Well, I've been posting on here for a while, but it's my first time in this thread. Let me give you a brief summary(for more detail, see 'Need help here...real issues!')

W told me in July that she doesn't feel like she was in love with me anymore. We have been married for 16 yrs, have 3 kids (s15, s12, d8) and I never knew we had any real disturbing issues. She began to bring up things that I have done in the past and I took full repsonsibility for them and have made a sincere effort to change. W had become more and more despondent towards our M.

To make a long story short, I found out Saturday that W has been having an A (not sure if its PA or EA). I confronted her about it, she got real defensive, and now if ticked of that I outted her. I don't know what to do. I still want my W and want to make things work, but it just doesn't seem like that'll happen. I told her that I will not file for D and that I will not agree to anything, that if she wants D, she can file. Can anyone help here? I know this is such a short sumary, but there has been so much detail in the other thread that I would retype for hours. I hope someone can help me save my M!

I'll jump in here, if I may, and add that WGO has been at the Emotional Needs board for a couple of weeks, trying to see why his wife has been so upset and rude toward him, despite all the changes he was trying to make in his own behavior in order to make the marriage better for her.

He has changed quite a bit, was spending a lot more time with his family and trying to reach out to her - and she was, for the most part, very cold and rebuffed his efforts. She works third shift, and has been very cold toward WGO for months - and his kids have noticed the way she has been treating him and have been very angry toward her for some time.

Welcome to the GQII board. There are a ton of posters here with experience ready to help you. I just reviewed your EN postings and I am sorry you have had to deal with the "it's your fault" crap the last few months. Your WW (that's her name now on this board) has unfairly duped you and rewritten your marital history. You are not alone. I neglected my wife as well and am partially responsible for the state of our marriage pre-affair; but the affair is/was not our fault. Everything she has said to date was all fog talk and except how it relates to Plan A should be ignored.

So you busted her this weekend. The OM is the delivery driver to your WW job. He is married with 2 kids. Exposing the affair will be the first order of business. It is best done in one swoop. Have you exposed to OM's wife?. To her job? (they may switch delivery companies). To his job? (they may not like him getting involved with clients...bad for business).

Also, you may need to do some serious snooping. Do not get caught. Go to Radio Shack or WallMart and purchase a Voice Activated DIGITAL voice recorder and a ton of batteries. Pay with cash and hide the receipt (in case you need to return it). Never admit it is yours even if you get caught. Hide it in the most likely spot to get intelligence (home, garage, her car tucked up under the passenger seat). You're likely to hear some aweful stuff about you but it is all fog talk and should be ignored. You just need the truth about YOUR LIFE so you can make informed decisions.

You will make it, with or without your wife, you will make it.

Mr. Wondering

I concur, you need to expose the affair. Make sure to read up on how to do it correctly and take action NOW. I didn't expose in the beginning and I believe that may have been a bad choice on my part. I think exposure is right for 99% of the cases but timing of it is critical. Since he's married and there are careers involved you have a lot of leverage to break up the affair. That's job #1. It's all part of Plan A which is probably the most difficult thing you will have to endure. I'm in the middle of it and wish you the best.

As a side note I know a lot of what you are getting hit with. My wife has rewritten our 10 years of marriage to "good friends". It's quite dreadful how the "fog" overtakes them.

Whats,

I'm glad you decided to post over here. I'm going to make a link to your thread at EN so people can get a better idea of your backround and whats been going on.

Symphony
What's thread on EN

I aggree with all of the above. You should expose to OM to his wife and employer.

I have been gathering information on him for the last couple of days. I need to get up the courage to do it when I find out everything. I have exposed A to family and friends already, which W is not happy about. It's really tough to comprehend what is happening right now as it's still fairly fresh in my mind.

bump

Bump II. Anyone have any advice for what's?

Thanks CC, but it seems hopeless. I want my W in the worst way, but I have no idea what to do now. It seems like 'throw in the towel' is the correct expression to use right now. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Dear whatgoon,
You have just exposed.
You now have to sitback and let the pressures of family and friends help illuminate the relationship between w/w and o/m for what it is, a sleazy immitation of love, that is carried on in the shadows of the night. You have shone the light on it. You, have just begun the fight.
You have so much to wage this battle with.
You have the experience of the many posters and the principles and concepts of the harley's to use as your weapons.
Read up on all the concepts.
You can find most of the concepts right here on the marriage builders website.
And remember, Plan A requires time. Be patient.

I am thinking that WGO has actually been doing a Plan A without realizing it for several weeks at least. He has been changing and trying hard to meet her ENs, even before D-Day.

Does any of that count? I'm sure it has helped lay some foundation, plant some seeds. He has demonstrated to his WW that he is capable of changing to make her happy, even though she is and has been "in the fog".

Don't be decieved by appearances. It can be done, and many people here have done so.

Remember, too, that you just found out. You are looking at things while you are still in shock, in a state of depression, with the pain of betrayal still fresh. You are not looking at this with the kind of objectivity you would if it were happening to someone else.


As long as you want your W in the worst way, you have got to fight for your marriage. You will never forgive yourself if you don't try.

When the time comes to throw in the towel, you'll know it.

I posted a link to the info on this site on combatting infidelity in your thread at the EN forum. Read it all, it will get you started. Get a copy of "Surviving an Affair" by Willard Harley.

You can do this. You've already made enormous changes in your life to make her happy. You never had a chance while this affair was secret, that's why you didn't see any success. You were treating the wrong symptoms. Now that the affair has been exposed, you can fight it directly.

There are no guarantees, but you have a chance. You can fight this, and I am confident that you have what it takes to save your marriage.

Whats, I didn't read every detail of your sitch, but sounds similar to mine. My FWW works a lot, we started spending a lot of time apart, etc. One day she teills me i love you, but not in love with you. 3 mos. later was d-day. It does seem hopeless, but it can be done. (At least I hope so, cause I'm not that far along either).

Read up on the site, and read some of the books that people suggest.

As I understand it, step 1 is ending the A. Has that happened yet? IF not, that is your first mission. End the A, during this time you avoid LB's. Don't worry about EN's cause they wont matter if she is still in the A. So, if the A continues;

1 Expose
2 Don' LB
3 Work on yourself - make yourself attractive to WW
4 Continue to snoop, confront WW on any continued contact with OM.

Set your self a time frame for this plan. Say 6 mos. do nothing but the above until the A is over. If it doesn't end in 6 mos. go to plan b. If it does end, get the NC letter and start working on recovery. You can work on plan B/recovery later

Hope that helps

What have you discovered about OM? As previously stated, exposure on his side is the next step. Is he married...his wife has to be told. We also need to determine if calling OM is a option. He may not know the truth of your situation as happened to Johng and many others here.

Please read Johng's thread and search for and read JDINSD thread. I posted in both of those and some of the advice should be relative to you. Especially getting the Voice Activated DIGITAL Recorder.

I know it is frustrating and you feel like giving up. We all make mistakes in this process too so do not get discouraged if you get 2 x 4's. We here are all well intentioned people trying to help you save your marriage. Try to trust the advice you get and not rely so much on your own intuition because your own style probably includes pleasing your wife and avoiding conflict.

BTW, I gave up on my marriage. In June of this year I actually believed my marriage was over and there was no way I could get WW back. Actually, I felt empowered with this revelation. I prayed for the power to change what I could change and the ability to accept that which I could not change. Things got easier when I just released it to God and stopped trying to force my wife to change. I became less needy and desparate. I more effectively Plan A'ed because I ultimately knew I could only control myself. I figured if it was going to end I was going be to get to know my wife and understand her more than I ever had before (you know how us men failed to really listen for years...well I started really listening). I also committed for my daughters sake to enjoy to the extent possible our final summer together. Being a fun loving carefree guy that doesn't need to talk relationship all the time was more attractive and helped me save my marriage. In time you too will more likely than not save your marriage as well so stay strong and resolute.

With acceptance things immediately started changing with my WW as I stopped pressuring her and starting just listening to her. My only boundary at that time was I refused to be in a loveless marriage. She would get angry when I indicated I would get custody of our daughter or when I interferred with her affair but I stuck to my boundary. She indicated she felt trapped cause although she really was I had confidence I was a good enough husband and father to win her back IN TIME. Once contact with OM ceased (he broke up with her) slowly my wife feelings came back and now she can not believe she even did this to me or herself. Our marriage is better than ever.

I also know some are overly concerned with recovery and feeling like 2nd best. Not me. I am her husband. In God's eyes I am number one. She was His choice for me and I, her. In recovery that was never a problem for me and I hope you are secure enough in yourself to feel the same. Push aside your juvenile insecurities. This is not your high school girlfriend dumping you all over. You are a husband and father now... "man up" so they say and fight for your marriage. Worry about recovery after you bust up this affair.

Mr. Wondering

Thanks, Mr W, for your words of encouragement. I have a question for anyone who can answer. Is there any way to get information on a person thru a cell phone number? I know it's a Verizon number, but when I use their website it doesn't come up. Someone told me that there was a way to find out info on a person from a cell #, but didn't know exactly how to do it. Can anyone help?

My w/h and I have Verizon, but everytime I have tried to look up another Verizon number, it doesn't show who it belongs to.
Wish I could be of help.

Well, hopefully I can find some way to get this information. That way it will be much easier to expose the A.

Oh no, it is not hopeless at all unless you do nothing. Do what Mr. W has advised you and do it as soon as possible if you want to save your marriage. The first order of business is EXPOSURE. Expose in ONE DAY to these folks in this order:
the OM's W, his employer, your W's employer, her family, your family and any key friends. This is your BEST WEAPON as exposure is ruinous to an affair.

In the meantime, do not fight with her and avoid lovebusters. Do your best to attract her back into the marraige.

You can't do much until you bust up this affair. When the affair is busted up we can help you recover your marriage. But, you must do something here and do it quickly.

This is far from hopeless.....

Any suggestions for a game plan here, folks? W is still living at home w/me and 3 kids. She doesn't go anywhere (which makes me believe this is just an EA), but has proceeded to blame me for everything wrong in our marriage. I realize now that W is putting the guilt on me for her waywardness (although, I know I have had my faults). I really need help with a game plan here! She is so cold to me and has a nasty demeanor right now it is tough to even get in 2 words with her. My kids are aware of the situation and are clueless as to what they should do, feel, etc.....towards their mother. All of our family (mine & hers) have thrown up their hands in the air and given up on trying to reason with her. She is a very stubborn, hard-headed woman, who hates when things don't go her way. I don't understand this. The 1st 1/2 of M (16yrs total) was rocky and one-sided (me being selfish), but the last 1/2 (up until July) was going pretty good (at least I thought). Never did her feeling or concerns about our M ever come out into the open until July. Please help! I am so confused that I don't know what to do!