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Joined: Oct 2005
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I think of myself as a good debator because I stick to logic and the goal is not to win but for both to come to something they are comfortable with.
I struggle deeply with the part of invalidating someone else's feelings or concerns though. It's more complex than that but let's try and keep it simple.
Someone please tell me how you would react or revise this argument:
Background: wife has not attended family functions for over a month. Some of family has made snide remarks and sister and wife don't get along at all. But parents have been neutral and civil. All of my relatives have been civil to her for at least 3 months. Also, about the time my wife stopped visiting is when I told my mother that my wife had punched me on the side of the head one night as we had an argument. I think there is an embassment factor there that they know she is capable of violence and they know her dirty laundry. Wife agrees to go to dinner with parents but asks me to write email to confirm sister won't come with them/be at restaurant. Wife reads email:
wife: your email is soo obvious that I asked you to say it. You said "I hate to ask it this way but just want to make sure (sister) isn't coming."
man: well, I don't exactly feel GREAT about having to ask my parents if my sister will be there. How would that make you feel if you were a parent and one child is making sure the other child isn't going to be there?!
wife: Well, I'm starting to feel like I shouldn't/don't want to go. I don't want to come between you and your family. You, your parents, and your sister should go.
man: That's absurd. This dinner is not so my family can get together. It's for me and you as a couple to have dinner with my parents! That's been the plan all along. I seriously doubt my sister would even be available to show up on such short notice even if they asked her to go because she wan't part of the plans tonight!! Your problem is with my sister. Why are you punish my parents because you dislike my sister!
wife: Come on now. Your parents don't like me. It's not like they are going to miss me not being there. They are not happy that I'm in your life.
man: Look, you are an important part of my life. We told them we were going to eat dinner with them as a couple. You've been avoiding them and haven't seen them for close to a month now! Why can't we ever just make a plan and stick to it!!
You're being overly sensative. When are you ever going to be ok with them? They've written numerous times saying how they wished you would have come to family dinners. They are being civil. What do they have to do before you're satisfied with how they are treating you. Ask you to call them mom?
wife: you're exaggerating. I just don't feel like they like me.
man: honey, I think they are basically indifferent. If your parents didn't like me, as long as they treated me civilly I'd show up to an event because it would be important to you.
wife continues that she doesn't want to go. Husband gets really frustrated because she always backs out of things at the last minute or complicates what could be simple situations.
HOW WOULD YOU FIX THE EXCHANGE WE HAD?!
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Joined: Mar 2001
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Wasp... I'm going to look at this but 1st let me give you some advice. You would be best served sticking to one board (Emotional Needs) and keeping all your posts in one area. All this jumping around doesn't allow people to get to know you or your whole story and you get advice based on mis-information. Sure some of it may be 'feel' good advise but not something that will help you in your marriage.
Hugz, Thoughtz, & Prayerz
Bill
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OK, to begin with, I’m simply going to focus on you because that’s the only control we have in the situation.
“””Background: wife has not attended family functions for over a month. Some of family has made snide remarks and sister and wife don't get along at all. But parents have been neutral and civil. All of my relatives have been civil to her for at least 3 months. Also, about the time my wife stopped visiting is when I told my mother that my wife had punched me on the side of the head one night as we had an argument. I think there is an embassment factor there that they know she is capable of violence and they know her dirty laundry. Wife agrees to go to dinner with parents but asks me to write email to confirm sister won't come with them/be at restaurant. Wife reads email:”””
So your wife has some issues with your family and on top of that you air your dirty laundry to them….. Not very smart dude, that will only drive a wedge further between y’all.
”””wife: your email is soo obvious that I asked you to say it. You said "I hate to ask it this way but just want to make sure (sister) isn't coming."
man: well, I don't exactly feel GREAT about having to ask my parents if my sister will be there. How would that make you feel if you were a parent and one child is making sure the other child isn't going to be there?!”””
OK, from the start this discussion is doomed. She made a statement and you took the conversation a different direction without even addressing her point and turned the focus on her.
”””wife: Well, I'm starting to feel like I shouldn't/don't want to go. I don't want to come between you and your family. You, your parents, and your sister should go.
man: That's absurd. This dinner is not so my family can get together. It's for me and you as a couple to have dinner with my parents! That's been the plan all along. I seriously doubt my sister would even be available to show up on such short notice even if they asked her to go because she wan't part of the plans tonight!! Your problem is with my sister. Why are you punish my parents because you dislike my sister!”””
BOOM…. Conversation over and I haven’t even read any further. Your first two words “That’s absurd” HUGE LOVE BUSTER. Her feelings of thinking she shouldn’t go are her feelings and they are not absurd they are valid, they are hers. And further, after you bust her you the interrogate her.
”””wife: Come on now. Your parents don't like me. It's not like they are going to miss me not being there. They are not happy that I'm in your life.
man: Look, you are an important part of my life. We told them we were going to eat dinner with them as a couple. You've been avoiding them and haven't seen them for close to a month now! Why can't we ever just make a plan and stick to it!!
You're being overly sensitive. When are you ever going to be ok with them? They've written numerous times saying how they wished you would have come to family dinners. They are being civil. What do they have to do before you're satisfied with how they are treating you. Ask you to call them mom?”””
WOW……. I don’t even know where to begin. I will say that your wife must have some serious patience for even continuing in this conversation. Who are you to say if she’s being too sensitive or not? What is the core issue? Then to top it all off your last statement is something a 3rd grader would use in a fight.
”””wife: you're exaggerating. I just don't feel like they like me.
man: honey, I think they are basically indifferent. If your parents didn't like me, as long as they treated me civilly I'd show up to an event because it would be important to you.”””
Here’s a note for you SHE’S NOT YOU, doesn’t think like you, doesn’t act like you, she is herself.
How do you fix these exchanges? I think you need two things. First, information, what’s her beef with your family? Second, COMMUNICATION, yours is currently filled with Love Busters, disrespectful judgments, and angry outbursts. You won’t get anywhere with that. Have you read the Basic Concepts on this site? If so, why are you continuing these bad behaviors? I would suggest you read them and follow them. Further, I would recommend getting a book on or taking a class on Effective Communication.
I thought about trying to write responses in there for you but frankly since she’s playing off you, they really would reply. One key thing to effective listening is ensuring you understand. This can be done with direct questions. Another is validating feelings and thoughts, even the ones you don’t understand, they are still valid to her.
Hugz, Thoughtz, & Prayerz
Bill
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Joined: Aug 2005
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Why in the name of Christmas would you tell your mother your wife hit you on the side of the head?
Me: 56 H: 61 DD: 13 and hormonal DS: 20
Oldest son died 1994 @ age 8
Happily married 30+ years
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I think LH has nailed it pretty much on the head.
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I think of myself as a good debator because I stick to logic and the goal is not to win but for both to come to something they are comfortable with. wasp, this is childish. Your W is not an opponent against who you should be negotiating. She should be the center of your universe! Anyway to your query: if she doesn't want to go, then be fine with it. Why would you want to make her do something which she does not want to do? And moreover, if there is friction between her and some of your family members, why would you want to get into a situation when you'd have to see people you love be in a situation where they are uncomfortable with each other? Go to the dinner alone. You'll have fun.
Me: 50. W: 50. Happily married since 1993. 3 kids.
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Also, about the time my wife stopped visiting is when I told my mother that my wife had punched me on the side of the head one night as we had an argument. I think there is an embassment factor there that they know she is capable of violence and they know her dirty laundry. wasp, you really need to keep the ups and downs of your relationship with your spouse private. Your obligation lies to your W. She has to be able to trust you that anything she tells you stays private. Even the law recognizes spousal privilege. Just exactly what did you attempt to accomplish with telling your mother about your fight with W? Nothing good can come out of that.
Me: 50. W: 50. Happily married since 1993. 3 kids.
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