I've been reading through pages of archives, and I'm so impressed by BSs who seem to have it all together and are plan A-ing within a week or so of finding out.

My H told me about his ongoing affair with his old girlfriend almost exactly two months ago, and in those two months I did everything on the list of what NOT to do. I pushed, cried, gave ultimatums, bugged him on the phone, snooped, made plans for D, you name it. I was reeling and had no idea how to proceed. He moved out two weeks ago, and told me last week he wants a D.

I am finally now in a place of some peace and calm, where I understand his EN and am commited to the marriage. I haven't spoken to him since Monday night when he came over to take my girls trick-or-treating. He has plans to come over Saturday or Sunday, and I plan to be pleasant and energetic, have a nice environment, show him that I've done work around the house without his help, etc. But I'm terrified that I've already blown it, that while I'm sitting here calm and collected, he's at the lawyer's office. He's told me he's not coming back, that he loves this OW passionately, that I've been replaced in his heart, that he "emotionally divorced" me months ago.

Can someone give me reassurance that it's not too late? This all moved so fast and I reacted the only way I knew how at the time, but I would like to hear that when BS back off the H also starts to slow down the D process. He isn't living with her, he's in a motel and talking to her 16 hours a day. He plans to fly to see her at least two weekends between now and Christmas. Should I just sit tight?

You have come to the right place. While I don't have the experience or knowledge to tell you the right thing to do, I am sure one of the other experienced members will know just the right thing for you to do. It seems like the right thing to do is the opposite of what b/s instincts and emotions say to do. Just remember you will have so many emotions of highs and lows. This time is one of insanity and unstability. Try to get a grip on your emotions, and let your head do the talking, not your heart. You have to be strong minded, and listen to what other experienced poster are going to suggest. Just want you to know, all of the b/s know the pain and torment you have been going through the last few months. You might want to read up on Plan A and Plan B.

Sincerely,
K.D.'s Heartbreak

Thanks for the support. I really appreciate it. I have a feeling I'll be at this site for awhile. It just seems so hard to tell what is "fog" and what is real. He's always been a rational, intelligent guy, so when he says he wants a divorce, he's thought about it, he's clear, he's not coming back, etc., I don't know whether to believe it.

He just seems so *addicted.* He says he can't live without her, that he couldn't go two days without talking to her if his life depended on it. He couldn't sit here for an hour on Monday without disappearing into the kitchen to check his text msgs. He talks to her first thing in the morning and last thing at night. At one point in this whole process, I said "H, you're addicted!" and he said, "No, I'm in love. When you're in love, you want to talk to them all the time. That's love."

You yourself need to seek legal counsel asap and find out what rights you have to protect your children from exposure......

it's never to late to change yourself and become a person with whom you are comfortable and confident with your reactions.....

ARK

All the w/s think that their love is the real thing. Blah!! That is just the fog speaking. I have one of the most level headed husbands but he then became the w/h who is a lieing cheater, that couldn't control his urges to talk, text-message or see the o/w.
Now that there is no contact I now am seeing the original husband, the w/h seems to have faded into history. So as long as he is seeing o/w, expect the fog to continue, even if there is shreds of truth with the w/s babble talk.
There is no way that the highs of being in a passionate affair, can continue with feelings at this level. Sooner or later, their decietful affair will take its toll on their "addiction/true love(tongue in cheek) and they will start viewing the other person as a real life person, who has bad days, stinks when they go to the bathroom and breath smells when they wake up. It will help to make them realize that what they had with the o/p was nothing more than an illusion.

That's what I thought, too -- that real-life would eventually come crashing down like a ton of bricks on them. But this is a long-distance relationship. She lives in another state. As long as they carry it on long-distance and only meet for fun-filled weekends and romantic strolls in Central Park in NYC, he will never have to fight about bills or struggle with her kids.

It's like an endless vacation romance, and they can keep feeding it with "when we're together it will be wonderful blah, blah." And he says "Oh, I know real-life with her will be hard, but I'm so prepared to make it work. I wouldn't be doing this if I didn't think I could make it work."

Hey. I am sort of new to this site but have been getting a lot of good advice. I am a FWH who had the same type of A you are describing from your H. And when I say Former, I mean like NC just for about five days. I am just getting out of the fog so I know/remember exactly what it feels like. The "fog" is real and it is terrible. There is not a lot you can do about it, unfortunately. My W tried to take me to counseling and I would sit there with my arms crosses. She tried yelling (what you tried) and she tried being nice (drawing me baths when I got home from work). Nothing worked. Until there was NC, it was not going to happen.

I want to do whatever I can to help. If you can get him talking and there is a chance he might be willing to talk to someone who was in his place, I would be happy to. He can e-mail me if he wants to and we can share other contact information. Tell him to send an e-mail to tsargentjr@aol.com and I can tell him everything I went through. I am 99.99% sure it will blow him over how similar our stories are. Mine were just like every other FWH's stories I have read so I am sure his thoughts are right there also.

Don't give up Hoopsie. I definitely think you should try the being nice route. Especially in front of the kids. But tell him to get on this site and look around or to contact me.

I will pray for you tonight as I know a lot of posters are doing the same.

SNT

Hoopsie,
My H affair was long distance too. He had rented an apartment in secret....he worked 1-1/2 hours away from home, so I never knew. He used to stay over often because the commute was so long (sometimes 2-1/2 hours! L.A!). He is an attorney, so it was all about logic and rational thinking for him, except when it can to her.

I am telling you this because he did change his mind, but it took 3 months to change it and 3-4 more to stick with it (another D-day) and finally go NC. This can happen to you too! I did all the same things during the first few months. I am not sure plan A at that time would have made any difference....they were sooo in "love". Makes me want to puke when I think about what he said during that time.

I know what you are saying about the weekend romance. It is not hard to keep your "party face" on for a fun weekend and let the true "you" come out after you have gone home. I experienced the same problem. I couldn't do anything to stop it. At one point, we saw a MC who said he needed some alone time to figure out what he wanted......he was in a spiritual crisis! I knew that was crap, but my H was there clearly distressed, so I said yes. That gave him a whole week of fun with the OW, with my "approval"!

It can change. You can change and be more confident about what you are doing and less needy. Sorry about the needy thing, but that is how I felt. Definately talk to a lawyer, along with the plan A and taking care of yourself. My H finally saw what he would miss with our family. It was still a stuggle to pull himself out, but we both worked hard.

Are you in MC? or at least IC? I can't imagine having made it without our MC. He was awsome and took my H on head on, which can be difficult.....courtroom lawyer and very good at arguing.

You haven't ruined anything! If anyone ruined something it is your H and OW. You have done nothing wrong......don't accept that you have from H or anyone. Stay strong and try to get your emotions in control (yeah right!) so you can keep a good perspective on what is happening.

Wow, LBelle, we have some similarities in our situations. My husband is very good at arguing too. He's an executive type, very calm and rational and self-possessed. Except for now, of course.

If we divorce, I've told him I'm taking the children across the country to my hometown. I think he understands at some rational level what a divorce and "building a life" with this OW would mean for him -- he would lose his children for all intents and purposes, he would have to give up his career to move to her small hometown, he would have to pay me thousands a month, etc. But from what I've read about these romantic I'm-in-love affairs, they think that true love requires sacrifice. The sacrifice is how he proves his love for her.

I've been strong and haven't called him. This is the longest we've gone without talking since D-Day. I don't know, he may be sitting a work now thinking "gee, I wonder what W is doing, I'm a little curious, maybe she's not as needy as I thought" or he may be sitting there thinking "thank god the old ball-and-chain isn't bugging me today, on to the wedding!" The OW is his first love, his high school girlfriend, so they have history. At one point in this, he told me that when he took his vows he kinda didn't mean "forsaking all others" when it came to her. Ouch.

Does OC mean other child with the other woman? I gotta say, for me that's a line I wouldn't cross. If she got pregnant (unlikely, she's 36 and already has kids), I'd be out of here without a backward glance. That's wonderful that you're reconciling, however!

Yes, OC mean "other child". Awful, isn't it? The OW is my case was 43!! She also had already had children, but if you need a trap......! At first, my H couldn't believe anyone would gamble like that, but he became a believer later from the things she said to him. She had also be involved with married men before. Even broke up a marriage and then didn't take the man after all. I think she thought this time she was not going to lose! If he needed help to have courage to leave me, she was going to increase the stakes.

I never, ever thought I would have been in this situation. I guess none of us do. I thought just having the affair would have been the line he couldn't cross! But I have learned that you never know what you will really do when faced with a crisis. For my children, it was worth a try to see if it could be repaired. You can always get divorced! That is what kept me going. I wouldn't always have the chance to fix it, but I could always get divorced. So I kept moving forward.

If he had wanted contact with OW/OC, I would have been out of here. I gave him the choice to be free and with her......I did not sign up for "joint custody" with OW, or he could go NC, pay the child support, and see if we could work ion our marriage. Some people think that is terrible that I would not want him to be with OC. However, it was largely OW. She still wanted my H. And what about me and my children? We were of no consequence to her (sometimes him too) and we didn't deserve any of this. He had his choice and he made it.

I agree with SNT. We didn't make much progress until he truly went NC. I could almost tell everytime he had talked to her (although I had no proof), because he would take several big steps backward!

I hope I am not boring you with so many details. I keep doing it to show you that you are not alone in what you are experiencing and it can have a good outcome, even though it doesn't seem like it today. I wish I had found MB during the really dark times. Especially the board about OC. I thought no one knew my pain. Unfortunately, many people do.

Lean on the support here! Others are better at MB advice than me. But I know what you are going through and my heart breaks for you!

Take care!

Hoopsie,

What's happening?

SNT

It is never too late. There was ten years between my FWW AE and D-Day. We both love busted most of those ten years. At the point that either we got to the bottom of the matter or else I went a different direction, D-Day finally filled in a lot of the blanks over those ten plus years. Since that time, we have worked through those issues and well into recovery.

I don't have any experience on how to proceed while the A is still continuing. My FWW's was over long before I ever found out. But consider the alternative to Plan A. If your husband does still leave and you have done a good plan A, you will move on with your life knowing that you have done everything possible to save your M. Obviously, your H has not to this point but could do a 180 at any time. Either way, with you doing a good plan A, you win regardless. This is particularly important if it goes to D and you have children. Your committment to trying to work through this will go a long ways toward minimizing the emotional scars that your WS poor choices have left them with.

Hi SNT,

I'm hanging on. I spoke to him briefly and cheerfully today about his weekend plans with the kids. I'm taking a class on Sunday, which I told him about. He said, "Oh, good for you, that'll be fun." I think he's in a glad-she's-adjusting-to-the-reality mode rather than so intrigued by my plans.

I try not to be pessimistic, but it seems like my situation is further gone than many people's here. He has said absolutely unequivocally that he wants a D. That it is too late to try. He does not want to try. He does not want counseling, online or otherwise. He loves someone else. We are "winding down," he said. He mentioned something a week ago about giving me "time to transition," by which he meant disengaging from him, preparing myself emotionally for a new life, developing my own interests, etc.

But, no papers today. Good sign, right? Although he continues to talk about putting the house up for sale. I'll check back in after Sunday. Thanks for the support!

Hoopsie, I was in his shoes one time. Exactly. There was a time when all I could think about was getting my next "fix". I was in the fog just like it sounds like he is. The good news is I came out and he can too. I am not sure how I did so I am unsure what to say to you.

Is he a WS that says "the kids will get over it"? Or does he say "the kids will be better off"? Or how does he put the kids into all of this? That was a big driver for me to at least explore the thought of reconciliation or at least the thought of the attempt of reconciliation. I knew I wouldn't stay in the marriage solely for the kids but I knew they were worth giving it a shot. What does he say about the kids?

I will think about what my W could have done to get the fog to wear off quicker. There may or may not be a way. The cold hard truth is that it will wear off and if he has made a bad decision, he will be unpleasantly surprised with where he finds himself. You can let him know a FWS who was just like him 4 months ago (so it is still fresh in my mind) said that. He WILL wake up one morning and he WILL regret leaving his family. No doubt. Tell him I said it in a caring way. As I mentioned earlier, encourage him to drop me an e-mail. He probably won't because he is scared that someone might rain on his fantasy parade. However, tell him if he is so sure this is what he wants to do, at least correspond with someone who has been in his shoes.

I am going to pray for you and your husband and your girls tonight.

SNT

Oh, I'm sure our three young daughters are the only reason he hasn't pulled the trigger already. I have no ties here whatsoever, and I've told him that if we divorce, I'm moving with them to my hometown where I have extensive family support. He said he wishes I wouldn't do that, but he doesn't want an ugly custody battle and he would want me to have the support I need if he's going to betray us like this.

However, a move would mean he would see them about twice a year. Obviously, that would be painful for him in a way that I think he only dimly comprehends. You cannot parent daughters by weekly telephone calls and looking at pictures online. Disneyland Dad, my [censored]. He has said he understands this and has taken it into account when making his decision. However, it is one thing to say that and quite another to actually serve me papers and see us driving off in a moving van a few months later.

So, I don't know. He has said he doesn't want his life held hostage to his children, that he loves them but he must do what's best for him. He talked about some woman mountaineer who died climbing a mountain and left her young children motherless -- was that monstrously selfish of her? Or was that her being true to herself? OTOH, when he curles up with them on the couch, when he watches them twirl and play, when they yell "Daddy!!!" with such joy in their faces -- well, then, I think he may waver. And that combined with the love I intend to offer him over the coming months may be enough for him to turn down this woman and come home to us.

Thank you so much for your prayers. I think we'll need them.

Also, this all just makes me so, so ... angry. I've been doing *nothing* over the past weeks but reading. Reading about affairs, reading about divorce, about recovery, about the children. Heck, at one point, I was even reading profiles on Match.com to see what the fish were like out there in the dating sea. He's been reading text messages from his high-school girlfriend saying god-knows-what.

You know, I flipped through a memoir by a former professor of mine who went through a divorce and remarriage. When she and her first husband were in the divorce process in their mid-30s -- same age as us -- they spent *years* sitting in counseling together and separately. They cried together, talked together, worried about their children together, mourned together. When they decided it was over, they hugged and cried and genuinely wished each other well. When she remarried after a period of living alone and strong and self-examination and growth, she and her new husband spent *years* thinking about the challenges of blended families, going to therapists and financial counselors, etc. When they finally got married, it was in front of their friends and family in a spirit of joy and hopefulness and *maturity.*

If a marriage breaks up, or if a remarriage happens, THAT is the way it is supposed to happen. THAT is the way that thoughtful, careful, intelligent people manage their lives. Not with 8 months of text messages and trysts in NYC and sudden divorces and elopements in Vegas and saying "oooh, I can hardly wait to be your wife, it'll be so great!" and "oooh, I can hardly wait to have sex with you!" That is madness.

I'm sorry, I'm just rambling a bit. I guess it's better to get all this out here than in front of his face, although I'm ashamed to say I have said all this to him too at various points. Maybe it is sinking in in some portion of his brain. Maybe not.

Hoopsie, I know exactly how you feel, about the way things are SUPPOSED to happen. My H shocked me out of the blue on 9/5 saying he was tired of our marriage and needed a fresh start. Took off his ring and went straight to his female friend's apartment. I had no idea he was carrying on A with this OW, supposedly my friend, too. After he left, then I checked the cell phone records. Now, here we are 2 1/2 months later and I've filed for divorce. I feel like he forced me into it, b/c on Monday night he threatened to file, even I've told him many times that I'm not ready to go through it. I keep thinking of other folks I know who have gone through this, and it's usually a process of months and years, not weeks!

Be as angry as you want to be. Get it all out here, punch your pillow, scream in your car as the train goes by. And don't feel bad about slipping up and venting to your WH. That happens to everybody. But most importantly, know that you are not alone in your pain, and use this time to better yourself. It will make you stronger. Whether or not our WS's wake up and come out of the fog to bask in the glow of our fabulousness, we can be better people for our own sake.

SD05, you don't know me from Adam, but one night last week when I couldn't sleep I read your whole thread a few pages back. My H told me on 9/4 too, but you apparently got it together and were much more rational than me much sooner. I kept reading your story thinking "oh, please, please, let them make it!" I saw so many similarities to me and it was like an awful cliffhanger, and I was so sad for you when I saw the ending.

I know it's not a story to you, it's your life, and from what I read you are managing beautifully. I can't imagine the double betrayal of it being a *friend.* For what it's worth, I've also read stories of papers being filed but languishing for some time b/c neither party has their heart in it.

I have a baby daughter too, a few months older than yours. (And a 3yo and 5yo.) And as if I'm not ashamed enough by all this, I can admit I wasn't a particularly good mother to them during the first few weeks. I was tense and snappish and they watched a lot of TV while I sobbed on the phone to my mother. But now they're what keep me going. Same for you, I imagine.

Take care, and I hope to talk to "see" you again soon here.

Hi Hoopsie and Sad Mommy05

You 2 sound like you are getting it together, and Sad Mommy I am astounded at how quick you have been to get your emotions under control and understand what needs to be done.

Hoopsie I so agree with you about taking to time before walking away from committment especially when children are involved. I told my WBF that when our DD asks what happened I wanted to be able to look her in the eye and say that we tried very hard to make it work and thought about it very carefully but decided was better for all involved if we separated. Unfortunately I can't say that to her.

I am another BS with young daughters. I does stink thinking how this is affecting th children now and what the long term damage of seeing their father leave their mother for someone else.

My WH also freely admits he is being selfish and says the kids will adapt. He even told them that he hates coming home to mommy, that is why he works so much. So if he didn't have to live with mommy, he could come get them and spend more time with them. Of course, he has been out of the house for seven weeks and that has yet to pan out. He sees them 1-2 days a week.

Just wanted to chime in and let you know there are several of us in the same boat.

((Hoopsie))