NTT,

I wish I had some insightful thoughts for you. You may just need to be patient for awhile... kind of see where things go. Try not to obsess about it. Try to have some fun with your husband. I am really fortunate. My husband has made everything as easy for me as anyone possibly could. He has really treated me well through this whole mess. I think he's already addicted to me. YIKES!

Here's a wacky idea. It just came to me. When your husband does fill out the EN questionaire, have some sort of "thank you" surprise ready for him. I'm thinking something nonsexual would be best. If it were my husband, it might be tickets to a sporting event or comedy show, or a new CD, or a promise to do all the cooking all weekend (as much as that would kill me! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />). I don't know what your guy likes, but give it some thought. My thinking behind this is: even if he's doing nice things just to pacify you right now, if you show that you're going to do nice things back, it might start this wonderful vicious cycle of good deeds.

The reason JL's post over on my thread was so helpful to me is that it helped clarify what my husband's porn use was really all about -- an escape, a stress reliever if you will. It really wasn't a way to get SF at all. My husband even says it had gotten to the point that there was nothing 'satisfying' about it (even when, tecnically... physically... you know <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />). That's why I suggested that your 'thank you' gift be nonsexual.

You seem to be focusing on all the ways you can provide him with SF. Yes, I think that's important in the grand scheme of things -- especially if you enjoy the adventures too! But if his use of porn is more about escaping when he feels sad, stressed, angry, frustrated, overwhelmed, inadequate or whatever feelings he's trying to escape from, SF from you isn't necessarily going to help with that. I could be way off base, here. I have no idea why your husband is really drawn to it. I bet he doesn't even know. I'm pretty sure my husband didn't. He does now, but only in hindsight.

Hang in there, kiddo, and keep us posted.

--SC

SC- That is a great idea! Thank you.

What has your H done to prove to you that the "materials" are gone? It would be easier for me to believe him if this was the first time, but in essence, it's the third. He tried to justifly this time by saying that it wasn't porn. It was just woman, alone, no sex. But I'm sorry, they were naked, strutting around, and the videos were hidden and lied about. He said, "Well at least I don't have any f**k videos". I explained that these were even worse IMO. For the ones with intercourse, at least it would be the act that would be sexually stimulating, but for these videos it was the woman, her body, and looks that were to be stimulating. I think he understood.

I have also been following some of Damage_inc and BT's posts and I find them to be frighteningly familiar. Not everything, but many things sound like my H and I. If things in our M were to continue on as they were just a month or two ago, I could see us fighting many of the same battles. Its scary and has given me even more reason to really persue a more intimate M. I just hope I can get my H to come with me.

You guys (NTT & SC) are so strong! I just realized in posting to Endless Horizon how I don't seem to have the emotional strength you two do to deal with this. I just want to wail over it! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

Good idea about the EN worksheet. I'll probably be watching this thread closely for practical ideas. I'm very good at analyzing, not so good at implementing.

So NTT, what have you decided about the truth? What do you want to know and what are you willing to do to get to it? If you're happy with the way things are going, great! I just want to caution you to really think about what it is you want. Don't overlook it because things are going well, KWIM?

I'm thinking of you both.

I don't really have much to contribute, just wanted to chime in with a "me too" as I'm having a similar problem trusting my husband about porn. Its the only thing we've ever fought about, he's promised numerous times to stop over the past two years but I've always caught him doing it again. His most recent promise was the most sincere sounding one yet, but I'm not convinced he's done with it for good and worry that he just hasn't had time to really look lately and that as soon as he gets his new work hours and has time alone (except for maybe the baby) he'll fall right back into it. He recently bought a laptop and I worry he might be using it to look at porn. He gives me access to it, but that doesn't stop him from looking and then deleting it from the history. On my own computer its easy enough to check the history and temporary internet files as I know when I cleaned them out last and can tell if they've been messed with, but I don't have that with his computer. I'd like to trust him, but there of been so many lies that I just can't bring myself to in this area. I'd like to think he has more respect for my feelings now that he claims that he understands how hurtful his actions have been, but he went and bought that darn laptop despite my obvious misgivings about it. But such is life and I know how you feel. I'll shut up now since I don't belong here as there has been no infidelity in my marriage so far. >.>;

Oh no, schnln, you belong here.

As far as I know, my husband has not actually met anyone, had sex with anyone but himself or me, nor do I believe he has emotionally become involved with another woman.

However, he has proven unfaithful to me in sharing sexual activities in on-line chat rooms and has looked at other women with lust. That is infidelity in my book, and in many others too.

This is a devastating thing. I went immediately into Plan B and broke it only once when I lost control on the phone. My boys were talking to him and I grabbed the stupid thing out of their hands, screaming at him that I hoped he died. I have never screamed at him in that manner. It was horrible to me and evidently it was to him too because he said to my coach in amazement - this has really hurt her! (I was sneaking looks at his e-mail correspondance). Uh, duh.

Anyway, I feel for you. I am pretty hard nosed about all this, having taken really drastic measures. The thing that I think you too will need to contemplate is what are you willing to do to hold him to his promise? I let my husband run over me time and time again because I didn't want to make waves - and I didn't even KNOW he was consuming porn. You do know. It seems that much worse to me.

I'm thinking of you, praying for us all. God bless.

I think our R may have just taken that final hit. I will be brief since he's lurking around. I will need you guys and your advice more than ever. I will be back online tomorrow, please, if you can, be here!

Hey SLA,

you wrote:



After what you have been through, I think it's perfectly understandable that you want to wail. Rant. Rave. Heck, throw an all-out temper tantrum!!! Sounds to me as though you ARE dealing with it. Just because you feel all torn-up inside sometimes does not mean you are weak. Just because you need to vent sometimes does not mean you are weak. We all feel that way sometimes. Please -- give yourself a break!

-SC

Okay guys, now I really need your support. Last night my H spanked our almost 3 year old son. I don't think that spanking is a bad thing if used timely, I was spanked when I was a child and I don't think I've suffered any ill effects. So I asked what he was doing that warrented a spanking. H said that S was kicking at him while he was changing his diaper and so he spanked him and "got him good." H when out on porch for a cig so I looked at S's tush. Red hand print. I asked H how long ago it happened. He said 15 minutes ago, and told me to drop it. I showed him the mark and said that if it is still there after 15 minutes has past then he hit him to hard. He said the punishment fit the crime, but I didn't see any red marks on H! H almost seemed to feel empowered, like on a power trip. I said,"There is something wrong with you!" Of course he got defensive, said that he could discipline his son when needed and then started shooting his mouth off with stupid threats to me. I didn't fear my safety, H know better. I won't take it! But now I fear what his "discipline" is way overboard.

NTT,

What is up with this man? I've actually been meaning to ask you more about him. You've been focusing on his porn use, but something you mentioned awhile back has stuck with me -- that he often dismisses your opinions and feelings. That IMHO is a big red flag.

Now this??? Whether or not you think spanking is an effective form of discipline, I agree that he went overboard in this instance. The idea that he apparently struck-out in anger and seemed to take pleasure in it is very troublesome. How does he normally treat your son? Is this an isolated incident? Could it be related to the pressure he's feeling from the tension between the two of you? Still no excuse, in my opnion, just wondering.

I don't know, NTT. I know this forum is dedicated to saving marriages. I know a lot of people around here believe there are only a couple of justifiable reasons to split (such as an affair). But back when I was trying to decide whether to talk to my husband about a possible split, and agonizing over what that would do to our children, I decided our girls would be better off in the long run if I took a stand and kicked my husband out than if I continued to live in a situation where he treated us all as though we were "burdens -- getting in his way" all the time. I'm lucky. He doesn't act that way any more.

I want to write more... but I'm at work and need to go... I'll try to check in later.

I'll be thinking of you.

-SC

I don't know what was up last night. I don't even know why he told me, not that I wouldn't want to know. I guess he really did feel justified in spanking him. Now I really don't know what to do. I don't even care now if he does the EN questionaire, I think counseling may be th only way to go.

Thanks for checking in, I'll be on line off and on all day trying to sort out my thoughts.

Quick comment NTT- do you find you are on your computer often? It can at times find you compeating for attention between it and real-life duties. The PC is a wonderful tool, but it's also inherently very antisocial. In my relationship, it became a wedge.

NTT,

I'm sorry about the spanking incident. That's hard! I was the perpetrator in the spanking incident in our house. I was angry at my son's behavior, the spanking seemed to give me some control back. I fortunately was able to come to my senses and see that it was my problem.

Now about your husband. Is he angry a lot? Is he on the computer a lot? Mine was/is. The weirdest things made him angry. Mine punched & kicked holes in the walls, called me names and drove erratically when angry.

Now, you have been focusing on the porn like SC said. It's an easy thing to focus on. But, if he is displaying any of the other abuse symptoms/signs, then his problem is deeper than the porn. He needs help to get the anger under control.

Please, please take a look at www.CompassionPower.com. I think this man's techniques may save my marriage. My H is an angry man, true, but I also have anger issues.

I noticed that people tend to be attracted to people that are at the same level of hurt. Do you have issues with anger? Or maybe depression?

I don't in any way think that this is any of your doing. He is responsible for his own actions. Just that, well, you're here and he's not, so I'm talking to you.

Ah. I'm afraid I may be stepping on toes, so I'm going to stop. If I can help in any way, please let me know.

Endless-No, I limit my time on the computer to certain times of the day that do not interfere with family time. Last night I was on because I simply didn't want to be around him. I was angry and knew that I wouldn't communicate properly. As for duties, I wonder what your implying and it may be nothing. Are you actually asking why I wasn't the one changing the diaper? We own a horse boarding facility and I was out doing the night chores, WORKING!! I wasn't playing on the computer. Sorry if I am reading more into your question than you meant.

SLA-No, your not stepping on toes, I'm here for opinions, whether I want to hear them or not. I don't have anger problems but I will stand up if I feel threatened. I didn't feel threatened, but I didn't like how he had handled the sitch. H is hardly ever on teh computer, he's addicted to TV. As for depression, I have never been treated for depression but there have been tough times in my life. Right now is one of them. I don't feel like hurting myself or anyone else, I just feel tired alot and don't have the motivation to do the things that I used to enjoy. I have found exercise to be a great relief, but I feel off the wagon about a month ago and really need to get going on that again. It helped immensely when I first found the videos back in August.

I feel like what your name inmplies, lost. Kind of foggy.

NTT,

"foggy... lost... tired..." I'm no expert, but it sounds like mild depression to me. Exercise is a great idea.

Again, it seems like there's a lot more going on here than the porn. Will you husband do MC?

--SC

I'll just post a quick reply since I don't want to the threadjack, but I think I do need to contemplate that. I really have no clue. Thus far he has gotten anger, the cold shoulder, and tears and none of them have swayed him, just made him appease me as best he could and go back to doing what he wanted. Still waiting to see how well the calm, respectful, heart-to-heart talk we had last time works out. I have misgivings about it since only a day or two after the talk he not only looked again but after having agreed to tell me if he did look again, he didn't say a word to me about it until he could tell that I was upset about something. Haven't caught him since then and that was a few months ago, but I've gone months before catching him in the past as well. Wow, this is a lot longer than I intended, maybe I need my own thread to ramble in, lol.

schnln-please feel free to stay, as the original poster, I invite, no, beg you to join us. This is supportive. More heads are better than one, that's why I"m here.

H has called a few times today, acts as if nothing is wrong, God, that drives me insane. Luckily, I have a meeting to attend tonight, so I won't have to deal with him much.

SC- Iwould like to got to MC, and even get three paid sessions through my employer, I'm just not sure if he'd put in the effort. It seems like a waste if he won't participate. I'm sure he'd go, but it would just be to shut me up.

Thank you all, it helps immensely to have people who understand to talk to.

Well, by duties, I just meant everyday chores both partners should be sharing in, together. Anyway, maybe instead of spending that time away from him on the PC, let him know how serious you are about things.

My wife had a cyber-EA before I realised how serious she was about me meeting her needs. I wished she spent the time she spent on the computer, telling me again how she needed me to change. I took her for granted, and was angry at her myself, so no other warnings ever came. I found out the hard way.

Anyway, not all is doom and gloom, I think it's helped my relationship out plenty, but it's an uphill battle for sure. I wouldn't internalize, if there's a problem, you need to do something about it before something gives...

NTT,
I'm going on vacation for a week and my not be able to check-in much. But I'll be thinking about you, and sending good vibes your way. Hang in there, and give that little boy of yours an extra hug and kiss from me!
-SC

Have a good vacation SC. I give him lots of hugs and kisses, I'll add a few more from you!

Endless- I have told him over and over again how I feel, just to have my feelings pushed aside. I'm the one who has the problem and cannot seem to let it go, he's "happy". That is my H's thought process. I am internalizing because it hurts far less to just deal with things alone than to be told that my feelings don't matter, that they are my problem. I'd rather be alone than be called "retarted" (last nights verbal abuse). I can't take much more of him.

Unfortunately, some people don't see a problem until "something gives".

Boy does that sound familiar. My H always seems to think that if he ignores something then it will go away. And if I don't ignore it with him, then I am "out to get him."

NTT, his porn use is not the problem. It's just a symptom.

I can't remember if you've answered me (and I couldn't find it by just browsing the posts), what are you willing to do in order to get to the truth? It sounds to me like your H is waiting for the storm to calm down, 'til you look like you can live with what's happening, then will shut off even further.

Do you remember what Damage said? He had no intention of stopping, but told his wife he would. He did not take the problem seriously. I don't understand why, but men seem to have such a hard time taking us seriously. It could be because we don't hold them responsible. When push comes to shove, what we women seem to do is yell, holler and rant, but it's usually all empty threats. Your H can sense this. You'll have to MAKE him pay attention.

I don't know what it will be in your case. Again, I strongly advise you to get professional help for this. My coach is wonderful. This board is great and all for support, but when it comes down to it, it's just our opinions. The professionals have seen a number of cases, seen what works, what doesn't and have usually taken many, many courses on this stuff.

Please. For the sake of your marriage, your child, and your sanity, talk to a professional. A pro-marriage professional. It can be expensive, but aren't you worth it? Don't wait years like me. I was told almost 1 1/2 years ago I would have to go to Plan B. I couldn't do it. Then all of a sudden, I had to. It's not easy, but I wish I'd done it sooner. 1 1/2 years lost! 1 1/2 years of LBing on both sides. All those love deposits lost.

It's hard to face it all, but we're here for you.