to him. His text says "safe with me." Sounds like she is portraying you as an abuser. Really important for you to act calmly, serenely.

She's being pressured by both of you. She's about to snap. Let her go snap on him. She's going to lose her home, her daughter, her lifestyle, and her view of herself. She's going to suffer greatly. There is NOTHING you can do about that.

Let her crash. Work on making yourself a safe place to return to. Lighthouse -- but from a distance.

Wow dazed...it's about time you got it ok?

Your WW is a master manipulator.

She is! A genius at it!

She is burning the candle from both ends as I told you...she's doing nothing except BLAME SHIFTING!

To OM to justify time spent with you eating cake, she paints YOU as the culprit...a mean, nasty and YES CONTROLLING angry BS...who follows her, DOES control her etc...

and to YOU, Dazed, she justifies time spent with OM eating cake, she paints HIM as the culprit...a controller, follows her, etc...

DO YOU GET IT NOW?

She is like a chameleon...she changes to fit whatever environment, or man, she is around.

I am really worried about her mental health. My xh is just like that. He can be anything and become anybody he wants in a spit second.

She knows what she wants. She is a consummate liar right now and you need to accept it.

You have done a good plan A. I have told you that over and over again.

But she is NOT responding any more positively to it. Instead, she brings home papers, goes to lawyer, etc. I agree with previous poster saying that it seems A is NOT having the effect you desire.

Hence my famous Einstein quote..."The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting the outcome to be different."

Now it was a sweet gesture to make the home nice, buy candles, prepare night as if a "date"...

but come on! She is fogged out! It is almost darn near impossible to make an impression on a completely fogged out WS who can't wait to leave home to have a cake eating spree ok?

The whole instability from her...I do not see her as a "manipulated woman...sad, unsure of her marriage so she seeks out an om"....not at all. I see a woman with serious emotional issues...and her moral compass is totally askew. At some point in her life, she learned how to manipulate men. I don't know when. But it happened. And she's gotten quite good at it.

The real victims here are YOUR family. Sure the OM is a predator...but she does not in reality to appear to be the shrinking violet type either...she is an ACTIVE participant in this affair and YOU need to accept it!

Call the Harleys. I am sticking to the point that if you want her to rethink her reality...the truth of what is really happening here, she has to see what is going to happen..and deal with it.

I absolutely DETEST HER WORDS TO YOU! Words where she said "well I have six months to make up my mind" regarding the divorce...aka, she will file, you'll get the divorce, and she thinks she CAN CONTINUE TO EAT CAKE FOR SIX MORE MONTHS "trying-out the Om" and doing a trial marriage with him while you sit back and fall into emotional ruin...your daughter is in great pain...and she just holds all the cards...she is saying that If she wants to come home to you both, then she will do it when she feels like it if ever.

That is NOT a WS who is close at all to ending an affair.

Please get real. We are indeed praying for you. But also ask God right now to impart wisdom upon you ok?

You're doing same thing over and over ...no change...it's getting worse in fact! She says whatever YOU WANT TO HEAR...so she can get off the hook...she is doing same thing to Om. She will end up making you both crazy...but what is the one thing we don't want you to do?

Become so emotionally hurt as a result of this you lose all respect and love for her.

You're also doing bigger love busters too.. two in 2 weeks to be exact..

B needs to be addressed immediately.

I am really getting weary of saying the same things as I watch this happen. It hurts those who want to help. Like my patients...if they don't take their medicines how can they ever manage the disease processes they are battling?

Please...be one who "gets it" know! You can still save the marriage. It is NOT too late!

But if you do not see the forest for the trees, something worse is going to be the result.

Lexxxy-
Yes- the walk away wife story is yours.

She has filed for a divorce. I have the papers.

Just to add to Peachy's train of thought.

You are becoming fogged. You are latching on to this idea that she has become brainwashed and has no control over her actions. I suppose that makes it easier for you to swallow that she is leaving you. Its not her fault -- its that evil OM. If its not her fault, then you can go on Plan A'ing her and wanting her back.

You think that if you keep talking -- you're gonna somehow get through to her. You don't have that power Dazed. She needs to end this because of her own realizations, not yours.

Go back and look at that text exchange. She is a willing and enthusiastic participant in destroying your marriage. Protect yourself from her.

HI Dazed,

I'm so sorry you had to see those messages... they even hurt ME... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

BUT... you were strong and didn't let her see your pain... AWESOME!!


I hope as I type this you're talking to Steve H.

I agree with Lexxxy and others... you HAVE to stop talking to her about divorce and REALLY have to stop about OM...

JUST HOLD HER WHEN YOU CAN AND LISTEN....

Telling her what OM may or may not do won't help... OM is doing the same thing...scaring her away from you...


This is just confusing her more. She said some really good things last night and today.. she slept in the same bed...she even kissed you... she's not gone yet..

I REALLY REALLY THINK.. she's genuine with you... and lying to HIM now...filed to shut him up... she KNOWS she doesn't HAVE to go through with this...

Before I forget... read my last post..... this may be what's holding her back...please read it it took me a while to write it...

Her finding out that you read her text messages was GOD stepping in....it may make her realize that even with knowledge like this you will still forgive her...

Maybe you could print the post of all the prayers and candles (BLACK OUT YOUR HANDLE OR CUT OUT THE MARGENS SO SHE CAN'T GO BACK AND READ EVERYTHING YOU'VE SAID!!!!! JUST BE CAREFUL WITH THIS...BLACK OUT WHAT I SAID SHE SAID EVEN....)

Let her see that there are a LOT of people praying for your Marriage....and with all that prayer she IS safe...


I hope you're talikng to steve...
GOD BLESS.....FRANK

I agree with Peachy and Lexxxy. Your wife is a master manipulator. She's got you and OM fighting over her like a couple of bull rams. What is OM talking about - he wishes she was with him and safe from YOU?????

This is absolutely CREEPY. Why aren't you in Plan B?

******************edit********************

Thanks for editing this Justuus.... I was just coing back to do it myself....

Dazed...you KNOW I was being sarcastic right??
I just got frustrated with all the Plan "B" "Kick her out" talk.... trying to make them see how they sounded.. (to me) FRANK

Frank:

You are dangerously close to letting YOUR OWN ISSUES AND HANGUPS AND FAILURES AND SUCCESSES play too big of a role here.

This is NOT happening to you again, his (Dazed) WW is not yours. This is a situation removed from your own.

You have called out a number of people for not "being supportive" and the like, yet you post a sarcastically laden post essentially castigating Dazed and others for not continuing on with what YOU want him or feel he needs to do.

I think you are projecting alot of YOUR issues here. Yeah, he may glean "support" from it, so I guess it is all good, but as a health care provider who has suffered from this also (and have been guilty of it here) you need to remember that THIS IS NOT HAPPENING TO YOU. STEP BACK AND REALIZE THAT.

You are taking this way to personally and for your own sake should recongize that.

Lemonman <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Frank,
Whatever.

No one could possibly empathize with his WW more than myself. There is not one post here, where I have called her a name or disrespected her. In fact -- no one has but you.

There comes a point in time where you can Plan A standing on your head, hanging from a tree -- its just not gonna work.

Plan B is also an extremely effective part of the MB program. Dazed is being encouraged to consider it, because we all care about him and hope his marriage will recover.

Okay-
I just spoke with Steve.
He pretty much matches everything that Frank has been saying.
His toughts are I'm doing a great job showing her the door is open. I must first get out of the door way too let her in. Stop all negitive talk about otherman now. He is using the same tact against her from his end. Talk about him is risky and avoid it unless she wants your help when is is bad to her.
Stop lecturing her that is coming off as hurtful and judgemental. You can share your feeling and concerns but don't present in a way that belittles her. This makes me look less attractive.
Continue Plan A and be consistant in my change. Applogize every time she talks about what I did and plead ignorance. Demonstrate the new me and not roll into traps that lead to anger and judgment. Because she will need to feel its okay to come back when it crumbles with him.
When I told he about the text message discovery, he asked if I have been taking anger management courses. Nice compliment. I think I'm still in shock over seeing those words.
Also, gave me advice about the divorce. Recommends that I go to my lawyer ASAP. Ask for primary custody of daughter because OM is not to be trusted.
Do not sign and agree with anything until the 11 O'clock hour. Last minute. Do not cause delays, just dont hurry and use all the time given.
He says plan B is a mistake right now. I need to show her the door is open and its her choice to come back. Plan B and a filed divorce is a tough because of the rules of communication. Also, she will see your choice to Plan B as a angry reaction to her filing. Not a loving road map home.

I have to say that I had expected to find text message trash. It's just the timing and her words that really hurt me badly.
WW responding to OM's afternoon post proves he is pushing her.
Yes, I agree that she has told him lies about me and how horrible I must be and unstable and unsafe. Think about it. It is a horrible lie, however she must do this in order to keep him at bay and justify herself. She don't want him thinking she is a tramp that just dumped me because she was lonely and the reason its taken 8 months to commmit to him is because what I might do if she does. This strings him along and buys her time.

Do whatever the harleys say to do.

However...make sure YOU told them EVERYTHING...

You should however, counterfile against her, claiming adultery...this stalls for time...what you want is time if a plan A is what you choose to do. Plus it helps clear away the fog...the WS wants the BS to sign papers showing it was NOBODY'S FAULT this happened...

they want to slide it under the rug and pretend nothing happened so when they carry on their affair relationship, that it is not met with any resistance...any more than it already has been.

Frank, please be objective btw!

I will side with only a professional...

Caveat emptor:
PLEASE BE CAREFUL LEGALLY..I do not condone a divorce, but will say if a WS is fogged out, and filing for divorce, get an attorney. Make sure YOU and DD are protected legally should the WS attempt to go after full custody. She can pull the "crazy H' card and try to get that. Just be wise, and watch out.

Lexxy:

In a way I have this view of it, and perhaps it is all the same. I think the extreme dysfunction that Dazed lives in daily necessitates some form of "change" whether PLan B or whatever to save himself...F the marriage at this point !!! (Yes, you heard me say that). Let me explain myself. He is "losing it" day by day here. If he continues down this path with ever increasing strength...he will have lost himself...and be himself "broken"...you cannot fix a marriage if you haven't fixed yourself first.

So while it may be thought of by some as "noble" to fight to the death for this marriage, any sane and rational person who can look at the situation OBJECTIVELY can see that Dazed is hanging by a thread here.

Watching this is like watching a car crash in slow motion....Dazed gets banged up and encouraged to go back in the fray becasue somehow his wife's actions are interpreted as "progress" and somehow, someway someone interprets that things are looking good and that his WW is probably lying to the OM and filing divorce just to "shut him up".....and that he is making progress. This fuels his fire and he sees "hope", yet day after day, hour after hour he keeps getting zapped back down to reality.

Do you all know about the experiments that defined "learned helplessness"...the f-ing rat kept getting electrocuted when he went for that cheese.....and eventually he stopped going for it because he knew what was coming (even if it wasn't). Same peinciple taking shape here.


I think PLan B should be about ONE-saving yourself and TWO- the marriage. You cannot have 2 without 1.

Just my take.

Personally, I say Dazed does what ever the he** he wants. I am for personal recovery first, so if HE feels going in there and getting busted up day after day and "taking bullets" and asking "why????????" is his way to salvation...then GO FOR IT.

Please remember that in the end, WE don't live with the decisions that we advise and opine on here. Dazed is 100% responsible for what happens to his life here.

SO, whatever he does, is on his own accord. I am guilty of getting to "personally" involved in the tribulations of others here, and that "line" is easily crossed. When I start to feel personally "hurt" or tied up with too much emotion on someone elses issues.....it is time to re-think things FOR MYSELF. That is the only way that ***I*** am able to crack a chest of a 16 year old kid who dies in the ER trauma bay...tell his mother and father who are obviously grieve striockewn beyon what any of us can probably comprehend, and then go eat a chicken salad and watch the rest of Monday Night Football...and be ready to do it again. I am not saying that people need to be like me..God, no...but just to look at it from that perspective. If we all get too bogged down with our own projections and issues when helping others, how can we really help them?

Everyone should be wary of theor own "line".

Lem <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />