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The reason that they're pushing for this letter is too make it CLEAR TO BOTH OF THEM that NC is to be established and enforced. IMHO, I personally think that OMW should be copied on the letter as well...so that she too can help enforce this.
Regardless of there being a letter...your wife agreed to it but has failed...AGAIN.
You need to confront her now about her email to OM. You need to make it clear that you will NOT accept this.
My case was VERY similar. My wife had an online EA...and for about a month aftwards would agree everytime we'd go to MC to end contact...and would fail within a day or two...so every week it restarted. This went on for a month...then she broke contact and seriously tried to reconcile. NC lasted about 3 weeks...and then SHE slipped and emailed him. I saw it because I was checking her emails...and waited three days for her to admit it to me. She didn't...and I finally told her I knew that they'd started emailing. We had a major blowup over the whole thing...but she sent him an NC email that morning. She broke down 5 days later on Father's Day and sent him a Father's Day card...and HE wrote back to her letting her know that he's honoring her choice to stay with me, and she needed to end contact. She admitted this to me BEFORE I found out about it...and that was the end of the contact.
Do NOT let it slide...becuase that's what she was hoping for. She's testing the water to see if he'll resume contact...and to see if she can get away with it as well. Trust me...she might not even be thinking about that, but it's really her motives here.
Confront her with it, make it clear that you know and aren't happy with it. And...make it clear that you're going to continue to check on her, because she needs to rebuild that trust between you. The onus is on HER to begin proving her trustworthiness to you...and she can do that by being an open book.
Trust me...been down this road myself friend.
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Pepperband and Owl,
Thanks for the advice!
Me BH(31)
WW(29)
EA/PA Sept-Oct
D-day EA October 24, 2005
D-day PA November 28, 2005
NC letter sent 1-29-06
Wife is almost completely fog free.
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Well, You guys warned me....She talked to him yesterday on her cell phone....on my birthday...
Me BH(31)
WW(29)
EA/PA Sept-Oct
D-day EA October 24, 2005
D-day PA November 28, 2005
NC letter sent 1-29-06
Wife is almost completely fog free.
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As we were all afraid of October. These WS's really aren't much different in how they act or the things they say. Time to start trusting the solid advice of the veterans here. ANY contact is contact and ANY contact resets the clock back to zero on withdrawal. She finally woke up. Since then she has almost been her old self again. You're no longer looking for her "old self". You'll need to be looking for the new person that can emerge from this mess IF she's willing to emerge. I'm sorry you've been dealt another blow but use this as a tool that helps you realize that there are no short cuts that can be taken when it comes to restoring your marriage. There is NO quick fix. This is MAJOR injury requiring MAJOR surgery and then months or years of rehab. You CAN do this. It is obvious that you love your wife and you have shown great control and strength. No more shortcuts. Ok? (You should know I made many of the same mistakes you did. Only after the fact, when I found this place did I realize how much pain could have been avoided with these techniques. Ugh!) Praying for you.
Me (BS) 36
FWW 35
Married 5/25/91
DS-7
DD - Born 11/8/05 !!!
PA #1 12/1996
PA #2 4/01 to 1/04
NC 1/04
There are people in the world so hungry, that God cannot appear to them except in the form of bread.
- Mahatma Gandhi
Don't think exposure is a good idea? Go here...
From Harley Himself
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So sorry to hear that friend...but this doesn't mean that it's over either. It means that you have to continue to fight. So...confront her on it...NOW. Did she admit to talking with him, or have you just seen the bill? I ask because I don't know if she knows you're aware of this or not yet. If not...confront ASAP. Point blank...tell her that you KNOW she's resumed contact with him, and that it has to end NOW. Non-negotiable. I don't know much about your situation friend, but something else that I did to end contact between my wife and I that was out of the ordinary was contacting OM directly myself. When I discovered the emails to him again, I wrote him an email. I held on to it, and when my wife and I had our blowout and sent her NC letter to him finally, I followed up with this letter to him myself: [OM],
I wanted you to know that [WW] shared the email she received from you as soon as she got it. We’re not hiding anything from each other anymore…we’re talking and working things out. We’ve begun rebuilding our marriage, and things are getting to the way they used to be WAY before all of this happened. We’re working hard to ensure that we don’t find ourselves back in the situation we’ve been in the last year or more ever again. [WW] has found that she truly is still in love with me…and that I really have never stopped loving her either. She’s come to realize that much of what happened was due to depression…she felt that she wasn’t getting any of the love and attention from me, so she accepted it from you instead. She’s seeing it from me now, and we’ve been happier together in the last few weeks than we’ve been in a long, long time.
Based on that, I want you to do something. I want you to walk away. I know that she’s said that she wants to have you remain as a friend. I know that she likes you, and that she does miss your conversations. But you know as well as I that I can never trust that friendship between the two of you again. Just seeing that email from you created a huge amount of strain between us that we’ve not had in weeks. I’ve told her how I feel on this…but you know as well as I that she will make her own decision. So, once again I’m coming to you to ask you to do the right thing.
With you in the picture in any sense of the word, rebuilding our marriage will be FAR more difficult. That’s not fair. It’s not fair to me, and it’s not fair to her either. She’s working hard to regain what we’ve lost, just like I am. I know that you feel that you love her. But you know as well as I do that your feelings for her are WRONG. She’s always been a married woman, to a man you thought of as a friend. You VERY nearly destroyed a love that has lasted for 18 years. I think I understand how you feel about her…and I know that you’ll never completely think of her as just a friend.
Walk away. Free her and I to continue to rebuild our marriage and our friendship with each other. No matter what, don’t come back. For as long as you continue to do so, you’ll be making the lives of two people you claimed as friends (and more) more painful than you can imagine. Walk away. Do so knowing that she’s happy again with her marriage, and that our family life is coming back together like it should. Do so knowing that you’ve done the right thing, and secure in the knowledge that there is the right man with her, who will ALWAYS fight to help her be the best person she can be, and will always love her and be there for her. Things got rough between us, and you did help to bring that out in a way that will make sure that we will NEVER let them get that bad again. Walk away, and find your own peace. Find the person you’re SUPPOSED to be with. It’s not [WW]. You two both did a lot for each other from what I’ve learned. You know that you can love again now. Go find where YOU are supposed to be, and leave [WW] and I free to be what we’re supposed to be. It's long and sappy...but it also got the point across to him too. My advice stands friend...do not delay confronting her on the renewed contact...because the longer she has contact, the greater her withdrawl will be AGAIN because of it. She WILL go through withdrawl again because of this...no avoiding it. But the only way to minimize this is to end the contact as soon as possible. Hang in there friend...keep posting here, and don't be afraid to take strong action to save your marriage.
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Oh...wanted to add something. The email I refer to at the beginning of the letter was one that the wife DID share with me that last week...because I saw her open it. It was a 'phishing' email from OM...that she showed me as soon as she got it and deleted it immediately. But...where SHE went wrong was in copying him 'accidentally' in an email later that same night...and it was his response to THAT that I saw in her inbox and confronted her on. Hope that clarifies some.
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So I asked her if she talked to him yesterday...
I know that he called her at 5:05 and that call was 12 minutes long.
Then she called him at 5:30 and that call was two minutes.
The number he called from was a new one that I had not seen before.
This is her response. Would you believe her?
"I received a call yesterday as I was leaving work. First one I've answered in a month or more. It wasn't a number that I recognized and I answered while I was waiting for the elevator. I lost the call in the elevator, waited for the shuttle, and eventually got to the parking lot. When I got there I was going to call home and let you know I was on my way. I opened the phone and it was still connected on a call, even though the line was dead. I called back to advise I hadn't hung up rudely, but had lost the call. That was it. No big discussions, but then again I'm sure you know that.
It was one of the reasons I was in a bad mood before I got home last night. I didn't say anything because it was your birthday and we'd just been saying how it was behind us, and I didn't want to ruin your day."
Please let me know what you think. Things have been going better than ever for us. I think I believe her story, but I want your input. Either way, I think I can use this to insist on a NC letter as well as all of the other things I think she should do to put this behind us.
Me BH(31)
WW(29)
EA/PA Sept-Oct
D-day EA October 24, 2005
D-day PA November 28, 2005
NC letter sent 1-29-06
Wife is almost completely fog free.
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Me (BS) 36
FWW 35
Married 5/25/91
DS-7
DD - Born 11/8/05 !!!
PA #1 12/1996
PA #2 4/01 to 1/04
NC 1/04
There are people in the world so hungry, that God cannot appear to them except in the form of bread.
- Mahatma Gandhi
Don't think exposure is a good idea? Go here...
From Harley Himself
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She sent me another e-mail saying she now realizes it was wrong not to tell me. Then she laces into me for emailing her at her job about this and trying to sabotage her career. This seems real Foggy to me. All I did was send her one sentence. "Did you talk to OM yesterday? She says that she is shaken up and crying and that she has a big meeting in a little while. I am thinking that she is trying to flip this around on me and make me feel guilty. She has done that alot in the past. I'm not going to converse with her anymore today. When she gets home we will talk about a NC letter and my other terms.
Last edited by OctoberHeartbrk; 01/10/06 11:46 AM.
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I wouldn't believe a word she says to you. There is NO WAY that she can "still be connected to a call" when the phone is dead. She is and has been in contact with him. A 12 minute phone call is NOT a "no big discussion" call. a lot can be said in 12 minutes...and I can GUARANTEE that this is not the first time she has spoken to him. She is speaking to him from work and I'll bet money that he called her on the phone thinking you wouldn't recognize the new number...
Believe me, I've seen it all and know it all...I know all the tricks they use and I can smell trouble a mile away. Dont believe a word she says. You will only set yourself up for more disappointment.
It is all about her cuz she is still seeing him and she is getting caught easier now. She is angry that you are disrupting her life the way you are. Did she ever send the NC letter?
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October - We're not trying to bring you down but we do want you to see ALL of the reality. I really wish my FWW Flukette could post to you from work. She would give you wonderful insight into the stuff your W is pulling. I'm sure she'll post tonight though. She's a great resource for this kind of stuff. DON'T FALL FOR IT! There's lots of road to travel yet. Put on your good walking shoes and we'll do the same. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Me (BS) 36
FWW 35
Married 5/25/91
DS-7
DD - Born 11/8/05 !!!
PA #1 12/1996
PA #2 4/01 to 1/04
NC 1/04
There are people in the world so hungry, that God cannot appear to them except in the form of bread.
- Mahatma Gandhi
Don't think exposure is a good idea? Go here...
From Harley Himself
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She can not see him because he lives on the other side of the country. I will insist on a NC letter tonight. Her choice...With me on my terms or without me.
Me BH(31)
WW(29)
EA/PA Sept-Oct
D-day EA October 24, 2005
D-day PA November 28, 2005
NC letter sent 1-29-06
Wife is almost completely fog free.
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She's blowing smoke to cover her tracks friend.
I work for one of the top telecommunications companies in the US.
If a call is "dropped", it's automatically disconnected back at the switch...it couldn't possibly remain connected through her phone. If she closed the cover on her phone, it would have disconnected any calls she was still dialed into as soon as the switch inside her phone indicated it was closed.
Does it take her 12 MINUTES to go from the elevator to the parking garage??? I don't think so...I can run two miles in 12 minutes. That is a LONG time...she could have WALKED nearly a mile in that time...get the picture?
And then...as you said she immediately tried to make you out to be the bad guy for bringing it up at all...classic tactic.
Go online and check your online invoice for that phone for the last few months. Any OTHER calls to/from OM? What about text messages?
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October,
As a FWW myself, I thought I'd chime in here...
I must jump on the bandwagon of the others here, and stress to you how very important it is for you to confront your W about any contact! You should also continue to snoop for quite a while...you MUST inspect what you expect!
This early into your recovery, neither of you realize how strong the pull back to the A can be. Please believe fully the Affair/Drug Addiction analogy so often put forth here...it is very REAL. Right now the "pleasure" of the "high" that she got from a "fix" is all too fresh in her mind. And she will continue to seek that feeling, sometimes subconciously. In my own A, even when contact with OM became negative, it still fed my need for a "fix"...I didn't realize it at the time...it has taken hindsight and some serious reality checks from many of the wonderful people here for me to truly get it...thankfully now I really do...That's why I feel comfortable in telling you unequivocably that her holiday email wasn't innocent at all, instead it was a "junkie" looking to get her next "fix"...I know that neither of you may feel that way now, but I promise you, it was what it was...That email paved the way for his most recent phone call, do you see that? As for whether or not she is telling the truth about that, well, it doesn't really matter, what matters is that she didn't come to you immediately about it...you had to find out via phone records...Of course, if you ask her about why she didn't come to you, she'll tell you that she didn't want to hurt you further and worry you unnecessarily-BULL!!! You must both truly get and internalize that TOTAL openess and honesty must be practiced in order for your recovery to be real, and for you to get what you are supposed to from your marriage...even if openess and honesty hurts, it MUST be practiced...that's the only way...
Is your wife reading or posting here? If not, can you get her to? I couldn't possibly put into words just how instrumental that this site has been for Mr. Wondering and I in our recovery...Please tell your W that there are many FWW's here that will understand all that she is feeling and dealing with...she won't really believe that right now, as all waywards falsely think that their own situation was so unique...NOT! I know that you would both benefit and even help others if you were here together...think about it, ok?
If there is anything that I can answer for you, I'd be glad to...
I wish you all the best...
Mrs. Wondering
FWW ~ 47 ~ MeFBH ~ 50 ~ MrWonderingDD ~ 17 Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered
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The worst part of all of this is for the past two days I have felt back to normal for the first time since 10-24-05. I felt like I was really making huge progress in putting what happened behind us, forgiving, and trusting again. I could see a happy future for us. I now see I'm doing all of this on my own. I hate this damn rollercoaster!!
Me BH(31)
WW(29)
EA/PA Sept-Oct
D-day EA October 24, 2005
D-day PA November 28, 2005
NC letter sent 1-29-06
Wife is almost completely fog free.
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Owl,
This was the first call since I confronted her on 12-9-05.
Me BH(31)
WW(29)
EA/PA Sept-Oct
D-day EA October 24, 2005
D-day PA November 28, 2005
NC letter sent 1-29-06
Wife is almost completely fog free.
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Posts: 63
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I'm mad because we have to reset the withdrawl clock. I am so sick of resetting it. This was the closest we came, almost 3 weeks (as far as I know)
Me BH(31)
WW(29)
EA/PA Sept-Oct
D-day EA October 24, 2005
D-day PA November 28, 2005
NC letter sent 1-29-06
Wife is almost completely fog free.
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Posts: 6,316
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Openess and Honesty is the only way off that rollercoaster, October...Keep her honest, by being honest in your confrontations about what is truly going on...back her into a corner, show her that she can't hide ANY dirty little secrets from you--sounds harsh, but it's what it takes...let her know that there is no fooling you...SNOOP, SNOOP, SNOOP, and then SNOOP some more!!! This is YOUR life that she's playing games with!
Mrs. W
FWW ~ 47 ~ MeFBH ~ 50 ~ MrWonderingDD ~ 17 Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered
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The worst part of all of this is for the past two days I have felt back to normal for the first time since 10-24-05. There is no going back to the old normal...you must establish a "new normal"...you can do it, October!!! Keep posting, and try and see what you are doing as heroic...eventually she will see the same... Mrs. W
FWW ~ 47 ~ MeFBH ~ 50 ~ MrWonderingDD ~ 17 Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered
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Your not in recovery...this was the first call that YOU KNOW OF!!! I can guarantee they are talking at work, emailing, etc...she just got caught this time!
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