THIS is not to say that any of you have to take anything I say with anything greater than milli-ounce of salt...though their are definitely lots of wisdom here from posters..........

THIS warning goes out to all BS who live in fear...........

too fearful to ask a legitimate question
too fearful to say something

you need to re-examine your own role and fear in these instances......

.........

It is my belief that if you can not change any other person on this planet which is what I believe...
It is also my opinion that even actions that scare you when done within the context of PLAN A....can not and will not be the reasons for a marriage failing or making it....

too many live in fear if I do this
or if I do that...
then I the BS will blow this marriage...

my dears...the marriage was blown the second the WS went off with the OP into EA/PA land...

they own that like a tattoo.....and there is NOTHING that puts the onus on to you.............

which is not to say it can't be rebuilt.....like the six million dollar man........

it is just to say that the fear on these boards needs to be picked a part...

what?????????????

afraid to stand for what is right....?
afraid to say something cause it might
hurt
upset
anger
the
WS...
phoooey on that one....and all the other ones as well

If you are in plan A and let fear guide you...you will flounder more than is necessary.............

You will find yourself posting questions here about your WS behavior that NO ONE here can answer

you must go to the source......

pray for clarity
prepare for any and everything...
think it through...

WS have many options in which to respond so prepare prior to asking...

prepare for
a lie
a retaliation
a reversal of blame
to be ignored....
and on and on is the list of crap a WS can use to deflect you...

prepare like the boyscouts.............
(I actually don't know much about the boyscouts..so that may be wayyyyyyyyy off....)
but I think they should be prepared...
as should YOU in plan A........

CHOOSE YOUR BATTLES>>>>>>>>>>>>>

When there is severe blatant disrespect in your face...
you must not take it.......
you must not go belly up..........

and you must NOT then decide to tackle some ridiculous nebulous issue instead...

WS are very very confused....
they use words that have different definitions than anyone else on the planet...which is why BS must be steadfast and hold on the correct meaning.......

WS even in plan A need consistant signs of responding differently.................

BS in my opinion should wear their wedding rings...as long as and UP until they are not married...
the message is that MARRIAGE has meaning NOT based on the actions of a WS but because in and of itself it stands alone.........unchanging in definition........NOT BASED ON A WS CRUEL WHIMS........

I could go on and on and those than KNOW me know I can...but the typos will blind you if I get on good roll...................


TAKE your fear
EXAMINE it in your hand...turn it over and over....
play with it
work with it
look at from different side and different angles.......
see how much of your fears are valid...
see how much of your fears are conveniant stagnators that play in to the WS hands...and keep you in limbo...

ARK

Thanks Ark,

That was very encouraging, it made say 'YES I can do it'. I have been scared of asking my husband for more question (refer to my post) but your post has given me encouragement.

Not to say that I would do it but I will read it again and again until I convince myself.

Thanks again.

So true ark and I might add,what are the fears,rational or not,that keep you from living a life of honesty and dignity NO MATTER who is hurting you?

What are you sacrificing and for what? Should you be?

O

Not to say that I would do it but I will read it again and again until I convince myself.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

I just adore honest answers...
and that is an honest answer...............

pray for clarity
play with the answers you fear.................

ARK

Timely Ark.

Fight or flight. Recover or divorce. Cowering and living off WS crumbs is undignified and not a successful personal recovery strategy.

Ask yourself

"What would I do if I were not afraid?"

It is usually the RIGHT thing.

Ark - Thanks for the post. I agree with you. Fear can and does paralyze people.

I think for me, more than the fear of am I going to upset my WH or is what I do going to run him off, is the fear of being alone. Taking care of myself and my kids alone. The fear of OMG I have been a stay at home Mom for 20 years and now I have to go out and fully support myself. Not just get a job, but something that I can live on! That scares me.

I have gotten over the fear of worrying what my WH will feel or think. But that is a VERY real fear in the beginning stages of betrayal I think.

Choose Your Battles...I have always loved this! I use it with my kids and my friends and now my WH. You are right.

I think we can all look back at our beginning posts and see/hear the desparation in our voices. We are scared and think if we blink the wrong way our WH will leave. But you are right...it is not what we do, it is them!

I wear my wedding rings and I am coming to grips with my fears.

Thanks for the post!

Ark,

Having become recently a BS, I can certainly confirm that in my case, soon after learning about the affair, being in a state of shock, and therefore not being able to think clearly, I was a prey to my fears.

- fear that I was unloveable because WS did not want me, fear that it was my fault that A happened, fear of being alone, fear of having to take charge of every aspect of my life, fear that I will not be able to, and then what would happen? Reasonable fears became overly exaggerated and paralysing.

Being so fearful to not even consider 'playing the if game' and just try and answer the questions and imagine myself there.

I think D-day got me so 'off-balanced' that when I needed to be the most strong, I was the most vulnerable.

By no longer being 'grounded', I was easily 'led' and kept getting 'lost' further. A WS at the helm? You can imagine where that's headed to.

So, yes, I think for a BS the 'fears' become one of the biggest challenges to manage in an A.

Personally, I feel I am only starting to get a grip of my fears and try to deal with them as best as I can. What did it take for me? PLAN B, the fact that I am no longer under the direct 'influence' of my WS. Not being part of the chaos/drama of a triangle I seem to be able to think clearer.

I was just recently able to communicate to my WS the one sentence that I should have said to him much much ealier on: that I would consider interacting with him again the day his A with OW ended.

It seems such a simple sentence now.

So, definitely, the quicker BS identifies his/her fears, tries to deal with them or manage them, a BS will be better able to 'function' and do what needs to be done in the face of an A.

To date I had identified the fact that I was 'off-balance' and not able to act, but, with your reflection, I can now say that my fears when in an 'off-balance' state got to me.

Thanks, Ark.

I have to go out and fully support myself. Not just get a job, but something that I can live on! That scares me.

turn it around in your thoughts and empower yourself...

nothing makes a person stronger than facing hurdles...little by little step by step..........

breathe deep
and feel your strengths.............
you ability to master tasks..........

even when we have lost the right to choose our path...we have not lost the ability to not fear it.........

ARK

You have made me think about what I am scared about.
To sum it up is losing him!

I am able to support myself (more than him!) But then the problem is if I move back to my country with my son or stay here. In one hand I would move back to hurt him and make it difficult to see his son, I have all my family and support there so nothing to worry about. But on the other hand I love my job, I have done very well and if I go back I would have to start from scratch. I love my life here with him.

Sorry, just puting my thoughts in paper, sort of speak...

Don't worry about losing him by confronting the truth or making him come out about his actions! If he is lying, you don't have him anyway. And what is so bad about losing someone who does not want to be honest and faithful.

Stand your ground. Don't be afraid.

(P.S. You are angry right now, but I am sure your mothering instincts would really not let you use your son to hurt him...thereby hurting your son.)

Sorry, no, I would not hurt my son, but I do believe that we would be better off next to my family as I haven't got anybody here.

I had big fear issues after D-day. The thing that helped me the most (but I didn't do this until WH had moved out) was making a list of my priorities. My marriage was #4, after my sanity and the physical and emotional well being of the children. The house, the finances, the stuff was all pretty low on the list.

So then, I could more objectively look at potential actions, and see what on my list that action might help or hinder.

I have also accepted worse case scenario and have made peace with that. For me, worse case scenarion is me getting nothing out of my 15 year marriage but my children and some child support. I am OK with that-I wouldn't love it, I don't think it is fair or just, but I can do that.

(Actually, worse case scenarion is my WH abducting my children or driving off a cliff with them-but I had to give that fear to God)

I pray differently now, I use to pray for peace for my family, I prayed for WH and OW to have peace and stop their destructive behavior, I prayed for things that I thought would get me what I wanted. Now, I only pray for knowledge of God's will for me and the power to carry that out.

Before my WH moved out, my OD was very fearful, so I had her make a list of everything that she was scared of. And two months later, everything on my 8yo's list has happened. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/teary.gif" alt="" /> BUT, we are still strong, we have some joy to temper the hurt, and we have hope.

Not operating from a place of fear has kept me sane. I am still working on not operating from a wounded ego, but that is a different topic <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Warning: thread jack.

MAWB, I can understand wanting the support of your family for you and your son. Besides, if it turns out he has continued contact--HE was the one that left...not you!

This is it for me, Ark,

quote:----------------------------------------------------
even when we have lost the right to choose our path...we have not lost the ability to not fear it.........
----------------------------------------------------------

Ideally, we like to choose paths in our lives, think about the choices, think about what we want, about what is involved, evaluate whether we think we have what it takes, etc. In the case of an A, where the BS is left out of the process of the decision-making, not given a 'choice', it becomes an 'imposed' path, coming from the 'exterior', and a BS has not been given a chance to think it through, how the challenge would be mastered.

For me, it's like being given the task of going swimming in the lake.

One way, I am given the chance to test the water with my toes, convince myself that since I can swim there should not be a problem, and basically going at my rhythm, to finally end up in the lake swimming confidently and enjoying myself.

As opposed to being pushed in the middle of the lake by surprise and panicking and doing all the wrong things and risk drowning.

A BS has been pushed in the middle of the lake, and while panicking needs to think clearly and convince oneself that inspite of it, we have what it takes not to drown.

I know this image may have many flaws (like any comparison does), but it helps me to understand better how a fear can be managed or it can overwhelm you.

I agree, Bob, our answer to this question can sometimes tell us how far off from the mark one really is:

"What would I do if I were not afraid?"

I am saying that while there is great fear in being the BS...

it is imperative to spend time with it and examine and re-examine it over and over.....

to look at it a 100 different ways........

ARK

Keep on having these moments!

I am sorry, Ark, I am not sure I understand. Would you be able to give an example? I would really appreciate it.

quote:----------------------------------------------------
I am saying that while there is great fear in being the BS...

it is imperative to spend time with it and examine and re-examine it over and over.....

to look at it a 100 different ways........
-----------------------------------------------------------

luna...

look at the responses....

look at new posters ...the gut reactions not to upset the WS....

it's irony at it's greatest.......

look at the men...so thrown in to crisis the fear of losing their wife clouds their ability to parent their children...

then look how strong mortarman, frankd, bobpure and others became so strong and sooo dayum attractive to their WS when they took that fear and sat with it...then on it....and became men of men by being DADS!!!!!!! ( and even though frankd has not recovered his wife...in his daughter eyes is a hero beyond compare...)

look at jean who made a list and found her marriage at NUMBER FOUR!!!!!!!! of priorities.........
that's a good list........with clear perspective of needing to be strong and healthy first for any of this to work...


look at BS who watches the actions of their WS and are too afraid to ask them questions ...so they come here and post what does this mean...or why did they do this or that...
and never ask their own WS...because they fear the answer..which most likely if you think it through will only be a lie or half truth if lucky.............but the fear of the unknown is not greater for them..........so they wallow in the fear of knowing..........

what is it you really fear..

being alone...
what if your spouse fell off a cliff today..
you'd be alone...

what is the fear that stops you from doing or saying something...and how much is it consuming your thoughts....

play out what you fear in the best and worst..
prepare for each one..............

FOR ME I am more terrified than living with a unhealthy WS then I am any day of living on my own with three kids seven years and under...the fear of the damage that environment could bring out weighs the fear of being with a WS

and that might be real goal of this website....

Thats such a good point. People ask mehow I lost myfear. Truth is I didn;t. My fear is sitting next to me as I write.

Know your fear, and you can operate despite it. My fear and I have a healthy mutual respect. He will stop me doing reckless things and I will stop HIM from inhibiting my life.

Thanks for your reply, Ark.

Ark, I am still having a hard time figuring out what happened to me right after D-day. I think the shock of learning that the person I trusted the most had betrayed me was so unexpected that it just hit me really really hard and had me question and doubt myself at every level, rather than stay strong and stick to my values.

Thinking about what I just wrote, the answer that comes to mind is that probably, during my M, what I had done, without realizing it, was give away 'control' over me, give away 'power' over me, so that I ended up in such a vulnerable position after D-day.

Not a good idea to ever trust someone to that point. Now, why did I do that?......

Like Jean, I need to think about my priorities in life, and more importantly, how not to lose sight of them.

Thanks for getting us thinking, Ark.

I think of you and what you say/said often.