lady,

No she didn't buy the car. He told me he bought it. Plus it is added to our insurance I just got the coverage and the insurance papers today in the mail. Pretty funny actually because he told me he had changed the address for that on the 4th when he payed the bill. But I got it today here.

So anyhow the car is in his name and he paid for it according to him. Why the story she bought it was told I have no idea. Unless it was to throw me off for the court thing.... But I really didn't want it anyway....

I AGREE!!!

Oh Mimi I do pray we are right, but I feel it in my heart , I think its coming.... I feel like a calm peace has come over me today.

Its like someone or something telling me not much longer and you will hav your answer.... Did you feel when the end was near? Wheather or not its the end we want I still feel it.... Maybe I am crazy or something .....

Read my post.

Late last night, my xh called my home from OW/w's cell phone...as if I WAS THE OW.

It is a definite insecure OW you're dealing with...and a man STILL NOT READY TO END AN AFFAIR.

What can end the affair?

You have a few tools. Hmmm. No contact seems to work. Him thinking you're getting a life seems to work. OW getting furious at the mention of your name seems to work.

How can you work these factors from afar? That is something that might just have an effect.

I would stay in direct NC. I would plant things to the "talky" ones...like, you're getting sooo tired of being alone. That he'd best get off fence or you're getting a life...stuff like that. And then do something radical...new hairdo, new style..talk different. Do something to change status quo. Can work from afar I can attest to you. And let's see... hmmm. How could you possibly have your NAME brought up as much as possible?

I would almost call him on the affair phone...and leave a vm saying "as for me, it's still off. And I am glad this stands for you too deep down. Keeping what you said to me in mind." Say somethign foggy. Where OW will hear your voice..and you do NOT say your name. Where she has to find out that the D is temporarily off as per her loving little cakeating bf.

Or just stay dark.

Very very dark. And have as MANY PEOPLE WHO ARE JUST MUTUAL FRIENDS BRING YOUR NAME UP...and say stuff about new clothes, hair, you're being sad about being soooo alone...foggy type stuff. This kinda stuff does work. Sorry, but it does.

I mean, look at my life. I do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING...but be me...and NOT FEED AN AFFAIR...and lo and behold! I am now viewed as the ow! Crazy huh? The mistress freaks totally out at the sight of me, my name...or anyting remotely about me.

If you don't know me by now....

I trusted in the LORD..I had turned it over to HIM by then...

I guess looking back now..somewhere deep inside..I knew my H would come back if he could..

Something I saw in his eyes that told me that he was in there somewhere...

I believe that you can trust in your gut instinct...

I do...

The important thing now is to stay dark and to allow him to SUFFER...

That was my biggest mistake..my regret...

I prolonged the A by enabling it...

peachy,

I don't have to worry DD talks enough for all of us. I don't tell her things but she does tell WH everything she thinks will get him wondering no matter how small. Heck she even went so far as to tell him what size jeans my MIL bought me yesterday. I can tell you know that probably was a shocker to him... He already is loving my new look..... He couldn't stop looking at me friday.


Mimi,

I trust my gut instinct on this and it says its almost over. You know talking about the eyes, as I was talking to WH friday I saw a few glimpses of H in there. I saw the sparkle that has been gone for months now. I heard the laugh I have not heard in months, the real laugh not the fake one he has been trying to fool people with. I saw the real H come to the surface a few times. I know he is in there. Its time to just sit back and let him fight his way out. He wants out I can see it, he just has to fight harder. I think with my assurances of love and commitment I can help him come out and stay out....... its just going to take a little more time.......

I know your H is not my H but I do remember him saying:

"I got myself into this..I've got to get myself out of it"..

He wanted to do it so NICELY AND NEATLY...

I kept telling him JUST DO IT...if you want ME....

best thing you could have said Mimi.......

They have to be able to get themselves out of this.... Because I feel if we try to fix it or get them out of it they won't learn the lesson and are bound to repeat it. Because they won't feel the pain they have caused.....

I am praying so hard right now that things are turning, I have been praying all along but now for some reason I just feel that they are starting to be answered. As you have been saying I had to let God do this is in his own time....

Hurting,

Just checking in. Maybe your DD was feeling particularly close to her dad after he told her that he still loves you, etc, and that's why she left you to be with him for Thanksgiving? If he's been keeping her in the loop and she's trying to get him home, it makes a little more sense now. Just a thought.

Cat

Hurting:

It is certanly not my intention to cause you more pain than you have been through already, but you need to realize that H will not be 100% out of the fog just like that when he leaves OW's flop house.

The work has just begun and your life and relationship will never be the same as it was. When I say that, I don't mean that it won't be better at some point, it just won't be the same. There's much work ahead for both of you and struggles when he does come home. I think most if not all BS in recovery or recovered will tell you this.

Also, this thing about him wanting to break it off at his pace and using the excuse that he wanted everything done before he leaves is a crock of baloney. I, like Mimi, don't agree with your therapist on this one.

It doesn't take weeks to put things into place. He could have moved those cars, had an address change done at the post office and notified his bank etc of an address change in less than 30 minutes. His clothes and other belongings could be packed and outta there in more than likely less than an hour. OW isn't home 24/7.

Continue to protect yourself emotionally.

Very wise post from Nutshell...

I agree wholeheartedly....

Inanutshell and Mimi,

I agree with you both totatlly. I know all of these things can be done quickly. I know if he was really ready to go he would leave. I also know he won't be the same once he does leave, I have read enough of this stuff to know nothing will be like it was before. I believe I am ready for the hard work it will take. It won't be easy this I know.

I know he is not ready yet. I don't want him until he is ready. I don't want him waffeling back and forth once he leaves. If it takes another month or whatever I will just have to be patient. I just feel its coming but just not yet. I have been alone this long so I can wait this out. I also understand that anything can change and he may never leave. So as time goes on I will make my descions as I need to.

Don't worry I am doing just fine. Time will take care of this for both myself and him.....

I just want to let you know we keep stressing not taking him back too soon because, well, several of us HAVE DONE IT even when we said we wouldn't. A few of us were so embarrassed and ashamed of the results (false recovery) that we avoided posting here because we'd get a 2X4.

I know for a fact I keep repeating myself because I worry you will go through the same. Believe me, I know you are not stupid! So please don't be insulted by it.

Mojo,

I am not insulted at all. I understand what everyone is saying. i don't want to go throuhg a false recovery either. I have already been there done that back in Aug. and it almost hurt worse than the first time he left.

I don't want him to move home right away if he leaves OW. I want him to find a place to stay be it his moms or sisters. Heck even a room somehwere. I feel we would need to take things slow because of all the things that have happened.

But like I said I don't see him leaving OW'S for little while yet he just is not ready I don't think. Its close but not yet. He has to be able to get this out of his system so to speak, I for one want this to be his descion so I know when he leaves its because he wants it. And hopefully since it would be his choice it would help keep him from returning. I know it will be hard for him to leave even if he is unhappy because of the addiction asspect of this.

I d on't think it matters at this point how much he loves or not loves me, he is not ready to break away... I can't say I understand why its so hard because I have never been in his position. And by God's graces I hope to never be in that position to find out.....

I said this was a tool. How to use it is where the finese of the BS comes into play. Knowing DD will blab to the WS is a fact. Now the court info will be at the very least partial knowledge...... if the BS is smart she can learn to use this as a tool to stab at that A. How?

ex:
DD: What happened in court?

BS: Not much, judge agreed with me and your dad got all teary eyed.

DD: What do you mean?

BS: People get sad when it comes to parting with their $$. Regardless if it is for a good cause. Especially selfish people.

(end of convo).

DD: Dad, mom said you got teary eyed in court.

WS: Well I did, a bit.

DD: Why 'cuz of the $$?

WS: What?!??!? Well losing $$ isn't fun but no that's not the only reason.

DD: Well at least it is a for a good cause. Mom said so.

WS: Hm.... she did? Well she c/b right. Still don't like it. I don't want to lose your mom.

DD: Well you sure aren't showing it.

WS: I need time. Gotta let the OW down easy

DD: Why?

WS: She might get mad and hurt you all.

DD? WHAT?!?!?!? She might hurt me?

WS: Well maybe not you directly but maybe your mom.

DD? She's already hurt mom, what do you mean? Why would you ever.....?!@)#)$(*%*&#)_#_%_^).......

See where a planted thought can go? This is just an example.


Orchid: Now my thoughts on the above post is that you should NEVER say you w/b available when he is ready. What does a message like that send? If he knows you will wait, why should he hasten his return? He will still get the same for less effort. You are your own greatest enemy and enabling the A with those thoughts.

Instead you should say something like: 'well when you come to your senses, let's see where everyone w/b. No guaratees we will be here but you still have to come to your senses.'

See the diff? Either way he has to do the work. A BS should never promise to wait for a WS. NEVER!

JMHO,
L.

orchid,

I have never told him him I would be waiting forever. Thats my own thoughts for me at this time. I would never tell him that even if it was true, which I know it isn't. I know I won't wait forever and I have told him this. In fact I told him this friday, in fact my exact words to him were:
" WH you know I love you and I want to be able to have our marriage back. But until you leave OW and commit to working on us and have n/c with her we can't move forward. I can not promise you I will wait for long because I must move ahead in life." He just looked at me and said just give me a little more time. I told him time is running out.

Anyhow I went to work tonight and talked to a few of my co-workers who asked me how things went. I told them about the talk WH and I had and how he didn't sign or file the divorce papers. Once I told them all that he didn't want OW to know we talked or that he didn't sign the papers it was split on what the yall thought. Some feel he is just wanting to cake eat, the others feel he wants out but is unsure how to do it. Its all so confusing.

I guess what most of everyone I talk to dosn't get is why he would lie to her about the divorce papers. because we all know at some point he is going to have to explain to her why there is no court date. Which I gues this is my biggest question as well, how is he going to explain no court date, so seems to me one of two senarios can only happen: 1: He actually moves out and leaves her before this is figured out 2: He actually signs them at a later date and gets a court date. Personally we all know which one I prefer but its not my choice.

So I really thought after this last court date I would have some kind of relief knowing he had decided to file. But here i am still in a sort of limbo waiting for the other shoe to fall.

I wish I had asked him the questions on friday why he is hiding this information from OW, but I guess I new I would get some bulls*it story. .... Anyhow I realize nothing has changed, he is still with her I am still alone and even more confused because of what he said to me.

What crap....... But I am actually doing pretty good not depressed or weepy just confused and trying to figure him out, and boy is that a waste of time and brain cells..... But unfortunatley thats how I am I try to analyze everything, I have always been that way and guess I always will be......

Orchid: Good presentation but it m/b good idea to stop with the ILY's. Remember which character u r communicating with.


Orchid: It is crappy isn't it and sooo illogical. That is the one constant factor. Total illogic. That's why it is hard to make plans as long as the A is in our lives. Once I realized that, I could move forward. You see getting the OW out of my life gave me the freedom NOT t/b in the A. I realized my focus on removing the WS from the A was futile. That was his job, not mine. What my job entailed was removing myself from that A mess. Yes, he was and is the father of our child but the OW was nothing to me but a big headache. I swallowed my bitter pill and readied myself for the D. My mind and heart synced up fast after that. I progressed quickly and it shocked the WS. Yea it still hurt but I could move forward. The burden of having to contstantly put the OW back in her hole was no longer my responsibility. She was in the hole of her choice.....all of her own doing.

U know what? That OW got all riled up and mad. Yea the WS in their stupor state tried to 'fix it' for the OW because you see there are feelings involved. Stupid feelings but feelings nonetheless. I on the other hand had feelings for the OW but they were more on the line of contempt and pure hatred. You wouldn't see me canvasing to save her soul.....no way. I thought about that long and hard, what she did to my family deserved nothing less than a loss of her life, I still believe that. I was not the one to carry out that punishment, that belonged to a higher source and giving over all that anger and revenge freed my soul to deal with my real life issues.....moving forward and carrying for my child.

The A eventually loses steam. Just amke sure you don't lose yourself in it.



Orchid: Don't worry, the answer probably wouldn't have made you happy. Look at actions, eyes and reality. Words have little meaning coming from a liar and a cheat. He has a lot of making up t/d just to get back to square one. He does not deserve to have any needs met until he makes it up to his family. Don't pamper him.


Orchid: Your feelings will still swing from one end to the other. Your mind and heart are syncing up but your heart is still the stronger one. What t/d? You can just keep reminding yourself of your boundaries. The need to communicate will go down. His will go up. You are not responsible to fill any need of his until he proves he deserves his family back. No shortcuts.

I had to learn that lesson the hard way. The recovery didn't start until 3 years after the A started. All the recovieries in between were not all a loss but they sure weren't real progress. I was getting very tired but very good and whipping out that plan B and implementing it in a New York minute. LOL!!!

Take care, you are vulnerable right now. Even though you don't want t/b, u r. Just par for the course.

Hugz,
L.

Orchid,

Thanks for all of your help. I don't like being in this confused state. It just gives me a headache. In facr the more I think of our conversation the angrier I get because as much as I wanted to believe him, I see so much babble in it now.

I do think some of what he said had some truth to it but when you put it all together it reeks of babble and falsehoods.

I believe he loves me and wants our relationship I think those were true words, but underneath those words in the back of his mind he wants the relationship with both of us. He still wants to try and cake eat and have both. Well thats not gonna happen, I am worth more than a piece of cake. He needs to realize that.....

OW is not worthy of even being called a piece of cake, she is more like a wad of chewed up bubble gum stuck to the bottom of my shoe. I am Red Lobster and she is McDonalds.... WH will someday see all of this, I just hope for him its not to late.

I can see myself moving on without him now, I don't like it but I can see it and know I will do just fine. I honestly don't know how much longer I will wait for him to get it together, but I can tell you this I see myself in a whole other place come this time next year. Time is running out for him and he does not even know it......

Hi Hurting-
Haven't had a chance to reply since you had your court date
and the encounters with your WH, but I am very happy that
it proceedings went well so you can have less financial
worries, and also that you had a chance to talk to WH.

While it's true that he has a long way to go and has to
show "action" now to back his words, I think it seems like
your WH is at least starting to break out of the fog and see
what he is missing. Definitely sounds like the A is losing
it's "fantasy bubble" too !
I think you did very well in handling the conversations and
letting him know how you feel as well as reiterating the
conditions he already knows he has to meet.
I think your plan to continue in "B", and to keep up your
guard sounds smart.

I understand how having contact with him has made you feel
some confusion and all "riled up".
I've felt the same way since finding out that WH moved out
of OW's house. I guess it made me think/hope that them
breaking up would really push him to want to work on the M
and reconcile, however that hasn't happened since they
apparently got back together. I don't believe he sees her
as much, but it appears that they are still seeing each other, at least some, and until that ends completely and
finally, I know we can't get anywhere.

Although WH hasn't come out and directly said he is trying
or planning to break things off with OW, I have gotten the
feeling a few times that things haven't been going that
well, and that their "bubble is burst". I think my WH, like
yours, thinks he needs to break things off in his own way
and time, and will do it more gradually than a clean,final
break. He's also made a comment about "not being able to
just shut off his feelings like a light switch", which I
don't sympathize with at all, since the WS sure seem to be
able to shut their feelings for the BS off with no problem!

I am continuing to pray that the changes will come about
bringing a total, permanent end to the A and addiction that
has kept WH with OW. I just hope it will be in time .
I'm trying to keep as positive as I can, and know you are
too.
Continued best wishes to you-
Slammed

Me- BS, 42
WH- 38
Married 7 years, together 10 yrs, no kids (dog is our "kid")
WH has two daughters from previous relationships 13,9
2000- H diagnosed with depression, OCD
2001- Wh has brief inappropriate internet "friendship",
followed by EA with older, recently widowed woman (4 mos).
2005- WH becomes secretive, spends long hours on computer,
time and money not accounted for, no interest in SF.
Very erratic behavior, demands we immediately do D papers,
then does nothing with it. Several mystery "business trips".
8/22/05 WH moves out, denies A
10/18/05 OW calls me- exposing A in graphic detail and I
find out Wh has been living with her since August. They met
on internet, WH lied about marital status and numerous other
"details". Sounds like Wh and OW already have been fighting
and having problems. OW also calls XGF of WH and exposes
A to her and his daughter. WH furious with ME for talking to
OW, even though SHE called me. Two days later, OW kicks WH
out of her house- he spends one night at our house, then
rents a room. Frequent contact and seemed to show some
interest in working on M for a few days, then apparently
got back together with OW.

Slammed,

Things here are getting better for me. I am not as upset and spinning my wheels as much as I was a few days ago.

I just returned from the attorneys office to sign the order for th LS. Well is not back from WH'S attorney yet because WH has to sign it first. But even though its not signed snce he agreed to it all he still has to follow it from the date it was agreed upon.

Anyhow I talked to my attorney about how the LS works if we were to reconcile. I wanted to make sure I would be safe if anything was to happen. Good news is that in Okla. if we reconcile the LS is still in effect until it is desolved by the court. So if he was to come home and then leave again the LS would still have to be followed. So that makes me feel good just in case this was to happen.

I spoke to my brother this afternoon and told him all that happened since thurs. He told me that he feels WH is still playing games and was trying to get me back to the cake-eating. He says he has no doubt that WH and OW won't last but that WH is wanting OW to throw him out so he won't look like the bad guy. He said don't be surprised if come Jan. WH tells you he can't move from OW'S because he can't afford to since he has to pay you x amount of $$ per month. He also said if he wants out that bad why wait until then, he could do it now just as easy. So I have to agree with him and all of you who said that. He really does not want to leave he is just trying to leave me hanging on as his safty net for now.

I asked him then why do you think he didn't file the d papers. He says why should he? He is still doing what he wants and has no consequenses for it. So I said but if he does not want to be with me why would he keep me as his wife? Because he can until either you get fed up and do something yourself or he finally decides he is done playing and wants to come home. My brother and my attorney both feel WH is still on the fence not knowing what to do. I am just more confused as ever.

My MIL is so angry with WH right now because of his game playing as she calls it. She says she is going to talk to him this weekend and just tell him how she feels. I asked her not to bring me into it because I don't want the backlash from it. She told me BS this is all just going to far and I am tired of it. He needs to make a descion and stick to it. You can't continue to live like this. I am hoping by the weekend she has calmed down some. She is even threating to go see OW and tell her all the lies that are being said. I don't want her to do this but don't know how to stop her. I have asked her but she is just fed up.

So anyway this is were I am at this point. I am just trudging on and doing the best I can. I am calm and pretty much ready to accept whatever happens, happens I can change no one but me ..... I still have pleanty of hope but life must go on......