I am seriously wondering if there is a difference in the pain felt by BS and that experienced by truely remorseful WS. Can anyone out there who has the misfortune to have played both roles articulate the similarities and differences??

I know that the WS has to deal with a lot of issues, but there is no way that their issues can begin to match to pain, disappointment and disgust that a BS feels. This is not to be judgemental but as a BS I feel like that I had to not only handle the emotional degutting that occurred as I found out the truth but also had to deal with and live with all the things that I know now that I could have done to prevent the A from happening in the first place. So IMHO, I think that BS has the same feelings of guilt and remorse as the WS plus the horrifying feeling of the betrayal.

BS (me) 41
FWS 39
M: 18 yrs
PA: 3/1994 to 11/94
NC for a long time
D-Day: August 26, 2005
Recovering and very satisfied in current relationship since D-Day.

No the pain is not the same, but neither or worse or better, and in actuality - being a WS for me was even a little harder to deal with.

Here's why - as a WS I only had myself to blame, - i wasn't a victim, it wasn't done to me, I did it all on my own, and the weight of that reality was very hard for me to handle. Everything pointed back at me. As the BS, I knew I had some blame - but it was my H's actions, and there was anger towards him, hurt towards him, and not just to myself. I didn't have to bear the pain of shame as a BS which to me was harder to bear.

This doesn't mean because I was a WS first the BS didn't hurt me as much - there was a debate on here about it once. I still lost the weight, puked my guts out, couldn't breath, didn't sleep for months, had nightmares, got uncontrolably mad...but because my A contributed to why he had his or because I understand affairs did it make me hurt less then anyone of you - maybe? But let me tell you - my world almost fell apart - after 7 months of recovering and changing, and bearing the guilt and remorse of my A, to have H have an A was so hard to grasp - why would he do this after he KNEW what it did to us - how could he want to make me feel what he felt.

The BS's pain is hard and it cannot be compared to a WS pain as it really is different - The pain of being BS was pain put on me, while the pain of being a WS was pain I put on myself.

As the WS i let myself down, my family down, my friends down and most of all my husband down. I was such a failure - and hurt and almost lost everyone I loved and I had no one to be angry with or blame but myself. This is not easy to get up everyday and even want to smile when you are carrying this - all you want to do is die.

As the BS my H let me down, he hurt me and was willing to give me up. And while I had some blame...it was his actions, and I was angry, and I was hurt, and I was confused. But it wasn't all on me. So the pain was very different.

Well I rambled so I dont know if I made sense - but there you have my take on it anyhow.

What Dorry said!

Do you think it is too soon to offer w/s sympathy for all the guilt and shame of hurting me? I do feel so sorry for my w/h.
I remember as a young girl, having an accident with this elderly man at the roller skating rink. Our wheels connected and he fell backwards and cracked his head open. I was so traumatized I stopped rollerskating and remember how horribly guilty I felt. It was the worst feeling I have ever experienced, minus being betrayed by my husband. I thought of that elderly man for a month solid, and cried buckets of tears.
So, when I know my w/h has felt such shame and guilt over the pain he has caused me, I would love to reach out and try to comfort him.
Would that be counter-productive????

Dorry,

How is it that you say your own A was all on you...and yet you seem to feel blame for your H's A? Two wrongs don't make a right?

Or, do you believe he never would have except for yours? Was it a revenge thing?

I think it might also be impossible to relate to the feelings of the BS side of things just coming out of your own A... The other thing, the A has some positive feelings associated to it for the WS... the BS generally has not got one single positive emotion for xx period of time, and then, when WS comes home, the euphoria of the homecoming is generally ruined because of withdrawl!

I'm trying to associate the feelings of guilt/shame to just raw pain BS side of things, but my mind can't make the connection yet....question: How many FWS suffered from PTSD? How many BS's do?

I don't take blame for my H's affair - but I do know that my affair contributed to the downward cycle he was in. I take responsibility for causing that hurt.

The way I see it is that H contributed to some the problems in our marriage that hurt me and allowed me to justify my actions, (although I do believe that if I had learned better commnication skills, he would have contributed nothing), anyways - even though he contributed to the state of the marriage - MY ACTIONS WERE MY ACTIONS and there is no one to blame but me.

And in the same way - my A contributed to his hurt and his pain which allowed him to justify his actions. but HIS actions are HIS actions and I am in no way responsible for them - no more than H is responsible for my actions.

I wasn't just coming out of an affair, I was 6 months out of withdrawel completely and had made some amazing changes in my life. My H had been on board in recovery for 4 of those months, and then I watched him start to follow a path that was all too familiar to me, and desperately tried to keep him off that path, and in my attempts possible pushed him further away.

It was no a revenge thing - he truly began the same negative cycle that all ws's go on - rewritting history, living in a fantasy. He met someone, and actually planned a future with her. He left me 2 weeks after he met and fell in love with her. He continued to plan with her for another month, until they met in person and consumated their fantasy relationship. He had no intentions of returning. This devestated me - not only had he had an affair - but he abandoned me, after all my changes, all my work, all my remorse - he betrayed and abandoned me. And even though I could say I did the same, saying that only made me hurt worse, not relate it or feel better.

After his weekend with her, he realized many things about her that reminded him of me, and also realized that he would have to change who HE was in a new relationship,and he liked who he was, and realized part of who he was is ME! So he called and confessed. A week letter I moved back home.

During these 3 months that this all took place over - I was not close to my affair anymore, and so dedicated to our marriage and so in love with my husband and so willing to do whatever it took to make things work - read my old posts - you will see. And to be honest - his affair and his leaving me took me by surprise. I was very hurt, shocked and disappointed in him. I had put him on this high horse that he was somewhat better than me (wrong of me) so my world and vision of him came crashing down.

My withdrawel only lasted 3 days, as my affair was not a love torrid affair, but more of an addiction affair...I was not planing a future with my OM, or dreaming of leaving my H. While in my H's case he was planning a future with OW and did leave me. I still to this day do not understand his reasons or justifications for his affair...they are so different than mine and he doesn't understand mine either. We only agree we both know how the negative cycle can get you to this place that allows you to cross the line. And we agree we both hurt eachother more than we ever thought we could.

I do not believe that the hurt of the guilt/shame are the same as the raw pain of the BS, but it is pain - I can't describe each pains - but both killed me. With being a WS, I almost drove myself to the hospital one night as I no longer wanted to live and felt I deserved anyone and that everyone would be better off without me...as a BS, with H leaving and having his affair, my world fell apart, everything that had been stable for me, my lighthouse from my affair, my rock had broken and I had nothing in the end - and I wondered how life will go on, and I was sick and I was terrified and I was lost.

They were different pains - but both more painful then I ever want to experience again.

Wow. Thanks. I really appreciate the input. Almost 2 years since Dday, I still wake up each morning with the same pain. I often look at my FWH and wonder, "do you feel any pain anymore over what you did." It isn't that I really want him to. He has tried so hard to be the best possible husband. I guess that I still miss seeing him as the perfect man that I though he was, even if he really wasn't. I still love him so much, but it just isn't the same and I am so sad all of the time.

It was not pleasant...being struck with the reality of being betrayed AND facing (after 9 years) the cold hard truth of the horrific thing I had done to another human being. I always thought better of myself and having to face that was not nice, but I am a better man for it now.

Now that I have "Discovered the Dusk of my Day has reached its Dawn", the two issues were inextricably interwined and I don't care to know which was worse...thats time better spent on the present instead of looking rearward for no desired result.

I came out of this mess knowing I will never be a part of infidelity again...that's all I need.

It just sucked...

Life is sure more complicated that I would have ever thought. The only person who got away clean here seems to be the OW. But then, I don't really know if that is true either since she lives on the other side of the country and there has been nearly 2 years of NC. I guess the role of the OP is one I sometimes ponder. I sure would like to believe that I could never be one. It has been difficult enough for me to look back at the time I now know that my FWH spent with OW. Given that she claimed undying love for my H, I'm not sure how she could have stood the knowledge that he still spent 90% of his time with me.

I do know that I could never be a WS now. I also know that if my FWH ever had another A, it would be the deal buster because no way could I ever go thru this pain again. I am pretty darn certain that just moving on to heal would be easier.

The devastation of a BS is incomparable. The weight loss, sleepless nights, puking, etc. was harder than anything I've gone through including multiple miscarriages and loss of a parent. But now it very rarely crosses my mind, and until I read what a new BS writes, I've often forgotten how bad it was at the time.

Whereas while injuring someone else through adultery caused a lot of pain and misery at the time, it was nothing like how I felt as a BS. BUT it is something I have to live with forever. And as WHnowBS says: I discovered intimately what I had put someone else through almost 20 years earlier. In fact, I looked upon some of the pain I experienced as a BS as amends for what I had done to another woman long ago. To finally really and truly walk a mile in her shoes.

However, I think the problem lies in trying to compare the two. The pain of guilt/remorse and the pain of betrayal are enormously different.

Perhaps if you think of a medical comparison it might give you a better understanding.

The pain of a BS is trauma, emergency rescue procedures, life and death -- a knife thrust into the heart, interfering with your breathing and your very survival.

The pain of a WS is like (I imagine) cancer to be -- slowly, eating away, popping up in unexpected ways, never leaves you. Even in remission (remorse and amends), it can still come back to haunt you and it never ever leaves you.

Merge

I have been on both sides of the coin. I like what a previous poster said about I just don't want adultery in my life anymore, mine or his.

The pain as a FWS is very real, once the remorse sets in. I woke up one day and realized what I had become. I was filled with such self loathing and guilt. It rocked me to my core, I did not know who I was anymore. BUT, I was accountable, I could exercise some control in my life. I could choose not to be that person anymore.

As a BS, I feel so powerless. I did not ask for this, I want to be the innocent victim. I can not change anything about this, but how I perceive it. I don't want to join the first wives club, I don't want any of this. I hate the powerlessness.

I have been in screwed up situations before, and I could usually pin point where I had caused the ship to run off course. But being a BS, I don't have that "that is where I screwed up" moment. As a WS, I could DO stuff, be accountable, be transparent, take a very active role. As a BS, nothing seems to help but patience, and that does not get me what I want.

I have anger and rage as a BS. As a WS, I had self loathing and repulsion, both very painful. I do think that a remorseful WS has alot of pain, but a BS is going to have ****** regardless. A WS can choose to run away and justify and try to pretty it all up, a BS just has the crappy clean up job. I hate the powerlessness.

I've been both.

To me there is no contest -- being a WS nearly destroyed me.
Being a BS hurt, but being a WS hurt 10x worse.

I guess, that for me, what rubs the most is the lack of control and decision making authority the BS has. My FWH CHOSE to have an affair. No one forced him to do it. At some point he DECIDED that he could and would do it, that IT would be WORTH it. I had no say in it. Guess it has left us both wondering if he had said to me, we need to work on our marriage, we need to discuss thus and thus or I WILL have an affair, would things have gone differently. In the end, my FWH is ashamed, he is sorry, he is remorsefull. But, he seems fine. I, on the other hand, am still a mess in many ways. I don't choose to walk in his shoes for comparison of which role hurts the most.

What I don't understand is folks who are repeat offenders. Why in the heck would any one ever do it again knowing how EVERYONE gets hurt?

Because such people (and there are a LOT of them) have NO character. They only think of THEMSELVES and relentlessly pursure what THEY want, not giving a tinkers [email]D@MN[/email] about anyone in their way.

I don't know if they ever see the light, but they will be by themselves once the "bloom falls off their rose" as they get older...nothing like a 50+ year old "swinger" huh?

They'll be on barstools by themselves, looking back on the wreckage of their lives (numerous ex'es, kids that don't want anything to do with them)and wondering HOW they got there! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

It's really pathetic that such people don't CARE what they do to anyone, as long as they are "living in the moment". <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />

OOPS! a little bitterness just leaked out! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

I have not been on both sides, just being a BS... but I would still like to comment.

I agree with Merge in that you cannot compare the two (BS vs. WS)... and I'll go a step further and say that the pain and suffering is different for each individual.

My parents are ministers and spent most of their ministering in the social services field of The Salvation Army. I spent much of my youth, including every Christmas morning, down at the hostel and rehab centres where they were working. To see the men and women who lived in the hostels and how they lived was very sad and disheartening. Why do some people end up as transients, with addictions they cannot control, as "bums on the streets"? They faced life challenges like all of us but for some reason they could not cope? Why did their divorce, their loss of work, their ______ challenge leave them in such a state where others are able to rebuild, cope, move on.

I think the pain and suffering hits us all differently depending on many factors... their upbringing, their religious or moral beliefs, their experiences, where they are at emotionally in their life (what other stresses), what they believe as to entitlement and how life works, whether or not the spouse is working at the M, if there are kids involved, the length of the A, how you found out, who the OP is, etc., etc..

I know that my WW is struggling with guilt and shame and it didn't help when I said that the hardest thing for me to move forward is now knowing what she is capable of.

I think we try to find answers based upon other people's experience... and it does help... but we have to remember that each of us are different and the affects of the A will hit us all differently.

We just need to know that it hurts like ****** irregardless of whether we are the BS or WS.

Shaden

WHnowBS,

There is nothing quite like getting old to put things in their proper perspective. At 52, I wouldn't go back to the old pre-affair WhoMe at any age. I like the new me better. I am a little less self confident and a lot more vulnerable, but I am more caring, compassionate and open with my FWH. Something lost, something gained too....sometimes I have to keep reminding myself of that everyday.