Reposted from other topics:


I just found out that my wife is not in love with me.

Background: She was in love with someone else before we met. The other person we will call "L" pushed her away because of an age difference and other issues.

My wife says she figured that if she got married and did everything she was supposed to that everything would be all right.

20 years later my wife contacts the other person to see why she was pushed away since she was still in love with "L". "L" said they were still in love with my wife. Now they are in full contact with each other and have spent time together while I was deployed.

We have 3 children and neither one of us wants to ruin thier life. She says she loves me but she is not "in love" with me. She says that being intimate with me now makes her feel like she is betraying "L".

Your wife is doing what all wayward spouses do in an affair, they rewrite the history of their marriage in order to justify the unjustifiable. She feels if changes the history, her affair will be justified.

Almost all WS's say "I love you, but I am not in love with you." This simply means that she is in the fogged out fantasy state of an affair and does not "feel" love for you right now. That does not mean, though, that she won't feel love once her affair ends.

Now, if you want to save your marriage, you should go into Plan A. Plan A is a plan designed to bust up the affair by attracting her back into the marriage and by putting pressure on the affair to end. The best way to pressure the affair to end is to expose it. Exposure is ruinous to affairs as they cannot survice with secrecy for long. Good exposure targets are the other man's wife, his parents, your W's parents, family, close friends, and your family.

The second part is to do your best to meet her needs and avoid lovebusters. Lovebusters only push her away and make the OM look more attractive.

Please read the link in my signature titled Plan A and Plan B and order the book Surviving an Affair bym Willard Harley frm this website. That book will be instrumental in helping you understand her affair.

Welcome to MB. It is a great resource and the best place to be under the circumstances.

Please read as as much as you can on the site- not just the forums.

Buy and Read Surviving an Affair.

Read everything on the site about plan A. Plan A includes exposing the Affair to help with its demise. Is L married? If so, you need to let his wife know of this situation.

Keep reading and keep posting.

Thanks for the posts.

"L" is not married. This "love" goes back 20+ years. My wife says she fell in love with the way I treated her and hoped that she would actually fall in love with me. When I discovered the A, she said that she never really fell in love with me. Right now there is NC and I am pretty much in Plan A. I've exposed the A to a pastor friend of ours and am deep in prayer.

She has no disire to leave the children and that may be the main tie or saving grace.

Has she ended contact with the OM?

It is very common for a WS to imagine they were "never in love," but its usually not true. This is just the typical rewriting of history. Do you believe she was really never in love in all these 20 years and you just never happened to notice it?

Her 20 year "love" for the OM is a fantasy. She hasn't known him all these years so coudn't possibly "love" him. As she wakes up from the fog, her fantasy will fade, don't worry.

She has known the OM for the last 24 years. Until recently the only contact was by forwarding emails. The OM is also a friend of my wife's mom. They still talk on the phone but my wife says she has no intention of leaving. I made my feelings known about sex. She told me that it isn't about sex and she wouldn't care if she never did it again. Including with me. Although it isn't in the forefront of my mind, I still deal with the thoughts of her with someone else.

I think if I push total NC, I will push her away. I'm still reading about the negotiations of Plan A. Right now, the only bargaining chip I have is the children. I would not use that against her. If she did decide to leave, she would have to explain it to our children. That would be enough to kill her.

Hangtime

I have been where you are. You need to expose more. Friends, her family, etc..... Continue to push for NC. She will be furious in the begining and it may make things worse early, but down the road this is your best chance at recovery.

Stay strong my brother.

HT,
If your wife is able to be in close proximity to OM she's probably having a full blown physical affair. The sooner you come to terms with this as a real possibility, the sooner you can make a plan. I stewed in denial for 5 months while WW and OM built their relationship. This delay is only torture for yourself. Avoid it. Check my thread called "wife wants me out". Stay here and ask questions. The experienced people will keep you from getting too far off track and give you your best possible chance to save your marriage. Let's keep each other motivated.
68

Unless contact ends completely, recovery is impossible. Any contact is only a continuation of her affair. She has not ended her affair, my friend if she still has ANY contact with him. She is still carrying it on right under your nose with your approval.

She will never feel anything for you again until all contact ends. NEVER. She will never feel anything for you unless she withdraws from the OM and withdrawal will never take place until contact ends.

You should never settle for anything less that TOTAL no contact unless you want to just end your marriage now. Because it is hopeless otherwise.


Here is what Dr Harley says about it:

Never see or communicate with a former lover

Once an affair is first revealed, whether it's discovered or admitted, the victimized spouse is usually in a state of shock. The first reaction is usually panic, but it's quickly followed by anger. Divorce and sometimes even murder are contemplated. But after some time passes (usually about three weeks), most couples decide that they will try to pull together and save their marriage.

The one having an affair is in no position to bargain, but he or she usually tries anyway. The bargaining effort usually boils down to somehow keeping the lover in the loop. You'd think that the unfaithful spouse would be so aware of his or her weaknesses, and so aware of the pain inflicted, that every effort would be made to avoid further contact with the lover as an act of thoughtfulness to the stunned spouse. But instead, the unfaithful spouse argues that the relationship was "only sexual" or was "emotional but not sexual" or some other peculiar description to prove that continued contact with the lover would be okay.

Most victimized spouses intuitively understand that all contact with a lover must end for life. Permanent separation not only helps prevent a renewal of the affair, but it is also a crucial gesture of consideration to someone who has been through ******. What victimized spouse would ever want to know that his or her spouse is seeing or communicating with a former lover at work or in some other activity?

In spite of career sacrifices, friendships, and issues relating to children's schooling, I am adamant in recommending that there be no contact with a former lover for life. For many, that means a move to another state. But to do otherwise fails to recognize the nature of addiction and its cure.

entire article: http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5060_qa.html

You have this backwards. The only hope of getting her back is NC. She is pushed away NOW. She is in love with another man; that is about as "pushed away" as one can get. And she will stay this way until her affair ends. Her affair has not ended if she is still in contact.

Well, there was a great post submitted by Starfish that summarizes PLan A in such a way, that even a mentally challenged person like myself can understand.

I don't know if I would use the word "negotiate"...but I have seen it used.

Goodluck.

POST BELOW BY STARFISH:

Plan A as Harley meant it to be...

Plan A is not (repeat NOT) about making the WS happy, or feeling good.

Plan A is NOT, contrary to popular (and very incorrect opinion), about "making yourself a better person," or "working on yourself."

Plan A is ALL ABOUT the straying spouse. In Willard Harely's ever brilliant words, Plan A is a stategy to end the affair and to entice the straying spouse to reconsider the marriage.

So, it has several elements that should be done at the same time.

First is to eliminate LBers and to meet needs as best you can... recognizing that the unfaithful mate may not allow the betrayed partner to meet needs.

Second is to CONFRONT the unfaithful partner with what you know. Doing so (of course) in a way that is respectful and about you... how you feel, how you are affected by the affair.

Third is to expose the affair to the scrutiny of the world. The lover's spouse or s/o, coworkers, family, friends, church family, children, etc.
ALL OF THAT is Plan A. And it should be done as much as possible simultaneously. (If you don't believe me call the radio show Mondays and Thursdays at 1pm Central Time and ask Dr. Harley for yourself.)

Plan A must have a deadline. It's called Plan "A" because there is a second step... aptly named Plan "B." Willard Harley suggests a max of 6 months for men and 3 months for women before going to the next step. If Plan A hasn't worked in that time, it's not going to.

(I challenge you to find anyone who has done Plan A longer than that and been successful. I define successful as the A ending, n/c promised and verified, and the couple working a good recovery plan which includes meeting needs, eliminating LBers, getting in 15 hours a week of UAT, and most importantly following POJA.)
--


Plan A is not about being a nice guy. Plan A is about ending the affair.... being a nice guy is part of that, but only part. That's why confronting and exposing are crucial elements of Plan A... and if you're not doing those things then you can't really say that you're doing Plan A

Listen to Mel. She is right. More than you can know.

Hangtime...

First, knowing someone for 24 years is a whole lot different than living with someone day in and day out for 24 years...Your wife has built a huge "soulmate" fantasy up in her mind...

Second, NC means NC...and it must be for life...your wife's mother is a prime exposure target here...this man is NOT a friend to the family in any way, shape or form...he is a HUGE threat to the security of your family...he is engaging in, at the very least, a full blown EA with your wife!!!

The things that Melody told you above are all EXACTLY right...listen to her...

The stuff that your wife is telling you is a bunch of HOGWASH...WS FOG BABBLE...my own A was with a "past love", and I said much of the same baloney to my H...PHOOEY, on everything she says right now, NONSENSE!!!

And lastly, my favorite piece of MB advice for you...YOUR MARRIAGE CAN SURVIVE YOUR WIFE'S ANGER, BUT IT CAN NOT AND WILL NOT SURVIVE AN ONGOING AFFAIR!!! Hangtime, your wife is DEFINITELY involved in an ongoing affair right now...NC and EXPOSURE is in order if you value your family...and I know you do...Keep reading and posting here...we will help you in every way that we can...

Blessings,

Mrs. W

Hangtime...

What your wife is saying about sex might be true for her right now, as many times the EA is the most important part of it for women, but you know that men are different...If she continues contact with OM, he will begin to push for a PA, and your wife, anxious to feed her addiction to the EA will oblige in order to keep the EA going and get her "fix"...You gotta have total NC here...NON NEGOTIABLE!!!

Mrs. W

Fortunately we live in a different state and with the children, she is really in no position to cross the state lines. I will keep posting and push for NC.

Hangtime,
Here are some direct quotes from my WW who is involved in a full blown PA involving major sex at as often as 3 times a week while my kids are in school. See if you recognize any of them.

"I just don't feel about you the way a wife should feel about a husband."
"He's just a really good friend."
Me: Well, why don't we have him over for dinner so I can meet him?
WW: "What would that accomplish?" very testily.
Me: " just really just want to hold you and make everything alright"
WW: " I don't want anyone to hold me right now. I don't want anyone to touch me. I just want to be alone except for the children."
WW: "Why don't you move out? I feel like I'm alone so I might as well be alone."
Me: I don't want to do that. I'll be leaving you and the kids and I can't make anything better if I'm not here. Plus I don't have the money to maintain another place."
WW: "I think our best chance for reconciliation is for you to leave. Then we would have to work to see each other and we could start all over."
Me: I don't want to do that because it is the first step toward divorce.
WW: "Where do you think we are headed now?"

bottom line: She's cake eating. I pay for her lifestyle and provide childcare. She goes off when she wants to and plays with the OM.

It is not forunate at all that you live in different states because one does not have to be in the same state to carry on an affair, as your wife has demonstrated. She is in a FULL BOAT AFFAIR and until you understand that, you will not get your W back. An emotional affair is just as intense as a physical affair to a woman. Your W is carrying on an affair with this man. And there is no hope for your marriage until that affair ends. NO HOPE. So, don't push for no contact, make it a non-negotiable condition. If she won't end contact then start exposing her. That will make the affair most uncomfortable.

My OM was 750 miles away...didn't stop the A and was still a GIANORMOUS threat to the security of my family...NO CONTACT, Hangtime, it's the ONLY way!!!

Mrs. W

OK, since I haven't got the book yet, how do you initiate the NC discussion?

*bump*