waiting, it really was a wonderful gesture, though! That is the kind of stuff that does deposit love units even though you can't see it right now. Unfortunately, she is just not responsive now. But, I wager she will be. You are on the right path and are doing exceptionally well!

[quoteAlso, not to provide too much info (TMI) but we have always slept buff <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" /> since day one 21 yrs ago. During 1st EA withdrawel and counseling she went to PJ's for awhile.[/quote]

Thank heavens this board is ANONYMOUS!!

Sigh.

We have always slept naked - my wife does like undies and a singlet - but she always has.

When she had just come home, we slept in seperate rooms for a couple of nights - I basically told her if she didn't want to sleep with me she could sleep in the office on a mattress on teh floor - not real understanding I know. Silly thing is even though she could barely look at me or speak to me and couldn't stand being close to me, that first morning when she came home, She walked in on me in teh shower. We have always followed each other into the shower so I was really pleased with the way things were at the time that she didn't have a problem letting me see her naked every morning - I couldn't touch her even if she was dressed mind you, but boy, the sight of her did keep me from going crazy for a few weeks before she decided to exorcise some demons with some nice SF one night.

It was just strange that she let me see her naked when the withdrawal was so acute and her feelings so ttrong for the OM. Also weird is that the day before I discovered her affair, we were making love in the usual enthusiastic manner - couldn't quite figure that one out either - asked her about it a couple of weeks ago and she basically said that it would have been a dead give away of the affair. The OM was pretty PO'd when he found out we were still doing it too especially when he hadn't made any headway in that area!

Ah. I am so glad she never could bring herself to do it with him even in the 2 weeks she was gone from home. There but for the grace of God.

Wed morning we both have a phone consult with SH together. We talked to other MC today and she is big time in the fog. I am so drained about her tude. I hope SH has good luck tommorow. She is so confused on what the real issue is.

I am just tied of not getting a feedback from her. I need something from her. She told the MC today that she is just tired. Oh my gosh, she is tired. I am tired. We "dance" around each other and like she is the hurt one.

I just need a breakthrough. Maybe Wed morning will bring that. I pray to God it will happen. I feeling like this. I looking at other couples and being jealous for that picture again in my life. I feeling like my dog gives me more love and affection than my wife. She is actually glad when I come home.

I work hard all day. Come home, work hard around the house. No deal. No appreciation for the fact that I provide a good living, a good home, am a good Dad, she never wants for anything, I bust my chops and she can't feel for me.

Poor wife, just can't bring herself to feel for me. She had no problem falling in love with someone she really did not know anything about in less than 3 months.

After 20 years of marriage, where does that leave me. My MC today asked us to write down some things that we where sad about about the other person taking in our lives.

I really don't understand the point, but one thing I am really ticked off about is that my wife took away my feeling of trust in a marriage. I look at her lips and don't see her lips and how lucious they are. I see something some other creep kissed and the fact that she actually went to him.

Oh God, <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> I pray for a breakthrough tommorow. I really do. I pray I will be able to forget things like this. I pray for a normal life. I pray for the day I become a dad again without the baggage trying to do battle to hold our marriage together. I pray for a time of peace to feel like I can go to my wife who used to be my best friend and just talk about stuff.

She seems to forget we actually had a relationship before. It is so painful. God it is so painful and I feel like such a whining pitiful male that has no confidence. I used to never be the way.

I was strong and sure of things. Sure I had doubts about stuff, but now my life is completely turned upside down and she can't bring herself to smile at me or be a wife to me or even act like a friend.

Sex, kissing, conversation, none of that was a problem before her little affair and now she makes everything seem like it was a problem.

I may be slow at times, but I promise I am not crazy. We did have a good relationship that worked.

Oh my God, please forgive me for ranting. Fellow MB buddies, please forgive me for sounding so pitiful.

Maybe the sunshine and a call from SH will change the outlook tommorow.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

All I can say is I know EXACTLY how you feel. I was in the EXACT same situation. It does get better - not sure how long for you since DD but my DD was at the end of August this year.

Hang in there mate - it will get better.

Yep. Just looked this up. This could have been written by me. It really will improve for you. She is probably still in withdrawal and in a fog. She will come out.

waiting, from what I have read it takes a long time for the feelings to come back. Please don't expect everything to return to normal in a few days or even weeks. It takes months!!

Try not to get discouraged and continue to Plan A. Just try to give without any expectations, that is what Plan A is all about.

Your WW can't return anythiing to you right now, but in time when the feelings start to come back you may start so see some signs.

Trust me, I know exactly how you feel.

Time and Patience my friend. You will get there.

sorry abt the poor type but I am using my phone to post.

today was tough. we did session together with sh and I thought it went well until after the session. sh wanted us to share to each other our en's. we did and she cried and said after that she felt less hope after than before. she insists there are issues she can't work past in the past on our relationship. I love busted a bit by telling her how hurt I am that her family has not called me or even called me on my birthday. she exposed herself to her family and it is like they r made at me.

anyway she cried a bunch. said she doesn't know how much more she can take. still says divorce is what she wants but is determined to give all this a chance.


SH pointed out to us not to get ahead of him and try to look for a solution to our problems. Just complete the excercise of EN's and tommorow we do LB's. Then we talk to him again together.

Is is normal for things to seem worse before they get better. How critical is it to have family support. She also is very tied to her hobby which is where 2 of her affairs began.

It just seems hopeless.

Does anyone have any thoughts.

I would not put it past her family may also be offering her a safety net, ie job, gas allowance, health insurance, place to live, etc...

I am not saying her family is aggreeing with the affair, but I do think that our marraige has been described by a WS in fog to her parents and as a result I have been made to look overly jelous, controling etc... when in fact, I suspected an affair well before D-day.

I also, suspected one before. I am not sure her parents understand all this.

What should I do? Go to her parents with real version or back off and work on marriage. My wife said if I go to them to tell them how hurt and I an let them know what all my thoughts are that it will be very difficult for us to work things out and will only make it more difficult for her parents to ultimately get over everything.

What should I do?

I think you should set the record straight with her family. But don't expect too much as blood is thicker than mud. But be assured that the story your WW is telling your ILs is much more sanitized than what really happened. Further, I am sure you are a very bad guy in the story she is telling them. So at some point, you have to tell the ILs the real story.

But before you do, consult with SH. He is in a better position to advice you.

Thanks UVA. I will try to find a way to talk to SH about this. It just seems like every turn we take there is an uphill battle ahead. Like is just being relentless and wants to see our marriage destroyed.

I really need a breakthrough. We need a breakthrough.

Thanks for the advice UVA.

By the way is UVA a UVA Cavalier? Just curious.

"By the way is UVA a UVA Cavalier? Just curious."

Yes

UVA,

Thanks for the encouragement again. I am a Yellow Jacket. ie Ga Tech. Good luck this weekend. It should be a good football game.

Thanks again.

To All who have followed thusfar and been a great encouragement.

Last night was a little better than the day. After our couseling session with Steve Harley and our EN review with each other, we both had to go to work. We work in the same office (our business). Well there was a little timeout. She had a nail appointment. Then she came to the office.

The day went ok, she then talked to our former brother in law who works for us. (my wifes sister is the one that had an affair on him, and we remain close to him)

She cried alot with him and they talked for about an hour. He encouraged her to keep trying to work on things.

I went to church with our youngest son and our oldest son had a Fellowship of Christian Athletes leaders meeting at school. Wife will not come to church on Wed night even though until June of this year she was there every Wed night teaching youth. (A became hugs, kisses, etc... in June) She resigned from teaching in July.

Came home and she was basically nice and not teary or combative. Actually told me she was going to get a bath rather than just disappear. Then after her bath actually told me she was going to bed. Please understand, I am not obsessing but she has basically quit telling me much of anything she has been doing lately.

I came on to bed. Told her good night.

This morning after I woke up the kids, she slide over next to me and not really cuddled but did lie beside me. Formally she has been completely on the other side of the bed and rolled over with her back to me or a pillow between us.

What should I make of this behavior after such a what I perceive as a bad day.

I mean it is nothing great, but it seems she actually moved toward me a little last evening emotionally and then some physically. Actually asked me if I was wearing a pullover this morning because it was going to be cold.

HUH??

Does anyone have any thoughts on what is going on in her mind possibly?

waiting, this is why they call it a rollercoaster ride. Don't put too much into your WW coming closer. My WW does it on occasion but I don't know why either.

Just keep going with a strong Plan A right now and try to meet whatever EN's she lets you.

I'm pretty much in the same boat as you so I know what you are going through. It is very important that you do not LB right now. You have to gaurd your WW Love Bank.

Then slowly chip away at her emotional wall.

It takes time...lots of time.

You can do it.

I wouldn't see it as a bad day from your description. Hey. She is trying.

When my wife came home, for the first few weeks I didn't think she was trying at all. But when you find MB and learn about withdrawal, it helps you understand a bit more. My wife would be close, then withdrawn etc. I didn't think she was trying. I even said to her that if I had had an affair and I came home I would be doing anything and everything to make ammends - because I didn't have a clue what she was feeling. In another thread, snowbelle put it like this....

"Withdrawal really puts us BS's over the edge. We want our WS automatically to disengage from the OP, turn their "love" to rabid hate for that person, and fall into our arms telling us how sorry they are and how they plan to make it up to us.

Save it for the soap operas. The fact is that your wife has nursed a whole life with this OP for some time (weeks or years, it really doesn't matter) and she has to grieve the loss of that crutch. She may truly want your marriage to survive while she still wants to be with her "soulmate" (yeah, the one who never calls HER). It takes time for the WS to cut the strings that bound them to the OP and see the relationship for what it truly was. Hang tough. It's hard on you now, but it will be even harder on her when the dawn starts to break through. Then she will really need you."

Snowbelle has a lot of wisdom in those words.

I really see it as a positive sign really. It will get better and you will pull through.

I sure hope you are praying for her and the prayer chain at church is too. If you are keeping it under-wraps - don't. Your pride is not important here - your marriage is and some humiliation for us BS's is a small price to pay to get our wives back again.

[quote]I sure hope you are praying for her and the prayer chain at church is too. If you are keeping it under-wraps - don't. Your pride is not important here - your marriage is and some humiliation for us BS's is a small price to pay to get our wives back again.[quote]

Thanks BigKahuna - I have 2 questions for you or anyone.

I am praying for her and our marraige. That is what keeps me going along with the support I am getting here.

I am curious about something. I have done no exposure on the OM's side. I really don't know who to expose to. I have his Dad's name and the people the guy leases the barn from but that is really it. He is not married. Exposure has been in our town with basically our family and my wifes family, pastor and our very best friend.

Questions 1)

Do I need to do any exposure or threaten exposure on the OM side. I assume there has been NC since 9/11/05. That was our d-day. Or should I save exposure as a bullet if NC is broken or found to be broken.

Question 2)

If she shows affection, should I respond or withhold as to make myself not appear as needy? I am playing it pretty cool right now. No ILY's and I am not trying any bodily contact at the moment.

We are exactly 2 months from d-day. She slid a little closer to me this morning in bed and I sensed she either wanted to try to cuddle or just plain out did. I really wanted to stick to me withholding affection myself but if she is starting affection I am confused as to what to do.

Thanks

wiating, I am not bigkahuna, but I will take a stab at your questions. You should not be withholding affection AT ALL. Look for every opportunity, without appearing clingy or needy, to show affection.

No further exposure is necessary. The purpose of exposure is to bust up the affair so there is no need to expose.

I agree 100% with MelodyLane here. I would not under any circumstances withold affection. Her wanting to show affection is a good positive sign and you should respond accordingly. You have to understand she is in an emotional rollercoaster. Unfortunately, today she may be affectionate and tomorrow she may be distant again. In Bill Harley's book surviving an affair, the WW describes this as some days feeling in love with spouse and other days feeling nothing but then over the course of time, the days in love increased.

Look, if she wants to be close, be close. Meet her EN's as much as you can. If it leads to SF, excellent - I am sure you could use it. It is the most frustrating time of your life right now but I think you will pull through it and she will be in love with you again.

My timeline is roughly as follows:-

DDay 8/28 this year. My wife had been having an affair with our next door neighbour, our eldest sons football coach since the end of May this year, 2005. They would meet for walks, coffee, hand holding, kissing, etc. She was willing to walk out on our 23 year marriage (+4 years before), 3 children. Thought since the kids liked the neighbour they would all be happy to play happy families together. She got her first shock when the kids told her no thanks - they would be staying with me. Her memory as she drove away was of our 14 year old bent over sobbing in the driveway. I don't think she expected that.

Wife left home 8/30 - stayed with a girlfriend and had some passionate sessions with OM but could not bring herself to have sex with him.

9/3 told me she was going to come back home within 1 week. I didn't know at the time but she had promised OM she would wait 1 week before coming home - he was a next door neighbour - he wanted a chance to patch with his wife. He hassled my wife that week to try and get her to change her mind. Withdrew a fair few love units in the process. (Yay)

9/9 she came home. wanted to sleep seperately - I showed her where the office was (I know - I was all heart - but she left and she wanted to sleep seperately) - lasted 2 nights before we slept in same bed. But she wanted no physical contact, coud barely look at me or speak with me. During the course of that week, she nearly cracked a few times and went back to OM. Fortunately resisted that feeling.

We went to church together the next day and when we got home I sat her down and told her I wanted to know everything about it - how it started etc. Blow by Blow stuff. She resisted pretty much but then agreed and we spent a few hours while she came clean. I have had some questions since and she has been open and honestly answered everything. I know it hurts her going back in her mind but it helps me to come to terms with everything.

I hadn't found MB and really had no clue what was going on in her mind - our counsellors (Pastor & Wife) really didn't prepare us for what was happening emotionally - I was told my wife was "confused" etc and that I just needed to "love her" etc. Really, all that was like motherhood and apple pie - but no earthly practical use to us. We struggled on for a while - wife was getting through withdrawal etc.

That Sunday night, 9/11, she had been home a week and we were talking after dinner with the kids (Sons 12,14,16) about maybe moving and stuff like that and it was like the weight of the world decended on her - she started crying and saying she was sorry.... It was a nice moment - I had been waiting for her to crack and say sorry. It was hugs all round and we sat down together on the lounge and she just wanted me to hold her. I thought I was in - SF for sure tonight but no - the ice queen came back as soon as we went to bed. Again I had no understanding of what was happening as I hadn't found MB yet.

At the end of second week home, Friday 9/16 she wanted to go out and walk by the water near our home. She initiated physical contact and we did some nice kissing. When we got home and went to bed, it was like the ice woman had moved in again, but something happened and we made love. After she said it felt so good. But the ice queen was in and out for he next few weeks after that.

So anyway, we struggled on for around another 3 weeks I suppose of ups and downs emotionally - I was getting frustrated and my wife really was confused about what and why she was feeling like she did. Counselling was no use. I was getting pretty depressed. She was still having feelings for the OM - couldn't work any of that out - didn't make any sense.

Meanwhile, after she came home, the OM did promise N/C and he only dealt with me - although he did speak to my wife once at length after she had just come home really giving her a serve about leading him on (Ca-Ching Ca-Ching went the withdrawals in the love bank). They did also speak once more that week as we both wanted to know what the others were doing as the domestic relationship over the fence was a little tense. We decided to move temporarily to give everyone some breathing space although in reality I only did it to make my wife happy. Fortunately we own our home outright so we were able to rent another property close by - I still work from my home.

Fast forward to 10/20 - I was feeling depressed about where we were going and was really dispairing about coming to a happy place in our marriage. I went for a search on the Internet about affairs and divorces looking for some statistics etc. WHat I found was MB. Downloaded and printed out teh affair FAQ's. It was just like he had written them for us. Suddenly everything became clear. It was such a relief and weight off our shoulders - we started to understand and see what had been happening. It was seriously the best revelation I have had in my life I think.

So I got HNHN, LB, Surviving an affair, Fall in Love, Stay in Love, and as we are in Australia, I also ordered the Audio CD Course which we are working through now.

I also started reading these forums.

So here we are now. It is 11 weeks since D-Day and 9 weeks since my wife came home, 8 weeks I guess of 100% no contact. My wife tells me she loves me - and I think she really means it. We have a lot of physical contact - not just SF. We are talking a lot. We really are meeting a lot of EN's.

I don't pretend our case is typical or usual or anything. I know we have a long, long way to go. I still can't spend an hour without thinking about the maggot next door and what he tried to do with my wife and tried to do to our family. I still get resentful when I can't play certain types of music or can't see a certain type of movie because she associated things with him. I can't get used to the fact that she will probably always love the OM in some way. I still have questions I want answered. I haven't got it all together. We are still struggling to make our way through all this. But I do know we both are determined to make it to the other side with our marriage and family intact.

We are only up to lesson 2 in the HNHN audio course.

I have to kick myself now when I realise again it's only 8 weeks into recovery. Feels like much longer.

I wish I could stop thinking about the affair all the time. So does my wife.

Sorry for hijacking.... I hope my story gives you hope.

Wow BigKahuna,

Thanks for the details. Don't appoligize for "highjacking". I really appreciate it. Your story shows me hope just as you desired.

My sons are both very frank to their mom what they believe in fact, my oldest told her he would still love her but would not be able to have anything to do with her. She told me how much it hurt her today to hear that. Oh well I thought, but I did not say anything. I really don't want her hurt, but that is the consequences of her actions.

She still does not get it though. The fog is still there. It is all about how unhappy she has been for years. I guess the lies that she and the OM told each other have become like cement in her mind. My BIL told me that is how the OP moves in. The WS and OP talk about how bad things are at home or whatever and they instantly build repore with one another and over time they have "soulmate feelings for the OP".

I am starting to understand more now, but it is a process. Reading all the posts to me and others have helped a great deal.

Thanks again.

I was very quick to acknowledge my faults in our marriage. I am a pretty domineering personality and my wife did not feel loved or cherished for many years. I asked her the other day what she thought I would do when she left - she said she didn't think I would care. That broke me up.

She knows the affair was wrong. I know I was wrong with the way I treated her emotionally. SHe knows she has faults too. That is the beginning of our healing.

When we went to Church together that first Sunday she was home, the Pastor preached on strongholds in the mind. The next Sunday he preached on repentance. Boy, did she get nailed in both of those. She just found them so helpful.

You can listen to them on-line if you are interested - www.ccc.org.au and follow your nose to service archives.