Luna,

This Plan B has been so good for you! You sound like you have found your path to recovery. I am happy for you and your children, that you have your mother close enough to visit!
Continue, my friend, continue!

C42, Kim, LT: thanks for popping by.

quote:----------------------------------------------------
Glad you had a good visit with your mom...I bet she loves her kid too.
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Nooooooooo doubt about IT!

Kim - quote:----------------------------------------------
I am amazed at how calm you seem through all of this. I feel like I am about to bust.
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Kim, hang in there, you haven't been in PLAN B long enough. You'll get there too. You believe me, don't you?

LT - quote:------------------------------------------------
This Plan B has been so good for you!
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LT, read your thread, you're doing pretty good, too.

Update: Just to refresh your memory, WS rented apt one block away from me, so the likelihood of running into each other is high. Soooo, ran into him at the bank! Just said 'hello' and went along my business.

One of my new objectives - asking myself on a regular basis about 'how I feel' and letting myself feel it: pain, joy, sorrow, peacefulness, etc. because it's one of the things I wasn't doing much before - too busy thinking about others!

So, asked myself how I felt about seeing him: I still care about him very very much (won't say 'love' because I am totally confused about this term seeing how it is being used to describe how WS feels about OW), I know I would not want to be in his place - because it would mean having to comprise some of my most fundamental values and I would have a hard time looking at myself in the mirror, actually I would have a hard time 'living' with myself if I were to choose a life that would be at the expense of my family. I would not be able to 'enjoy' anything if the cost was the care and safety of my family.

I was surprised that I wasn't 'angry' at him, and didn't blame him for where I was at. I chose to enter into a M with this man - with promises, but no guarantees. I am now living with the consequences of that choice.

I now choose not to continue to be part of his life if OW is involved as well. I am impressed at the courage that I have shown in doing what it takes to do so (not easy, could have chosen: compromise on my values, lose self-respect, take crumbs!) I chose what I believe to be the high road (simple long-term but hard short-term), rather than the low road (difficult long-term but easy short-term).

I am working hard at seeing this as a 'new' page in my life and to look forward to its new challenges and adventures. It's not what I would have chosen, but, hey, let's make the best of it! One thing I can say for sure: WS is no longer totally occupying my mind, and the pain is less acute!

Again, the role the MB board has played in all of this is priceless!

Like some, I do wonder sometimes how helpful it is to continually read, discuss and share about affair(s). Right now I must feel that my doubts are being overweighed, because I am learning so much from all of you, want to share with all of you, and do want to support quite a few of you - simply put, I like being part of this group, and there is no better reason for being part of anything!

Thanks.

P.S. ....and most importantly... being part of MB board is not at the expense of anybody I care about!

Bumped.
For no other reason....other than following Hurtin.
(I am very easily influenced!)

Luna,

You sound great. I am so impressed with how you are handleing all of this.

I hope to get to that point myself. I believe I will in time. I think once I can get this court thing behind me and know he is having to pay will help me a lot. Right now I just feel so overwhelmed with all of this.

Keep up the great work your doing. Your an inspiration believe me.


Hurting

Hi Luna,

I imagine that was strange running into WH at the bank--as if you were running into someone you once knew. I bet he finds it surprising that you jave reacted the way you have in Plan B!

How are you otherwise? Fill us in. Have any interesting plans for the holidays? Hope all is going well.

Hi Hurtin,

quote:----------------------------------------------------
I hope to get to that point myself. I believe I will in time.
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You know you will!

Hi Ahuman,

Thanks for asking. Well. I am surprising myself. Getting back my sense of humour - definitely a good sign.

...I am actually enjoying being by myself more and more!...going to movies, reading, meeting friends...and of course, my week with the boys...

I still wish I could continue sharing my life with H - but since he's not available.....I am moving on! I promised myself I would never ever consider sharing life with a WS! YUK! I do regret 'abandoning' me.... I was vulnerable... by trusting too much, I gave MY power away (one of Dr. Phil's favourites)..and WS took advantage of it... I came to MY rescue with.... you got it! PLAN B!?! As Mortarman keeps reminding us: it does give back the BS control over their lives (with added benefit of maybe helping WS to wake up before it's too late)

I am tapping in to my 'adventurous spirit', which I had not 'visited' for so long that it took me a while to find it again. It is true, that like years of not using a bike, it all comes back...stronger than ever.

WS became a major major threat to my well-being...in fact, did a lot of damage....but I will learn from my injuries and respect them.

God, was I thrown off or what by WS....back in the Spring. I know it was hard for some of you to see me down and watch me continue to 'stay down' and do nothing...but your support was priceless...(I remember well your concerns for my wellbeing, Ahuman)....and I think and hope that all of you know that...and never question the value of your input and support!

I am doing much much better with PLAN B. Although hard, it is the best plan in a bad situation: it stops the bleeding (by removing MYSELF from the chaos of triangle) and give a chance for the healing process to start (whenever) and I wholeheartedly agree with ARK and others.....and can now see it better: that WS is most definitely not in a 'happy place' no matter what he SAYS or DOES. PLAN B will maybe give him the space to figure out what he wants out of life, too!

No 'specific' plans, because my emotions are all over the place...busy trying to figure the 'messages' they are trying to tell me, since I ignored them for so long.

Lawyers have not yet been involved in the process...unless WS force me to (like in Hurtin's case), I will get there at my own pace.

With each day away from the chaos, peacefulness is finding room in me to settle in.

The holidays will be difficult and challenging, a lot of triggers, but not unsurmountable if I take it at my pace...give my emotions a voice....figure out what my needs are...and than act (rather than react) on how to best meet them...by myself, or reach out (which I am also getting better at)....

I appreciate my life as it is. I can't think of a better place to be at.

...Huh... as usual....getting carried away here....don't want you to be sorry you asked!

All of you here will have a special place in my heart because of your honesty, your courage, your stamina, your concern for others, your humour, your generosity, your inquisitive minds, your willingness to learn...your recognition of the value of a life, no matter what...a BS...a WS...the children... all important enough to make the fight for a better world for each of us all worthwhile!

I thank you all from the bottom of my heart.

Luna ... you've come a long way baby ! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Thanks, Pep....appreciate and value your comment!

Luna,
My Plan B friend, you are doing well. That is so good to see. At the beginning of Plan B, I was thinking "So where is the peace and self empowerment that people talk about here?" It didn't come immediately, did it? For me, it took about 6 weeks for it to start appearing briefly. Now the peace and calmness stays for longer periods.
It is nice to know that I have a Plan B companion, that knows exactly what I am going through at this moment in my life. Thanks for checking in on my thread so regularly!

Hi Luna.


What a wonderful example you are, Luna.

How is S9 doing? Hopefully he's well on the mend by now.

Alph.

LT, Alphin, thanks for dropping by.

S9 will be seeing dentist on Monday again to better evaluate what to do next. His morale is good though.

I would appreciate your comments please:

If some of you don't know, I am in PLAN B, and share custody of two boys, S9 and S14. No legal process initiated yet by either one of us. WS has rented an apt one block away and we alternate one week each taking care of the boys. At the moment, the boys are aware of OW, but WS does not 'impose' her on them (she has own apt and I believe WS spends with her the week I have boys - sounds to me like WS is into compartmentalizing!)

My adolescent in particular is unhappy about how 'things' are the week he is at his Dad's. I am not surprised. This is a big change for the boys - going back and forth - only seeing and dealing with us separately. S14 and WS tend to be 'confrontational' in their exchanges, and I guess the situation we're in is not helping.

I know S14's solution to his problem would be to stay with me all the time (because he has told me so).

Although this does 'tear' at my heart, I am not prepared to do this because....

.....I don't think it's a solution to his problem in building a relationship with his dad, and just 'dealing' with me all the time may not be so healthy for either of us, and then.....what about S9?

...I also see it as a way of S14 to avoid dealing with issues, and I don't want to encourage CA solutions in his life

...besides the legal issue, deep down I know S14 (and S9) need dad in their lives (inspite of all his faults and now being in fogland), and so I encourage and try to help S14 on how to best deal with his dad, like, being honest about how he feels, think of suggestions to make about daily routine arrangements

...but the most important reason is that, I believe that the two brothers need to stay and move around 'together' and build and work on the relationship with each other and their dad, both for their benefit, for now and in the future; they play together, enjoy each others' company, and they do love each other (although don't ask S14 to admit it!) and have shared happy moments and now painful ones

...I guess knowing that what would best meet their needs is being in a family with two parents working and 'living' together...caring and protecting them....they are getting shortchanged... and I am feeling powerless and guilty in knowing that I cannot control the fact that WS has chosen to move out

...since I cannot control this, the next best thing, I believe, is to encourage my boys to develop as good a relationship as possible with their dad, and their brotherly relationship, and not 'separate' them on top of everything!

WS may be in the fog and can't see it, but when I look into my boys' eyes....I do see the pain...and it hurts me...but I won't deny it....it needs to be recognized....and I know that our separation will be a 'critical event' in their lives, and not necessarily a happy one

I guess I am feeling the pain of having to see my boys in pain.... Well, then, what I can do is help them to realize that one can overcome pain....by showing how I am doing it....one day at a time...trust themselves and have confidence in themselves to be able to make it through it rather than avoid it....

It's not easy seeing those we love experience pain...

I know I don't want my S14 to be disappointed in me...but he may be feeling so...he may even be feeling like he's reaching out to me and I am not helping him... and so feels abandoned and alone.... no matter what I say to him...

I want S14 to be able to count on me, but I don't want him to expect that I will do whatever he asks of me... and I have to expect and accept that S14 may not understand my reasons for doing or not doing something right now

I keep hearing about the resilience of the human spirit....I am counting on it, for myself and my boys...

Thanks for reading me, I know for sure that it has been helpful for me to share.

Luna,

I really don't know. This is a tough one.

I put myself in your D14's shoes. I can understand how he feels like a ping pong ball being bounced back and forth. It's tough being a teenager. Your not a kid any more and your not an adult yet either. Do teenager's have rolemodels of how a teenager should or could be... I mean positive ones? He needs a stabile place to call his own. He doesn't want to live a double life. He also does not want to be have of a set of brothers... teenagers are developing their sense of individuality.

Luna, I think that I would let my son live with me and encourage him to visit his father whenever he wants. He is just a block away.

Just my opinion. But that is me. I think that you should think on this, talk to your son more. Then reevaluate and go with your gut feeling. You are a good mother and a good person. You'll make the right decision.

Luna -

I know exactly how you feel about your children. I have spent quite some time thinking about my own son and how this might be effecting him.

I am just amazed every time I come to read your thread about your emotional maturity. Encouraging the relationship between your children and their Dad. Even though WH has done something so wrong. That is a hard thing to do.




I believe this is happening for you - you might not realize it right now, but you are so on your way.

Hugs!!

Kim

Hi Luna,

I can see what you mean about CAing, but at the same time you want to encourage your boys to have the relationship with their father--so letting them make choices in that relationship is part of that, don't you think? Afterall, just being physically present at his Dad's doesn't mean he is not CAing already, maybe he goes there and clams up and doesn't talk about the problems.

Maybe him confronting his father face-to-face and telling him on his own WHY he doesn't want to go there anymore and letting him take a stand is a way NOT to CA. This at least would put the issue on the table and give the people involved (WS and OS) an opportunity to deal with it.

What does S9 think about this? Does he want to keep going even without S14?

Poor guys, I feel for 'em.

LT, Kim, Ahuman,

Thanks for the input.

I don't think I want to put S14 (or S9 for that matter) in a position of having to choose between their two parents, or that they CAN choose, because I do feel they need both of us to be part of their lives, and I think it's a dangerous road to start putting that kind of decision in their hands, yet. WS may be less emotionally available to them (because he's in fogland) but I know he loves boys very much and is capable of taking care of, at least, their physical needs (meals, clothes, etc.) without even considering his 'legal' parental right.

So far, WH has not imposed OW on boys (who has her own apt and I believe WH stays with her the week I have the boys).

I am trying to see what S14's frustrations are....they seem to be related to typical adolescent ones....wanting to stay out later and later...monopolizing phone..... so S14's solution of staying with me would not resolve these....may think they would be....and actually be more frustrated....
his focus at his age are activities with his circle of friends...he's at home for meals and evenings during the school week, otherwise he is becoming independent and organizes his own weekend activities, etc.

Also, if S14 starts staying with me, only seeing his dad whenever he wanted to, he would probably choose not to see him very much. Deep down, although I would enjoy having him stay with me, because we do get along better, I don't think it would be in his best interest long-term to have his dad out of his life.

Also, if S14 were to stay with me, I know that S9 would really be divided...and would definitely be unhappy being the only one going at his dad's...may be wanting to also stay with me, but I know he loves his dad very much, too... My gut feeling is to keep the boys together as long as possible somehow.... it may not be so important now, but I think it will be for their future relationship....to have had each other, at least.

Definitely, when S14 turns 18, I will allow him to stay with me, if he so chooses, and then I will see about what to do about the 'younger' brother...who by then will be l3!

Actually, S14 and S9 are turning S15 and S10 in December... The boys are growing and WS is lost in fogland and BS is sometimes overwhelmed with coping with the whole thing...

I am keeping a close check on this.

God, a year ago I had a family, now it seems to be going all to pieces!

I would appreciate it if others with a similar situation - children not being keen on going to WS's place - letting me know how you are dealing with it. Thanks.

Luna,

I know my sitch is different in the fact my WH lives with the OW but I have told my DS(15) I want him to spend as much time with his dad as he wants. Now I do not want over nights because of the living arrangements and WH knows this. But lucky for me DS does not want to be out there anyhow.

I have allowed DS to make the plans with his father. I don't push or prod him into going if he does not want to. So WH sees DS mostly on Saturdays and so far DS is ok with this. Since I have allowed him to make the choice I think it has worked out to something DS can handle.

I understand your feelings of wanting your sons to be together and bonding. But I also feel your DS should be allowed to make his own choice he is old enough. We have to remember your WH chose his path in life and if DS does not want to be part of it that should be his choice. So if it makes WH uncomfortable thats his problem he made the ultimate descion to leave his family so now he will reap the repurcussions of it.

This is just MVHO and take it with a grain of salt, you know what is best for you and your kids.

Take Care,

Hurting

Thanks for your posting, Hurting.

I have decided to encourage S14 to work on his relationship with his dad but, if it gets to be too difficult, he will have the option not to go over to his dad's place. I also left WS a message about this - that I am leaving the door 'open' for S14 to stay with me if things get 'too heated' between them (hoping also that this may encourage WS to work on his relationship with S14 - and not take it for granted - because that's not the case). It would be sad for both of them to be out of each other's lives, even temporarily, but...it may very well get to be yet 'another' consequence of WS's decisions.

I talked to OWH. I hadn't for a while. Wanted to see how things were proceeding from that end. Separation of assets continuing to take place. House up for sale. OWH was trying to slowly move on, so I don't think we will be in touch much (unless something major happens). Reported that he had met with OW (his wife) and basically confirmed what we all know here (difference between WS and S) because he felt like he was talking to 'another' person and not the wife of 27 yrs.: very nervous, uptight, no talking from the 'heart'....feverish...were his exact words. Confirmed that her adult children (which he helped raise) had been introduced to my WS, but refuse to 'accept' him with open arms as mom's choice/no questions asked. Apparently OW's family really celebrated the holidays and this year, I guess, is really going to be different, because he was not prepared to 'act as if....' just for the children and grand-children...he tried a few times already... afterwards he was physically sick (had anxiety attacks - ended up in the hospital) and did not want to put his health on the line anymore. He seems to basically be going for PLAN B/D. It seems OW is getting a 'reality check' from her end of the family.

Also, just thought I would let you know about some interesting reading I have been doing lately (it's in French), but apparently author is following theories based on concepts put forth by Marshall Rosenberg and the organization called The Center for Nonviolent Communication (website: http://www.cnvc.org/). Really really interesting - in case you have some time on your hand and want to check it out!)

By the way, S14 was doing much better last night, less discouraged and upbeat. Never underestimate the benefits of sharing, it seems to lighten the load, but I tell you, I don't think there is anything harder than to see/hear someone you love feeling pain. After 'toughing it out' and 'being there', it was my turn: I called a friend to share and lighten MY load...and the circle goes around.

I have got to tell you that I have been doing some lurking...and I am not sure if it's me or the posters..or both...but particularly today when I was reading some of the postings I caught myself laughing out loud...

Hi Luna,

What is the name of the book? I may be interested in it.

Good luck in working things through with your son.

I see the wisdom in this, Luna.

It's got me thinking about Christmas. Maybe I should tell my daughters that they are to spend Christmas with WH and the inlaws. Circumvent a powerstruggle with WH and relieve my children of an anguishing choice.