He claims he is innocent. He never has admitted to killing 4 people. I wonder...

JL:

DID YOU REALLY MEAN THIS? Dying in a car accident is not the same as MISTAKENLY KILLING someone.....

I pray that either mistake doesn't happen to one of my loved ones...

I agree with Low...

Most WS claim to be innocent.... I wonder... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />

I'm talking about those on death row who REALLY are INNOCENT...

It's seems SAVAGE and FINAL...

I believe GOD takes care of the RIGHTEOUS and seeks VENGEANCE on EVILDOERS...

I've seen it happen in my lifetime OVER AND OVER AGAIN....

And there have been quite a few innocent people that were put to death, and later "exonerated".

My problem with the death penalty is that it is mostly reserved for minorities and the poor. Lots of people that have money get off.

Most WS claim to be innocent.... I wonder...

Good point Shattered.

Oh please ,not the race card again, come on, too many of them get off just because of their race , or they were poor or they had a bad childhood. Who the ****** here is for the victim? All these bs ,saying how a ws should be punished, but let the killers go ? Makes a lot of sense to me.


Scott

So....

Why is it that someone who commits adultery, once a crime punishable by death can rehabilitated yet a murderer can not?

Please..understand that this man is clearly not the man he once was...what point are we really making here??

mimi, I understand. You said "It seems savage and final". I disagree with the savage part. I would bet in most cases of murder that qualify for the death penalty, the death they INFLICTED on their victim was considerably more SAVAGE than dying in a prison, having had (most) of your last wishes satisfied, having your arm medically sterilized (never understood that part) and then being injected with a drug that puts you to sleep, permanently. That's not savage....it is a humane judgement, done in most cases to the letter of the law, with judge and jury. At least they know their death is forthcoming, and have the chance to make peace with all who will have it, and the chance to give up their sins to their Supreme Being before they go.

This will seem radical even to those who support the death penalty, but the reason it is less a deterrent to capital crimes today, is because they took it all behind closed doors. The death penalty served as a much greater deterrent when it was done outside the courthouse in full public view.

Lastly, with DNA testing having become more reliable in the past few years, the number of people wrongly accused of a crime and put to death has, and will continue to decline. DNA testing has also released several who were erroneously sentenced to death.

How often have you heard of really serious convicts escaping from prison lately? There have been a few high profile cases of this in the past few months. Convicted murderers who have been executed do not escape from prison to kill again.

Just a few points for the sake of discussion....
SD

well smomw, ask the families of all these children that have been raped and killed why it keeps happening over and over by the same criminals. Ask a friend of mine why he has no business, why he has no life, ya know why? Because while he was on a business trip, his wife was kidnapped, raped, and her body in the trunk of a car for 3 damn days, by a guy
just out of prison for rape! Only this time he killed them, seven women, and there his azz sits on death row.
You think hes really sorry? ****** no, hes not sorry.

Scott

Scott - No one thinks they should be set free. I think more people should be locked up for life. Some folks just can't seem to be loose. But the fact remains that if you have money, you have a good chance of beating it. If you are a female, you most likely won't get the death sentence. If your victim is white, you will. If your victim is black, probably not. It is not equitable.

scott...

my problem is the guy is on death row....convicted...in cases like you describe...they should have strung him up the next day...I am speaking of the case of Tookie...and how we seem to have double standards....

believer,
ya know, those thugs, somebody is feeding them, their warm, they don't deserve it! Who keeps them up?? Theres a lot of old people , we collect stuff for them, don't you think they could use some of that money? Dont they deserve
to be warm and fed? We buy for some kids at Christmas,
ya know ya have to take all the tags off and make sure their parents can't take it back to get a refund for drug money. I mean why don't we worry about the people that need it?

Scott

Scott -

Actually it is more expensive (because of all of the appeals, etc.) to execute them, than keep them in prison for life.

I live in California where we have the 3 strikes law. As far as I'm concerned, many should only get 1 strike and they are locked up for life.

The problem to me is sure, they are well-behaved in prison - they HAVE to be. There are no kids to rape, etc. Once a person has done something atrocious, I think they should be kept away from society.

But I would like to see a reform in the prison system. These guys should be working, and paying the victim's families.

Believer
Like I said, bullets are cheap. I have plenty to spare.
Thanks Arnie.





Take care
Scott

Mimi,
You asked You bet your bippy I meant that. People get on the road drunk, or physically impaired all of the time. They hit kids on sidewalks, other drivers, kill their passengers. Sorry, Tookie got a fair trial, he has had appeals and 25 years to exconerate (sp?) himself. Dead is dead, and the loss is felt whether it was a drunk driver, or the very very few condemned to death and actually executed mistakenly.

I most assuredly meant it. If people want to make an impact go where the largest number of lives are lost by innocent people.

I guess I have had too many friends die in combat, in car accidents, friends lose children to car accidents, skateboarding, to worry too much about Tookie or his like.

If I sat in the jury I would do my level best to render a fair and honest verdict. I think most if not all people do. He had a far fairer shake than most of the people I have known that have died in recent years and I am not even counting the combat deaths from when I was a young man.

Sorry, I am far more interested in getting people and kids to wear helmets when the skateboard or go bicycling or even riding a moter cycle.

JL

What is sad is when the families of the victims watch Tookie leave this world and expect to feel better...and don't. Their beloved family members are still gone in a violent horror that never goes away.

They are still gone...and Tookie still faces the crime he cannot undo through our legal system.

May the peace of the Lord embrace them all. Not sure human kind is qualified to judge Tookie, but we will all face God for judgement. Whether it's 2006 or 2036 is really up to Him. I want no part of killing anyone.
GS

O, TMCM, others - Why?

All actions have consequences. So you argue for "life without parole" (and assume that "life" MEANS until they die of natural causes or are killed by another inmate) instead of permanently removing (by death) from society someone who has proven that they DO NOT value or respect anyone else's "right to life."

Our Constitution guarantees the rights of each individual, who lives here under the LAWS of our country, to LIFE, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. Do you disagree? Do we extend those rights to LAWBREAKERS? Do we say MURDERERS are still entitled to "life?" What about "liberty?"

There are people who say that the death penalty is not a deterrant. For a lot of hardened murderers or the plainly "evil" or "psychotic," that fear of death may NOT be a motivating factor. But just like "no fault divorce" has allowed divorce to run rampant based upon personal whim, I would submit that the "average" person MIGHT just consider the "consequence" of murder (the death penalty for themselves) to be a bit too high of a price to indulge their desire to kill. I know I had serious thoughts about killing my wife's OM for a while and the potential consequences to myself and the rest of my family caused me to "think." Also, God's command is clear, "thou shalt not kill (murder)."

But equally clear is that DEATH is a penalty, a consequence. Hel! is a penalty for unrepentance. Vengeance is mine, saith the Lord. The wages of sin is death. It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God. Render unto Caesar the things that are Caesar's....

No, the death penalty is not "cool," but it IS authority that is given to governments who are empowered to act on our behalf, so that WE don't have to "Take the law into our own hands." Even Jesus, who had the power to stop death, did NOT stop the execution of the two thieves alongside of himself. The issue is NOT death, it is our relationship with Christ and with God.

To be blunt, and perhaps offensive to some (so my apologies in advance).... if someone comes uninvited into my home and threatens my family, I WILL blow them away if it's possible in order to protect my family....as I am commanded to do. Evil must be confronted, or it will flourish and grow.

Folks have mentioned abortion and some have argued for abortion in the case of incest or rape. I personally don't believe in abortion under any circumstance (punishing the innocent) but I wonder how many abortions would be performed if ONLY rape and incest were the "qualifying events" that allowed for a "legal death sentence for the unborn" and how the "slaughter of the innocents" might be greatly diminished. The child had/has no choice. Tookie did.

If he has "found God" and repented of his sins, he need not fear his future. But if not, we all have UNTIL the "hour of our death" and no more.

Orchid: Who r these people?


Orchid: Who r these people?

Btw, how much of your families assets/savings/income r u willing to spend on lifeterm sentences? Before you put your opinions about how right it is to save a life, think about the lives that are factually killed (no doubt they were murdered) and how low the guilty verdicts much less the actualy sentences are handed out.

Does $$ play a factor? Certainly does. It does in bringing reality to the WS and it brings reality to the communities where these criminals do their crime and then serve their time.

Can't have it both ways. Will some innocent get caught in between? Some already have. Should that in itself be a deterent to allow the guilty to enjoy the luxury life of prison....you are aware that some prisoners consider it a life a luxury.....some even choose to go back (not an opinion, known fact).

Lessor of 2 evils? More or less. Regrets? Always. The decision maker? Hm..... that's a whole 'nutter topic. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

JMHO,
L.

You reap what you sow. It was written long before any of us were here. God is loving, but he is equally just. Tookie knew the consequences and committed the crime anyway.