Hi... I'm feeling really down and need some advice..

WS (not married to him, but together for 14 years) left me for OW in August. Since he left, we've only seen each other 3 times (all because of financial reasons - closings on 2 properties -- we sold our summer condo we owned together and I bought our home from him). All of these real estate transactions took place within 2 months of his leaving... way too fast as far as I'm concerned.

My only means of contacting him now are through email... but it's very infrequent contact (once every week or two). He has yet to sit down with me and discuss any of this... I've asked... and he ignores those emails. Our only real discussion was D-Day when I discovered the affair... I told him over the phone I knew... and we yelled at each other for about 10-15 minutes... he refused to come home... and that was it.

He still has a key to our place... and he routinely comes over every 1-2 weeks during the day while I'm at work to get his mail (mostly junk... important stuff doesn't come here anymore.) He has taken some of his clothes (the stuff he likes), but the rest sits in out closets. I know I should probably ask him to take the rest of his stuff, but after 14 years, our stuff is so intertwined... and I don't think I really want him to take it... I just don't know... it's all just so overwhelming and sad.

Should I just give up hope that he'll ever exit the fog and come back home?

I know I should probably try to move on... but I still love him and miss him very much... and wish he'd come home.

What plan are you in?

I think I've been forced into Plan B... since he won't talk to me or see me. I wish I was still in Plan A though. What should I do next? Any thoughts? I'm so confused.

Any advice? I really need it... thanks

Well, there is always lots of hope. You should be in Plan A. Move on with your life. Work on yourself. If there were any behaviors that he hated, eliminate them.

If he won't talk to you or see you, leave him alone. They are often like that when enthralled with the affair. But affairs usually don't last.

I'm just nervous because it's been 4 months since I discovered the affair... and since then all of our financial ties have been severed. The only real tie we still have is the fact that he still has tons of stuff in my (our) house. Other than that all connections and shared responsibilities are gone.

It makes me glad to hear that there's still hope. I've been feeling so alone and helpless lately.

Should I continue to let him come into the house to get mail, etc while I'm at work? All of my friends at work keep telling me to change the locks... but I really don't feel right about doing that. I have considered just asking him to not to do it... but in a way I feel closer to him knowing that he still stops by to check on things... Is this bad?

I also have been trying to "work" on myself. I've joined a gym near work and have been taking some classes there with friends. He was always annoyed that I never used to go out much with my friends, so I've been trying to get out more... so I am trying...

Also being alone has given me TONS of TIME to reflect upon myself and my behavior. I have also been forced to take over all responsibilities for the house... he used to pay all the bills (and did lots of cleaning too)... so I'm doing many things for the first time. Since I had to buy the house from him... I now have my very own mortgage too (scary... but true!). I think I've done a lot of growing up over the past 4 months...

anyone?

I'm wondering why you didn't get married after 14 years together.

Snoopy,
I would ask him to have his mail forwarded and ask him if he can give you a forwarding address. I think you need to lay down some boundaries. Personally, I don't think it is fair for him to continue to enter your home at his leisure to pick up what he needs. If you don't feel up to forcing his stuff out of the house, at least change the locks. He is keeping a foot in your door but as I said, you need to establish the boundary.

There is most definately hope for your situation. When they intially leave to chase after their affairee, you won't hear from them much. They say most affairs eventually burn out. I would suggest reading all you can on this site and purchase the books Surviving an Affair and His Needs, Her Needs.

I would also suggest that you not bombard him with relationship talk when he does come around. No angry outbursts or disrespectful judgements. It is usually best to make improvements to yourself and act as though you are moving on. Counterintuitive I know, but it works and either way you will come out on top. Do some soul searching and try and figure out what went wrong in your relationship.

Good luck.
S.

I always wanted to marry him... He always claimed he just didn't feel ready to be married. We basically lived as though we were married though.... or at least I did. I still can't even imagine being with anyone else.

I did it... I sent him an email last night asking him to stop coming over when I'm at work. I also told him he needed to think about taking his things. He responded in a kind of vague email saying he needed to think about what he actually wants to keep of his stuff and then went on to say that he really has nowhere to store anything, so he'll need to figure that out and then get back to me... guess the OW apartment isn't too spacious... he should of thought of that before he moved out and sold our home to me!

I know I should feel good about finally standing up for myself and setting some bounderies... but I feel worse than ever. I feel so foolish for secretly hoping he'll snap back into reality, realize how much he misses me, beg for my forgiveness, and then be a wonderful, loving and committed person for the rest of our lives.

Join the club - we all often feel like that. I hope you are getting out and doing things to make your life wonderful.

There are lots of turn-arounds here. In the last couple of weeks I've heard from several folks who completely gave up on their relationship who are back together.

But there is no sense in letting your life slip by while you are waiting.

Snoopy, you and he lived together for fourteen years and he still didn't feel ready to be married? He has a wee, small problem committing to you huh? I may be out of line here, but my immediate thought when you posted that information was that he's had other women from time to time you didn't know about. I refrained because it was Christmas Eve and I didn't want to be negative that day.

I think you need to be firmer about your boundaries. (A) Change the locks on your doors. Until he comes to his senses, it's YOUR home now, not his. (B) It's been 4 months, he's had long enough to decide what he wants to keep and what he wants to get rid of. Give him a definite timetable for clearing out the rest of his stuff. That'll make him decide. (FYI, it took me four and a half minutes to arrange for a storage facility for my camping gear when I found I no longer had space in my apartment. It shouldn't take him any longer than that.) (C) Tell him you are not "Mailboxes R Us." Have him change the address on all the "unimportant" mail he still has coming there.

Frankly, all this might provoke a response from him. I gather he is having a good time with OW, but he's not going to be thrilled that you might be moving on. He’s off somewhere with her but he wants you right where he left you. Some people are like that. Let him see the changes in you when he comes over to pick that stuff up. Be dressed (casually) to the nines, if you know what I mean. “Can't-commit” boy needs to be jolted out of his fantasy world, don't you think?

I agree with changing the locks. It's your home. He chose to remove himself from it.

That said, I would also let him know that if he needs to come by he is more than welcome to make an appointment with you to do so. If he wants his things, he can be there...with you.

If/when you do see him, Plan A as much as possible.

It sounds like you are taking control of things in your own life and making changes. Good for you! No point sitting around stagnant while waiting.

Change those locks and see what happens <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

FIM

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Longhorn - You are definitely not out of line for saying this. I think you may be right here. He actually did have a PA with this same OW several years back in 1998-99. We were not living together yet. I found out about it. It continued for a few more months, then he decided it was wrong and that he owed it to me (and us) to try to make things work. As a gesture of commitment (his words at the time), he sold his house (site of the PA) and bought a new place that we moved into together. That was back in early 2000.

Things went really well for a while. Then I lost my dad in 2001 and my mom in 2003. For obvious reasons, I had a very difficult time dealing with all of it. I withdrew and became very dependent on him... but I really thought things were still going okay.

I did notice big changes in him about a year and a half ago... he became much less interested in me romantically, but I kinda brushed it off, since we still had a great time doing really fun things together (boating, motorcycles, vacations, etc.). In the back of my head, I was a little suspicious, but kept rationalizing it... thinking he just didn't have the time to have an affair. We were always together. He does have a weird work schedule -- 24 hr shifts at the fire dept... which gives him time off while I'm at work... but nights and weekends if he was off-duty he was always with me.

I only really became super suspicious beginning in June, when he started making excuses to spend the night at the fire station. I'm a teacher, so I get summers off and we had a summer condo by the lake about 2 hrs away... so once school got out the end of June, I headed up there. Since we've had the place the past 3 summers, he would work his shifts, then come up for his 5 days off. Well, the excuses started right away... which led to huge fights. Finally, by the end of July, he gave me the "I'm not in love with you anymore" spiel, "but of course there is nobody else". Well, I spent most of the summer alone up there... returned home the end of August and within 24 hrs found proof of the affair with the same girl. Thank god that the house looked like no one had been here in a month, so as far as I know he never brought her here.

I called his cell phone immediately, yelled at him... he admitted to the affair and said he wasn't coming home. And that was pretty much it. I've seen him 3 times since then (once to move stuff out of our summer place that I had to sell, once for him to sign the check over to me after I went alone to the closing for it, and once at the closing when he sold our home to me). Since D-day (Aug 17), he has refused to talk to me about any of it. All properties were sold and financially settled by Oct 21st, and I haven't seen him or spoken to him on the phone since (email contact only). I have no idea where he lives or what his new cell phone number is.

Sorry, for the long winded reply here... It was kind of theraputic I guess to replay everything I've been through... sorry!

During that one and only conversation (ie. 5 minute screaming match back on D-day), I did ask him how long it had been going on for. His response was "well, you mean alot?"... My response "No, how long total"... His response... "Well, like since the beginning of the year" (interpreted as last January, I guess).

I also asked how many others have there been... His response.. "well, a few". I asked "when?".. His answer "I don't remember." So, I guess over the years, there have been other women.

Sorry, to ramble on so badly... after hearing all that, I'm sure most of you are thinking why would I even want him back. But, he's really not all bad... really. For most of the past 14 years, he's been my best friend and a very nice lovable person. I want that person back... not the jerk who for some reason thinks the grass may be greener on the other side. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Thanks for listening...

Snoopy

I'm really hesistant about changing the locks... despite the fact that my friends as well as everyone here on MB thinks it's a must. Shouldn't I give him a chance first to honor my request for him to not enter the house without my permission any longer? Any thoughts here...

No, you shouldn't wait to change the locks. Snoop, he's made his position abundantly clear and he's stonewalling you. He has no more right to get into your house than anyone else in his fire company. There are those out here who will say you should be in Plan A, but I don't see how you can apply the principles of that plan when you see him three times in five months. He’s doing a Plan B on you and he’s pretty solidly entrenched.

With regret, Snoop, I don't know what can possibly shake him loose. You're not married, so exposure to the fire department isn't going to do anything. To them, I suspect you're just another girlfriend he's dumped along the way. That's an exaggeration to illustrate the point. I expect you got it.

I have a couple more points to make. First he has NOT been your best friend all these years. In fact, he’s betrayed your love, as well as your friendship, any number of times. You’ll probably never know how many times but it’s equal to the number of times he thought of another woman instead of you, plus every time he made a phone call to one, plus every time he bought one a gift, kissed them, hugged them, made light conversation with them, etc., etc.

He’s not all bad? You’re correct. Few people are. But good people do bad things and he’s done far more than his share. Look at it this way, Snoopy. He was happy as a clam having you as his wife to keep his house, clean for him, etc., but the moment you started asking questions, the moment he got the slightest bit uncomfortable, he dropped you like a hot rock. From what you’ve written, he doesn’t have a single regret either. Best friend? Snoop, you can’t afford an enemy like him, much less a friend.

I think you should contact an attorney and discuss your state’s laws on common law marriage. I don’t know if that’s the proper term or not but, after fourteen years, I would think you might qualify as his common law wife. That might give you leverage to sue for………whatever. Don’t go to a lawyer spitefully, but do go. Find out what he owes you.

My thoughts are with you. Best wishes.

I actually exposed the affair to his buddies on the fire dept right away. After I discovered evidence of his affair on D-day, I called his cell and left a voicemail, and then headed right over to the fire station to talk with his former best friend (they had a falling out). His former buddy was shocked... said he didn't have a clue either. I'm also good friends with some of the guys wives, so believe me everyone knows now. But from what I can tell, he had the whole thing pretty hidden from them the whole time. The fire dept is a pretty tight bunch... lots of couple and families that hung out together often. I've known everybody over there for years and believe me nobody there approves of what he did to me. They definitely do not see me as just another one of his "girlfriends".



Right after I found out about the affair, I did contact an attorney. Unfortunately, my state does not recoginize common law marriage. As far as divided property, it is already done... I bought the home we were living in from him for about 50K under market value (I guess he felt a little guilty?) and he didn't make me repay him for my car which he bought for me last January using part of his home equity loan (worth about 25K to me)... so I think I did okay financially and legally.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

They might be friendly with you, but I expect nothing can be done officially. <sigh>

I hope some of the others out here have better ideas than mine.