How do you gain the self respect needed to end it. I went to a brand new IC yesterday and I don’t think I like her. I spent the whole time bringing her up to speed and yes my story does make me look like white trash but I am not and I got that impression that is how she felt.

Yes it should be a no brainer – my friends, my family, my mb family says leave or Plan B the jerk but yet I still hang on because:

I am conflict avoider (her words-so she knows something)
I don’t want marriage #2 to fail and or 2 marriages “under my belt”
I am afraid of the anger that my wh (I guess that goes with the CA part)
I am afraid to be alone (though I am most of the time now)

What do I do, what do I read, where do I find the anger I need to demand more self respect from people mainly wh. Why to I accept this treatment like it’s normal? Am I just a wacked – am I hopeless, I just don’t get it and I guess you guys won’t either.

Tdr

tdr,
I could be mistaken, but this question is problematic: "What do I do, what do I read, where do I find the anger I need to demand more self respect from people mainly wh?"

When you ask it like that, it implies that you are looking for the key to changing your husband's behavior. But I'm sure you know already that you can't change someone else's behavior.

So let's consider this: What if I could guarantee to you that your husband WILL NOT CHANGE? What if you knew that the day will never, ever come that your husband will treat you with respect?

In that scenario, what do you do?
-Does the second failed marriage matter?
-Will you prefer the sure thing of never ending misery in your current marriage, or the hope of something better?
-Will avoiding conflict be worth a lifetime spent in that scenario?

Call Steve and get some phone counseling with a plan.

Can u do that? Also work on getting your mind and heart in sync. Then your fears w/b of a managable size.

L.

tdr -

I am so sorry you are having such a hard time with this. I've been there and I understand some of what you're going through.

Something that SH told me was to do things that I had wanted to do, but not things that would preclude WW from joining me if / when we got back together. That is when I started pottery (been wanting to do that for years) and my CASA work.

I know this self-respect thing is hard because we are, in essence, 1/2 of a "team", and the other 1/2 is our most important support network. We NEED to hear from our spouses that we are wonderful, smart, attractive, loved, etc. When we start getting a message from our spouse that contradicts that, well, it is hard to maintain a good self-image and self-respect.

From the brief communication I've had with you, it is obvious to me that you are a smart, caring, attractive woman. I believe that each of us are of eternal worth. Our foolish WS's try to build themselves up by tearing us down....we have to defend ourselves by telling them that they are liars and we won't stand for it.

If you're not very, very comfortable with your IC, find another one. That is an important relationship to have. He / she can help you see your worth and your "right" decisions.

Georgia

tdr, I think you have this backwards. You don't have self respect because you won't end it. Self respect has to be EARNED, it is not something that some counselor can give you, it has to come from yourself. It comes from acting in ways that you will respect and honor.

Do you feel respect for yourself when you allow others to treat you disrespectfully? Of course you don't. So the way you EARN self respect is to take actions that you CAN respect, not by acting in ways that you cannot respect.

Hi tdr,

I am not familiar with your specific story. But I recognize the issues you have mentioned in my own life... (though I am the FWS).

One thing that I wanted to point out, thinking maybe it would help, is that all of the problems you listed:
I am conflict avoider (her words-so she knows something)
I don’t want marriage #2 to fail and or 2 marriages “under my belt”
I am afraid of the anger that my wh (I guess that goes with the CA part)

....stem from putting your self worth in other people's opinions. You already understand (but sometimes it helps to have someone say it) that your self worth has to come from within...otherwise it's just co-dependence.

Also, I think it was Ark or suzet that once started a thread on fear. I will see if I can bump it for you.

But I remember her talking about following your fear through to its conclusion....that is you mentioned you are afraid of WH anger? (I am assuming you don't mean afraid for your PHYSICAL well-being.) So, now imagine he is Really ticked off at you....yells, rants, raves, says all kinds of angry mean stuff.....then what? You are still alive, you are still you. His anger can't change WHO you are and does not somehow define whether you have value. His anger is just that--his emotional reaction to the situation. His tool used to deal with what he does like. (And probably a tool that worked to intimidate and control people around him.)

If it helps, I have been dealing with someone who has angery reactions to things....it used to really scare and intimidate me. Now, when it happens, I create a visual image of a giant three year old...unable to speak calmly or reason maturely...throwing an anger-tantrum. I use the same method I did on my three year olds....I speak calmly and ask the person to speak calmly...if it continues, I remove myself (or the person) from the situation.

Anyway, the point about taking your fear to its end--is to imagine the worst case scenario and get to the bottom of what you are REALLY afraid of....it makes it much easier to face.

Besides...imagine the WORST POSSIBLE thing EVER...that you get to the end of your life and realize--you never stuck up for yourself, you never guided your own decisions, you let other people walk all over you...you never lived YOUR life. Maybe that helps to motivate you?
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

okay, I bumped it, its called being effective and operating from strength by suet*.

Good luck!

Earning self respect also comes from placing more value on your own approval than that of others. Ahuman is right that your fears all seem to revolve around what others think. Maturity and self respect demand that you abandon the fruitless pursuit of the approval of others and concern yourself, instead, with doing what is right.

To do otherwise is to sacrifice your self respect for the [fleeting] approval of others. Has that been a healthy trade off for you?

This is a part of the devotion I posted under the prayer section this morning. They are some things you might want to thing about.
1. People Pleasers rarely consider their own needs, wants, and desires.
2. People Pleasers take criticism as fact, and immediately suffer a deflation
in their own self-esteem.
3. People Pleasers feel an extraordinary fear of abandonment.
4. People Pleasers blame themselves for everything that ever goes wrong.
5. People Pleasers are more concerned with others' feelings than their own.
6. People Pleasers have an overdeveloped sense of responsibility, expecting of
themselves magical abilities to fix the significant others' in their lives.
7. People Pleasers learned early in their lives to bury their own feelings,
needs, and wants, and keep them buried until they get help for their
problems.
8. People Pleasers chronically confuse pity with love and self-sacrifice with
caring for others.

tdr,

How are you?

L.

This is so totally wrong.

Anger (in most instances) diminishes your ability to think clearly, therefore more mistakes can be made while angry.

You don't need anger to make good decisions!

How silly is this ~~~> YOU go into a fancy department store to purchase a dress for a party. The sales clerk tries to get you to purchase a wrong-sized, wrong color dress that is way more $$$ than you were planning to spend. Do you NEED to get angry in order to tell her "No, I don't like that dress. I don't feel pretty wearing it. Stop trying to sell me that dress." ... Do you need to be angry with the sales clerk in order to voice your needs and desires?

Well, do you?

Here's a tip .... you can say to your husband "You are the wrong size, you just don't fit." .... and you do NOT have to be angry to say it. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />

DEMAND respect? This sounds more like intimidation than respect.

Respect comes when YOU set your boundaries and then dont let other people demand (or intimidate) you to change them. Think of Ghandi...just politely, silently sitting in on his boundary with the British gov....and an army was brought to its knees.

Example from another poster:

FWH continually comes home late without notice...and as a result ruins dinner, which he expects to be ready when he gets home. BS sets boundary--not demanding WH call--not getting angry--just plainly and directly stating the boundary: if you are home late without warning, you will make your own dinner.

Thank you everyone. I have printed your responses and plan on doing some real soul searching. I didn't know my post took a life of its own.

Orchid today i'm not good. Had to talk to the ow to see if the house payment was going to be paid. My wh only tms me and so far its been avoiding the mortgage payment questions and about trying to get a booty call and he misses us (he has been mia for 3 weeks.) It hurts and sickens me to talk to her. I just tm him to ask him to remove my number from her phone again (since I had to call her) and to never put me in that situation again.

Pep - On needing to get angry. Maybe this is one of my psychological flaws but I need to be pushed over the anger edge just to stand up for myself. Go figure.

Tdr

'xsplain dis one again?' You had to call the OW because the WS won't deal with calls regarding the mortgage?

Can't his bank account be auto debitted for the mortgage?!!??

Never talk to the OW. She is a stinkin' liar. Plus she smells 2! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

L.