I have been up most of the night in tears. Head is killing me... I have not cried this much since D-Day.
H had to work late last night, into the 3rd shift, which the OW now works. H did not get home till near 4 am. I know he was just working, but that he is notable to have a complete NC (no contact?) with her kills me.
I have been getting to the point lately with pent up emotions, anger, frustration, fear, confusion.... kept it bottled... last night it all just blew up on me.
I feel so alone despite all the posts I read here about people in very similar situations.
But have only posted to a few....not one response to my post about my D day and feel like I have no one to talk to ... Would like to know if anyone else has hit this kind of spot I am at now.???
Really could use some support, friendship... my girlfriends are here for me but haveno clue as to the depth this thing is affecting me and no clue as they have never dealt with this, an A. They can't believe I have been so "great" through all of it. and so this is not the only thing I talk to them about, I have started to keep things back from them now and wear my brave face for them, too.
But my "brave face" is starting to fall apart.
HELP???? [color:"green"] [/color]

Just needto add, I do notknow how to keep getting through the days with this building up as it is. I am taking Zoloft , Thank God...Had just started it 3 weeks before D day as I was starting to have panic attacks. It helped immensly I belive but now not so much I fear. My focus on things has deteriorated to where I have neglected so many important responsibilities that THAT is causing even more stress butI can't seem to straighten out!
Really need some people here to talk to ......

Hi Harmonie,

You aren't alone... although it sure feels like it at times.

It must be hard with your H still working at the same place as her. What is that situation? Why does he still have to work there?

Shaden

There are only a handful of companys here that he is qualified to do the type of work he does. We have been to all of them when he was job searching in January due to being fired from our church (read 2 months since D day post)
Any how, this company is AWSOME and he is so fortunate to have landed this job with them at the rate of pay he has. He has no formal education and has no other job skills. He works 2nd shift and so did OW till 2 weeks ago. He has told me she moved to 3rdshift, 11 till 7 am...he works 4 till 12:30 am... so they do cross over a bit. I begged for him to do a NC letter ...or phone call with me on the line but he refused to. Saying it was not nessesary , that I have to try to trust him on this.
However I got to meet The OW 3 weeks ago when Iwent to work with H and that was very interesting.
Not to be concieted but I am a far more physically attractive woman so THAT helps. But I knew this started as an EN for friendship first... just can't understand how H let it get physicall...that makes me want to throw up every time I think about it. She is FUGGLY next to me....amd I am NOT saying that to be meanspirited or concieted I SWEAR! It just is what it is. Thank God That part of my self esteem was not shattered!
I have to run to get ready for work , but would love to talk to you more as I sure could use the support. I hope we can talk again.
Thank you, Harmonie

Hi Harmonie,

I skimmed through your 2 months since Dday post and will read it more carefully later.

A couple of things...

First, it can be a good thing that you are more attractive (although this is subjective) than OM as physical attraction is often an EN for many men... as it is for me... my W is very attractive IMHO.

However, it is not the only EN. Many times in my teenage years I grew to really like different girls that I spent a lot of time with. Later, I would be a bit surprised when I thought about the fact that I would not have originally found them to be physically attractive.

Second... stop "begging". The NC letter is very important... but it has to be done because he sees it as being necessary. Otherwise, he will write it to appease you and then there is still no assurance that it will mean NC... he can simply tell her he wrote it to get you off his back. When I first discussed NC letter with my wife, she didn't want to... gave lots of excuses and then I asked her is she afraid she will hurt OM's feelings... she said yes... to which I LB'd and said to let me know when my feelings are worth more than his. This is only an LB because of the way I said it... with sarcasm. I left the NC letter alone and we talked about it a few days later... she grudgingly agreed but said she wished her word was good enough. I told her it was important to me. Again I left it alone and a couple of weeks later, she brought it to me without me asking again for it. This may not be the way that most people would advise on this site. It is a boundary for yourself and you should expect it... but without the agreement behind it the piece of paper means nothing.

I have to go to an appt.... I'll get back to you later.

Have a good day at work... try and focus on things besides your situation... (yeah, right <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />, like that is easy to do)

Shaden

Harmonie,
I am sure that having your H work around OW is a terrible sitch. I know that I could not handle that at all. Make sure that he is totally transparent to you. You can't "trust" him on this. There is no basis for this trust.Is he remorseful? And does he understand the concept of NC?

I do know the feelings of falling apart and not doing the daily things that I needed to get done after DDAy. I would have panic attacks which I never had before and didn't even know what they were. Household chores were neglected and even having fun with the kids was impossible. I truly could not function. My MIL helped me tremendously. Try to do one thing that needs doing. Just one. Try to stay focused on that. You'll have to prioritize. One thing at a time.

I know that good friends are wonderful to have, but if they have not gone through infidelity they have no idea what you are going through. If a year ago someone I knew was going through this, I would not have been able to comprehend the devastation and after awhile would have stopped "listening". Unless they've been there, to me, it's not worth the effort to discuss it. I may be wrong. I have 4 sisters and have not told a single one of them because I really don't feel that they can help me. It's sad in a way, but real. People on this forum and MCs are the ones that can help. They UNDERSTAND.

Keep posting and bumping them up. Try to get some of this bottled up emotion out. Write it down and post. It helps.

Hoping this helps.

Hi Harmonie, I'm back.

You probably are at work and won't see this for some time.

I came home from work to take my kids to school and allow my W to use the van. She is headed into a meeting at work which she knows that she is probably going to be fired. She's been off on stress leave for the last 3 weeks and discovered an email that her boss was going to let her go when she returned. There is completely no grounds except he knows she can't stand him and he is a big part of her stress. I also blame her work situation as part of the reason her and I are in our situation... but that's another story... this is your thread.

It's hard to comment on other peoples lives without knowing the full story and situation, so please take that into account. From reading your 2 month post, it sounded like your H has some issues with self-esteem (don't we all). With the alchahol problem, trouble finding work, etc.. I know from my own situation, I was a fixer... my W often had different stresses or problems and I just wanted to fix them for her so she could be happy. What I didn't realize before was that she just wanted me to listen to her and empathize... not judge or advise (at least all the time) or fix it for her.
When your husband was down, you mentioned that you did everything to help him out... finding him a job, etc.. This probably seemed like you were there for him and showing him how much you loved him... exactly how I felt with my W... but possibly, the reality in that one situation, was that his sense of low self-esteem was being magnified... he couldn't keep a job and needed his W to bail him out.

This is a tough spot to be in because you also need to ensure your family and your finances are surviving.

We just sold our home and have bought a new home ( a huge risk considering the state of affair... pun intended... our lives are in). We move in on Nov. 5...and I am faced with my W not having a job. I know that she can "play the game" with them and demand a higher severance than what they will probably offer... we have had legal advise... but she may be too stressed and will want to just quit and get it over with. I've told her, even though we need the extra money, that however she decides to handle todays meeting is fine with me. I also offered to go with her (wait in the van), but she wanted to go alone. Before, I would have been hurt by this as I wanted to be needed... but now I just told her I was proud of her decisions and the work she has done... I know what kind of employee she is as she was my Exec. Asst. for 3 years before taking this job.

My point is that even though we may be set back further financially during an already very difficult time, I believe it is more important for us that she rebuilds her self-esteem and start to love herself again.

On another note... try not to bottle up your emotions... this is very hard as we are trying to create a "safe" atmosphere for WS to come home to... I find this very difficult. But if you store them up now just to get a short term recovery, they will eventually let loose later and send everything back to square one. You need to watch how you express your anger... avoid yelling, sarcasm, throwing the affair in their face, etc... but you also need to tell your H how you are feeling. This is a risk, but it is also a huge part of building intimacy... if it is done in a positive, mature way. It may set things back for a day or two, but you may also find that after he has a chance to process what you are saying, that he will feel closer to you.

I can't imagine a tougher spot than what we are in. I said on a different post that I find it hard to get a balance. One minute I am focused on W's needs... trying to show love and affection, forgiveness, etc... and I find myself becoming obsessive and needy. I recognize this, so I concentrate on making me into a better person... working on myself and doing things for myself, and then I find myself feeling indifferent and cold. It is hard to plan A when you question everything that you are doing and your S is doing. But my belief of Plan A is that you are working on yourself to be the person that your S or anyone else would love to be with. While doing that, you are setting boundaries, and showing your spouse that you love them without enabling.

Sorry for such a long post.

Take care,

Shaden

Hi Shaden,
Thankyou so much for your responses. This is exactly the type of support and reassurance I was hopping to find here!
You have hit some nails on the head! I have been very disgusted with myself for feeling like I am "begging" all the time for things, and even sometimes like I am compromising my self.

I have been so very careful as to how I express myself with H. I will not do the yelling or sarcasm. I know where that has led us in the past. H has always been very quick to get defensive anyway and is the person who uses sarcasm, Sadley, that is how he was raised. But I feel like I come off as so clingy and needy to H. Like you said, I too, am doing all the things to make our home life as comfortable and welcoming as possible. I focus on all things positive and try not to be confrontational in any way. I always use "I feel, or I need" statements, I have not done any blaming or thrown the A in his face at all ...though a few times I have wanted to just rip loose!

I read his journal he kept the 1st 2 weeks after d-day, and in one of his entrys he wrote " I have no regrets about what I did, especially if it means bringng "Harmonie" and I closer together again". He has not once appologized for all of the pain his actions have caused. Though he did write "I'm Sorry" to me regarding a recent bad decision he made. Saying he is not known for doing the right things at the right times.

With his working so much the past week and for the next several weekends in over time, I am freaking out because there is no time for us to focus on anything other than quick info about what is going on with the kids and anything that may need important attention.... like our marriage recovery work will have to wait till we are caught up on the bills....
I am again , as always left alone to raise the kids, run our home, pay bills, and be the marriage counselor.... plus I work 2 different jobs, one 5 days a week and another on an as needed basis.

I have been building up resentment about barring all this responsibility for years as it is, which is partly why I am to blame for some of the LB's that led to the A for him. And now Trying to make the marriage recover from his A seems so one sided as I play "single parent"... it is so hard for me to "keep cool" about everything. To work on ME was easy the second week after Dday. I was going strong until 2 weeks ago, then I caught a cold and I have been "crumbling" ever since. I caught the same cold again this week, sinuses & cough, and feel miserable...that seems to magnify all the turmoil in life even more.

I am affraid I too am starting to become indifferent and distance myself bit by bit with H. And THAT is exactly what I did from May till August, 2 weeks before D-Day. Why I think the A happened, too.

I have not really done a plan A or B... have yet to really read what they are all about... it is in the book How To Survive an affair.. right? Or where here?
Do you find it helpful?

Need to go start dinner and such.... Sorry if I seem to be rambling or too random in what I say..I am having such a hard time with my focus...I just spill over it seems!!!
And so much to say!!!!!
Thank you again for your responses.
Be Well,
Harmonie

Michele,
Thanks for your support, I am sorry you too are feeling like I do. This is all so insane!
As far as H being transparent...that is getting tough for me... he has been such a good liar! Though when Iread back through all my journaling in the last 3 months before D Day, I saw all the signs infront of me... I just thought he was hiding that he was drinking again....sometimes I thought "or worse" but I just never thought he would ever betray our marriage. He always swore that was his one strong point, faithfulness, despite all his other "short comings".....alcohol, drugs, anger issues, domestic abuse, but infidelity was not one of them.

I sort of responded to some of the things you wrote to me in my response to Shaden... I am so scatterbrianed and tend to ramble right now as i have so much information running through my brain!

Just focussing all I read here at MB and from the books is enough to process.... then we have to get through our daily lives and try to live as "normally" as possible..... then there are the people in life who have no idea what we are going through and they want things from us and wonder why we can't be all and do all that we usually are doing.....

Some days I just want to wear a sign on my back that says it all.... and then on the bottom of it....
JUST GIVE ME A MINUTE!!!! .....LOL!!!!!

I learned my sister's H had an A onher 1 1/2years ago. We do not have alot of contact with each other as she lives in another state and we have not talked since last May. I just got a call from her today and told her about what happened to my H & I.... I was so glad now to finally tell her as I know she will be able to understand what I am dealing with and it is someone who KNOWS me, my life, family etc.

She tells me she has come here to MB everyday to read though she never posts. She says it is easier for her to deal with things that way...where as me... I am a talker and need to have communication with others.
I am so glad I found this site!

Thankyou for your support & hope I can talk to you again!
Be Well, Harmonie

Hi Harmonie,

It sounds like you're hitting one of the bottom tracks on the roller coaster ride... atleast you can look forward to going back up again soon I hope.

It sounds like you are trying very hard to make this work... Plan A and Plan B are discussed in the Basic Concepts and Articles if you click on at the top of the screen. Someone also sent me some info on it in one of the other threads, I'll try and find it and send it to you.

Don't worry too much about the lack of time right now as you sort through regular daily life. It may help you take some of the focus off of the A and keep going. Right now there seems to be so much happening in our lives that we have barely been able to talk about the A... but some of it is helping to bring us closer again... My SIL is just about ready to separate from her H, my W's nephew is going through a rough time, my W lost her job today... but that was actually a good thing, we are trying to move, my MIL is moving and my W trying to help, I'm travelling with work,some of our employees in another province just came off of strike... so lots happening, but we are able support each other through it... just haven't had much time for healing or talking about the A and R.

Is there anything you can do in your life to simplify? Our moving and her changing jobs is part of our simplification. Can you arrange to go with only one job, or other changes? What about some of the work you are doing... if you don't do it will your H be forced to help? Have you asked him for help especially with the kids and maintaining the household? Does he expect you to do all of this and you are trying to do it to "meet his needs"?

I guess all the extra work is to catch up on the bills, so it would be tough to quit a job... will the bank help with a consolidation? Is your H working the OT just to pay the bills or as an excuse to be at work with OW? Even if it took longer to get out of debt, could you still do it without H working that extra shift?

Reading the journal can be a difficult thing. I read my W's notes during the 6 weeks that I was "giving her space" not knowing what was going on or about the A. The stuff I read in there... things that she thought after "rewriting" our M history due to the A, and being in the fog of the A... the things I read hit me worse than finding out about the A. Actually I felt a little better after learning about the A because it explained some of what I read. Remember your H is still in a fog... the things he is saying in the journal is not accurate to how he used to feel and probably to how he will feel about you again in time.

As for not saying sorry... this also takes time and it doesn't work unless it is real. My W now says sorry nearly every day, but I still don't feel she is truly at the stage of remorse. She is sorry for hurting me and feels upset about the A, but I'm not sure she is yet truly sorry about having the A... it is getting closer. Your H needs time.

IMO, you need to take some time to think about how you envision your M if it was better. What do you need from your H? What do you want for yourself. You need to know what you are willing to live with. I believe it is worthwhile doing the hard work to recover from the A, but you also need to know if after, the M is going to be what you want. Will your H change... because you can't change him. Can you live with the M if he doesn't change from who he was pre-A? Once you decide on this, then I think a plan can be made.

It's good that you now can speak to your S and get some support from someone close to you who knows. Maybe she'll read your posts and reply as well.

I don't know if anything I am saying is helpful... I am definitely still a rookie here. Don't take my ideas as Gospel... make sure you read or ask for help from some of the veterans who have made it through. But even from them, make sure you think through all of the advice because each situation is different.

Have a good evening. I'll be praying for you and your H. I am hopeful that things will improve.

Shaden

Hi Shaden,
Yes, bottom of the roller coaster sounds accurate! LOL.
I was able to talk to my S for 5hours last night. Gawd howrefreshing it was to beable to talk to someone "live" and have them be able to comprehend everything I said! From the terms used here at MB to the goofy confusion I feel to some of the things that have happened... she can relate to all of it. My S and I grew up seperatly and did not know each other till I was 14 and she was , she is actually my 1/2 sis , but who is measuring, right? lol. (same dad, different moms)
She did read all of my posts here and that was so helpful too cause it caught her up on alot of details and I did not have to go into it.
I did read plan A again in HTSA book. I guess it would just be more helpful if there were more specific things to help me stay on track with it right now.
It is great to be busy with all the stuff we have on our plates in the real world, But don't you ever feel like it as more time passes that the issues will just get brushed under the rug?
That is usually what happens here with us the more time that passes and then itis harder to bring a subject back up to deal with.
I know H would just as soon never discuss the A ever again and avoid all this stuff. DENIAL is huge with him I feel. I become more apprehensive to bring specific things up too at the risk of his getting defensive and it turning in to an argument... despite how carefully I choose my words and how I approach him.
As far as simplifiying life.... I have pretty much "shutdown" and only deal with the "have to do " list in life right now. I know that everything that HAS to be done will still be there tomorrow and if I can get througha thing or two then I have done what I can. Just that the reprocussions of anything left undone will fall on me. H does what ever he wants in the daily scheme of things. If he is tired, he sleeps, wants a bike ride instead of chores, he goes. This has pretty much been the way things havealways been and I have been fed up for years. I have asked, begged, fought about it (LB)... It really feels like it doesn't matter. I may get a temporary change from him but it isjust that, temporary.
I was at the end of my rope with this when I started working my 1st new job in April, and I felt strongly I wanted to end the relationship if he didn't start to step up and take on some of the responsiblities here besides just providing the paycheck. All our past issues are still here and now with the A on top of it all I just have a hard time seeing the future as ever getting any brighter.
Domestic Help is a huge EN for me, always has been.
I was of the thinking that he would be trying extra hard now to do all things needed to re-build and repair our relationship. But in truth it is the old saying...The more things change, the more they stay the same.

Sorry, I feel like I am pratteling on, whinning. ARGH! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" /> Have any cheese and crackers to go with the whine?

Thanks for everything, being here! All words help, even from a "rookie" lol. I hope I can return the favor to people someday.

Keep in touch,
Be well, Harmonie

Hi Harmonie,

I'm finally able to sit and relax in the hotel... just a business trip for one night.

I found the bit of info. on plan A that was posted to me earlier...



I'm doing pretty good with the carrot, but not so good with the stick... which is typical of me and my M.

It sounds like we are in the same boat in that our S's were both the takers in the M and they both had the A. If you were doing all the chores before the A, then just doing them now to be the person he wants doesn't really help... but not doing them will make you more miserable.

I've read the book on Tough Love by Dr. Dobson. He talks about two people in a R. When person A moves away from the other,person B, the natural instinct is for B to follow and hold on... this causes A to run further away. He suggests that if B were to move away from A a little, then often A stops running away and comes towards B. He shows it with pictures in the book which makes it easier to understand then my explanation. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> I guess I'm wondering if, by just doing things to make you happy... and things with your kids... would you be able to stop chasing him and move away abit for him to move closer. Stop asking him for anything or about anything. Act and be happy as much as possible. Do things for yourself. Spend time with your kids or friends. Don't LB... be kind, considerate, and friendly to him... but act like you are fine with or without him.

Hopefully you can get other advice on this before you take mine... but I would suggest reading the tough love book... but don't let him see it, because then it just becomes a manipulation. This move does have to be real and truthful... you need to believe that you will be ok on your own. This is a risk... but so is any plan for rebuilding. There are no guarantees.

Again, you need to decide what you will accept in your M. If your H is never going to help around the house and that is a major EN... then a decision on your part will have to be made. But... let's hope that in time, he will see the importance of making his own changes. Don't give up yet... it's way too early. I can't remember... are you in MC or IC? If not, this may be a way for him to figure out some of these changes if he would agree to go with you.

By the way... if you don't mind saying... what is the reason behind your screen name?

Well that's enough words tonight from a rookie.

Have a good evening. I'll be praying.

Shaden

Hi Shaden,

Thankyou! The Carrot Sticks make total sense! An outline of sorts was exactly what I needed for when when I felt like I didn't know what the " H-E-hockey sticks" I was doing.
For the most part I have instinctually done these carrots and sticks on my own. The sticks are a bit harder though.
Especially feeling as though what he did was MY fault. Yuck, that is an awful feeling, and I remind myself we all have choices.... even I made a choice, to stay and work things out. And boundries are a bit hard cause I am affriad if I say too much I would be demanding.
I had briefly shared with H the concept of the POJA but it is hard to try to implement when he is allways at work and we have such little time now for disscussion. And as I may have said before, he has started to hit his Denial phase of dealing w/things.
Your explanation of Dobsons A & B people makes total sense! And I have actually done this and can see how it works. However I have to be really careful as I tend to with draw to far and that is a bad LB and pattern I have had in the past, IMO. But the TL book sounds like a good plan for more than 1 reason.
I have an almost 17 year old Son who may be coming back home to live in a couple of months after being away for a year. Long story short, I tried TL approach w/him when his behaiviors were out of control and for my own sanity. Was so hard but I did it on my own with no guidelines or info. Anyway, he may be moving home and that is goingto be like walking on eggshells between H and DS#1 and Me.
*like I need ANOTHER challenge in mysoap opera life! LOL*
Like I said , too, with this stupid cold I have, it has been even more difficult to focus on things and "do my own thing". If I could just rest and get over it I know I could work the carrot sticks much better.
As for what I will tolerate.... oh my! I have tolerated SO MUCH in the passed 10 years (at the risk of being a martyr!)
I just don't know where I am going to draw that line in the sand. I guess I know that if the old patterns of our relationship do not start making a positive change for the better in say 6 months, I will have to make a decision. Both H and I have said that we do not want things to be as they had been before the A. But if he is not willing to work some kind of plan with me I do not see how our old patterns and behaiviors will change?

As for my screen name, It comes from a favorite song of mine by Sir Elton John *major fan of his* The song is called "Harmony" on the Good Bye Yellow Brickroad lp.
It is a song that ever since I heard it I felt is was "MY SONG". There is a line "Harmony, gee I really love ya and I want to love you forever, and dream of never, never, never leaving Harmony" and then at the end he just sings the name over and over. It has stuck to me.
Probably sounds sappy but oh well, it's all good to me. LOL!

Talk to you soon,
Be Well, Harmonie

Oh, Shad, another thing I forgot to mention, yesterday was like a total LB day Where H was so incredibly "snarky". I was again either in tears or on the verge most of our time together. I had stayed home from work as DS#2 is sick too and I wanted to try to catch up on some of my obligations.
My family was going to go on a weekend trip today , but H had made a plan that he would drive us up north and he'd come back home to work for Thur & Fri (being home alone and un accountable) I had decided I could wait until Saturday am to leave instead saying I needed more time here to get work done. He became very quiet and his mood dropped. I could not help but suspect that this could have something to do with a deception on his part.??? As we were together through out the day till he left for work, he snapped at me or was sarcastic about everything he said. Really hurt.
However, when he came home last night, he seemed in a better mood, cheerful, AND initiated an apology! Not his norm! Then we had an hour of pleassant small talk before bed. ????? I feel like a yo yo!
By the way, how is your trip? Do you have to be away from your family long? How do you deal with being away from your W and with trust?

O.k....I'll let ya go now! LOL!
Be Well, Harmonie

Hi Harmonie,

Sorry to hear that your cold is still lingering. ...just when you think it can't get worse, and then you have to deal with feeling lousy physically as well.

It does sound a little fishy about his mood when he wanted to be alone... it could just be that he knew you didn't trust him and that bothered him. You mentioned that he is doing NC as much as he can with still working there. Are you feeling that the A is still ongoing, or is he still just in a fog and acting selfish?

My trip was a short one... go home this evening... just one night away. I handle it fine... I've chosen to offer my trust to my W. I still have moments of anxiety but they are lessening. She does not have to account for her time to me unless she wants to... and she is doing a pretty good job letting me know on her own. I thought it was important to do this... even though it goes against what most would suggest here... because the first thing my W needed was to regain her self-esteem.

Anyway, I need to spend some time with my family now that i'm home. I'll respond more tomorrow.

Shaden

Hi Harmonie,

Feeling any better today?

It's great news that your son is coming home?!... atleast I'm guessing it's great news. I'm sure that is an interesting story, and whatever happened a year ago for you to have to use tough love, must have been torture.

In the past, pre-A, how did you feel when you were "being the martyr"? When you were cleaning, looking after the kids, taking care of the finances, etc... did you feel happy that you were "giving" in this way, but resentful of your H that he wasn't giving back? Did you feel you needed to do these things for your own peace of mind and happiness. When you found out about the A, did you feel "how could you do this to me after all I've done in our marriage and for you... I've given so much! It's not fair!" I'm just wondering because of some of the things I've learned about myself. I can say more after you've answered... if you choose to.

How were things today with your H? Was he still in a good mood? The roller-coaster ride is so hard... but it can get better. I don't feel like I'm dropping nearly so far and so often these days... but I do drop.

Especially the last few days, my W seems so much more relaxed now that she is away from her job. I believe her job was the straw that brought her over the edge to have the A. On the plane coming home last night I listed every possible reason I could that I thought led to her being in a position to choose the A. There were nearly 30 reasons I came up with. From history... her parents affairs and divorce to physical... her battle with depression... to stresses... her work... to me not meeting EN's like listening to her when she was feeling so depressed from work. I can so easily intellectualize and understand how it happened... and then my emotions scream "why!?"... how could our marriage and my feelings mean so little?

Back to the trust issue. My W is doing little things to make sure I know and feel ok. For example, the other day she went with her sister to pick up her Mom's car from the shop... the shop was next door to OM's work (he manages a new car sales shop). Even though she was with her older sister (who doesn't know about the A... her Mom and twin sister knows)... she called me to make sure I was ok knowing she was going there. I wasn't concerned that she was meeting him, but still was concerned about the triggers of emotion.
I don't know many details about the A... I haven't pushed it very much yet. I don't know if they met at his work or anything. All I know is they were physical 5 or 6 times with the first time at the end of April, just before we went on a family trip to California... it makes that trip now a bad memory for me. I do know she never brought him to our home... she said "she would never do that"... which I thought was funny... like there are good forms of A behavior rules and bad forms.
I do still have times of paranoia, but am coping with it. My MC spoke to me about "snooping"... which is basically considered an acceptable practice in circumstances like ours... but she said what cost to myself and the future of the M is the snooping doing. Yes I have to protect myself, but is it making any real difference in recovery? If my W is going to break NC, she will find a way to do so whether I am snooping or not. My paranoia may be damaging the recovery. If I am focused on making myself a better person and knowing that I will be happy and ok with or without my W, then snooping serves no purpose except to create stress and anxiety. If she is still seeing him I will eventually know. The opposite to this argument is when a S is in a fog... they don't act rationally and making them more accountable through checking on them helps to give them the strength to get through the withdrawal. I agree that protecting yourself and assisting spouse in this way may be needed. But I believe my W is past the worst of the withdrawal and it is more beneficial for me to work on rebuilding the trust. I'm probably making mistakes in this... especially since I have a knack for ignoring advise from others on here who have been through it longer than I have... but I also need to come out of this at the other end feeling good about myself and what I was able or willing to do.

Have a good day and enjoy your trip up north. Hopefully it will be time to relax. The turnaround for my W and I was a couple of family camping trips in the summer... this time away really helped.


Well I've babbled enough for today... I should get back to work.

Shaden

Hi Shaden,

I actually have good news to talk about today for a change!

Some how, H has snapped out of his fog and has been communicating and receptive to me! He responded to my last journal entry, in our shared journal, where I had written somethings about how I was so sad and feeling lost and alone in our recovery. Though what he had written to me I had misunderstood and I was so hurt that I tore the page out and crumpled it. He saw that I had done this and actually confronted me and initiated a talk about it. He was so thoughtful in explaining his response and appologized for not writting more so I would understand what he was saying. The LB deposits he made at that moment were so huge! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> He also explained to me that what has been troubling him is thathe has been dwelling too much on his work and that the hours he is putting in are catching up to him. He said he is troubled that he is "bringing his work thoughts home with him".
I felt able to work plan A again in a loving way!
So last night I surprised him with a really nice dinner
and after we ate we watched a movie together and then got to bed about 5 am! The time we spent was so nice and our conversation was relaxed and easy. What a nice change from the passed 5 days!
Also, I gave him a presant for both of us to share. I got the book "I Cherish You" . It is a smaller version of "His Needs, Her Needs". When I saw it I knew that it would be perfect for me to help him learn the concepts of EN. He had said that he didn't want to read the other books like Love Busters etc. But that if I wanted to discuss what I have read and learned he is open to that.
He has dislexia and has a very hard time reading and comprehending what he reads, though if read to him and then discussed in small bits that seems to work better.
I think that the way this book is formatted, it will be an easier read for him and I together, with out too much information to overload him. Just the basic facts.

We leave tomorrow am for our trip up north and the work we had planned to do for my parents up there has already been taken care of so he is happy about that and we can just go up there and enjoy our time instead of working on what little time off we have. We invited another couple to go with us (friends of mine that I am trying to get him more aquainted with). This way the guys can go out on the ATV's together and "rip it up". This also spares ME from having to go out on the trails! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> lol!
Any how, I am in hopeful spirits again as I see him trying a bit more than he had been, and that feels wonderful.
How is everything going with you now that you are back home? Do you get to be home for a while? When you are home does your family get to do much together?
Well, I should run and start packing for our weekend. With staying up till 5 am, I did not get moving till 12 today and am a bit behind the schedule! (whats new!) Hope you have a nice weekend too.
Be well,
Harmonie

Hi Again Shaden... And OOOPPSS! I did not see this last post of yours when I last wrote. Didn't realise we got to a 2nd page! LOL!
Still learning the ropes I guess! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />
I need to get busy here but will respond in a while to your recent post.... sorry... I have been dragging all morning...need more coffee, sleep, a maid, ....LOL!
Be well,
Harmonie

P.S. What is the meaning of your screen name? It sounds like a real name of sorts? Or am I missing something? LOL.

Hi Harmonie,

That was great news on your post. I would normally say it's important to try and not get too high or too low with all the changing emotions and circumstances... but theres probably nothing wrong with it. One of the problems in my M was that we were both conflict avoiders... in one book I read, it described our marriage like the dial tone of a phone... just steady and unchanging. We were not feeling enough passion from the highs and lows... no anger no joy.
So let the emotion out and build the intimacy.

Have a great weekend.

My screen name is a name of sorts... a combination of my two son's names... Shane and Braden.

Take care.

Shaden

Dear Harmonie,

I am in a similar situation as you. My husband had an affair with his secretary which he stills works with right next to his desk. I found out 4 months ago. I am still crushed, still crying, etc. etc. Went to therapist, he didn't think he did anything wrong.

He says he will not change jobs, because of the income he is getting. He is working on transfering her - so he says. But, it takes time and has to be done the right way. I don't know how long it will take. What is a reasonable amount of time? She is in the union and has been working at his place for a long time. He told me he can't just tranfere her, even though he made her his secretary and she's only been with him about a year or so.

I too am attractive, men always comment to my husband about that and how lucky he is. The OW looks older than me, has wrinkles, a big nose, smokes, drinks, talks like a "sailor", slept with half of the office, I could go on an on. But, yet he went and had an affair with her, emotinally and sexually and preferred her over me. I think, this always happens. I was more insulted by the fact that she was just plain homely.

We're trying to work thru this, but I am so unhappy, crushed, thinking about what went on. I want to believe him because I love him. Hopefully, it will work in the end, for our children and my sanity.

I never realized how many people this happens to. How many people don't care of other people's feelings and well being, when the other person is devoted to them. When the affair happens there are dozens of excuses as to why it happened. Why didn't they just open up and try to work things out before they did this to us?

Take care.