L&C -

Well, I suggest a long run first. You need to do something physical to get rid of some of that anger. Then you have to realize that your husband is all whacked out and will remain that way for awhile. Pretend like the real husband has been taken over by the body-snatchers - just like in the movie. The shell remaining looks like your husband, talks like your husband, but is really an alien.

It is kind of like talking to a heroin addict. As long as you understand that their whole existance revolves around getting their fix, they can be very enjoyable people. If you expect them to be like a normal person, you will be disappointed.

Anyway, that is how I would approach dinner.

The problem is now I am weepy again and I can't control it. I just can't stop. I am so worried about him. He just looked so bad. I know I cannot save him, but I just want him to be okay. It is not like I can hold him and tell him that. I do not know what to do.

I might go to the ER and see if they have something stronger than the Lorazapam that they can prescribe. At this point, I take it and is is great for 2 hours and then I am falling to pieces with anger or sadness.

Sorry you are feeling so down. Maybe you should ask your husband not to come to dinner. Would that make things worse?

The Lorazepam should help. I don't know what your dosage is, but if it works for a couple of hours, maybe you could phone your doctor and see what his advice is.

Going to the ER is an option, but you better go early - long waits even on Christmas.

Keep in mind that you are very early in this. It is extremely hurtful, but gets much better. You will be in my prayers today.

I went to the ER and they said I can take more. I work at the hospital. I am working now. I am on .5 of Lorazapam. They said increase half pill. Mom is bringing them.

Very good. I didn't remember that you work at a hospital. Okay, so things should start feeling calmer.

This is a stressful time of year for everyone. If you think it will be too hard on YOU, I would cancel your plans. Only you can decide. But please stop worrying about your husband. He made stupid choices and it is very good for him to suffer the consequences. Take care of YOU.

Okay. Dinner was great, mostly. I had to leave the table a few times because he was being affectionate and I wanted to hit him or burst into tears. My Mom and Dad, his mom, my brother and sister in law and their son were there. We all had great conversation for the most part. My parents were wonderful. They treated him mostly like they always have. When we were leaving my mom started to cry when she hugged him goodbye, but it was momentary.

Dinner was so hard for everyone, but we got through it without a fight or uncontrolable sobbing.

Here is my deal. He told me tonight that he had not been going out with OW since he got his apartment and that he has just been staying there. Ummm yeah, he has, perhaps, but how many nights has she been with him???????????///

Friday, I drove there at 1030pm and her car was there. It was there at 330am and it was there at 7 when I drove to work.

I am alone. I am alone. He said he needed time to think, but he is not thinking if that [email]B@#$[/email] is with him. I feel like the back up plan, how fu$%^ up is that? He has done this. These are his choices that he has made.

Sorry, continuation. I feel like I need to tell him. I am sorry, but I am not willing to be his back up plan. I love him and I am concerned and worried for him, but he did this. How can he think this is okay?

How can I communicate to him how much he has hurt me with his lies and deceit and how much he is hurting himself?

I feel like if I wait to confront him about Friday that he has more deniability within his head and I am not okay with that. I can't stand being lied to. It is such a core value for me. It was for him. Where is he?

He is coming over tomorrow to get more stuff. I feel I just need to purge him from my life, but there is so much stuff.

******I think I need to write a letter as to how I feel because I cannot talk to him. I can, but he will not listen. I feel he needs to know that I know that he spent the night with her and that he is sleeping with her. A letter would be concrete. It would tell what I know, but it would also tell how I feel. He does not know how I feel. He will not listen to how I feel because of his egocentricity.

Please, it will take me a couple of days, maybe. Please give your input. I am just dying. I cannot continue like this. Everytime I see him I am either angry or so hurt. I know you have been there. I do not even feel I can be alone with him with out the possibility that I will tear him to pieces. I cannot do that.

*****Should I have my mom over tomorrow when he comes??????????????/

I am so scared for him because he is making so many bad choices. He is in such a bad place. She is not his answer. Apparently I am not either, but I am telling you, this woman is scary. She is so manipulative and she will destroy him. She is evil. I was her friend too. I know how she works. I do not want him to be decimated. I spent last night at a party telling 2/3 mutual friends the situation. I also told them to please support him that he had no where to go at all. Not in his stupidity and choices, but be there as an ear with intelligent input and not put downs. I have a good support network, albeit inexperienced, some, but he has the OW. He did this. He is excluding everyone. I practically begged them to reach out to him.

I know that ending my marriage is not the spirit of this site, but I need input from those who have been where I am and I do not know where else to go. I need him to understand what he has done. I need him to see how he as destroyed me. I deserve so much better. I truly need more meds. How can he not see???????????// None of my friends have lost a 13 year relationship or even almost. Please.

? I am sorry I am such a needy mess right now. I need a little input. I think I need to tell him I know about Friday. How can I do this?

Plan B letters are the best way of sending the message that you are not going to be his back-up plan.

Do you feel you've made enough deposits in his love bank to take that next step?

If not, what can you do while she's out of town for the next week to load up the bank, then be prepared to go very very dark in Plan B?

Some thoughts on love bank deposits that bring forward some of the previous deposits you've made. Spend the next day or two putting together a scrap book of momentoes - journal notes, photos, love letters, etc. Make it attractive, and filled with admiration for him - admiration you've shown from times past - leave him with all the memories of those wonderful times together for him to have in the apartment while he's alone and she's out of town.

Then keep cleaning, being attractive and inviting to him; then when she gets back, shut-er-down! no more contact with you until she's gone!

Okay, so lets say I hang on for the next week. If I send a plan B letter and go dark. And lets say he comes back and says he will have no contact. Do we then write the no contact letter to OW together. I do not think this is going to happen. He has made his choice. I just can't take all the lies.

Lost, I think you are way too early for Plan B. Plan B would be a disaster if didn't do a good Plan A. See, the point of Plan A is to attract him back by meeting his needs - as best you can - and avoiding lovebusters. Its purpose is to fill his lovebank. It should give him a glimpse of what marriage could be like with you. Hopefully, it will undo whatever it was that caused him to become detached enough to have an affair.

If you do Plan B too early, the WS is only relieved and happily moves on because he doesn't have to screw with you. He is detached from you right now. However, if you do a good Plan A, you will give him something to miss when you go into Plan B and cause enormous confusion.

See, the OW probably only meets 1-2 of his needs, where you meet 3-4. When you strengthen your hand by meeting those needs for a couple of months, he misses you when you go dark in Plan B. He is forced to come to the realization that OW cannot possibly meet all his needs. And since they don't have the benefit of Marriage Builders, they start lovebusting each other over unmet needs. And you end up looking like the good guy!

Sometimes, this can pull a WS off the fence. At the very least, it detaches you from the situation and allows you live in peace. It enables you to clear your mind enough to be able to make rational decisions about your marriage.

Are you doing a good Plan A? Have you avoided lovebusters? Are you looking for opportunities to draw him back in?

maybe some vets here can chime in but I think it is tooo soon for plan B yet..... All of this just transpired in the past 2 weeks or so right?? Lost, I know it is hard but this is a game of hurry up and wait I am afraid. You so what you can for you and your protection. Be proactive, you attract more bees with honey. I don't know about the Friday thing... I let my h know I knew he was back with her... he tried to deny anything but I knew and he knew I knew. Do others think she should put him on the spot for the lies?? Maybe I would say you insist on only honesty from him, that you know she has been there over night. That you won't tolerate lies. anyone else? mlhb

No, no, no, he has not made his choice. WSes are the most wobbly, confused, indecisive people there are. Their feelings change daily. Your job is to confuse him even more by acting in an attractive manner, ie: a good Plan A.

And when you go into Plan B, don't expect him to rush over and write a no contact letter to the OW the next day. That is not how it works. It sometimes takes months for them to get so sick of the OW and miss you so much that they are willing to do this. First he will try every way to get you to break your no contact with him. He will not like being cut off!

But that is down the road and I don't think you are there yet.

"Thinking?" Like I told you before, Lost, the only thing he was "thinking" about was getting laid by the OW without interference from you. That is the whole reason he moved out. If he was "thinking" about working on his marriage, he would have stayed home. Ya can't work on your marriage if ya ain't there!

So, please, lets be realistic here and drop this "thinking" ruse. Pleaes don't let him believe that you think that is anything but self serving, deceitful nonsense. He needs to know that you know the score.

In the meantime, be completely honest with him. Tell him you know why he moved out ["to think"] and that the OW spent the night with him. I would also encourage you to do some further exposures, such as call his family, his mother and any close friends and let them know the OW is openly sleeping with a married man now. This news needs to get out.

Okay I will.

Will you hold off on Plan B for awhile? I think it will be much more effective if you wait and concentrate on doing a good Plan A first.

Your situation is FAR FROM HOPELESS, Lost, and if you play your cards right, there is a good chance you will get your H back. Please don't believe for a minute that this is over, it AIN'T. Even if your H says today he never wants to see you again and wants a divorce. It is not over!! Because what this very confused man wants today will be different tomorrow!

I promise you I am not being falsely optimistic and am not blowing smoke at you. We have seen far worse situations than this end up in very happy reconciliations. Your sitch is fraught with unexplored opportunities, so don't surrender when you have so many unused weapons!

thank you. i am just so confused

I know, hon. It will be ok, though.

I spent the whole day cleaning while he spent the day organizing and packing. At the end he opened one of my desk drawers and pulled out the purchase contract for my engagement ring. He laughed. I lost it and left the room. Took a pill.

I asked him what he wanted me to do during this separation. He told me he wanted me to think of all the horrible things I did and how badly I treated him for the past 13 years. I told him that I thought it was funny that except for the past year or perceptions of our marriage are completely different.

I told him that coming home alone was very hard and that I had too much time to think, but that I thought mostly of the good times in our marriage, but also the bad. I said we had a lot of problems that should have been addressed, but I just didn't see it as a bad marriage overall.

I had to tell him that I knew she stayed at his house all night on friday. He says they read books and talked. I said the quilt I gave him for his bed is the one we slept under for 13 years. Deny deny deny. He said yes they had a relationship, but it is not what I think. I told him that their relationship was causing me to fall apart and that if it was not an affair he would have ended the friendship.

I told him the choices he was making were devestating to me. I told him I felt like he didn't care and had no remorse. He said he doesn't want to hurt me. Well, he is doing a great job.

He said he loved me, but wasn't in love me anymore and hadn't been for a long time. He said this was about him not being happy and me not being happy.

I said people fall out of love, but they can fall in love again too. He says yes, but often they can't.